Craigslist's Craig Newmark--no more Mr. Nice Guy?

(continued from previous page)

Martin Sorrell, chief executive of British media and advertising company WPP, warned traditional media companies to beware of destroyers of traditional business models, according to a report published last week in The Financial Times' online edition. Sorrell singled out Craigslist, according to the newspaper, when he asked the Times: "How do you deal with socialistic anarchists?"

Craigslist as a killer of newspapers is "more mythology than truth," Newmark said. The site is having an effect, but newspapers have bigger problems, with falling circulation stemming in part from the public's growing distrust of mainstream media, he said. Newspapers themselves, he said, are dropping the ball when it comes to responsibility: "Newspapers fail to speak truth to power," he said. The media outlets Newmark praises are decidedly new school: television's "The Daily Show" and "The Colbert Report" and the satirical Web site The Onion.

Consumer rights fight
Still, nothing fires up Newmark more than a fight over consumer rights.

For example, he resisted charging for apartment listings in New York, Li said, until becoming convinced that it was the best way to discourage unscrupulous real estate brokers there from posting "bait-and-switch" listings or repeatedly adding the same listing to the site so that it would remain among the most current ads. When customers perform a search on Craigslist, the company's policy is to display the most recently posted listings first.

Another hot spot has involved Net neutrality. Telecommunications and cable companies have hinted that they may charge companies that eat up more bandwidth than others. Net neutrality proponents, including Newmark, want every Web site to be treated equally, and don't want big businesses acting as gatekeepers. In the end, it's consumers who may end up paying the price. Craigslist has become a poster child for neutrality proponents after Cox Communications recently blocked access to the site. Cox, owner of cable and newspaper operations, blames an unintentional systems glitch for the problem. The problem is still unfixed after more than 100 days and that's made conspiracy theorists of some in the neutrality camp.

And then there's the accusation that Craigslist violated the Fair Housing Act by letting people post discriminatory rental ads. The company is fighting these accusations and last week got a hand from Google, Amazon.com, AOL and Yahoo. According to the National Law Journal, the companies filed a brief in the U.S. District Court in Chicago, saying that ruling against Craigslist could harm the future of many online service.

Still, such charges must hurt someone like Newmark deeply, Li said.

Newmark doesn't belong to any minority group and readily acknowledges that his family was not among the poorest in his New Jersey hometown. Nonetheless, he says he shares an affinity with marginalized groups after growing up a nerd, complete with pocket protector and glasses held together by electrical tape.

"The nerd people as a nation are my people," Newmark said. "That means I can identify, to one extent or another, with people who are left out or disenfranchised. I've never been disenfranchised all that much. I'm speaking a little bit out of turn, I know. But what that means is I know I need to pay attention to people who are seriously left out."

And this goes hand in hand with Newmark's basic philosophy on life and business.

"If you want to be successful try to do the right thing," he said. "In the short term you can succeed by screwing people, but it doesn't work too well long term."

[the1kingarthur]

Wakeup World

If Newspapers would stop rapping people for their classified ads they would not have to worry about Craigslist's, E-Bay or other online advertising. There is no need to charge as much as they do. Some Newspapers like Ann Arbor News in Michigan charge $ 30.00 for a simple 4 line ad.

Wake up you greedy monoplistic over bearing newspaper publishers. Times are hard for the little business person. Offer fair and competive services or get out of business!

[craignewmark]

Hey, please give credit to Jim!

Jim Buckmaster is the guy really running things, does a great job, great article:

http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB115049840863382886-9QyN65ef6meo_D2UlLOxAdRmbN0_20070616.html?mod=rss_free

[appletoys]

Hey Craig!!!

Just wanted to say THANKS!

[appletoys]

Hey Craig!!!

Just want to say THANKS!

[Len Bullard]

Got That Right

I am impressed by the statement that we do what we feel is right and that is the moral compass.

Exactly right. Justice is something individuals do because it doesn't exist in nature. Whether or not he is more moral than his critics, he takes responsibility for his actions. That is a quality of the enlightened. Nations and corporations are abstractions; abstractions don't act. People do.

Good on Newmark.

[scioara]

Well ...

You say "I am impressed by the statement that we do what we feel is right and that is the moral compass."
This works rather well for Craig - by the way, BIG THANKS Craig - and, from my point of view, is an admirable and desirable thing to do.
However, what do we do when people subscribe to this philosophy have no morals - or at least morals that don't match our sense of morality - and, therefore, from our perspective, follow a broken moral compass.

[Bobgarrett]

Craigslist

Move over Billy. Didn't Al Gore create CL?

[bfleming98]

Give him a Break

I listened to a podcast interview of Craig. He sounds like a really nice guy. Sure he could have sold his site for millions, but he didn't. Plus he makes it for free. The press needs to just lay-off.

- Bryan
http://www.BryanCFleming.com

[bobby_brady]

Craigslist lets the little people get back at newspapers

$30 to a ad inserted in the daily paper is ridiculous! I'm glad newspapers are taking it on the chin, because they deserve it!

[-OldTimer-]

Craigs list

Sounds like the recording industry who will not realize this is the 21st century and the way things have always been done is not good enough now and they can not make the change and money at the same time.

[jessterw]

Clarification

In the interest of being fair, the blocking of Craigslist by Cox was not an across the board action. I know of several regional areas where the site is not and has never been blocked.

[ChazzMatt]

who cares?

why won't they fix where it IS still being blocked? for a while they were trying to blame Craigslist for the glitch, when it is proven to be one of the most accessible sites in the world. Finally they saw that stupidity was not being believed and they found the real problem, but they still haven't fixed it. This is a taste of what non-net neutrality will be in the future.

[carefree1]

Cox blocking Craigslist...

In the interest of being fair, the blocking of Craigslist by Cox was not an across the board action. I know of several regional areas where the site is not and has never been blocked.

True...I am in Phoenix, have Cox, and Craigslist has never been blocked.

[extinctone]

Of course Cox will block CraigsList

Look at who Cox owns: Mannheim Auctions, The Trader Company (who in turn owns autotrader.com & autobytel), etc. Why on Earth would they *not* try to censor their stiffest competition?

[Buzz_Friendly]

not everywhere

I have been with Cox out of Hampton Rd Va for several years and not once have I not been able to access CL. In fact as I am writing this the other Firfox tab is on CL looking for used Kayaks.

[wylbur]

Craig never was nice

I got stalked through Craigslist. Craig was no help. When I wrote to him and pointed out how much more helpful MSN was being, he told me I was a liar. When my fiancee wrote to him to ask him to help stop the stalking posts, he wrote to her and told her that I had control issues and she should leave me. We are now happily married. Craig is an antisocial, self righteous jerk who needs to come to terms with the valid criticisms the world makes of him and his selective sense of social responsibility. I hope he loses the fair housing lawsuit.

[fear_and_loathing]

stalking posts?!?

What the hell is a stalking post???

Is that anything like when I was a kid I would just stare at my
little brother until he would yell to mom "MOM..! He's staring at
me!"

It's just a post... If you don't want to read it, you ignore it!
Quite frankly, it you wrote to me and said someone was stalking
you through C.L., I'd have a good laugh at your expense.

[moon_brain]

media access and free speech

Craigslist is one of the finest examples of what the internet should be, along with sites such as eBay, youtube, blogging, social networks, and so on. People like you and me now have more equal access to both produce, publish, and consume mass media, barter and trade with others, and reach across the globe on even a personal level. Of course some parties perceive a threat.

I think commerce is a great thing and I have nothing against large commercial entities on the web.

However, it is clear that more traditional media powerhouses and those with older business models feel threatened when ordinary citizens can just about meet them at level.

The world is evolving. Either get with it or get out. Rupert Murdoch saw the light with MySpace. Apple saw the light with iTunes. Apparently, some of the world doesn't.

Furthermore, those who critizice Craig for allowing discriminatory housing listings are barking up the wrong tree. If there is a blatantly discriminating real estate or rental ad, the victim's complaint should be with the poster and not the web service.
Post at your own risk. Respond at your own risk. It's like life. It's what makes Craig's List beautiful. Let's not take away our own freedoms, folks. Once we lose them, we won't get them back. If you can't handle a site like Craigslist, the newspapers will be very glad to have you back.

[larrymadill]

Craig Not that Big of a Hero

Sure, the guy deserves some credit.

But he also has an odd way of pursuing his social agenda through Craig's List. He seems to pick and choose his sides, and his side seems to always leave people that are looking for legitimate work out in the cold.

He cants a lot about doing the right thing, but at the same time ... Craig's List allows employers to post ads asking for people to work for virtually nothing. This has turned the entertainment and writing jobs/gigs sections into sewers in Los Angeles.

Everyone's complained, Craig's List does nothing, seems to regard people that are looking for legit work in the Business as beneath contempt. "Craig" seems to side more with people who want to pay people for working fourteen hours a day on their short film with "copy, credit, meals" and not with hardworking people that need to make a paycheck to get by.

Not to mention the un-justified flaggings, random blockings, and other nuisiances. Craig's List seems to draw in nuts and scam artist, and drive out legit users.

Ultimately Craig's List is like Ebay. A slice of petty corporate fascism tarted up to look like the consumers best friend. Sure I'll use it until something better comes along. But I won't cry if it goes away either.

[moon_brain]

blame the job posters - not the conduit

I understand that using Craigslist as an alternative to traditional methods and then offering lower or non-traditional renumeration for the work will cause an upset in the field. I understand that you must be frustrated that workers in that field aren't paid what they used to be. I don't think it's a good thing either. But, it is not Craig's fault that those companies decided to "hire" that way. If not for CL, I think they could have easily found or even started their own site to do the very same. Please direct your blame at the parties doing the posting and the hiring.

Also, be wary of the word "Legit." If the employers are in fact doing something illegal, I hope the law catches up with them. If they are simply bucking tradition, then what they are doing on CL is just as legit as the old way - even if you think it's unethical.

There's also a gazillion scams out there. I'm amazed that it's possible to police the site at all, and I'm incredibly impressed at the extent to which they are able to. I hope that they keep up the good work and that Craigslist and other such sites NEVER go under.

I just can't fathom why with so many things these days, consumers want to blame the wrong party...usually the one with the bigger pockets. It's the real estate agents and landlords who are discriminating. It's buyers and sellers who are scamming. CL is just the means. If someone hung up a scam flyer on a coffee shop bulletin board, would you sue the coffee shop?!

[Joe Blow]

Yeah, and Where is the Story about How "Nice" the Media Giants Are, C|NOT?

It's funny how journalists try to walk around with this badge of honor about how they're the defenders of truth, justice, and the American (or, substitute your favorite democracy) Way, while at the same time, licking the boots of the Powers that Be in the Big Media Conglomerates. I could care less what Craig's politics are, as long as he doesn't insinuate them into what does or doesn't get on his servers (i.e., he can do what he wants vis-a-vis competitors, as long as he isn't editing the posts, other than to comply with existing laws). If someone were to try to post a discriminatory ad in a newspaper, the newspaper is obliged to review it before publishing it to comply with established laws, because they have a whole raft of editors and lawyers who do nothing but scour prospective ads to make sure that they don't break any laws. The courts have consistently ruled, on First Amendment free-speech grounds, that public on-line sites cannot be held liable for posts by individuals, and are not responsible for their content, unless they perform an editorial function on anything that is posted (so, they can either review and potentially edit everything, ala the newspapers, or review/edit nothing). If someone (e.g., a prosecutor, or someone who feels discriminated against) wants to follow up on potentially discriminatory behavior, more power to them.

I'm all for anything that levels the playing (for-keeps) field when it comes to us Davids vs. those Goliaths - may they fall on unoccupied soil.

All the Best,
Joe Blow

[wylbur]

editorial function

The trouble is that Craigslist does perform an editorial function. The flagging system only results in posts being deleted at the discretion of Craigslist staff. The courts' rulings are based on the 96 telco act, not the first ammedment. There is little case law, but the cases that there are suggest that discretionary editing by the service provider would void the liability protection congress granted in the act.

[wylbur]

Stalking Posts

The stalking posts were fake posts containing my name and e-mail address in the post body and implied I was organizing a flash mob. This resulted in a terrible inundation of spam and was clearly part of a broader stalking that I was subject to at the time.

[ontharocks007]

hey ! mr graigslist . when i heard about your free add post im like thats cool as hell lol sorry < but im an older guy not much money so i post some things i had for sale and i sold them real quick that was so cool < but then i got blocked i guess < now craigslist wont let me post anything or it wont let log on it keeps saying wrong user name or pass word so pls fix this so i post and pay some bills.ps i dont understand why i got blocked , thanks very much and have a nice day. steve/. or i love to hear from you 864-316-0384