Manage updates with the Download App
August 22, 2006 10:14 AM PDT
Microsoft reaches out to Firefox developers
- Related Stories
-
Piecing together Windows Vista
November 8, 2006 -
Mozilla delays Firefox 2.0 release
August 16, 2006 -
Logitech keys in to Vista
August 14, 2006 -
Symantec picks away at Vista's core
August 9, 2006 -
Vista Views: What Vista can learn from Leopard
August 9, 2006
Sam Ramji, the director of Microsoft's open-source software lab, posted an open invitation for them to work with the software giant on a Mozilla development discussion group mailing list Monday.
"I'm writing to see if you are open to some 1:1 support in getting Firefox and Thunderbird to run on Vista," Ramji wrote. Mozilla oversees the development of the open-source Firefox Web browser and Thunderbird e-mail client.
He stressed that Microsoft is "committed to evolving our thinking beyond commercial companies to include open-source projects" for Vista, the update to the Windows operating system due for broad release in January.
Ramji was also anxious that Mozilla and the open-source community should not take the offer lightly. He stressed that his contribution to Vista is the "nontrivial effort of getting slots for noncommercial open-source projects."
Early signs from the open-source community indicate that some are suspicious of Microsoft's motives.
But others believe that Monday's offer was a sign that Microsoft is changing. The company has finally realized that "ultimately...proprietary technologies will always get replaced by an industry-supported, open-standard alternative, hence the embrace of RSS, Open Source Lab, XML and royalty-free access to Open XML," one enthusiast wrote in a posting to the Ars Technica Web site.
Firefox already runs successfully on existing Windows, Linux and Macintosh operating systems. Testing by ZDNet UK Reviews found that it also runs well in Vista beta 2, so it's not clear why Mozilla would need help from Microsoft.
Mozilla Europe said it was "too early to comment" on Microsoft's offer.
Colin Barker of ZDNet UK reported from London.
See more CNET content tagged:
open-source community, open source, Mozilla Corp., Firefox, offer
72 comments
Join the conversation! Add your comment
Or more likely, is this just a big PR stunt?
<a class="jive-link-external" href="http://www.techknowcafe.com/content/view/631/43/" target="_newWindow">http://www.techknowcafe.com/content/view/631/43/</a>
CNET. No one can possibly be worse than CNET.
They put Netscape out of business. Hello no! is my answer, go and develop your IE bs browser.
They put Netscape out of business. Hello no! is my answer, go and develop your IE bs browser.
back, screw you over and steal as many ideas as they can from you
in the mean time. Then sue you for infringing on their proprietary
ideas (which were stolen from you to begin with, remember).
Personally, I trust Micro$loth to screw up my computer and make
me vulnerable to every 12 year old with internet access. Oops,
make that I used to - now I have Linux on my machine and I feel I
can trust M$ to leave me alone!
devil.
Here's the smart play. Spurn MS, let it twist. Port Firefox as before,
and prevent MS from colonizing the effort.
Another simple fact: MOST FireFox users are running FireFox on WINDOWS, not an OpenSource OS.
FireFox developers have an offer for assistance from Microsoft. The arrogant anti-MS attitude I see in these comments is pretty ignorant... why not take advantage of their assistance? Since the code is OPEN SOURCE, its not like FireFox has anything to lose.
I've used IE7 and have had nothing but problems with it cruising a variety of web material... So I'm thinking they're looking for some insight from Firefox.
Why would they go to Redmond? Why doesn't MS just look at the code and help them out? This is very suspicious.
If folks think that Firefox works better in Linux (okay, IMHO it does), and they use it because (perception or not) IE is an outright hazard for surfing, then they may indeed be tempted to try the (to them) new OS. OTOH, if FF works just hunky-dory on Windows, they'll stick with Windows, thinking that they're still perfectly safe (they are safer than by using IE to hit web pages, but still...)
/P
One of the main reasons is that if Open Source software truly becomes mainstream it would effectively hurt MS in areas where Windows and Office are concerned.
Software like Firefox and Open Office can be offered to the public either for free or to a fraction of the cost for retail versions of any MS product to any operating system besides Windows; if this type of software was exclusive to Linux and Mac, businesses looking for more affordable alternatives to MS licensed products would certainly look at these other OS products.
Also extending a hand to the Open Source community allows MS control over the development of these products as to how MS wants these products to work in Windows; MS does not want independent software developers to start "peeking and poking" in Vista to find advantages or holes that could either outshine a competing MS product or create a new security hole.
And a third reason is that MS wants to avoid the monopoly label that has been slapped on it by both the US and EU, making it to change its overwhelming marketing muscle.
Open Source should work with MS on a limited basis - asking for developer technical support but not under any type of developer guidelines that can help MS get an edge over its competition.
My two cents,
Ned
There's more than one way to skin and open source cat besides suing over the license, and MS is looking for it.
Microsoft is probably offering assistance to Firefox so that once they do become a part of the Firefox open source effort, their contributions can go down into the record books as showing Microsoft did in fact support open source projects. If there is any future litigation against Microsoft regarding browsers, Microsoft can open that record book and announce to the court that they did in fact work with the competition. On a case-by-case basis, it could actually work in favor of Microsoft.
This is just MS trying to pretend they are into OSS, to use for PR ammo. Nothing more.
Microsoft does not NEED to provide everything when someone else can provide a solution that works and is popular with the users. They can take their time adding the features to their products and they do not need code from open source projects to do that.
- Cnet reports that Microsoft makes an offer to Mozilla folks to make Vista beta builds available and give them access to OS devs if there are problems with Firefox on Vista.
- all the CNET knuckleheads go crazy about how 'evil' Microsoft is just trying to pull some nefarious stunt.
Do you folks all live in a fantasy cartoon world? Why does this have to be some sort of mafioso plot where Microsoft wants to whack the other boss after inviting him to a 'sitdown'?
Let me help you figure this out - Firefox is a really popular application. Microsoft benefits when really popular applications run properly on Windows, especially because people keep buying Windows so they can run their really popular applications.
Is there really more to it than this? Nope.
It is not like Vista is a new OS, and the same executable can be run and any MS OS from 98 on.
From reports I have read Firefox already runs just fine in Vista, but can't personally verify it.
This is a PR stunt, plain and simple.
Microsoft leased Mosaic browser from Spyglass Inc. Then ripped it off, when it was time to renew the lease they said, ummm nahhh thanks we got what we need. Spyglss by the way does not list IE the most used browser out there as an acomplishment. Wonder why.
It took Sun forever in court to get all rights back from microsoft. It is what they do. They con thier way into your dev team somewhere some how then ruin your product while pushng thier version forward. Open source is primed for this with low budgets. Court cases would be easy to tie up while they make billions.
That is what the big deal is. EVERY and I mean Every time, they steal code, key engineers, products, ideas and claim they are thier own.
In browsers Mozilla is giving Microsoft a better run for thier money than others have been able to. Now they want to help them? And they have a competing product? You do not find this odd?
Many only have computers now for internet. Just imagine, if they do not need IE, do they need windows? And now with writely, googles spread sheet, zoho.com, do you need office?
If hitler were alive today, would we let him help set up isreal security?
I mean microsoft has for years down played OS as a fad, then communisum, then a security risk, warned major compaines that if they used it they would loose thier trade secrets and property.
Now out of the blue they are pro OS? Common sense advises cation, speculation and dare I say pause. It is a red flag. An action that makes you say, wait a minute, what is going one here.
Name a project Microsoft worked on with another company besides intel where both came out happy. They have caned and manipulated the biggest names in the business. Like my example above. I belive history give an good indication of what to expect.
I believe that Microsoft has their own reasons, and it's probably to be able to maintain that they are not monopolizing the field, by saying that "hey, firefox works no problem, and we even worked WITH them."
But...firefox is a great product and it works that way not ONLY because it's open source, but because the people working on the project are focused on what is best for people, not just on getting paid at the end of the week. These people use good judgement, and if they do accept Microsoft's offer, they will still have the good sense to know when M$ is wrong, or pushing too much change for a feature or method of computing.
So I agree with Kruk28, there really isn't a downside for firefox.
Microsoft never does anything for the betterment of anything other then their image and bottom line.
"here are a lot of progressive examples of OSS collaboration in MS new technologies like .NET Framework"
MS has very little to do with mono, and really who needs or cares about .NET?
History shows that if you trust MS, and get too close you will get burned badly. There are no new actions coming from the company to suggest otherwise, only words.
Perhaps the real motive is to get the Firefox extentions to also work for IE.
Who knows, but I know one thing. Never trust Microsoft.
They aren't called the Evil Empire for nothing.
If MS were to find the cure for cancer tomorrow and hand it out for free, you'd see the same folks in these talk-backs bashing MS for page after page about how they 'stole' it or 'integrated' it or some other such nonsense.
Not sure how many of you remember the spin Microsoft used to say Windows XP boots faster than Windows 2000. All they did was present the login screen before everything finished loading. It still took LONGER to get to the desktop and start working, but you got to type in your password faster.
said the Great White MShark to the Open Source/Linux tiny fish in the Open Seas of Technology.
MS is the JAWS of the technology Water World.
@ Microsoft: Release Vista when its ready, Id like to free up some time on Tuesdays&..
@ Mozilla: If you smell even a hint of rat, dont let them near the cheese&..
@ everyone else: L16h73n |_|p! Our opinions really mean very little, unless of course we vote with our wallets. (Thats usually when companies begin to listen to us.)
:p
Who here does not already have a WIN9x machine and possibly even a dos machine hanging around to run software or hardware made unusable by Microsofts screw-ups.
The idea that every software and hardware venders should scurry around patching up their software to run on a new OS every few years is unacceptable.
Microsoft is making our lives miserable; Microsoft is not listening to us. Microsoft is giving us everything we dont want and nothing we do.
Microsoft is NOT GIVING US A CHOICE!
Frustrated.
Open-Sorce rules, and proprietary drools!
Would a Microsoft employee use Google in the open for all to
see? I don't know if I trust this report.
As Microsoft has been nearly-convicted several times (they settle often, don't they) of altering thier codebase to cripple/disable 3rd party applications while improving thier own, it could be argued that such degrading changes have occured yet again to Firefox.
Combined with the Netscape and antitrust history (all of it blurs together), they may be fearing the legitimacy of ANOTHER case against them, a very strong case given the prior legally-acknowledged evidence against them.