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October 11, 2000
(continued from previous page)
like the old Netscape push in that if you can develop all of your apps in a browser, it makes the OS less relevant."
Unlike Netscape, which came to Microsoft's attention as a head-on threat, Adobe has made its living over the years by dominating areas Microsoft tended to neglect. Until now.
"For Adobe, competition with Microsoft is its manifest destiny," said Jesse James Garrett, a consultant with the San Francisco consulting company Adaptive Path, which works with Macromedia. "The Macromedia acquisition makes Adobe a threat that Microsoft can no longer afford to ignore."For their part, Microsoft executives play down the competition, or as they like to call it, the "coopetition." For years, Microsoft has both competed and partnered with a number of other companies, ranging from database maker Oracle to Intuit, the leader in financial software for consumers and small businesses. Adobe, even with Macromedia, is no different. "There are certain areas where our products overlap. At the same time, Adobe and Macromedia are important partners for us," says John Montgomery, director of product management in Microsoft's developer division.
Assuming Adobe completes its acquisition of Macromedia, the combined company competes with Microsoft in three product areas.
In image editing, Adobe leads the market with its tightly integrated Photoshop and Illustrator applications. Microsoft last week released a test version of Acrylic, a vector- and pixel-based image creation and editing software title, though Montgomery downplays the direct competition.
In digital documents, Adobe rules the roost with PDF (Portable Document Format). The core of what the company calls its Intelligent Document Platform, PDF is widely considered the industry standard, in widespread use in government and the enterprise. (Adobe makes a point of noting, in its PDF fact sheet, that Microsoft applications Word, Excel, and PowerPoint all produce PDF files with the click of a button.)
Microsoft showed off its answer to PDF, called Metro, last month, as part of a demonstration of the capabilities of its upcoming, and late, Longhorn operating system.
In Web-based application platform technology, Flash and the recently introduced Flex server software have begun making inroads in the enterprise. Meanwhile, the world awaits even a test version of Longhorn amid continued evidence that Microsoft is having significant difficulty driving upgrades to newer operating systems.
With Longhorn late, Acrylic still in a test version and earning mixed reviews on developer forums, and Metro tied to Longhorn's fate, many see plenty of breathing room for Adobe and its intended acquisition target. Illustrator and Photoshop, part of Adobe's recently updated Creative Suite 2 package, are seen as all but invulnerable for the foreseeable future.
"It seems to us that the likelihood of prying creative pro customers away from either Adobe product, especially with the advances delivered in the new Creative Suite 2 releases, is not high at all," wrote Merill Lynch equity analyst Jay Vleeschhouwer in a report circulated last week.
But concern about Adobe's prospects--as reflected in a dip in the company's share price following the Acrylic release--has less to do with the quality of Microsoft's offering than with the fact that Adobe has provoked Microsoft's competitive ire.
Rather than competing with products or technologies, Hein said, Microsoft identifies competitive threats on a company-by-company basis.
"And they go after the company," Hein said. "Adobe and Macromedia are more of a competitor than either standalone, and Microsoft will compete by offering a free version that's better integrated with the OS. None of Microsoft's announcements or trial versions will displace Adobe, but it's a clear signal that Adobe just popped much higher on Microsoft's competitive radar."
See more CNET content tagged:
Macromedia Inc., Adobe Systems Inc., Microsoft Longhorn, web-based application, graphic design
I have no love for Adobe, since I am not a 24/7 graphics artist
working at the professional level. And Adobe has abandoned all
its basic consumer application focus. What's left is overly
complex bloatware that, for he average user, is useless, So far, I
have eliminated almost all Adobe's programs from my
company's publication operations
I also have no love for MS, but that's due more to MS's
'innovation' behavior than to MS's bloatware apps. Office is not
bad, but it needed a better core design. WIndows is a marketing
tool not an OS. And many of MS's independent apps are visual
and functional losers (Have you seen the Acrylic Beta yet???).
Of all MS's apps, I am still using Office.
But, obviously, both MS and Adobe has legions of devoted users
who have nothing but praise for the companies and their apps.
So, watching Adobe and MS 'duke it out' for dominance will be
quite entertaining. And I can remain impartial - it makes no
diffference to me whoever wins.
I have no love for Adobe, since I am not a 24/7 graphics artist
working at the professional level. And Adobe has abandoned all
its basic consumer application focus. What's left is overly
complex bloatware that, for he average user, is useless, So far, I
have eliminated almost all Adobe's programs from my
company's publication operations
I also have no love for MS, but that's due more to MS's
'innovation' behavior than to MS's bloatware apps. Office is not
bad, but it needed a better core design. WIndows is a marketing
tool not an OS. And many of MS's independent apps are visual
and functional losers (Have you seen the Acrylic Beta yet???).
Of all MS's apps, I am still using Office.
But, obviously, both MS and Adobe has legions of devoted users
who have nothing but praise for the companies and their apps.
So, watching Adobe and MS 'duke it out' for dominance will be
quite entertaining. And I can remain impartial - it makes no
diffference to me whoever wins.
ColdFusion with the latest incarnation is enjoying continued growth - how many other "not free" web technologies ever reach 10 years of age (July 13)? And being built on J2EE but still being incredibly powerful and easy to use.
Flex and Breeze are also extremely popular whilst Studio MX 2004 brings best of breed web development tools to both Wintel and Mac platforms.
Adobe have responded to criticisms about the time it takes to load certain "readers" like Acrobat - but with MM they also get Flash Paper. Should be interesting to see what new tools and technologies the merger produces.
I was always worried it would be Microsoft that acquired Allaire, then Macromedia and maybe now Adobe. Microsoft grabbed Vermeer for the poor FrontPage remember.
The new Adobe will be hard to beat as they will cover alot of bases with superior (if not pricey) solutions.
Adobe is going to have to make some major changes in attitude, support, third party developer support and most importantly not screw up the Macromedia products if they expect to stand a chance.
And, please don't take this as my support for Microsoft. I don't care for them either.
Robert
ColdFusion with the latest incarnation is enjoying continued growth - how many other "not free" web technologies ever reach 10 years of age (July 13)? And being built on J2EE but still being incredibly powerful and easy to use.
Flex and Breeze are also extremely popular whilst Studio MX 2004 brings best of breed web development tools to both Wintel and Mac platforms.
Adobe have responded to criticisms about the time it takes to load certain "readers" like Acrobat - but with MM they also get Flash Paper. Should be interesting to see what new tools and technologies the merger produces.
I was always worried it would be Microsoft that acquired Allaire, then Macromedia and maybe now Adobe. Microsoft grabbed Vermeer for the poor FrontPage remember.
The new Adobe will be hard to beat as they will cover alot of bases with superior (if not pricey) solutions.
Adobe is going to have to make some major changes in attitude, support, third party developer support and most importantly not screw up the Macromedia products if they expect to stand a chance.
And, please don't take this as my support for Microsoft. I don't care for them either.
Robert
then they don't stand much of a chance with professional
designers. MS does not seem to be able to create an intuitive
application like the ones Adobe and Apple can deliver. Creatives
want to use a tool that helps them deliver their ideas quickly and
painlessly and not one that is bloated and unorganized. I know
of no one (designers and non-designers) who does not cringe
when having to produce anything of quality or complexity using
Word or Powerpoint. Of course, these are not programs targeted
at professional designers, but they simply are not intuitive or
well thought out. Even the Help in these apps is poorly
organized adding to the frustration of getting something to
work as it should.
Hopefully (for them), MS will take a whole new approach to
development and perhaps learn something from developers at
Adobe and Apple.... OR maybe they'll just target the weekend
creatives and mom & pop businesses where image is not a top
priority.
bloated app. Like with Word, start with a focused word processor
with fonts and all the other basic word processor functons. Then
provide a linked page setup program, which can take the word
files are build a basic document using the Word files and
apropriate graphics files. Then provide a Final Document
program which can add all the pops, bells, and whisles to s
finished publication.
Then the suer can go as far as his needs require and skills
permit. At least it sounds like a good idea - much better than
having everything crammed into one program.
For creative professionals Adobe will smoke Microsoft. Microsoft is just giving its office user guys more toys to play with and frustrate color houses output efforts. (IMO)
then they don't stand much of a chance with professional
designers. MS does not seem to be able to create an intuitive
application like the ones Adobe and Apple can deliver. Creatives
want to use a tool that helps them deliver their ideas quickly and
painlessly and not one that is bloated and unorganized. I know
of no one (designers and non-designers) who does not cringe
when having to produce anything of quality or complexity using
Word or Powerpoint. Of course, these are not programs targeted
at professional designers, but they simply are not intuitive or
well thought out. Even the Help in these apps is poorly
organized adding to the frustration of getting something to
work as it should.
Hopefully (for them), MS will take a whole new approach to
development and perhaps learn something from developers at
Adobe and Apple.... OR maybe they'll just target the weekend
creatives and mom & pop businesses where image is not a top
priority.
bloated app. Like with Word, start with a focused word processor
with fonts and all the other basic word processor functons. Then
provide a linked page setup program, which can take the word
files are build a basic document using the Word files and
apropriate graphics files. Then provide a Final Document
program which can add all the pops, bells, and whisles to s
finished publication.
Then the suer can go as far as his needs require and skills
permit. At least it sounds like a good idea - much better than
having everything crammed into one program.
For creative professionals Adobe will smoke Microsoft. Microsoft is just giving its office user guys more toys to play with and frustrate color houses output efforts. (IMO)
Recycled material...next!
Recycled material...next!
Apple has embraced Photoshop, PDF, and Flash.
While MS wants to compete with it.
Apple has embraced Photoshop, PDF, and Flash.
While MS wants to compete with it.
History:
Spreadsheet - Lotus 123 vs. Excel, till date Microsoft won the war not because of superior product, rather because of money and power. I still use Lotus for better analysis.
Word Processor: who will forget our loved WordPerfect? To my amazement many lawyers still rely on WordPerfect 5.1 for their paper work. Microsoft was not the pioneer; however they won the war because of bundling. And who will forget our historical Icon - Harvard Graphics, which Microsoft PowerPoint still cannot match, even twelve years later.
Those are their success stories: This will not be the first time that Microsoft has tried and failed woefully. Remember the first time Microsoft tried to challenge Adobe, (the Blog Heads will not remember) in the graphics design application with stolen name from Adobe Photoshop and Corel Draw; the program was called Microsoft Photo Draw - Disaster.
People need force Microsoft to put up superior products and not wait in the wings for somebody to come up something and bid brother Microsoft will jump in.
Note: This is about Microsoft and not about Bill Gates, whom I think is a wonderful human being. I know people will ask, what is the difference?
Notes: Don't judge Bill Gates through his donation. Judge him how he kills many companies with their owns ideas.
History:
Spreadsheet - Lotus 123 vs. Excel, till date Microsoft won the war not because of superior product, rather because of money and power. I still use Lotus for better analysis.
Word Processor: who will forget our loved WordPerfect? To my amazement many lawyers still rely on WordPerfect 5.1 for their paper work. Microsoft was not the pioneer; however they won the war because of bundling. And who will forget our historical Icon - Harvard Graphics, which Microsoft PowerPoint still cannot match, even twelve years later.
Those are their success stories: This will not be the first time that Microsoft has tried and failed woefully. Remember the first time Microsoft tried to challenge Adobe, (the Blog Heads will not remember) in the graphics design application with stolen name from Adobe Photoshop and Corel Draw; the program was called Microsoft Photo Draw - Disaster.
People need force Microsoft to put up superior products and not wait in the wings for somebody to come up something and bid brother Microsoft will jump in.
Note: This is about Microsoft and not about Bill Gates, whom I think is a wonderful human being. I know people will ask, what is the difference?
Notes: Don't judge Bill Gates through his donation. Judge him how he kills many companies with their owns ideas.
MS has attempted for years to topple Adobe & Apple in the arenas of professional press publication, ColorSync, Acrobat & digital photo / video processing.
Citizen Gates even went to the great lengths of buying millions of photographic rights, building a huge digital photo database & opening Corbis as his own company outside of MS, so he could control & make billions of royalties from professional photographers & publishing houses.
MS has lamely attempted to put out "prosumer" PhotoPC software for years without success to the point that they have to give it away with "Discount Dells".
Citizen Gates has also attempted to alter & undermine native Java / Flash coding with "Windows-compatible" versions of their own "interpretations" of Java/Flash in order to derail & dillute NON-MS coding on the Internet.
Gates has recently be very public about developing an Adobe Acrobat PDF killer-app within ShorthornOS in 2006/07/08/??.
MS doesnot have a built-in / included "Apple iLife Suite" equivilant (not even close) with MSXP.
This is such a slimy attempt to kill Photoshop/iPhoto/RAW file protocols within the entire digital creative industry in order to have world dominance in the realm of digital media all being "managed" through MSOS.
DOJ are splineless drones bowing down to the one they serve. All Hail Darth Gates!
that "analysis".
MS has attempted for years to topple Adobe & Apple in the arenas of professional press publication, ColorSync, Acrobat & digital photo / video processing.
Citizen Gates even went to the great lengths of buying millions of photographic rights, building a huge digital photo database & opening Corbis as his own company outside of MS, so he could control & make billions of royalties from professional photographers & publishing houses.
MS has lamely attempted to put out "prosumer" PhotoPC software for years without success to the point that they have to give it away with "Discount Dells".
Citizen Gates has also attempted to alter & undermine native Java / Flash coding with "Windows-compatible" versions of their own "interpretations" of Java/Flash in order to derail & dillute NON-MS coding on the Internet.
Gates has recently be very public about developing an Adobe Acrobat PDF killer-app within ShorthornOS in 2006/07/08/??.
MS doesnot have a built-in / included "Apple iLife Suite" equivilant (not even close) with MSXP.
This is such a slimy attempt to kill Photoshop/iPhoto/RAW file protocols within the entire digital creative industry in order to have world dominance in the realm of digital media all being "managed" through MSOS.
DOJ are splineless drones bowing down to the one they serve. All Hail Darth Gates!
that "analysis".
1. Make a product that can match the features and usability of their taget app. In the case of Photoshop, they have nothing that can come close to matching it, and nothing in the works(ie anything coming out in the next 12-18 months, probably longer).
2. Give legitimate reasons why a professional graphics house should spend the money on it, as well as possible OS switch. That is an extremely expensive switch. If the MS product is windows only, and not compatible with photoshop, it is dead before it gets a change to grow. Unless MS can show that their app is heads above its competitors, including tech support, useability, and compatibility, what is the incentive to go through a time consuming and expensive switch.
These articles about MS taking on Adobe are silly and pure fiction. If company X releases a very simple text editor, are they now competitors to Word? Microsofts current graphics app in beta is as close to photohop as the simple text editor is to Word.
1. Make a product that can match the features and usability of their taget app. In the case of Photoshop, they have nothing that can come close to matching it, and nothing in the works(ie anything coming out in the next 12-18 months, probably longer).
2. Give legitimate reasons why a professional graphics house should spend the money on it, as well as possible OS switch. That is an extremely expensive switch. If the MS product is windows only, and not compatible with photoshop, it is dead before it gets a change to grow. Unless MS can show that their app is heads above its competitors, including tech support, useability, and compatibility, what is the incentive to go through a time consuming and expensive switch.
These articles about MS taking on Adobe are silly and pure fiction. If company X releases a very simple text editor, are they now competitors to Word? Microsofts current graphics app in beta is as close to photohop as the simple text editor is to Word.
This is to funny. Adobe has a stronghold on the Design industry
and once they acquire Macromedia a near monopoly. No
professional designer is going to take anything Microsoft makes
seriously.
As a professional designer I would not buy MS software let alone
that I work on a Mac. But the web is moving away from WYSIWYG
tools. It's all CMS software running on servers and HTML/CSS
web sites that will rule. AJAX applications will control server
interaction for the future. Why would MS try and compete in
such a mature market?
This is just ridiculous and if Adobe stock drops again that means
buy, buy, buy!
- Analyst are funny people.
- by June 20, 2005 6:13 PM PDT
- Really why does everyone think MS can take on any company.
- Reply to this comment
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Showing 1 of 2 pages (52 Comments)This is to funny. Adobe has a stronghold on the Design industry
and once they acquire Macromedia a near monopoly. No
professional designer is going to take anything Microsoft makes
seriously.
As a professional designer I would not buy MS software let alone
that I work on a Mac. But the web is moving away from WYSIWYG
tools. It's all CMS software running on servers and HTML/CSS
web sites that will rule. AJAX applications will control server
interaction for the future. Why would MS try and compete in
such a mature market?
This is just ridiculous and if Adobe stock drops again that means
buy, buy, buy!