November 5, 2004 2:32 PM PST

More e-voting glitches surface

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A transmission error in the battleground state of Ohio gave President George W. Bush almost 4,000 phantom votes in the preliminary results posted online, the Secretary of State's office in Ohio acknowledged on Friday.

The error would not have escaped detection during the certification process that validates the election results and does not even come close to changing the outcome, said Carlo LoParo, director of media and voter services for the Ohio Secretary of State's office.

"Both campaigns have thoroughly scrutinized the numbers after election day before making their decisions," LoParo said.

Scrutiny of the unofficial results posted to the Board of Elections Web site in Franklin County uncovered that Bush had received 3,893 extra votes. Bush's preliminary total is actually 365, the Associated Press stated.

The document summarizing the unofficial tallies could no longer be accessed via the Web site late Friday.

LoParo referred questions about the particular incident to Franklin County, where the error occurred. Representatives of the Board of Elections for that county did not return numerous phone calls seeking comment.

According to the preliminary results posted by the Ohio Secretary of State's office, Bush garnered 136,483 more votes in the state than Sen. John Kerry, and while 155,428 provisional ballots remain to be counted, the likelihood of Kerry closing the gap remains remote. Subtracting the nearly 4,000 votes granted to Bush's campaign does not change those odds.

However, the mistake is one of the latest minor errors that have marred the performance of electronic voting machines during an election that was heavily scrutinized.

A county in North Carolina lost more than 4,500 votes because officials had thought the memory that stored ballots electronically could hold more data than it did, stated a report by the Associated Press.

Computer scientists and voting advocates have criticized the current crop of electronic voting machines for lacking strong security measures. While election officials have maintained that the voting systems are perfectly secure when used as intended, critics have pointed out that the machines generally have not made electronic voting more transparent. Some critics have pushed for paper ballots to be printed by the machines to create a better audit trail.

Such problems, however, caused far less of a problem than registration issues. Of more than 30,000 problems that voters encountered this week, only 6 percent were due to machines, while nearly a third were blamed on voter-register issues, according to voting watchdog group VerifiedVoting.org's incident database.

However, President Bush's extra votes in the key state of Ohio has grabbed the attention of election watchers.

Franklin County uses a direct recording electronic (DRE) voting machine manufactured by industrial equipment maker Danaher Corp. An official of that company maintained that the mistake would have been caught during the election certification process, or canvass, and corrected in the verified totals.

Some electronic voting experts argue that the glitch should have been caught right away.

"I definitely don't consider it to be minor," said David Wagner, assistant professor of computer science at the University of California, Berkeley. While the mistake didn't affect the election results, he added that "this is the kind of error that a well-designed voting system should never be subject to."

Wagner explained that correction codes could have prevented the problem, or at least made it obvious to election officials.

40 comments

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Does it really matter?
Kerry conceded. Bush wins. He would've won anyway. Do the e-vote mishaps really still matter?
Posted by (2 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Reply
If it means they will try to fix them, then yes. Also it might convince people to check their selection before they tell the machine to record their vote instead of just clicking through like they do with software EULAs.
Posted by unknown unknown (1951 comments )
Link Flag
yes it matters
4000 phantom votes may not matter, but what if it was 50,000 or 500,000?

Anything that could potentially manipulate elections matters, a lot. Wake up
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
Backtrack to Florida in 2000
Hell yes this matters. When a election is as close as what happened in Florida last go around. A screw-up in the thousands can win an election. Idiot.
Posted by Jonathan (832 comments )
Link Flag
Does it really matter?
Kerry conceded. Bush wins. He would've won anyway. Do the e-vote mishaps really still matter?
Posted by (2 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Reply
If it means they will try to fix them, then yes. Also it might convince people to check their selection before they tell the machine to record their vote instead of just clicking through like they do with software EULAs.
Posted by unknown unknown (1951 comments )
Link Flag
yes it matters
4000 phantom votes may not matter, but what if it was 50,000 or 500,000?

Anything that could potentially manipulate elections matters, a lot. Wake up
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
Backtrack to Florida in 2000
Hell yes this matters. When a election is as close as what happened in Florida last go around. A screw-up in the thousands can win an election. Idiot.
Posted by Jonathan (832 comments )
Link Flag
If only...
...the "Other" news sites got the story right! I cannot believe the headlines on some of the major brand news sites saying the election was off and so on.

Thanks News.com for stating the whole story!
Posted by Shutterstuff (42 comments )
Reply Link Flag
If only...
...the "Other" news sites got the story right! I cannot believe the headlines on some of the major brand news sites saying the election was off and so on.

Thanks News.com for stating the whole story!
Posted by Shutterstuff (42 comments )
Reply Link Flag
How many errors does it take to change the election
While a few errors in one precinct, or a few thousand in another may not be enough to change the election result, all those errors, and flipped votes on the emachines, added up across the country could be more than a substantial amount.

Every voting error needs to found and corrected.
A poll at a major national paper showed that 56% of those polled were unhappy with the election results.
That, with the reported voting errors, and the exit polls that don't match in states using electronic voting with no paper trail, and other voting anomolies says 'something fishy going on here".

We must make certain that every vote counts, that the malfunctioning machines are found, results corrected, and credited to the correct candidate.

Remember, it's the Bush bunch who paid the companies who make those machines.

Be Vigilant ! Our democracy is in danger of being lost to voting machines that can't be audited, or whose companies won't allow the code to be checked for glitches, accidental and deliberate.

<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/4/224812/643" target="_newWindow">http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/4/224812/643</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org/#breaking" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org/#breaking</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.infernalpress.com/Columns/election.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.infernalpress.com/Columns/election.html</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html</a> , Bush Supporters Still Believe Iraq Had WMD or Major Program,Supported al Qaeda
Posted by Texspeak (39 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Is their hope?
Can the election be overturned? Is the concession
irreversible? Perhaps an independent audit is
warranted. Maybe we can still save this country.
I will pray.
Posted by Johnny Mnemonic (374 comments )
Link Flag
How many errors does it take to change the election
While a few errors in one precinct, or a few thousand in another may not be enough to change the election result, all those errors, and flipped votes on the emachines, added up across the country could be more than a substantial amount.

Every voting error needs to found and corrected.
A poll at a major national paper showed that 56% of those polled were unhappy with the election results.
That, with the reported voting errors, and the exit polls that don't match in states using electronic voting with no paper trail, and other voting anomolies says 'something fishy going on here".

We must make certain that every vote counts, that the malfunctioning machines are found, results corrected, and credited to the correct candidate.

Remember, it's the Bush bunch who paid the companies who make those machines.

Be Vigilant ! Our democracy is in danger of being lost to voting machines that can't be audited, or whose companies won't allow the code to be checked for glitches, accidental and deliberate.

<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/4/224812/643" target="_newWindow">http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/4/224812/643</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org/#breaking" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org/#breaking</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.infernalpress.com/Columns/election.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.infernalpress.com/Columns/election.html</a>
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html</a> , Bush Supporters Still Believe Iraq Had WMD or Major Program,Supported al Qaeda
Posted by Texspeak (39 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Is their hope?
Can the election be overturned? Is the concession
irreversible? Perhaps an independent audit is
warranted. Maybe we can still save this country.
I will pray.
Posted by Johnny Mnemonic (374 comments )
Link Flag
E Voting Needs more scrutiny
As a voter, I'd be interested to know more, not only about the
companies selling these systems, but also the companies
producing the actual software and the people that work for
these companies. Deibold is a big one. Maybe the most well
known. but what about looking at some of the other companies
like Enfocom International Corp (www.enfocbsi.com) , a
Canadian company producing e-
voting terminals and e-voting software called 'WINVote' for US
company Advanced Voting Systems. (www.advancedvoting.com)
More transparency will equate to better systems and lead to
higher voter confidence.
Posted by (26 comments )
Reply Link Flag
E Voting Needs more scrutiny
As a voter, I'd be interested to know more, not only about the
companies selling these systems, but also the companies
producing the actual software and the people that work for
these companies. Deibold is a big one. Maybe the most well
known. but what about looking at some of the other companies
like Enfocom International Corp (www.enfocbsi.com) , a
Canadian company producing e-
voting terminals and e-voting software called 'WINVote' for US
company Advanced Voting Systems. (www.advancedvoting.com)
More transparency will equate to better systems and lead to
higher voter confidence.
Posted by (26 comments )
Reply Link Flag
WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Did the EXIT POLLS for states with verifiable paper trails match the results ACROSS THE BOARD???? I am no activist, I am only asking. Where e-voting did not have a paper trail - bush lead in each of those states DESPITE exit poll leads by kerry. Even e-voting in Nevada matched their exit polls - by the way Nevada used a paper trail.

Go here - <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/todays_show.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/todays_show.html</a>
Go here - <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>

please go to
Posted by (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Did the EXIT POLLS for states with verifiable paper trails match the results ACROSS THE BOARD???? I am no activist, I am only asking. Where e-voting did not have a paper trail - bush lead in each of those states DESPITE exit poll leads by kerry. Even e-voting in Nevada matched their exit polls - by the way Nevada used a paper trail.

Go here - <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/todays_show.html" target="_newWindow">http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/todays_show.html</a>
Go here - <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>

please go to
Posted by (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Want some form of proof
Google Max Cleland and the Georgia voting machine fraud that took place in 2002 - if you love this country you will at least take the time to learn and insist on verification of this election - Diebold owned by republican donors, ESS - former CEO is the newly elected Senator for Nebraska - HE WON ON HIS OWN MACHINES - HELLO! Is this not fishy????
Posted by (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Want some form of proof
Google Max Cleland and the Georgia voting machine fraud that took place in 2002 - if you love this country you will at least take the time to learn and insist on verification of this election - Diebold owned by republican donors, ESS - former CEO is the newly elected Senator for Nebraska - HE WON ON HIS OWN MACHINES - HELLO! Is this not fishy????
Posted by (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
How come...
every time they find an error it turns out to be in favor of the
Republican candidate? That and the fact that the guy who owns
the company that makes the electronic voting machines just
happens to be a Republican is just a little too coincidental for
me.
Posted by (33 comments )
Reply Link Flag
How come...
every time they find an error it turns out to be in favor of the
Republican candidate? That and the fact that the guy who owns
the company that makes the electronic voting machines just
happens to be a Republican is just a little too coincidental for
me.
Posted by (33 comments )
Reply Link Flag
All concerned about e-voting need to read this site...
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>
Be sure to play their one-minute "animation"
a movie showing how easy it is to "monkey around"
with the voting machine audit reports (records of who did what, and when, with the voting records!).
Posted by (5 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Yet another election stolen
This is just sad. How many errors have yet to be found? Why would election offices buy an untested system built by someone who benefits from making sure the machines are ont accurate?

If there is a hell, the lying, stealing cheating mass murderer named Bush has front row tickets.
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
BlackBoxVoting.org "monkeying" with the vote 1-min. movie
Be sure to see the humorous
one-min. movie linked from the site; a direct link to it is <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://blackboxvoting.org/baxter/baxterVPR.mov" target="_newWindow">http://blackboxvoting.org/baxter/baxterVPR.mov</a>
Posted by (5 comments )
Link Flag
All concerned about e-voting need to read this site...
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>
Be sure to play their one-minute "animation"
a movie showing how easy it is to "monkey around"
with the voting machine audit reports (records of who did what, and when, with the voting records!).
Posted by (5 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Yet another election stolen
This is just sad. How many errors have yet to be found? Why would election offices buy an untested system built by someone who benefits from making sure the machines are ont accurate?

If there is a hell, the lying, stealing cheating mass murderer named Bush has front row tickets.
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
BlackBoxVoting.org "monkeying" with the vote 1-min. movie
Be sure to see the humorous
one-min. movie linked from the site; a direct link to it is <a class="jive-link-external" href="http://blackboxvoting.org/baxter/baxterVPR.mov" target="_newWindow">http://blackboxvoting.org/baxter/baxterVPR.mov</a>
Posted by (5 comments )
Link Flag
WHY THE VOTE IS NOT OVER
Bush clearly hacked the vote. That is an act of treason --
subversion of the Constitution -- and also a major federal
crime. Can we allow a criminal and a traitor to remain in the
White House and be Commander-in-Chief? Only the cynical
will say "That's how we always elect Presidents -- through
rigged votes." In that case, what part of our Constitution
and laws are actually meant to be taken literally? Why pay
taxes? The story about the "small frauds" here and there are
just the TIP OF THE ICEBERG. This is a story that is just
beginning to surface -- and it will certainly lead to a
change in our leadership. HOW CAN IT NOT?
Posted by (7 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Looking for Maria Ashot
Masha,

S Novym Godom, of course!

I lost your contact numbers, after a crazy 2004 for me.

I am back in SF Bay Area, my phone number is 510-595-7457.

Hope for your renewed contact.

Volodya
Posted by (2 comments )
Link Flag
WHY THE VOTE IS NOT OVER
Bush clearly hacked the vote. That is an act of treason --
subversion of the Constitution -- and also a major federal
crime. Can we allow a criminal and a traitor to remain in the
White House and be Commander-in-Chief? Only the cynical
will say "That's how we always elect Presidents -- through
rigged votes." In that case, what part of our Constitution
and laws are actually meant to be taken literally? Why pay
taxes? The story about the "small frauds" here and there are
just the TIP OF THE ICEBERG. This is a story that is just
beginning to surface -- and it will certainly lead to a
change in our leadership. HOW CAN IT NOT?
Posted by (7 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Looking for Maria Ashot
Masha,

S Novym Godom, of course!

I lost your contact numbers, after a crazy 2004 for me.

I am back in SF Bay Area, my phone number is 510-595-7457.

Hope for your renewed contact.

Volodya
Posted by (2 comments )
Link Flag
Official balloting counts were corrected!
Yes, an error was made in reporting a ballot count, and that error was found and corrected in the final official ballot tallies. What part of that process was so wrong? None that I can see. The counting of ballots cast is much less a problem than voter fraud due to provisional ballots, multi-state absentee ballot voting, ballots with candidates being omitted, media exit poll reporting...
Posted by elhs (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
You are missing the bigger picture
The fact is that electronic voting is far worse then the old system due to several factors.

1. Diebold is republican. Don't you think it is odd that every error so far due to e-voting went in bushes favor?

2. A lot of areas that use these machines are not printing out each ballot. This is a serious problem. The local precincts can report whatever they want and there is nothing substantial to prove or disprove it. Add this to #1 and our democracy is in danger of toppling.

Our election process is under a dark shadow of doubt. Democracy can not exist under such circumstances.
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
Official balloting counts were corrected!
Yes, an error was made in reporting a ballot count, and that error was found and corrected in the final official ballot tallies. What part of that process was so wrong? None that I can see. The counting of ballots cast is much less a problem than voter fraud due to provisional ballots, multi-state absentee ballot voting, ballots with candidates being omitted, media exit poll reporting...
Posted by elhs (4 comments )
Reply Link Flag
You are missing the bigger picture
The fact is that electronic voting is far worse then the old system due to several factors.

1. Diebold is republican. Don't you think it is odd that every error so far due to e-voting went in bushes favor?

2. A lot of areas that use these machines are not printing out each ballot. This is a serious problem. The local precincts can report whatever they want and there is nothing substantial to prove or disprove it. Add this to #1 and our democracy is in danger of toppling.

Our election process is under a dark shadow of doubt. Democracy can not exist under such circumstances.
Posted by (242 comments )
Link Flag
Bev Harris : Fraud took place ...
Bev Harris, from "Black Box Voting" just released the statement you'll find below.

If you are an American Citizen and you are willing to get involved for real, not only writing in a place such as here, now is the time ...

If you're completely new to this, please visit
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.votergate.tv/" target="_newWindow">http://www.votergate.tv/</a>

If you're a Republican voter, just sit down and relax, now is the time for you to enjoy Bush's "victory" ...
----------------------------------------------------------------------

BBV: Our position is that fraud took place.

Help America Audit

Our organization has taken the position that fraud took place in the 2004 election through electronic voting machines. We base this on hard evidence, documents obtained in public records requests, inside information, and other data indicative of manipulation of electronic voting systems. What we do not know is the specific scope of the fraud.

We are working now to compile the proof, based not on soft evidence -- red flags, exit polls -- but core documents obtained by Black Box Voting in the most massive Freedom of Information action in history.

We need: Lawyers to enforce public records laws. Some counties have already notified us that they plan to stonewall by delaying delivery of the records. We need citizen volunteers for a number of specific actions. We need computer security professionals willing to GO PUBLIC with formal opinions on the evidence we provide, whether or not it involves DMCA complications. We need funds to pay for copies of the evidence.

There are certainly indications that a sting, or at least an investigation, is in play right now.

Strong indications that both Florida and Ohio would be flipped if election manipulations are rolled back. Some indication that fraud may have occurred in at least 30 states.

It's okay to use the "F" word. Fraud. You can say it in public. Pretty soon, they'll be saying it on TV. If no one else does it first, I'll be saying the "F" word on TV shortly.

Fraud.

Use the word.

It's okay, you can say it.

Bev Harris
Executive Director
Black Box Voting
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>
Posted by My-Self (242 comments )
Reply Link Flag
Bev Harris : Fraud took place ...
Bev Harris, from "Black Box Voting" just released the statement you'll find below.

If you are an American Citizen and you are willing to get involved for real, not only writing in a place such as here, now is the time ...

If you're completely new to this, please visit
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.votergate.tv/" target="_newWindow">http://www.votergate.tv/</a>

If you're a Republican voter, just sit down and relax, now is the time for you to enjoy Bush's "victory" ...
----------------------------------------------------------------------

BBV: Our position is that fraud took place.

Help America Audit

Our organization has taken the position that fraud took place in the 2004 election through electronic voting machines. We base this on hard evidence, documents obtained in public records requests, inside information, and other data indicative of manipulation of electronic voting systems. What we do not know is the specific scope of the fraud.

We are working now to compile the proof, based not on soft evidence -- red flags, exit polls -- but core documents obtained by Black Box Voting in the most massive Freedom of Information action in history.

We need: Lawyers to enforce public records laws. Some counties have already notified us that they plan to stonewall by delaying delivery of the records. We need citizen volunteers for a number of specific actions. We need computer security professionals willing to GO PUBLIC with formal opinions on the evidence we provide, whether or not it involves DMCA complications. We need funds to pay for copies of the evidence.

There are certainly indications that a sting, or at least an investigation, is in play right now.

Strong indications that both Florida and Ohio would be flipped if election manipulations are rolled back. Some indication that fraud may have occurred in at least 30 states.

It's okay to use the "F" word. Fraud. You can say it in public. Pretty soon, they'll be saying it on TV. If no one else does it first, I'll be saying the "F" word on TV shortly.

Fraud.

Use the word.

It's okay, you can say it.

Bev Harris
Executive Director
Black Box Voting
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.blackboxvoting.org" target="_newWindow">http://www.blackboxvoting.org</a>
Posted by My-Self (242 comments )
Reply Link Flag
 

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