Opera, Firefox squabble over best-browser claim

A Mozilla Foundation employee has lashed out at Opera Software for claiming it won a best-browser award, saying the award was actually won by open-source browser Firefox.

Opera sent out a press release last week claiming it had been named the best Web browser by technology magazine PC World. "A winning streak: Opera once again wins PC World's World Class Award for best Web browser," according to the release.

A few days later, Asa Dotzler, an employee at the Mozilla Foundation, claimed that PC World had named Firefox as the best browser.

"Firefox not only won the coveted Product of the Year award, sweeping all 99 other products in the list, but it beat out two other browsers, Maxthon at number 12 and Opera way down at number 88," Dotzler said in his blog on Tuesday.

An Opera employee, Haavard Moen, said on Wednesday that the company was no longer sure whether it had won this award and had updated its Web site to make this clear.

"At closer inspection, it appears that Opera might not have won the best browser of 2005 award from PC World after all. Opera is listed as the only browser in the 'Web' category, which I guess got us confused," Moen said in his blog. "We've removed the 'best browser' stuff from Opera.com until PC World gets back to us to clarify things. We're posting a statement in the near future as well."

Despite the vehemence of Dotzler's initial blog posting, he said in a later posting that he does not hold any hard feelings against Opera and would celebrate if it took significant market share from Microsoft's Internet Explorer.

"There have been a lot of people accusing me of hating Opera. They're simply wrong. I don't hate the Opera browser at all. I think it's moving in the right direction and for my use (and I suspect for many power users) it's the second or third best browser available--depending on whether or not you have access to a Mac," Dotzler said. "If Opera can start taking significant market share away from IE, I will be cheering right along with the Opera users."

More information on PC World's best products of 2005 award is available here.

Ingrid Marson of ZDNet UK reported from London.

[Bill Dautrive]

Obvious

The fine folk at Opera were just trying to pull a fast one. Firefox was listed as #1, period. Maxthon is not a browser, and should never be confused as one. It is a shell for that POS IE.

Opera would do better if they: a) lowered the price of the thing or b) stop offering a ad supported 'free' version.

FF and Opera are both excellent browsers, but opera is not good enought o be foreced to pay for it or look at ads.

It is amazing that people still use IE. I have yet to see one publication(that is not affiliated with MS) recommend IE since Firefox came on the scene. Pretty much the only people you see admit to using it are totally clueless types and the people, for whatever reason, worship and defend MS no matter what.

[dinkelburt]

umm...

Or those who have to use it for work or for sites that require it :-)

[mortis9]

fool of a took...

you must be joking. as is the case with their monopoly in the OS market, their near monopoly in the browser market (80% +) makes it a necessity to use I.E. i use firefox for nearly everything, but the only extension i have installed is 'ieview', because no matter what, you're going to run into a site that won't run without I.E. (like windows update perhaps...)

[gotip]

IE still the winner

I laugh at all the trouble everyone using these other browsers have. I have never had any trouble and everything I click on works.

IE still rules and with the new version coming out still will be number 1.

The comments posted sound just the same as the Mac crowd. Just can't see how people would enjoy using Microsoft products that actually work.
LOL

Opera is the best

"Opera would do better if they: a) lowered the price of the thing or b) stop offering a ad supported 'free' version."

They do both now. Opera now 's free and ad-free.
But I myself think even they don't do, it's still worth the price.

[tokeman]

Opera is free

Opera doesn't have the ad supported browser anymore it a free browser like all the others
thats why opera is getting so much attention now.
but you are right it isn't as good as firefox cus opera freezes

IE still the best

I tried Firefox & opera. Frankly, I dont see the attraction of either. FireFox is a functional browser, and very suitable as a main browser, but its not enough for me to want to stop using IE. Firefox seems sluggish, the interface is a bit unrefined, and the pop-up blocker doesnt work all that well. In addition, I see no noticable improvement on rendering, or even 'standards' adherence. Often the program hangs for a period of time on me. Yeah, it has tabbed browsing, but I dont care for that so its not an issue. On the security end of things, FireFox is turning out to have just as many holes as IE, so I dont see any advantage to it there either. I've never had a significant security problem with IE 6 to begin with. Just disable ActiveX, run XP SP2, and stop surfing the pr0n sites :-)

Honestly, I think most of the FireFox love comes from it being more of a geek fashion statement than having any real advantage over IE. It's just the hip thing to hate MS.

FireFox does get one recommendation from me, though...it is the best browser on linux. Though I'm still partial to Konqueror as well.

Opera...well, I tried it, but again, underwhelmed.

[David Arbogast]

Mostly Agree

While some people argue about small technical advantages, Squire argues that the real assessment should be made based on market share. And he has a point. Although, most of the Firefox and Mozilla users are geeky enough to let small feature-sets and an anti-Microsoft attitude define their position.

http://www.inaniloquent.com/PermaLink.aspx?guid=01c2f9f3-df0c-482d-a9ec-bc2ca831baf6

[Bill Dautrive]

Are you on crack?

Even if you turn off all the BS, it is still worse then FF or opera, by miles.

Besides, shutting of activeX, pretty much eliminates any possible reason for using IE.

[open-mind]

Not IE Version 6

That's the "standard" browser where I work ... a fortune 100 company.

IE6 has no popup blocker.
IE6 doesn't support tabs.
IE6 doesn't edit HTML.
IE6 doesn't support LDAP.
IE6 can't do email, newgroups, or chat.

Netscape and Mozilla do all that stuff.

[Kelson]

Standards capabilities

Actually, there's quite a bit defined in the CSS standard that IE simply does not implement, but that other browsers like Firefox (just one capital letter, like Microsoft) do. Ways of selecting page elements, for instance, or multi-level transparency in PNG images (finally coming in Internet Explorer 7!), or using CSS to automatically add content before or after an element. Consider adding class="outside" to any links that leave your site, and having the browser automatically add the appropriate icon based on your style sheet.

For further reading:

CSS/Edge: Experimental cutting-edge (at the time) CSS techniques
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/

Mozilla/Opera/Safari Enhancement: How to use extra capabilities with browsers that can use them while keeping the site accessible to IE.
http://www.mezzoblue.com/archives/2003/06/25/mose/

Dean Edwards' IE7: A script that converts standards-based code on-the-fly into a structure that IE 6 can understand. (He named it when Microsoft was still insisting there would be no IE7.)
http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/overview/

[NWLB]

To each their own.

There are going to be some people that like IE, just as there were when it was a dog of a program during Netscape's run.

I like and use Firefox, I don't use IE unless somehow I can't use FF on a page. I also have Opera installed and use it before IE if a page does prove incompatible. Ultimately FF will be as compatible as IE is now, there simply hasn't been enough time.

I presently have 9 tabs running in a single FF window. I can't do that with IE. Some will sneer at the mention of tabs, but I love them. They have changed HOW I browse the net, and that is huge if I'm not alone in that.

NWLB
****
http://www.nwlb.net

None Of The Above!

My vote would go to the Mozilla Suite 1.7.8 especially since I've got my "AOL Instant Messaging" features already integrated... why do I need another "browser" on my desktop!

;-)

[tlite722]

who cares...

you all need to get some color to your pasty skin tone and get into the sun a bit more. to claim the best is absurd. user interface is subjective and while FF could have raced ahead with a secure angle, it showed the true difficulty (if not IMPOSSIBILITY) of flawless coding. FF will continue to have vulnerabilities as will IE. and if you think Qwerty is right because he *thinks* he's not brainwashed to be antimicrosoft then maybe you are as dumb as he thinks you are.

[JLP]

Firefox, Opera both awsome

I have both Firefox and Opera installed on my PCs. And I think they are both great browsers. I use them both all the time although I use Firefox a bit more becase of very nice extensions you can get for it. And both are developing in the right direction of supporting open web standards and keeping it simple and safe to browse internet. Firefox and Opera are light years ahead of Internet Explorer in almost every part.

[mortis9]

tabbed browsing is the god of my chicken

firefox was my browser of choice prior to learning how that it had tabbed browsing... simply cause it was faster than i.e. in many ways and it was my linux browser of choice. now that microsoft has released a toolbar for tabbed browsing i scoff and say NAY! i wouldn't even call it tabbed browsing it's so poorly implemented. one tilt of my mouse scroll wheel opens a tab, one tilt the opposite direction closes it or scrolls to the next. i love that sh*t and i've got 3 moniters (2 computers) on my desk so i don't even need to worry about how many windows i've got going at once.... anyhow, i'm rambling.

the point is: even if Opera were comparable to firefox (which frankly it isn't) it still wouldn't be the first choice, simply because it costs money. what fools... don't they remember what happened to netscape???

[lowter]

This Went Too Far

Opera Software made just one mistake, why do people have to make such a big deal about it? I was an Opera user and had tons of arguments and debates on this.

Sure Firefox is great, but it is getting way too much media recognition.

Um Yeah...

Considering that FF sucks, has a poorly designed GUI, and has a ton of security problems, I'm shocked that Opera didn't win. I think there is some media bias here.

And SQUIRTY or QWERTY or whatever he calls himself is a brainwashed anti-MS fool.

[akshpd]

Firefox/Opera"8"- No way Opera wins

who says firefox is the best? Guess what ok, let me see who was my friend in my hard time - guess what it will be ha! it is Opera"8" - ask me how? When the connection is damn poor which often happens in poor india Sob! sob! then it is the opera that comes to rescue. Sometimes i felt the net works better with opera, yes it is.. How about opening of all the sites over the net- again it is opera(supported with java and other things).

How?

because i use net around 18 hours a day. Do u still need evidence? No way Baby.

Chill with opera?

[lowter]

Agree

I agree quite a bit. Opera is a much better browser compared to Firefox, and works great on a slower computer.

[akshpd]

Firefox VS Opera"8"- No way Opera wins

who says firefox is the best? Guess what ok, let me see who was my friend in my hard time - guess what it will be ha! it is Opera"8" - ask me how? When the connection is damn poor which often happens in poor india Sob! sob! then it is the opera that comes to rescue. Sometimes i felt the net works better with opera, yes it is.. How about opening of all the sites over the net- again it is opera(supported with java and other things).

How?

because i use net around 18 hours a day. Do u still need evidence? No way Baby.

Chill with opera?

[hatandglasses13]

"It's the Tabs, Stupid" ???

In the linked page to the PC World website, Michael Desmond
says that "the future of Web browsing comes down to one word:
tabs."

I'd have to disagree. I used Firefox on my PC after all the buzz
and I rarely, if ever, took advantage of the tabs. All they were
really doing for me was shuffling the different webpages open
from the taskbar on the bottom of the screen up to under the
toolbars in Firefox. Since my taskbar autohides and is at an edge
of the screen, it provides more screen real estate and is easier to
access than tabs. Plus, I can use the alt+tab shortcut with
seperate windows. I don't really see the point for tabs in this
situation, and therefore, like I said, pretty much never used
them.

Then I went out and bought a PowerBook, switched over to the
Mac side, and now I use Safari (the Panther version, not the new
one that is ONLY bundled with Tiger, what's up with that?).
Anyway, Safari blows away Internet Explorer and Firefox. Safari
also has tabbed browsing which I still rarely use. The only thing I
really love about the tabbed browsing in Safari (I don't think
Firefox can do this, but I might be wrong) is how you can make a
folder of bookmarks, put it on your bookmark toolbar, and have
all the bookmarks in the folder open in seperate tabs within one
window by just clicking on the folder. So, for example, say I
check three or four major news websites every day. All I would
have to do is put them in a bookmark folder, add the folder to
my toolbar, and then when I click it all four websites would come
up in seperate tabs, so I could look at one and easily close it or
switch over to compare to one of the other news sites.

At any rate, this is still a bit of a niche use. For common
browsing, tabs just seem impractical, and something that is
somewhat trivial like that shouldn't be the key argument in
switching browsers.

[tokeman]

Not happy with Opera

Well I gave opera a fair chance I downloaded this it worked great then a small update became available then when I went to use it it would lock up and freeze my PC. Opera has better Tabs than mozzila it looks better than mozilla of any variant the tabs work better I don't have to right click and tell the browser to open a new tab Opera just does it Opera also looks a lot better the skins are more clean looking and has a fair number of options that firefox or mozilla 1.7 has but I think they spend more time making it look cool rather than making it work as good as it looks trust me Opera isn't worth the frustration of freezing your PC, I even reformatted my drive and reinstalled windows and tried it again because I thought that I had a trojan or something but that wasn't the case the problem is the browser it self for those thinking about it I would say don't bother let Opera suffer a bit untill they can make it work as good as it looks stick with mozilla firefox or mozilla 1.7 atleast they don't lock up your computer when you try to use it.

[plings]

Not a typical Opera experience.

"Opera isn't worth the frustration of freezing your PC"

Then again, millions of other people are using Opera WITHOUT it freezing their PCs, so clearly there is a problem on your end.

FWIW, I dropped Firefox for similar reasons: It kept locking up PCs. Not just one, but two computers at home, and one at work.

Oh well. I know it was probably just a problem on my end althought I have heard similar stories. I just went with Opera and it works fine.

[arbonarbot]

a perspective from a long time user of both products...

i have been using firefox since version 0.80 and opera since version 7.00, both browsers are perfectly fine. having both firefox and opera on the 2 or 3 computers i have went through since the versions i mentioned above, has allowed me to keep internet explorer disabled for approx. 3 years now. opera has usually been set as my default browser and e-mail client, as it is a full fledged suite, and offers some features by default which mozilla products do not. when i am experiencing rendering issues on certain pages within opera i switch over to firefox and visa versa. mozilla browsers and the wide array of extensions available for them, offer some things that opera is not capable of providing, for instance the spectrum of data offered in mozilla browsers when examining a page's info with "page info" or with the DOM inspector, puts opera's info panel to shame. on the other hand, opera's seamless integration of the notes feature, various other panels, and its MDI (multi-document interface) make mozilla browser's "tabbed browsing" capabilities seem, for lack of a better word, childish in comparison. opera browsers from the start have by default offered features which mozilla browsers have yet to perfect or even present in some cases, even through extensions, such as with opera, when right clicking on an image which contains information about the camera it was photographed with, or the program the image was edited with, opera presents in an easily understandable format the information about the camera and/or program(s) the image was processed through. one could quibble over feature comparisons and the like, which i have attempted to do to a small extent, but the fact is with opera's browser being offered completely free for some time now, they both deserve an equal amount of media coverage or exposure, as both products are perfectly viable replacements and alternatives to the scourge of microsoft internet explorer.

[fun_coil]

Opera is the best

Opera is the best brawser from it's ver.3.00(currently v.8.10) I've tried a lot brawsers since then but none as good as Opera. Firefox very easy becomes victim of exploits as it is popular and the open source makes it even easier for the bad guys