Newsmaker: Gates on Vista, Linux and more

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We're also letting Novell give something that you get in the commercial model, but you rarely get otherwise, which is the indemnification, just like we always do with every copy of Windows. So we're pioneering some things here.

What about the role, though, for open-source software? Has your thinking changed? Is there a value that you see it bringing?
Gates: Well, let's distinguish: let's talk about free software. Free software has always been an important part of the software world, just like commercial software has been.

You know, BSD Unix was free (and) available. Many elements of it were taken by start-ups; they enhanced it. SendMail--they hired people, they created jobs, they paid taxes. So you have this incredibly wonderful thing that if free software works for people, they should use that.

Often, in terms of support and enhancement and ongoing relationship, people prefer commercial software.

Often, in terms of support and enhancement (and) ongoing relationship, people prefer commercial software, which, thanks to the volume of Windows PCs, is now a very low-price, high-volume type industry, which it wasn't with the mainframe.

People often choose commercial. Those commercial companies pay the taxes, create the jobs. The government takes that and puts it back in the universities, and then there's more free software gets created. So it's this wonderful (virtuous) cycle, and I love that.

Now some people are trying to break that cycle by saying that you can never take things that taxpayer money helped create and use that in a start-up; (and) that if you do, if your code and theirs ever touches, you can never license it.

Anyway, we do tell people to be cautious about that. But free software, we think, is fine. Unix: we interoperate with it, we compete with it. (Regarding) the idea of open collaboration, letting our source code go out on more things and using the Internet as a way of reaching out to developers, there are certainly best practices there--some of which we pioneered, some of which others pioneered--(that) we latched onto and, hopefully, will take to a new level. So it's a huge mix of things.

The only thing you see a disagreement on is that we think people should be careful about which licensing model they use, because it means you're breaking this cycle. Now (Free Software Foundation head Richard) Stallman, he is truly pure; unlike many people who sort of try to act that way, he's pure. In V3 (version three of the General Public License) he's going to really make it clear that there's the world of "can never be (commercialized)"--nobody can ever make money on it, you know, build Web services or things. At least he's pure.

So that's going to be harder to work with?
Gates: Who knows? I don't know. That's his world. The GPL is. The free software world is way, way bigger than that, and that will always be there. That's a noncontroversial thing that we love. We make some of our stuff free, some of our stuff we charge for. It all seems to have worked out so far.

There's obviously one other big product for the holidays in terms of things that you guys make--XBox 360. You did get the year's head start this time. There still seems to be pretty strong critical acclaim and demand for PlayStation 3. How do you see that?
Gates: I wouldn't change positions with them in a million years. I mean, we know what it's like to be a year late. We feel great about the position that we're in. And, of course, they're going to sell a lot in Japan.

You know, Sony can make 80,000 bricks, and people would buy them. So the real competition--you're going to see the impact of our innovation and all the momentum we have in Christmas 2007. This Christmas, the story is: XBox 360 is going to sell super-well, and they'll sell the rounding error amounts they can make.  

More Newsmakers

[Dachi]

PS3 vs 360

The main reason people are willing ot pay so much for PS3 is becasue there is this assumption that since it is a PlayStation it will become the standard.

The specs of the 360 and the PS3 are actually pretty similar despit the 360 being released last year.

The reason the PS3 costs so much more is because of the Blu-Ray drive which will come down in price long before you might actually need one. Besides, to actually use the PS3 on a high def system you have to pay $99 extra for the component cable.

I actually like the way the 360 handles the HD-DVD drive as an add-on, that way I am not stuck getting the drive now at a premium when I don't need it yet, and if Blu-Ray ever takes off, they can just make a Blu-Ray add-on.

I am not saying the PS3 won't pick up steam, but it does look like the 360 will be more competitave than the first xbox.

[umbrae]

Well...

I am not sure people are assuming the PS will be a standard. Sony has a bad track record with standards. The PS became popular because it targeted a mature audience. At the time, we were getting to a point where gamers were getting older and Mario did not always leave you fulfilled. It was never a good product, it just offered something to a group that was being ignored.

The people getting the PS3 are getting it to sell or because they are loyal to Sony. Gates statement sums it all:

"You know, Sony can make 80,000 bricks, and people would buy them."

Very true.

Wrong about PS3 cable for high-def system

You would have to be an idiot to pay $99 for a component cable for any game console. Sony should have included a high-def cable with the PS3 but it's not a big deal since an HDMI cable (which most people will use to hook up their PS3) can be purchased for less than $10 on the Web.

[Havin_it]

"Free software? We paid for that, you're welcome"

Hope you got that part, all FOSS developers out there. Bill's tax dollars made all your efforts possible. How can you be so inconsiderate as to use the GPL to weasel out of paying him back?

And how much do you make flogging Windows licences to educators, Bill? I'll bet if you combine the dollar-value and indoctrination ( = 'future loyal customer') value, it pretty much writes off your tax bill. **** you and the high-horse you rode in on.

[therealCSMR]

is that so?

You are saying that microsoft "pretty much" doesn't pay any tax?

[Seaspray0]

It's called supply and demand

I don't hear you screaming about 90%+ of the people using VHS format over betamax (by all accounts a better format). You don't like it because microsoft got rich selling a product. Why shouldn't they? They're doing what every company does... sell products at a price people are willing to pay. It's the public that decides what they want and that's what they're going to get, and that includes educational institutions. If the institutions didn't provide the demand, then there would be no supply to them. If you don't like it?... Tough!

[Seaspray0]

Nope, I'm paying for it

Tax dollars help fund our educational institutions. Microsoft pays taxes along with everyone else. So... they are, in part, funding free software that is developed through that funding. Do you have a problem with that? I don't. I find it amusing that money that would have gone into MS's pockets is used to develop free software. I also know that money that would have gone into MY pockets is also used to develop free software (I pay taxes too). Hope you got that part, all FOSS developers out there. MY tax dollard made all your efforts possible. How can you be so inconsiderate as to use the GPL to weasel out of paying ME back? SHOW ME THE MONEY!

[rslc]

tablet pc? wrong timing?

first, timing is almost everything.
second, tablet pc was a big joke.
what abt PDA?

Sad case of a geek who think he is a visionary.
That title is given to Steve Jobs and others
already.

[castingRod47]

Tablet PC/saving trees

I saw this vision in the Bill Gates story on Tablet PC..that the TEXT Books in the Public Schools could evolve away from PULP..then Bill Gates has been mentioning the CLOUD..I quess for lack of a better word/Cloud/has the necessary Pulse of TIME-on a level of days..Simple approach to things I have gathered so far..Visionary often means:SCIENCE:Bill Gates did mention his envelope theory about Pharma and malaria and Universities funded on a TAX-side..I think its the right foundation to accept ideas at..RESULTS vary always/and even slip away..I think Bill Gates is thinking ahead w/a level head..the world just needs some mention of their willingness of the foundations used so far..It seems the people problems excist at a Microsoft level of design.

[castingRod47]

Software and money

I'm a Home Desktop user..my very first PC was an AT&T PC[6300]in 1984 it cost $$2000.00 came with a SET of Books called George Washington-BASIC..it was a very baffleing piece of equipment..I read the Manuals of BASIC and subscribed to a Magazine and there were offers of $$10,000.00 or even $$20,000.00 for Programs to be written..from my first impression the Software looking for acceptance was very simple stuff/I never really went past some play-time w/the AT&T PC6300..in 1999 the COMPAQ Companion came along/the Internet RECIEVER-actually lasted about 1-year and died of[??who knows what??]..DELL started offering nice machines and Support Services/Microsoft OS/Office/and peripherals..I think along the way the(thing)that impresses the novice is the clear sense of moving into the Advanced PC-user..Microsoft has that offer "nailed" in my opinion..I think language has a very real place in the Support of PC's..if the language begins to drop off the SCOPE..so will the past success/soon diminish away like bad hardware..time will waste away and the PC-experiance will fall like a melting Ice Cream Cone at the Bazarr..I hope that Microsoft continues to be Microsoft..when Bill Gates loosens his grip on the day and the company works on the software in every space/we can always find every word at Microsoft about it.

[therealCSMR]

is that so

You are saying that microsoft "pretty much" doesn't pay any tax?

[Penguinisto]

Outright Ignorance on Gates' part

Seriously - even GPLv3 licensed software can be commercialized, no problem.

Gates' problems w/ all GPL versions is that:

1) it cannot be locked into a proprietary format, which means...
2) it cannot be stolen and called, say, the new TCP/IP networking stack for Windows
3) he cannot figure out a way to make money off of it, in spite of IBM, RedHat, etc etc. making quite a nice chunk of cash from Linux.

PS: Linux dominates in the server market - is the poor guy reading stats from 1996 or something?

/P

[Russell McOrmond]

Free Software != Non-commercial software

While I believe Bill Gates is very smart, he is on the "flat earth" side of a 200 year old debate and that is whether knowledge is like physical property. He equates charging a marginal cost for knowledge like software with commercial, when nature has made knowledge such that charging only fixed-costs is also possible.

Most Free/Libre and Open Source Software is commercial, it just doesn't charge royalty fees. Royalty fees are simply a business model choice, not the only way to make money with knowledge. Hopefully people will eventually realize the earth is round and stop making such silly mistakes.

Richest man in the world still admired, even if he believes the world is flat..
http://www.digital-copyright.ca/node/2793

[Tanjore]

He is ok with Open source which is commercial!!!

He doesn't have a problem with opensource movement. Opensource that is free!!!!

Current generation opensource though free, companies are charging for support and Gates should be ok with it.!!!

[Russell McOrmond]

Microsoft makes money when it "donates" software

The marginal cost to Microsoft for a license is zero. That's the nature of knowledge, and you can't argue with nature.

Microsoft then gets a tax write-off for the retail value of the software, and the reduction in taxes is *real money*. Can't argue with real money.

I've always thought it was a scam to allow companies to get a tax write-off for other than their marginal cost, which for software is zero.

I can legally donate a million dollars worth of Free Software to a school -- can I get my government welfare cheque now, just like Microsoft does?

[Dachi]

Bill: Please do something about Ballmer

I just finished reading this article on computer world: http://www.computerworld.com.au/index.php/id;839593139;fp;16;fpid;1

In it, Ballmer says Linux "uses our intellectual property".

The antitrust case would never allow MS to sue Linux out of existence even if it does use MS IP, so why make the comment in the first place?

George Bush shows more tact and diplomacy.

Maybe people are not ready to adopt Linux in mass, but they like knowing they have the option if it comes down to it. If Ballmer forces people/companies to take sides in the matter people are going to stand behind Linux to make sure you don't take away their plan B and that could be bad for MS.

If they have code that infringes your IP it will be rewritten, if you sue Linux companies out of existence new ones will emerge in their place and it might land you back in front of judge Jackson.

You know you can't sue Linux, so all Ballmer is doing is lighting a fire under your opposition.

Kicking Ballmer out now would look bad, so maybe you should hire him an "advisor" that will help him make more informed decisions moving forward.

[slim-1]

Bill taught Balmer everything he knows

So your kidding right?

[Bob H in NPR]

Gates on Vista, Linux, more

If these same comments had come out of Steve Ballmer's mouth, my reply would have been pure acid. With the announcement of the non-aggression pact between MS & Novell, the first question in my mind was, "We are being shafted. How deeply, how soon, & in which orfice?"

Bill Gates created the money grubbing, lying, mean spirited, monopolistic culture at MS. His unselfish contributions to the poorest cultures of the poor & the recent overwhelming blessing from Warren Buffet have earned him some of my respect. I still look for the other fork of the tongue when he speaks. I finally believe that sometimes his motives are as he says they are. I still need to ask the question, "Which ones?"

Many for profit corporations have contributed enormously to the development & distribution of open source software. Sun, Google, Yahoo, Grisoft, Lavasoft all come to mind, adding to the efforts of non profits like Mozilla in offering an alternative to high priced programs & software. Without this competition, today's prices would seem like bargains. I hope MS & Apple will soon follow suit. I'm just not going to hold my breathe. I will wait & see . . .

[FimShady]

Wii little flaw

Even if all of the people lining up were selling their systems, there are people buying them. Can't sell something to no one. The system is still being bought, even if it ends up in different hands than the ones that initially bought it.

[x-nc]

Alternate Realities

"But, in general, Linux is not nearly as high-volume as Windows is on servers."

Billy-boy, what have you been smoking?

You know, sometimes I really wonder how Gates, Ballmer, et. al. are able to keep a straight face when they say things like this. These guys make politicians sound like the most honest people in the world.

Additionally...

"We're also letting Novell give something that you get in the commercial model, but you rarely get otherwise, which is the indemnification, just like we always do with every copy of Windows."

Since the EULA for every version of every piece of software states that Microsoft can not be held legally liable for anything and everything related to their software. This whole "indemnification" thing is just another big smokescreen. A last gasp effort to try and keep their domination.

[jchandler15]

Tablet PC

Will the tablet PC ever have a big enough market??

Josh Chandler
www.techilious.wordpress.com

[KDubII]

maybe..

...IF it ever gets small enough and powerful enough to do what we all want it to do..
I doubt a tablet the size of laptop is going to do well..PDA's and Blackberries are too small.. a virtual keyboard (have you seen the laser types! COOL) that is integrated and something the size and weight of a good hardcover novel will probably do ok.. what I have seen aren't near to the right size.. I think they need to go to the consumer and do what Chrysler did in designing the miniVAn.. find out what the END USER wants in terms of form and function.. then think OUTSIDE the standard box and do it right! For now..they are going to gather dust on the shelves for the most part .. unfortunately the most likely scenario is to keep bringing cost down so people wind up using what is presently available..a bad alternative in my opinion!

[netbuddy01]

Bill & MS know nothing about Free & Open Source

Bill is no dummy but for some reason he fails to understand the FOSS world completely. FYI Billy most of the Internet is running FOSS of all sorts! Your cute characterization of this industry makes me laugh. Its a multi multi billion dollar industry that will continue to compete against you. The FOSS licensing spectrum is not at odds with Capitalism as you assert but you are at odds with understanding a thing about it.

[slim-1]

Bill says it's all about timing.

Very true.

It's about time they designed a brand new from scratch secure, not bloated OS preferably Unix based.

It's about time the stopped lying in every statement they make.

It's about time they quit attacking Linux and OpenSource software.

It's about time they quit screwing over their own business partners and PC vendors.

It's about time they quit pretending they don't do the above.

It's about timing all right. And it's time we all moved to anything but Microsoft.

Join the boycott Sony and Microsoft movement.