Version: 2008

Microsoft's shrinking license

By CNET News.com Staff
Oct. 18, 2006 4:00 AM PST

With an eye to quelling piracy, Microsoft is making changes to its licensing terms in Windows Vista.

Under the changes, buyers of retail copies of Vista will be able to transfer their software to a new machine only once. If they want to move their software a second time, they will have to buy a new copy of the operating system.

The license changes also apply to virtualization: Customers can only transfer the copy of Windows once, including a transfer from one physical machine to a virtual machine, or from a virtual machine on one PC to a virtual machine on another PC.

To find out what people on the street make of it, we asked our Vista Views panel, made up of ordinary readers, this question: The move is designed to help Microsoft battle piracy. But is it too stringent?


Brian Scates

I don't mind Microsoft protecting its products from piracy, but I have to draw the line at the point it creates major headaches and inconvenience to legitimate customers. For PC enthusiasts like myself who do frequent overhauls of their systems, limiting installs to two is a serious problem. That kind of licensing would be considered completely unacceptable with any other software product, and I don't know why Microsoft thinks it's OK for Windows.

If they proceed with this licensing, I would expect it to backfire and result in more piracy, not less, as enthusiasts seek ways to circumvent it with hacked copies. Nobody pirates a legitimate copy of Windows anyway, so why punish the people who are actually paying for it? This would certainly put a damper on any enthusiasm I have for Vista. I'm willing to pay for it, but I'm not willing to pay for it more than once.
Brian Scates is the president of Web hosting company Foing.com.



Nate Ardle

Nate Ardle

No. I can't remember when I moved my operating system to a new computer anyway. When I buy a new computer, it always comes with a new operating system. No problem as far as I can see.
Nate Ardle is a minister with an evangelical interdenominational ministry on the campus of the University of Michigan.



Jeff Rosado

The new licensing will have a limited effect on most people; however, I believe that tech enthusiasts will be the ones that have the biggest problem with it. While I do understand Microsoft's intent to combat piracy, I think that it could be implemented in a better way.

If someone buys a copy of Windows, they should be able to install it on any single machine at one time, an unlimited number of times--but how to do this in a way that would stymie piracy? Perhaps if they developed a mechanism which would allow a user to uninstall Vista, or deactivate it on one machine, that would generate a special reinstallation/activation key that would be used to install it on a different machine.

As for the virtual machine licenses, I don't think this will have too much of an impact on general consumers, as the majority of people who will be running virtual machines will either be using the Enterprise version of Windows Vista, or will be using a developer's version via MSDN.
Jeff Rosado is the owner of a computer consulting company providing tech support and training to businesses and individuals in Pensacola, Fla.



Robert McLaws

Robert McLaws

Ed Bott and I first brought this up on our blogs, and our analysis has held up, despite efforts by certain pundits to claim otherwise.

I'm really on the fence on this one. On one hand, I can see Microsoft's perspective that most people wouldn't run virtualization on Vista Home Basic anyways, so why worry about a license transfer there? And since XP didn't have the provision on transfers, it was abused profusely by piracy. From their perspective, they're just tightening the screws the same way they did for the security problems.

At the same time, there are a statistically significant number of people that will change motherboards often enough for this to be a serious issue to them. However small a percentage Microsoft thinks that will be, with the installed base they have, it's not an insignificant number of people. And the unfortunate thing for Microsoft is, those are the same people who tend to be influential, and those are the people that will scream the loudest.

Just remember, however, how forgiving Microsoft was over multiprocessor/multicore licensing. With 4, 6, 8-core chips on the horizon, they have made some good decisions, and credit should be given where it is due. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't hold their feet to the fire where appropriate.

So here's my counter-question: Should transfers be staggered by edition? Meaning that Home Basic would have one, Home Premium would have two, and Ultimate would have five? That would take into account the fact that most regular users won't swap out their motherboard regularly, but most enthusiasts will.
Robert McLaws is an IT consultant, community leader and Vista enthusiast. He has been running Vista enthusiast site Longhornblogs.com since 2002.



Joe Rud

Yes, these rules are too stringent. I believe that if a customer buys a retail copy of Windows (or any other software) that they are entitled to move that license around as they feel appropriate, as long as it is only installed on one machine at a time.

I do agree, however, that OEM licenses should be limited to the machine they come with. My reason for this is that the customer is actually paying a lot less than retail for this software.

With a purchase of full-price retail software (several hundred dollars) the user should be allowed to transfer the software as they desire.
Joe Rud is a computer industry professional from from St. Louis Park, Minn.



Gary Knigge

Gary Knigge

I am very concerned about this very aggressive copyright protection scheme. I don't believe it is ethical for Microsoft to make legitimate users suffer in order to make it harder for software pirates. There are just too many scenarios where people will need to install the OS more than twice in the life of the Vista product. In fact, it seems very likely that a large proportion of people will do so.

Clearly, Microsoft has a right to ensure that people using its products have legally acquired the right to do so. But I believe their customers also have the right to reinstall a piece of software as many times as necessary and for as long as they choose to continue to use the product.

As long as they are installing on just one computer, why should it matter to Microsoft if they've had a hard drive failure, purchased a new computer, or just want to install from scratch to eliminate some operating system problems?

I have been beta testing Microsoft Vista for several months. I cannot play a normal DVD movie rented from Netflix on my computer because Microsoft says it can't verify the copyright protection of the (mainstream ATI) video driver. Again, Microsoft is erring on the side of copyright protection rather than the side of trusting its customers.

Microsoft demands that we pay and then pay again. Are we beginning to wonder who the pirates really are? A reasonable company might find a way to protect software licenses that does not interfere with legal fair use by those who have purchased a product. It seems clear that as Windows becomes more and more the standard, Microsoft does not find it necessary to be reasonable. Living under a despot never did feel good.
Gary Knigge is an IT support person at the University of Wisconsin-River Falls, specializing in Windows desktop support for faculty and staff.



Stewart Retsis

Far too stringent. If my computer needs formatted more than once, then I'm up a creek without a paddle.

As for hurting the sales figures, no chance--it's Microsoft, after all.
Stewart Retsis is a normal PC user who lives in Thurso, Scotland.



Kevin Faaborg

Kevin Faaborg

I think this change is WAY too strict. I can't change my motherboard, or RAM or anything else. Or how about a computer crash? I'm only allowed to have my computer crash once? Please tell me you have a way of controlling how often my computer crashes, Microsoft, and maybe I'll invest that money into Vista, but we all know this is no perfect world.

With this main part in mind, my likelihood of purchasing Vista has dramatically dropped. In fact, at this point, I'm considering instead of bothering going to Vista, to instead just switch to OSX and be done with it. Microsoft has released so many things in regards to Vista that changes how an average user can use Windows, that I'm starting to reconsider my platform in general and that maybe I have invested enough money into Microsoft.

Microsoft, please don't make this true, or this may be the straw that broke the camel's back for a lot of users.
Kevin Faaborg works in basic hardware and software guidance for a large financial corporation, but he has experience in more computer sales-based jobs.



Wayne Sharpe

Wayne Sharpe

Yes, I believe this is too stringent. People should be allowed to transfer to as many different computers as they wish provided that they have WIPED the past computer before they do the transfer.
Wayne Sharpe is based in Ontario, Canada.



David Colon

My only major concern is if this applies when you upgrade your components such as your hard drive or video card, etc. as I have heard happens to others in XP where they had to reactivate their copy. As long as this isn't the case, then I really don't care about this license transfer thing. This would be the only way it would affect me and I'm hoping and expecting that this will be a nonissue.

As for the rest of the e-population that reads CNET.com: I'm willing to bet that this probably won't affect 95 percent of you. The other 5 percent are the ones that don't really respect the time and effort it takes to make an OS of this magnitude and feel that it's their right to be able to install it on as many machines as they would like. This is against the law not only for Microsoft's software but for any other pay software as well (unless otherwise noted in the EULA).
David Colon is a software developer in the QA department of a medium-sized government Web site application development company.



Wallace Wang

Wallace Wang

While Microsoft has the right to protect their software anyway they can, it's definitely a hassle for legitimate customers. Still, most people are just going to get Windows "for free" on their new PCs so the only people buying retail copies of Windows will likely be people building their own PCs.

In that case, restricting Windows to a single transfer is definitely too stringent. Legitimate customers should be able to transfer their copy of Windows to as many machines as they want for their own use as they keep upgrading to newer and faster machines, but how can Microsoft verify this? They can't, which is why they're resorting to such draconian measures.

If you buy a retail copy of Windows Vista knowing this restriction exists, then you can't complain. The answer is simple. Vote with your wallet by either buying Vista anyway and getting stuck with this restriction, or don't buy Vista and use Linux instead. All of Microsoft's antipiracy tactics have inconvenienced me long enough. That's why I've dumped Windows and moved to Mac OS X. Whether it's a "better" operating system is debatable, but it's just another alternative for people who don't want to put up with Microsoft's nuisances any more.
Wallace Wang is a freelance computer journalist and author whose books include "Microsoft Office for Dummies" and "Steal This Computer Book."

The Vista Views panel is being brought together by CNET News.com to discover what people on the street think about Microsoft's new operating system.

We're looking for a range of perspectives--from beta testers to business buyers to home PC owners.

Interested in joining the panel pool? Here's how it works:

Whenever key Vista news breaks, we'll e-mail a question to contributors. Sometimes, we'll ask a yes/no question and use the answers for a simple poll. Other times, we'll look for more in-depth feedback on Vista events. It doesn't matter whether you send us two pages or two sentences--we value your comments. And if you don't have an opinion on a particular story, or you don't have time to respond, that's fine too.

The feedback will often reach our readers. Our writers may quote panel remarks in stories. Or we may pull together comments--your two cents--in an article of their own. Occasionally, we'll ask contributors to take part in a weekly podcast to discuss their views with News.com editors and industry experts.

We want to know what our readers think, as Microsoft gets ready for one of its most important launches in years. If you haven't signed up yet, send an e-mail to us at vista-views@cnet.com.


More panel feedback
Story: Microsoft to lock pirates out of Vista PCs

Reader comment from Bill Johnson:

"Although some would probably think that Microsoft is going overboard with this one, I honestly believe that this will only help further prevention of piracy."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Will Vista stall Net traffic?

Reader comment from Brian Scates:

"Should Vista include IPv6 support, but not enable it, the driving force in desktop computing in the world would be hampering the worldwide adoption of a needed Internet infrastructure upgrade."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Leopard nipping at Vista's heels

Reader comment from Callum Jones:

"I think nothing should be copied--it just gives Apple fans another thing to point and laugh about. With MS doing that, we would be flooded with too many forum threads about Leopard vs. Vista. MS should sit down and focus on what they need to create, not re-create."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Bloggers to Microsoft: Take your time with Vista

Reader comment from Wallace Wang:

"We've been waiting over five years already for the successor to Windows XP, so we might as well wait a few more months for Microsoft to ship a secure, reliable operating system."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Symantec sees an Achilles' heel in Vista

Reader comment from Brian Clarke:

"Symantec needs to find a better business model than fear-mongering and profiting off of insecure operating systems from Microsoft."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Gates: 20 percent chance of Vista delay

Reader comment from Robert McLaws:

"Everyone has complained for years that Microsoft doesn?t listen to its customers. So why now is everyone complaining when they finally DO start listening?"

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Gates to bow out at Microsoft

Reader comment from John Kneeland:

"Ideally, it would mean that Microsoft will focus less on adding new junk and instead focus on making the existing junk work well."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.

Related News
Special coverage
Piecing together Vista
All the latest on the Windows update.


Videos
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CNET Reviews:
Windows Vista RC2

First Look: Vista still not ready for prime time.
October 12, 2006


Peek at Vista
CNET Reviews:
Peek at Vista

New features are designed to appeal to nonbusiness users. February 22, 2006


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A view of Vista
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Blog
The latest Windows blog postings on News.com.
Credits

Design: Gautama Swamy
Production: Kristina Wood


Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 3 pages (90 Comments)
Vista licenses hurts Virtual Test Labs
by rcardona2k October 18, 2006 4:57 AM PDT
The market for testing all kinds of software, even home market
software will be hurt by the virtualization license restrictions.
Does Microsoft not want us to test software on Home editions?
While, yes this can be done on the business and Ultimate
versions, generally there's regression testing on all supported
OSes. Using virtual machines with their Undo disk capabilities is
perfect for this kind of testing. But Microsoft licensing says
Home editions must run on physical machines. This means
using PXE or physical provisioning. That's just too high a
burden for testers. The quality of software of Home edition will
suffer as a result.
Reply to this comment
Vista licenses hurts Virtual Test Labs
by rcardona2k October 18, 2006 4:57 AM PDT
The market for testing all kinds of software, even home market
software will be hurt by the virtualization license restrictions.
Does Microsoft not want us to test software on Home editions?
While, yes this can be done on the business and Ultimate
versions, generally there's regression testing on all supported
OSes. Using virtual machines with their Undo disk capabilities is
perfect for this kind of testing. But Microsoft licensing says
Home editions must run on physical machines. This means
using PXE or physical provisioning. That's just too high a
burden for testers. The quality of software on Home editions
will
suffer as a result.
Reply to this comment
vista
by orangecrate October 18, 2006 5:50 AM PDT
bull **** if bay a copy have the right to install more than one time
Reply to this comment
Another view.
by Philips October 18, 2006 6:25 AM PDT
Probably that would be final push for me to install Linux at home as main system. Anyway, I would have to buy Windows at retail, since I do not buy OEM systems.

I already use Linux most of the time anyway. In office about 75% of time, at home about 90% of time. (Special thanks go to VMware Player.)

In the end, I use Windows only to play games. Though now that were rare events, since I have bought Nintendo DS Lite ;)
Reply to this comment
I used to be a die-hard Windows Geek...
by fred dunn October 18, 2006 6:48 AM PDT
But the writing on the wall for some time now is that Microsoft is going to the deep end and is trying to take all of it's user base with it.

I for one don't intend to follow.

I respect their need for control over piracy but do not respect their means of doing so.

I have been a die hard windows fan and administer thousands of windows systems including servers and directory services but the changes that are coming along with Vista are too much for me. Sure I'll support at work but I'll also start into Linux for my personal use and then start working it into the enterprise slowly.

Microsoft is just a bunch of programmers at heart and there is nothing they can do that others can't.
Reply to this comment
As I understand it
by Buzz_Friendly October 18, 2006 6:53 AM PDT
The same license transfer applied to Windows XP and is just clarified in the Vista EULA. That said I think piracy is a poor excuse to punish legitimate customers. Items I pay a lot more for I do not constantly prove that I did purchase. Product Activation, WGA etc etc is simply over the top. It only punishes the legitimate user while the pirates keep on their merry way. What if your car or home constantly required that you own it. Maybe your car won?t start until you authorize with On Star at GM or you can?t unlock your front door until you verify with the state or locality that it is in fact your home. I am a techie and constantly change and manipulate hardware coupled with the fact I build my own PC?s. I can say I have no intentions of buying a second copy of Vista or anything else unless I plan to put it on two separate computers. Guess I will simply adopt pirate techniques to be a legitimate user. If on Ubuntu or SUSE handled games a little better??.
Reply to this comment
Piracy will increase
by mikey999 October 18, 2006 7:14 AM PDT
This will just cause users who have never used pirated software to start! There will be a way around this shortly after the software is released. This will cause users who are legitimate users to start using pirated software!
Reply to this comment
Dongles work
by ewartle October 18, 2006 7:21 AM PDT
Microsoft - Give away the software.
Sell USB or Parallel dongles to allow the software to work on a single machine. Other companies have been doing this for years to protect their software. Why not you?
Reply to this comment
As a frequent upgrader...
by J_Satch October 18, 2006 7:24 AM PDT
...who has been through 3 or 4 major component upgrades since switching to XP (but only running my copy of XP on ONE machine), this, if true, seals the deal. No more Windows. I'll either switch to Linux or buy a Mac and use Bootcamp/XP for gaming. See ya Bill and Steve.
Reply to this comment
no Vista for me
by YankeePoodle October 18, 2006 7:38 AM PDT
I think I wont buy Vista for long-time to come. Atleast 6 months after Visual Studio - Orcas is released. There is no incentive for buying Vista as soon as it is released given that there are certain work-arounds to be done for the Visual Studio 2005 to work on Vista.

I hope in the mean time MSFT comes to its senses and changes this limited installs.
Reply to this comment
The day when you HAD to run Windows is long gone.
by rcrusoe October 18, 2006 7:43 AM PDT
Just a few years ago the majority of business users really had to run Windows, but no more.

MS is going to have to learn that people have real alternatives to Windows these days. The harder they try to hold on to their desktop monopoly the quicker they will lose it.
Reply to this comment
This is bogus
by poudyg October 18, 2006 7:45 AM PDT
I think limiting vista in two machines is completely bogus. I regularly format my drive and do fresh installs so that my machines runs tip-top. I seriously am going to think about getting Vista soon.
Reply to this comment
This is a conspiracy to kill the hobbist...
by umbrae October 18, 2006 7:58 AM PDT
I have been have power spike issues at home, and over the past 2 months I have had to replace 2 motherboard and several other pieces. In this time, I have had to contact MS 7 times to get new keys for XP. This process was frustrating enough, but under this I would have to buy windows vista 4 times! Just because parts are blown out. And BTW, XP sees a new, SAME MODEL, motherboard as a NEW motherboard.

I will never be upgrading to Vista, but I am worried what will happen when they decide to drop support for XP.
Reply to this comment
what do you expect from an illegal monopoly
by befuddledms October 18, 2006 8:29 AM PDT
this is ridiculas.
I hope the MPAA does not follow this same asinine logic.

Under the ms thinking, you buy a DVD and the license says that you can only play it in one DVD player ever. You get to "transfer" it to another player only once so if you want to play it in your bedroom you can only watch it there thereafter.

That would be insane but that is the same logic that they are using.

If they are truly "innovators" as they claim to be surely they can come up with a better way to verify that it is installed on only one PC at a time.

What happens if your motherboard dies? What about your hard drive? How do they define the PC that it is installed in? the main board, processor, HD, the case?

The more I deal with MS the more I hate them.
Reply to this comment
Most ppl above don't understand the new License regime
by nonicks October 18, 2006 8:37 AM PDT
I am amazed at how most ppl (whom are claimed as enthu(s), leaders and tech wizards - by c|net) just don't understand the core of new License regime.

New License doesn't restrict you from installing Vista on same machine N number of time. What it's restricting is - HOW MANY MACHINES YOU CAN INSTALL IT UPON.

Which is pretty okay to combat piracy.

If your machine crashes, it's fine to Re-install Vista.. as many times you want. All you got to do .. is re-register your OS at MS Website/ through Phone.

The process gonna validate.. if the "CPU ID and Serial # combination" exists in the Database. If yes, it's fine. If NOT... MS gonna allow you this only twice and it will lock you out after that or what they call it as "reduced access" mode.

So, please get your records straight.

c|net.. you guys MUST validate each posting. It's ironical to read half-baked information on a webite like c|net. Please mentain your repo guys.
Reply to this comment
Not a Good Idea
by WJeansonne October 18, 2006 9:09 AM PDT
I typically reinstall Windows once a year to refresh the systems on my home network. Typically the systems gets so bogged down from everyone installing and unstalling apps the registry gets cluttered and systems eventually come to a crawl. If Windows is released every five years, then I'm screwed.
Reply to this comment
Microsoft Has the Right to Do What They Want
by DecliningUSDollar October 18, 2006 9:11 AM PDT
Microsoft has the right to do what they want with their products.

Microsoft is a slave of capitalism.
The ultimate right and power belongs to consumers, who will cast their votes with their dollars. MICROSOFT AND ANY OTHER COMPANY MUST YIELD TO THE WANTS AND NEEDS OF THE CONSUMER OR THEY WILL SUFFER THE SAME FATE OF ALL OF THE OTHER BUSINESSES WHO DID NOT LEARN THIS LESSON.

By purchasing a product, you the consumer are casting a vote in support of the company and their business practices.

If you buy product x from an individual or company who treats you like crap, then you are saying with your dollars that it is acceptable for the individual or company to treat you in this manner.

When sales and profits decline, Microsoft will listen.

Bill Gates is rather obviously, a very smart man, he has seen the writing on the wall and has wisely stepped aside, he knows what is coming.
Reply to this comment
It is a very bad policy
by rpranesh October 18, 2006 9:38 AM PDT
I bought a retail legal copy of XP Professional 2-3 years back. Since then couple of my motherboard died or got upgraded. Right now i am on my 3rd motherboard. With delays in Vista, i do not see when i will buy another legal copy of Vista. By the time probably i would be using my 4th motherboard. I install XP only on one system and I expect to have this flexiblity and option and not just 2 installs.

If this goes through, I am NOT BUYING Vista retail copy.
Reply to this comment
Just to milk more money out of us
by kenkrauss October 18, 2006 9:44 AM PDT
Yeah, what do you expect from an illegal monopoly? Why hasn't the U.S. government stepped in?

This is just to milk absolutely every last penny out of the Windows user community. Microsoft is afraid that if users buy a Mac to run Windows virtualized in the Mac OS, then eventually they'll realize how much better the Mac is and drop Windows for good. Likewise for Linux. Do yourself a favor and drop Windows now. Macs are what Windows aspires to be -- easy to use, elegant, and secure. Linux is good, too.

Push back against this insidious rights management now! Don't settle for software that puts their own interests far above their users' interests like Microsoft does. Use Macs or Linux instead.

Although I personally think Vista will eclipse Windows Millenium in terms of the greatest step backwards that's supposed to be an upgrade.... Most users who digest their own information and don't blindly accept all the slop that's force-fed them by the establishment will jump from the sinking ship that is Microsoft in favor of quality operating systems like Macs and Linux with this release even without such a horrible rights management anyway. This is sure to speed it up, though!
Reply to this comment
Glad I kicked the (bad) Microsoft habit..!!
by imacpwr October 18, 2006 9:55 AM PDT
Is M$ out of thier head..?!?! I for one have updated to a newer
computer but retained the old OS. What about replacing the hard
drive..?? Where does M$ draw the line on the term "moving"..???
Well I know one thing for sure, Vista isn't going to be a headache
for me because I switched to a Mac already and I SURE AM GLAD I
DID NOW BEFORE I GOT STUCK WITH VISTA..!!!!
Reply to this comment
Showing 1 of 3 pages (90 Comments)
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