Let them come here to work and we benefit from the dollars spent here. Let them stay home to do the same work and our dollars help their home economy. India is already home to the equivilent of programming and tech support sweat shops connected by telecommunications that make them seem as if they are sitting in our own back yards. The visa limits don't work.
Ok, so does anybody really believe these companies when they say this is a technology issue? The rules on VISAS clearly state that the company must show that there is nobody in the U.S. who could perform the work.
With the number of IT employees out of work in the U.S. do they really want us to believe they need to bring in more foreign workers to be competitive? This is about paying lower salaries for the same jobs.
Gates gets my vote for "Most likely to be pulling a fast one." yet again.
who wants more IT workers? no one is talking about them! they are referring to foreign ENGINEERS with Master's degrees and Ph.Ds, not IT guys. now why would US tech industry want foreign engineers? because it's a large pool of educated, smart employees with fresh ideas and different perspectives from which to choose from.
The US has plenty of qualified techies if pay levels are adequate. For example, we don't see Google whining about a lack of H1B's.
I suspect MS's problem is that it's flat stock price has limited upside and it's image is tarnished in the tech world. When coupled with their low wage levels MS is finding trouble finding competent techies.
Rather than fixing the underlying problems they're instead trying to import people who don't know any better and who -- once they're here and learn -- can't quit without losing their visa.
Good point. Indeed, we don't hear Google whinning about that. Actually, I've heard that only from Microsoft.
On the other hand, apart from the high/low wages matter, I still believe that more open immigration policies favors the nation in the long run, especially if applied to people who come to work with IT, engineering and science (just look to what happened during World War II, when european immigrats, mostly jews, contributed to lots of the technology that gave America an advantage then).
I'm one who believes that outsourcing generally is beneficial to all parties/companies/countries involved.
However, this story features Democratic Party Senator, Patrick Leahy. He's advocating the H1B visa limits be abolished.
Wasn't it the Democratic Party that during the elections of 2004 was accusing the republicans of favoring outsourcing at the expense of the American people? Weren't they the party that was so concerned about job losses because of outsourcing?
Now that it's not an election year, is it okay to outsource jobs because the Anerican voter is not listening as closely?
Seems like there is conspiracy to smear the US IT Workforce
The only reason why jobs are leaving the US is because of the high value of the US Dollar versus that of other currencies such as the rupee or yuan.
Further, most of the jobs I have personally seen taken by H1-Bers were mundane jobs such as, build engineer, IT technician, junior programmers. Most that I have worked with possessed only a BS degree.
For the most part the design and management was done by US IT workers. And by design I mean everything from programming achitecture, user-interface, database structure... and so on.
The out-sourcing and H1B effect is to reduce the number of full-time starting positions. It does not create opportunity in the US.
Further it perpetuates a second myth, that the US is losing it's technological competitiveness.
Most IT work (programming, design, development) is learned on the job. This is evidenced by the large number of developers that do not possess Computer Science degrees or who have been in the business since before the widespread adoption of modern programming techniques (Object Oriented Programming, IDE's and alike).
For the most part what I read in the press seems to be based lobbyist hype. Lobbyist hype that is geared toward fooling Congress into thinking we need more IT workers.
Although it is possible for H1-b worker to switch jobs. I have never seen an H1-ber do this. I have worked with about 100+ h1b workers in the last 10 years, not 1 ever switched. At the same time I have seen about half my US co-workers switch jobs.
I can't believe that these people can go up to the world, keep a straight face and spout this garbage about the lack of a qualified American workforce. I mean when is our governemnt EVER going to get it that there is NO SHORTAGE of SKILLED LABOR, just a SHORTAGE OF CHEAP LABOR?
Didn't the crash of 2000-2001 and the loss of millions of Americal tech jobs teach these money hungry hogs a lesson?
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spent here. Let them stay home to do the same work and our
dollars help their home economy. India is already home to the
equivilent of programming and tech support sweat shops
connected by telecommunications that make them seem as if
they are sitting in our own back yards. The visa limits don't
work.
say this is a technology issue? The rules on VISAS clearly state
that the company must show that there is nobody in the U.S.
who could perform the work.
With the number of IT employees out of work in the U.S. do they
really want us to believe they need to bring in more foreign
workers to be competitive? This is about paying lower salaries
for the same jobs.
Gates gets my vote for "Most likely to be pulling a fast one." yet
again.
steve gets my vote for "talking out of his arse."
I suspect MS's problem is that it's flat stock price has limited upside and it's image is tarnished in the tech world. When coupled with their low wage levels MS is finding trouble finding competent techies.
Rather than fixing the underlying problems they're instead trying to import people who don't know any better and who -- once they're here and learn -- can't quit without losing their visa.
On the other hand, apart from the high/low wages matter, I still believe that more open immigration policies favors the nation in the long run, especially if applied to people who come to work with IT, engineering and science (just look to what happened during World War II, when european immigrats, mostly jews, contributed to lots of the technology that gave America an advantage then).
However, this story features Democratic Party Senator, Patrick Leahy. He's advocating the H1B visa limits be abolished.
Wasn't it the Democratic Party that during the elections of 2004 was accusing the republicans of favoring outsourcing at the expense of the American people? Weren't they the party that was so concerned about job losses because of outsourcing?
Now that it's not an election year, is it okay to outsource jobs because the Anerican voter is not listening as closely?
Further, most of the jobs I have personally seen taken by H1-Bers were mundane jobs such as, build engineer, IT technician, junior programmers. Most that I have worked with possessed only a BS degree.
For the most part the design and management was done by US IT workers. And by design I mean everything from programming achitecture, user-interface, database structure... and so on.
The out-sourcing and H1B effect is to reduce the number of full-time starting positions. It does not create opportunity in the US.
Further it perpetuates a second myth, that the US is losing it's technological competitiveness.
Most IT work (programming, design, development) is learned on the job. This is evidenced by the large number of developers that do not possess Computer Science degrees or who have been in the business since before the widespread adoption of modern programming techniques (Object Oriented Programming, IDE's and alike).
For the most part what I read in the press seems to be based lobbyist hype. Lobbyist hype that is geared toward fooling Congress into thinking we need more IT workers.
Although it is possible for H1-b worker to switch jobs. I have never seen an H1-ber do this. I have worked with about 100+ h1b workers in the last 10 years, not 1 ever switched. At the same time I have seen about half my US co-workers switch jobs.
Didn't the crash of 2000-2001 and the loss of millions of Americal tech jobs teach these money hungry hogs a lesson?