June 6, 2007 4:00 AM PDT
Tech seeing red over green-card proposal
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A software engineer with a sufficient number of points to make the green card cut isn't necessarily the one his company would want to hire, Sun's Sachs said. He compared a pool of generically qualified software engineers with that of doctors--"what happens if I'm interested in finding a brain surgeon and I've got a bunch of people to pick from, a pediatrician over here, a podiatrist over here, but no brain surgeon?"
There's also the constant worry, he added, that the allocated number of green cards will run out before everyone who is qualified for them can apply.
Compete America argues that any glimmer of uncertainty about whether potential talent could be shut out by point system requirements means the idea should be tested before Congress moves to scrap the existing employer-based green card system.
Right now, companies are able to sponsor and apply for green cards directly on behalf of the foreigners they wish to bring onboard, provided they can certify that there's no qualified American who can do the job and that the potential foreign hire has the necessary credentials to fill it.
The best of both worlds?
That additional flexibility is a major reason why Compete America has applauded an amendment (PDF) chiefly sponsored by Sens. Maria Cantwell (D-Wash.) and John Cornyn (R-Texas) that is expected to be voted on this week.
The amendment would reinstate 140,000 employer-based green cards while keeping the proposed point system in place. The effective number of green cards allowed under the amendment could climb even higher because it would exempt from the cap "very highly skilled immigrants." That category includes people who have earned a master's or higher degree from a U.S. institution or have received national or international acclaim for "extraordinary ability" in the sciences, arts, education, business or other fields.
Technology companies also have praised the amendment because it would provide for potentially huge increases in H-1B visas, the temporary work visas they have long argued are available in too short a supply to fill crucial gaps in their operations.
The underlying immigration bill already proposes a bump from 60,000 to 115,000 H-1Bs per year. The amendment proposes making available infinite quantities of such work permits for anyone with an advanced degree from a U.S. university or with advanced degrees in science, technology, engineering and mathematics from foreign universities. A similar proposal, also co-sponsored by Cantwell, has already been introduced in the Senate.
The amendment has drawn renewed alarm, however, from the Programmers Guild, a group that represents American technical and professional workers in information technology fields and argues for limits on worker visas.
Decrying the legislation as "war on American tech workers," the organization has argued that the unfettered crop of foreigners with advanced degrees alone would flood the market, discouraging American companies from hiring native graduates.
Kim Berry, the group's president, said in an e-mail interview that the point system is also problematic because it "distributes green cards unnecessarily, with no finding that no Americans are available." By the Programmers Guild's interpretation, the bill erases an existing requirement of certifying a U.S. labor shortage before hiring a worker on a green card.
A merit-based point system could prove a good approach if it gives immigrants more leverage to choose their employers and to bargain for better salaries, said Ron Hira, a professor of public policy at the Rochester Institute of Technology who has written critically about outsourcing American jobs.
"Employers, at the low-skill and high-skill, have shown that they can't control themselves from exploiting the programs," Hira said in an e-mail interview. "So, I think the key positive factor is this de-linking the visa from the employer."
Federal auditors reported last year that not all employers who take on visa workers had committed to paying their recruits the so-called prevailing wage determined by the U.S. government.
Sun's Sachs, for his part, blasted any allegations that high-tech companies have been taking advantage of foreign labors, adding that foreigners are actually paid "quite well." He added: "My flip response to it is that might be right in a bizarro world, but it's not true in this dimension, where I live."
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32 comments
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The Tech companies are nothing but a bunch of slave oversee'ers. They should be ashamed to keep a class of people in indentured servitude.
The h-1b program itself is being used to outsource jobs. More high-tech jobs are being removed by the h-1b program than could ever be created by the program.
It is a fact, that Indian IT Outsourcing companies use a huge number of h-1b visas to train their (Indian only) engineers, and then send them back home to continue outsourcing whole departments.
You cannot discriminate in the hiring by race, creed, or NATIONALITY.
When Indian companies only consider h-1b candidates (and then only from from India), for jobs based in the United States, it is a clear case of discrimination.
Prejudice in hiring decisions is a crime in the United States, it violates Federal Civil Rights laws. When companies are found to have violated such laws the punishment can include criminal sentences.
The main question is, if there is a job in the United States, do Indian IT companies (that are h-1b dependent) even consider a non-Indian candidate?
So far all evidence, and all the numbers point to a the startling fact, U.S. engineering candidates are barred from applying for U.S. jobs created by Indian IT companies.
Some of these Indian IT companies have U.S. staff that is 90% or more Indian, and almost all here on h-1b visas.
In open testimony before congress, a U.S. Citizen and job applicant tried to get an interview with for an open position in the United States. She was told that she could not apply for the job, just (and only because) because she could not be hired under an h-1b Visa.
Congress is merely asking questions, and India is protesting way-to-loudly. Something aweful (a complete disregard for Civil Rights) is being coverd up by the whole Indian IT industry and the Indian government.
There is no equality in the hiring practices of these h-1b dependent Indian IT companies, either you are Indian or you are not, that is the hiring criteria for an Engineer at an h-1b dependent Indian IT company for a job based in the United States.
This clearly is discrimination, this is prejudice, this is wrong, and against U.S. law.
The american people have the right to know when companies are destroying the very fabric of our society, by planting the seeds of racism, prejudice, and discrimination.
India threatens us with trade sanctions unless allow their companies to continue to discrimate. Call their bluff, India needs trade with the U.S. more than the reverse. Further what good is trade, if it leads to riots, protest, and civil unrest. Discrimination, more than any other, is something that we all agree needs to be eliminated.
The Senators are merely asking questions. Clearly though, we need to subpoena these companies. This is the biggest case of open-discrimination, bigotry, and prejudice in the United States today.
Karmal Nath (the Indian Commerce Minister) and NASSCOM (the Indian Service Companies group) knows Indian IT companies discriminate against U.S. citizens. They know that that Indian IT companies practice discrimination in the United States. And they are trying to black-mail the U.S. into letting it continue.
My @$$. Over 35? Too old, so-called "rusty skills", don't want you. Pale male? Forget it. Dot-com experience? Go sell programs at Wrigley or drive cab. Been making middle-class pay? Not here.
It must be all about cheap labor. That is why you rarely see any significant efforts to reach out, educate and train Americans. Where are the public service TV commercials? You don't see that but we consistently you see request for more foreign workers. Consistently we see more stress being placed on our social services with Americans getting the short end of the stick. Its certainly shameful and it has to do with greed and corruption in our political system and those who deny that reality and try to skirt around the issue with contrived statistics, well, shame on you for selling out your country to the lowest bidder.
I also notice that some of the fastest growing job categories (from the "survey") are all but excluded from present HB-1 and NAFTA visa classes. That will become a bottleneck in the near future.
Perhaps a point value based on mutual temporary worker exchanges could be added. Some people like to see the world and work at the same time, but don't intend to settle down. For every american who gets a job outside the country, a foreign worker can temporarily take their place. For instance, I know Canada has a stripper shortage right now - how about an exchange of people with brains for people with booty? :)
Special interests (the above greedy suckers and those they are in bed with and take money from) want to degrade workers pay and leave this nation without sovereignty and dumb us down to mexico's level. It all comes down to: do you want a United States, or do you want this amnesty with increased immigration plan.
I that the government is still espousing that there are too few engineers in this country...that's strange because I sat in a room with 91 engineers in all disiplines and background, all looking for work for more than a year all being told that while our experience was stellar a more qualified candidate was chosen. That candidate most often was foreign. We all came to the same conclusion...There ARE plenty of engineers in America but they are not willing to work for minimum wage. After the unemployment runs out you are no longer counted.....What wrong with this picture?
In short, they have no business working in high tech.
Few Americans with the background and up to date skill stay unemployed and under paid for long.
Most of this whining are from people who can't understand why they can't get a job with their l33t VB and HTML skills, but know nothing substantial. It must be the immigrants fault.
You want a real high tech job? You need to invest in serious education and work your ass off. If you want a job that requires little skill or brains, go get an MBA or something.
Tech workers must be self-taught, whether or not they have degrees. A degree program cannot encompass everything that a tech worker needs to know.
FWIW, tech companies can hire whoever they want. However, don't force the unemployed US taxpayer to bring these people into the US. Let these companies complaining about the so-called shortage set up offices on their own nickel in the countries where these presumably better candidates reside. Let us keep our tax money and use it to set up our own businesses, and compete.
www.ready4greencard.com