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March 23, 2009 4:00 AM PDT

What's the real cost of free music?

by Greg Sandoval
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SpiralFrog met its end just days ago, and already, operators of other ad-supported music services are rushing to put distance between their business models and that of the doomed site.

"The concept was good, but the management, board (not all), and execution were poor," wrote Robin Kent, the former CEO of SpiralFrog who went to work as an adviser to Qtrax, one of SpiralFrog's competitors. "It was obvious to anyone...it wouldn't survive."

"I think there is a hope in the music industry to turn back the clock. This is not 1999 anymore. There just isn't as much money as there once was in music."
-- Matt Graves, Imeem spokesman

What might encourage supporters to jump to the defense of ad-supported music services, which don't charge users to listen to music but support themselves through ad sales, is the undeniable whiff of failure floating around the sector. In the first three months of the year, SpiralFrog has followed Ruckus, the music service that catered to college students, onto the scrapheap.

Ad-supported music sites have been around for two years, and some have burned through lots of cash, but none has reported a profit. According to a letter sent to investors by SpiralFrog's attorneys last week, the company owed $34 million when it ceased operations on March 13.

Then there's the crumbling ad market. Even before ad money began drying up, questions lingered about whether ad-supported sites could generate high-enough ad rates to pay their costs, which include the hefty fees they pay to license music. Now, against this bleak landscape, comes a new threat.

Some label executives are questioning the value of offering the public music free of charge. For decades, a large number of people have believed that giving away music, such as playing songs on broadcast radio or handing out CDs at concerts, promoted music and helped boost sales. But now some in the music industry suspect that instead of promoting sales, ad-supported services are replacing them.

The problem appears to come down to a question of control. Broadcast radio for years served to introduce the public to new music. Radio was and still is a powerful music discovery tool, says Mike McGuire, a digital-music analyst for research firm Gartner. Only word-of-mouth recommendations drive more music sales, says McGuire, who is working on a forthcoming report on the topic.

But many ad-supported music sites are very different than broadcast radio. Traditional over-the-air radio enabled listeners to hear songs for free but gave them no control over when, or how many times, the song played. At Imeem, a social network that focuses on video and music, and YouTube, the Web's top video site, visitors can listen to songs in their entirety as many times as they want.

"There's nothing left to promote...this way," said a high-level music industry executive who wished to remain anonymous. "At what point do they stop promoting and start competing?"

(Credit: Greg Sandoval/CNET)

According to information supplied to CNET News by the music executive, who requested anonymity, a recent study showed that music purchases made by people who listen to three free-music sources fell 44 percent from the first quarter of 2005 to the third quarter of 2008. Over the same period, the purchases made by people who listened to four sources declined 49 percent.

The sources of free music included both traditional and new-media sources, such as broadcast and online radio, cable and satellite music channels, as well as TV and Web music video outlets.

There are plenty of questions that the data doesn't answer. For example, what were the buying habits for people that listened to two sources or one? Did they boost sales? That information wasn't provided. But what's important to music executives is that the data indicated that the more free music sources a person had, the fewer the number of purchases he or she made. That's not what the record companies want to see.

The source also said the labels are not giving up on sites like Imeem, Pandora, or YouTube. Nonetheless, this is likely one of the reasons why some recording companies are asking for higher fees in negotiations with digital services.

The thinking among some of the labels is that if ad-supported services are cannibalizing music sales, the record companies want licensing fees to cover the losses, the source said. The music services say they can't pay any more.

Matt Graves, an Imeem spokesman, acknowledged that his company's executives asked for and received a break on their licensing terms from some of the labels. That was before the economic meltdown. The labels are less willing now to cut similar deals, the music industry insider said.

Graves said this kind of thinking is short-sighted. He said ad-supported music has been the best defense against piracy. He said the labels should remember that Imeem and the other sites pay licensing fees and often share ad revenue with the labels. Peer-to-peer sites, he says, don't pay or share a cent.

"There's nothing left to promote...this way. At what point do they stop promoting and start competing?"
-- Music industry executive

"I think there is a hope in the music industry to turn back the clock," Graves said. "This is not 1999 anymore. There just isn't as much money as there once was in music. Imeem is not only sharing ad revenue but generating significant download sales. I understand their hopes. If my income dropped by 50 percent in four years, I'd probably be feeling the same way, but we're trying to help them understand the new reality."

McGuire from Gartner argues that a big part of the problem is that ad-supported services haven't figured out how to make money. He says they have struggled to charge advertisers an effective CPM, which, in Web advertising, stands for cost per thousand (page) impressions.

Michael Robertson, a well-known Silicon Valley entrepreneur, founder of MP3tunes.com, and record industry adversary, has long been critical of ad-supported plays. He says the economics just don't work because the sites must pay penny-per-play royalty rates to the major labels, and they just can't deliver enough ads at a high-enough CPM to cover the royalty fees, much less than the other costs of running a business.

He says the sites can't generate a high CPM because advertisers know that people often listen to the free music that YouTube, Imeem, and Pandora offer without paying attention to the ads. "People's ears may be engaged, but it doesn't mean their eyes are."

"What's stunning to me is that anyone is surprised about SpiralFrog," Robertson wrote to CNET. "The economics are very obvious to all in the know, but people keep pretending that the charade of ad-supported music works. It does not."

McGuire agrees that ad-supported sites must adjust their models but disagrees that they are without hope. He says that if word of mouth is still the best music-discovery tool, then social networks are places that "amplify word of mouth." He says his research shows that awareness that social networks offer music is still very low.

This means, said McGuire, that "there's a lot of room to make these things vibrant and relevant."

Greg Sandoval covers media and digital entertainment for CNET News. He is a former reporter for The Washington Post and the Los Angeles Times. E-mail Greg, or follow him on Twitter at http://twitter.com/sandoCNET.
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by dascha1 March 23, 2009 4:35 AM PDT
Maybe one should listen to "Spirit of the Radio" to answer some of these questions, eh? (i.e. echoes with the sound of salesman)
Reply to this comment
by FearNo1 March 23, 2009 10:12 AM PDT
Rush...FTW! Another applicable quote is "One likes to believe in the freedom of music"
by legendale March 24, 2009 1:19 PM PDT
"the craftsmen, the artist will have to be the ones to start...
by nanovation69 March 25, 2009 11:07 PM PDT
Isn't Your Free Music Downloads (www.yourfreemusicdownloads.com) a survivor of the free music downloads rush?
by MadLyb March 23, 2009 5:05 AM PDT
The researchers are right, visual ads will not work. Nobody stares at a music player.

There is only one true 'free' music approach which terrestrial radio perfected years ago...audio ads between songs.
Reply to this comment
by butchlajuan March 23, 2009 5:21 AM PDT
remember the 70's? i used to record the songs off the radio so i did'nt have to listen to the ads. that is the only way that it does work. though. then theres the problem of your target audience.....
by zyxxy March 23, 2009 5:27 AM PDT
And the only audio ads that make any real sense are geographically relevant ads. Local radio works because the local advertising content and local 'news' blurbs and announcements are relevant to the audience. Web streamed commercial supported music will only make sense when they figure out how to insert geographically relevant advertising and announcements. I think that problem can be solved, but I haven't seen it yet.
by dascha1 March 23, 2009 5:38 AM PDT
you mean something like this (probably works with the older folks too)?

http://tinyurl.com/csxhs
by rayzoredge March 23, 2009 5:45 AM PDT
@zyxxy: Shouldn't PHP be able to detect what IP addresses they're establishing connections to and, in that crude way, bring up geographically-relevant advertising using data query?
by ChuckyMMM March 23, 2009 10:44 AM PDT
@rayzoredge

You could use any scripting language to detect at IP address. However, being able to acquire an IP address doesn't translate into knowing where it comes from. One would have to write some sort of script to look up information on the IP address that is captured, and you would need to have access to IP geolocation information either through a service, API, or locally.

However, IP geolocation becomes less accurate the more you drill down to the user's location. It's not 100% accurate to begin with, but is in widespread use today. One example of huge inaccuracy is a business I used to work for. The business started out in New Jersey and moved to Wisconsin, and continued to use the New Jersey IP addresses because they are licensed the business. If you were to do geolocation advertisement on one of their IPs, you would end up seeing advertisements for New Jersey in Wisconsin!

So, theoretically, yes, you can do audio advertisements based upon IP address, but it becomes less accurate if you were to drill it down to the city level.
by viper396 March 23, 2009 12:43 PM PDT
@butchlajuan, you say you "used to record the songs off the radio so i did'nt have to listen to the ads". If you think about it, your activity held you captive to the ads. You had to constantly listen to the radio in order the distinguish the ads from the music and you invariably did listen to the ads at least once in order to stop/start your tape recorder.
The music and radio industry were certainly not suffering during the 70's and 80's.
by djpts March 25, 2009 6:49 AM PDT
TargetSpot.com helps properties like Slacker, AOL Radio and CBS Radio monetize their streams with audio ads. Any advertiser can buy an ad on these services and target the ad geographically in a few minutes. It generates meaningful revenue and it is a fast growing medium. Up to the property to decide how frequently they want to serve ads, but advertisers are embracing this medium due to it's interactivity (every audio ad has a visual, clickable, component in the player), measurability and targeting. This is the future of radio advertising, and this type of advertising will ultimately make the internet medium viable and profitable.
by Comodor_Falkon April 16, 2009 3:40 AM PDT
@ChuckyMMM

You're typical American citizen... :-D World is ending 1 mile from shores of USA... :-D :-D

Maybe for some US (and Russian?) intra-country IPs it would not work, but for most cases, IP geolocation would be pretty accurate... ;)
by Universal_Indie_Records March 23, 2009 5:47 AM PDT
Spiralfrog was doomed from it's inception and they threw in DRM on top of that!
Reply to this comment
by aMUSICsite March 23, 2009 6:00 AM PDT
Cut out all the people in the middle. Pay a cut of the advertising straight to the artist (ReverbNation does this already). Then the bands make more money if they drive more people to the site/service.

There is going to be less money generated from music therefore the money will go direct to the artist, then it will be the smart ones that invest this money on self promotion and the services labels used to provide. Which is a better model than a label giving you a contract saying we will provide X amount of services, give you Y now and if we manage to sell enough will give you some more, maybe....
Reply to this comment
by Renegade Knight March 23, 2009 7:17 AM PDT
In an automated world you don't need as many middle men as before as well.
by oldguytoo March 23, 2009 8:24 AM PDT
Artists cannot market themselves nearly as well as a label. Internet marketing is still not nearly as effective as print/radio/television marketing. Those who promote internet marketing are shortsighted, and blinded by their belief traditional model is outdated. Support Record Store Day, April 18, 2009.
by dumbspammers March 23, 2009 8:54 AM PDT
@oldguytoo: Wrong. Joanathan Coulton is doing quite well. In my previous comment I said I had stopped listening to music altogether except for satellite radio, but then I remembered that I buy and download Jonathan Coulton's tracks.
by oldguytoo March 23, 2009 10:24 AM PDT
dumbspammer - who the heck is Joanathon Coulton??? Never heard of him. I can guarantee you that if he were known outside his immediate circle, he would want the traditional model to expose his music to the masses, and to make a living from his efforts.
by Comodor_Falkon April 16, 2009 5:16 AM PDT
@oldguytoo
dumbspammer is right...
No matter you don't know who mr.Coulter is (nor do I) he probably could move his fanclub to use particular website - and that is MUCH MORE important for marketing than overall knowledge, particulary when mainstream market is full, maybe even collapsing due economic crisis..

"if he were known outside his immediate circle, he would want the traditional model to expose his music to the masses"
That's maybe OK for tasteless popmusic (dunnno who is trendy now), but for more "traditional" genres, faithfull fans are more important..
In an area of Symphonic Metal even Apocalyptica - despite using "traditional" advertising methods - rely mainly on fans who usually knows about weeks before advertising starts.. And despite Apocalyptica's music is slowly going to be more "trivial" to be plausible for mainstream listeners, for most of them it's still too complicated music and they will NOT respond to such marketing model...
by vikinzer March 23, 2009 6:23 AM PDT
I do not understand why no one in the ad supported music business cannot figure out how to make this work? Hulu figured it out. Look at what makes money in the traditional businesses and then adjust it to the new media. You don't LOOK at ads on the radio. You hear ads on the radio, and while they may be mind numbingly obnoxious I prefer them to my sources of music failing. They need to get audio ads on services like pandora the way that Hulu and other commercial video sites have moved to a full video ad format. This isn't rocket science.
Reply to this comment
by Renegade Knight March 23, 2009 7:18 AM PDT
Hulu isn't too bad but their library is lacking. Every time I turn to them to watch something it's not something they have. For example, they have season 5 of a show, but not season 2 which is what Im' trying to watch. Not very handy. On the rare occasion they do, It's not too bad a service.
by knowles2 March 23, 2009 12:11 PM PDT
Spootify already doing audio adds, they also have adds all over there program. But there audio library is alright, most of the stuff there, and I just torrent what is not but there search engine it ****.
by mitrich March 23, 2009 7:08 AM PDT
The real problem with free music is torrent downloads, not services like Spiral Frog. I used the Frog a lot. It appeared to be a front for Amazon.

Tracks missing from albums at the Frog were tracks one could not buy at Amazon without buying a while album in mp3. Also, on one album, where Amazon had a mis-spelling of the name of the album, the Frog repeated the error. The error could have originated with the publisher; but in the face of the evidence of missing tracks, I don't think so. Also, the download utility smacked of being an Amazon cast -off.

The thing with torrent downloads is that they can take a very long time to finish. 3.5 gig could take ine day or one week, depending on the "swarm" of seeders.

If mp3 tracks were properly priced, no one would go near a torrent download, legal or not.

But just try to find reasonably priced downloads of Jazz at Amazon. The prices are usually just below that of the full CD, and often well over US$1.00 per track. I bought The Who, "Thirty Years of Maximum R&B at Amazon, 95 tracks for about US$39.00. That is US$0.41 per track. Even that is too much for something sitting on a server. But it is cheap enough to keep someone from going looking for a torrent.

I buy a lot of music in mp3 at Amazon. I do not use iTunes, where I believe that the price structure is even worse.
Reply to this comment
by darfjono March 23, 2009 7:52 AM PDT
>If mp3 tracks were properly priced, no one would go near a torrent download, legal or not.

oh how wrong you are
by Maccess March 24, 2009 6:49 AM PDT
Torrent downloads are not "free." They cost money in terms of one's investment in a computer, storage space, search time, learning the software, internet service and electrical power.

People would gladly buy a discount DVD at $5, or a song from iTunes at 99 cents, rather than waste their time downloading a possibly bad pirated copy of a creative work.
by darfjono March 25, 2009 5:53 AM PDT
>by Maccess March 24, 2009 6:49 AM PDT
>Torrent downloads are not "free." They cost money in terms of one's investment in a computer, storage space, >search time, learning the software, internet service and electrical power.

>People would gladly buy a discount DVD at $5, or a song from iTunes at 99 cents, rather than waste their time >downloading a possibly bad pirated copy of a creative work.

INVESTMENT IN COMPUTER
well if you haven't done that sure it'll cost money.
STORAGE SPACE
ridiculously cheap. Externals are cheap and internals hold quite a bit
SEARCH TIME
yeah, all that effort spent typing "song title" into pirate bay or youtube or demonoid sure hurts me
LEARNING THE SOFTWARE
install>run>drag torrent into program>sit back and enjoy. it's not rocket science. there's no learning curve here.
INTERNET SERVICE AND ELECTRICAL POWER
i'll give you this one. however, i'll also say that driving to the store and buying a "$5 discount dvd" probably costs more than a torrent. itunes download also applies to the use of electrical power and internet service, and you need a computer.

>People would gladly buy a discount DVD at $5, or a song from iTunes at 99 cents, rather than waste their time >downloading a possibly bad pirated copy of a creative work.
i wouldn't. besides, i've never once found a "bad copy" of anything. then again, i don't use AIDSwire and KaViRuS
by Renegade Knight March 23, 2009 7:22 AM PDT
@ThePantsParty

AT&T Should be able to lock out the data plan or at least access so people unwilling to pay the fee can use WiFi features for their data needs. That's not an iPhone issue, it's an AT&T issue.
Reply to this comment
by mattumanu March 23, 2009 9:34 AM PDT
Don't you just love random comments?
by Renegade Knight March 23, 2009 11:53 AM PDT
I love the random errors as well. Grrrr...
by JCPayne March 23, 2009 7:26 AM PDT
The world is practically in a depression. Who has money to throw amay on CDs when u can listen to the radio free?
Reply to this comment
by BtmnHatesRbn March 23, 2009 7:57 AM PDT
Should've stuck to cylinder phonographs...
Reply to this comment
by fc528e March 24, 2009 7:10 AM PDT
Comment of the Article
by aSiriusTHoTH March 23, 2009 8:26 AM PDT
Hulu is backed by to major content publishers, so of course they found a way to make it work. They themselves, own have of the content! duh....
Reply to this comment
by seangates March 23, 2009 8:41 AM PDT
New music models are emerging and will replace the ad-supported model. We launched a site recently that does just that: http://www.turnitupmedia.com. There aren't and royalties paid and no CPM, but rather a CPE (cost per engagement) for the advertiser because the ads are directly targeted to users based on their profile. Also, the advertiser only pays when the engagement is completed.

The other side of this coin is the ownership of the music. With TurnItUp site users get ownership of the songs they download. This gives them the ability to put the music on any device without the restrictive DRM.

Lastly, the labels and artists will be paid for their music. Win-win-win all around.
Reply to this comment
by Maccess March 25, 2009 7:05 AM PDT
I hope you're able to distribute outside the United States.
by kannuc March 23, 2009 8:46 AM PDT
another situation which has not be addressed is the same CD repeatedly being sold on eBay, half and amazon. I haven't purchased a new CD in a decade but instead buy a 'like new' CD and immediately resell it after taking what I want from it
Reply to this comment
by dumbspammers March 23, 2009 8:52 AM PDT
I stopped buying CDs from US publishers the day Metallica filed their first lawsuit against their fans. I stopped buying *any* music CDs the day it was revealed that Sony was putting rootkit viruses on their audio CDs. Now I download podcasts, and I no longer listen to any music except satellite radio. I see no reason to think that I wil lever go back.
Reply to this comment
by screamapillar March 23, 2009 3:19 PM PDT
Such a sad state of affairs isn't it dumbspammers? I wonder if the music (and most of the media eg movies) industry will wake up and see that the model they were using pre-internet is not effective and they need to innovate. Many artists are doing this successfully (Nine Inch Nails, Radiohead, and others mentioned on this forum). It is criminal that Sony, instead of trying to work with the new trends just tries to hammer their way through to forcing their old model. We cannot honestly expect this model to work forever, yes it was a cash cow, but now it is time to move on. The music industry has changed models many times and every time they were resistant and accused the incoming model of destroying the industry (even vinyl was accused of destroying live music and I'm not talking in this century either).
by Comodor_Falkon April 17, 2009 2:24 AM PDT
Well, I stopped when I found out, than despite CD production cost is about 0,3$ price was usually around 10$ (for local-known-artists), from which only 0,3-0,5$ is going to artist and more than 9$ is swallowed by shops, label, etc...
(Well, older CDs can fall even to 4$, but...)

So I prefer torrents, or in case of some groups, I'm now negotitating that they would sell they CD to me without middle-man..
by Dave_Allen March 23, 2009 9:27 AM PDT
Hi Greg,

I sincerely believe that ad-supported music services will always fail. As long as the music labels keep holding on to land grabs and creating transactional friction via inordinately expensive licensing deals, there will only be failure. It is odd that for years the labels have given away songs to radio and videos to MTV for free but they foolishly don't understand the concept of "never" under estimate the power of a free MP3'

Dave Allen

www.pampelmoose.com
Reply to this comment
by sandonet March 23, 2009 3:17 PM PDT
Dave,

Thanks for posting. It's good to see a well-known artist (and well-known music blogger) posting comments here. I appreciate it.

What do you think a better model for ad-supported services would be or rather how do you think the labels should approach the ad-supported segment?
by TV James March 23, 2009 9:45 AM PDT
Hey, I found LAUNCHCast plus to be a good value and happily paid for it. But apparently it wasn't a decent business model or something.

Maybe they should try something like freeware - abbreviated (but usable) versions of songs that play for free. Buy the album and you get several versions of each song edited in different ways (like directors' cuts with DVD players).

Services like Pandora will make it really easy for artists to gain access to a large audience without a lot of marketing, as well immediate feedback to the quality of their offerings. Do good music, get a lot of thumbs-up, get a lot of sales of the audio tracks/albums as a result.

But the music companies need to recognize that the world has changed. We don't sit around listening to albums. We listen to individual songs on players that give us variety without innane DJs blabbing on and horrible locally produced ads for services that we don't need (or will call AAA or AHS for). The publishers don't have the same kind of control (stranglehold on artists and listeners) that they once did. Figure out a business model that gives us control and still makes money - because if the big publishers don't, someone else will. The money's still out there. Maybe not the same kind of money or the same way of collecting it, but there's still money to be made.
Reply to this comment
by shoelaceninja March 23, 2009 9:48 AM PDT
No matter how much their salaries go down though, t hey are still making a lot of money. Can they not face the fact that maybe a lot of people don't like the music that they sell? I for one, can't stand most mainstream music. They are selling themselves to perform to get money. And the people who work at the record companies make money off of the people who perform, so they pretty much control what music gets put out for everyone to see. If it gets them money, they sell it. Maybe they just need to change what they sell, and don't be greedy bastards about it. Don't own people and their music. If someone is truly good at music, they can sell it themselves.
Reply to this comment
by Len Bullard March 23, 2009 9:53 AM PDT
Foolish? Ad revenue? Free streams? Piracy? Yadda, I am tired of it.

1. Production costs have dropped for the indies. For the A-list talent that can't afford a single bad note and can only work with the best, costs are still high. Quality == Money. There is no way around that one. Look at the radio playlists and note the inordinately high proportion for tracks from 1964 to 1975. When the rewards were higher, music was better. American Idol will not get the numbers at those auditions that give them a statistically certain final 12 of high quality for a $500 prize.

2. ANY one who has tracks can go to MySpace/MyMusic and sign up for free. That solves the radio problem. They can add the Snocap service for free. That solves the pay-for-copy problem. This is easy, honest and there are good artists signing up for it.

3. Gresham's Law: bad money drives out good. The fact of cheap production means there is a very large volume of product and the costs of pushing good above the din are still high. For the indie, a well-managed set of Facebook pages and other free-access media can build a base but it requires someone to pay a lot of attention and time.

4. All of this means an indie has to have an organization and these people need to be paid. Pay particular attention to the way Arlo Guthrie put together RisingSonsRecords. They keep it small, tight and high quality. They leased back the early recordings and see to the high quality production otherwise. "In Times Like These" is a masterpiece and deserves a Grammy. They use every available outlet. He Flickrs and heck, he even reviews restaurants on the road.

There isn't the money concentration, but I think the money is still out there. What is going away is the fat middle, the entertainment industry with its extremes of lavishness that took the money from the pockets of the artists and gave it to the 'yes' people. The tour buses are still rolling. It's very tough for the songwriters and producers who don't tour or can't produce saleable product. Copyright income is harder to come by and that means mechanicals are still desirable but will increasingly fall as more artists defect from the ASCAP/BMI/SESAC triumvirate and turn to the self-managed online services.

We'll still have American Idol because the Golden Calf is an attractive dream and eternal. But we as artists and consumers will have more choices and we will use our social networks to cull just as we once used our friend's record collection in high school to find songs.

This is ok. A better perspective is emerging and while it frosts those who want the bigger returns or believe they deserve to be superstars, at the other side of the interregnum, I believe we are going to have a healthier industry and with that, the quality artists will rise. They just won't have as many houses and they'll have to spend more time paying attention to their fans and being a part of it all instead of apart from it all.

The new avatar of the new age isn't Dylan. It's Arlo. Get a clue.
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by Comodor_Falkon April 17, 2009 2:54 AM PDT
Just a small adition - I guess that there will be more mutations of websites like www.bandzone.cz - in fact band-oriented-MySpace-like site...
If I seek for a new music - this is my first stop..
For example:
1) http://bandzone.cz/interitus - well known symphonic metal group, also with downloads
2) http://bandzone.cz/secondchance - unknown group cooperating with above mentioned Interitus, that rocks on a stage (i had seen them on one neo-classical/symphonic metal concert) and is preparing their debut CD which would be sold probably only via this page..
3) http://bandzone.cz/project - that band turned into a single guitarist project last year, who is now composing short instrumental melodies, and all of the music history, except yesterday added "Na rozlou?enou II" is downloadable..
by bahamude March 23, 2009 11:10 AM PDT
The real cost of free music is nothing. During the height of the original Napster, CD sales were hitting record highs. Why? Because people were suddenly exposed to music they hadn't considered listening to before. I personally bought more CDs because of Napster in the early days because it widened my exposure to music and artists I hadn't ever considered listening to before.

Enter Radiohead years later and how they gave away their new album for free over the Internet and allowed people to give them as much as they thought the album was worth. They made more money on that one album than ALL of their previous albums combined.

Who's losing out? The record labels/companies who used to be the exclusive broker to music. Ironically by cracking down on the original Napster, and suing single moms and kids they've brought about their own doom. Now the only people making money in the music industry are the lawyers who sue kids and the musicians who can take their music directly to the people.

The Record Companies/Labels have made themselves an obsolete entity and deserve the extinction that privilege entails.
Reply to this comment
by wildbillc777 March 23, 2009 12:15 PM PDT
Bravo. Couldn't agree more.
by screamapillar March 23, 2009 3:31 PM PDT
QFE
by wildbillc777 March 23, 2009 12:13 PM PDT
I bought tons of music during the Napster days. Napster reminded me how much I liked music, and had disposable income to buy it.

Things have changed since then.

The RIAA cases really turned me off to the music industry. Since the RIAA legal massacre, as moral and ethical payback, I would rather poke a fork in my eye than buy a CD. I will never buy a CD again as long as I live. Period.

You guys are all missing the adversising point. Here's the kicker, I'll pay you NOT to advertise. I hate broadcast TV and radio because of ads, so I don't watch or listen. Same for satellite video and audio streams. When they start advertising, I'm turning them off too.

I don't want any more ED commercials or vaginal itch commercials, or hemmoroid commercials, or commercials that warn about side effects like sudden loss of blood pressure and blurred vision. In fact, If I see those things, I immediately turn off the source....or just circumvent with the fast forward feature.

I would gladly pay a couple hundred bucks a year for a commercial free digital stream of music and video that I choose.

So here's the model....I post a wad of money and music brokers enter competitive bids to service me with on-demand music and video. Easy huh?

I DO NOT want cd's, I DO NOT want albums. I do not want more disgusting advertising content in my living room. I want to choose the where and when and what is delivered into my house, and I'll gladly pay you for it.

.......but not into any of the retrotechno business models I've seen so far....so please just keep the Pandora and on-demand Netflix coming until you figure out how to digest the above, and are ready to bid for entertainment account.

Wild Bill
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by TV James March 23, 2009 1:33 PM PDT
I agree with all but one point. I don't want it to stop at my house. I want it available where I am on a device I'm already carrying. And ideally, without a separate device. I'm already carrying a personal cell phone and a work phone (even though they both ring together with Google Voice) and when I want to listen to music then I've also got the iPod. (When I get a newer Blackberry, sure, I can have Pandora, but there's still less control than my iPod.)
by screamapillar March 23, 2009 3:36 PM PDT
Yuppers, the model needs to be completely transformed and changed. The complete overwhelming and invasive level of advertising is beyond the joke and like you, Wild Bill, I am utterly fed up with it. I have my no junk mail sign on my letter box and it is routinely stuffed with junk mail. In Australia there is a 'don't call' list that the fed's run, so that telemarketers etc aren't allowed to call you. Everyone on the list gets called and have to then complain etc just to get something done about it. Australia also has anti-spam legislation, even for mobile phones. Guess who gets dinged the most for spamming? The phone carriers themselves!
I'm with you, give me a model where I can bypass the advertising, hand over my cash like a good little consumer and be on my way.
by bhushan bhaagii March 24, 2009 9:55 AM PDT
An omnibus subscription system won't work. How will the revenues be distributed? Who gets how much?
Do you create a huge bureaucratic organisation that monitors and collects subscription, and parcels out
royalties? In which case, we are back to the old system of record labels, isn't it?
by darfjono March 25, 2009 7:15 AM PDT
i like this idea quite a lot.

no more commercials for ED and endless commercials for services/products i will never have an interest in? sign me up
by zgreenwell March 23, 2009 12:58 PM PDT
I don't see how ad supported groups are much different than Radio.
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