Flash to jump beyond the browser

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Lynch said that Adobe is seeing more direct competition from Microsoft, even as the companies collaborate in other areas.

"It's good that Microsoft is recognizing the need for Microsoft applications to run everywhere, but it's very hard to achieve--and we have achieved that with Flash," he said.

Microsoft executives said that upcoming Windows Vista development tools will be able to run on non-Microsoft browsers and operating systems, although they will not be as functional as Windows-native applications.

Adobe is also looking to break out beyond its root business among illustrators and designers and appeal to corporate developers.

The San Jose, Calif.-based company is beefing up its development tools by introducing more corporate-oriented features, in an effort to serve both its traditional designer audience and more-mainstream developers.

Its Flex development tool for writing Flash applications works as a plug-in for Eclipse, a development program popular with corporate software writers who use Java. And Adobe has built Flex-based tooling, to make it easier for coders to tap into back-end corporate applications.

Desktop integration or download?
Apollo is a natural evolution to what Adobe already provides, and it will allow the company to package Adobe Reader (for PDF files) and Flash Player in a single product, Burton Group's O'Kelly said. It is also a way for the company to showcase the combination of technologies it gained when it acquired Macromedia, a transaction that closed late last year.

David Temkin, the chief technology officer of Laszlo, said that Apollo does promise some enhancements over Flash for third-party companies. Laszlo has a line of development tools and applications that run in a Web browser, using either Flash or AJAX.

Web application providers are looking for ways to better integrate their wares with desktop operating systems, Temkin said. Macromedia has a product called Macromedia Central, which allows Flash applications to run outside the browser. It hasn't gotten widespread use because it didn't fully integrate with desktops, Temkin noted.

"If I'm an application provider, I want to put my icon directly on the user's desktop without the intervention of someone else's branding. That's not something (Macromedia) Central provided," Temkin said.

Laszlo will investigate whether Apollo makes sense as a way to render applications built with its own development tools, he said. The company's decision will rely, in part, on how widely Apollo is used.

"If the user has to go out and download another thing and install it on their desktop, there will be an uphill battle to making it ubiquitous," Temkin said.

Lynch said that Apollo will be a separate download from its Adobe Reader (for viewing Acrobat PDF files) and from the Flash Player, and that those products will continue to be developed and distributed separately.

Adobe will take some steps to simplify the installation process, such as working with partners to preload Apollo on machines, Lynch said. The Apollo applications themselves will determine whether users download the software as well, he said.

"It's like any new environment, the question is always whether there is enough content for it," Lynch said. "Fortunately, we got a lot of people already using these technologies and capabilities."

[Musica360.com]

Traditional Microsoft........

"Microsoft executives said that upcoming Windows Vista development tools will be able to run on non-Microsoft browsers and operating systems, although they will not be as functional as Windows-native applications."

They want their tools and apps to be widely adapated but of course, if it's not running on Windows it will be crippled.

Get the hell out of here!!! They really don't get it and assinine statements like that prove it.

Flash would have never taken off in the way that it has if it wasn't as roboust as it is on every platform.

Microsoft, get a clue!!!!!

[arcadefx]

Good/Bad

I like web browsers and the freedom to explore. I can see these web-apps, that reside outside browser space, handle specialized tools and portals.

If these applications come out...

What about version compatibility? If I upgrade ?Apollo? does app <X> break?

My "Start->All Programs" menu is flooded with applications, why do I want more in there?

The web browser is great and I can keep websites and web client applications away from my desktop.

[Dachi]

THIS is why!

This is why people mourned the idea of Adobe acquiring Macromedia.

Adobe is looking for ways to make flash player more intrusive, like Acrobat Reader.

(for a Reader alternitave see Foxit Reader: http://www.foxitsoftware.com/pdf/rd_intro.php )

[JulesLt]

Get the facts right

It takes relatively little research to find the facts out yourself.

There is complete commitment towards keeping the Flash plugin
as is - they are focused on keeping it lean and invisible to the
user.

What Adobe are up to is finding ways to re-use the technology
from Flash. There is a real opportunity to make Flash a cross-
platform API.

And while Acrobat Reader is a POS, Adobe have done some
pretty cool things as a company - making PDF an open standard
for starters, means you don't HAVE to use Acrobat Reader,
wheras with SWF there is no legal alternative. I also suspect they
are behind the opening up of Flex - Adobe have always been
more interested in open standards, wheras Macromedia have
been tool focused.

[xorek]

The Problem is...

Macromedia has made executive decisions in the past that decide NOT to support or create Flash players and plugins for 64 bit operating systems. Try finding one for an operating system like Suse 10.0
when running in 64 bit mode on Opterons!

So they may SAY it is cross platform--but only platforms of their choice (and they don't support modern 64 bit operating systems).

How many opterons have to be sold (and run with 64 bit operating systems) before macromedia decides it will produce Flash for 64 bit operating systems?

If everybody is going to run Flash on their desktop, they could start by making Flash work
in a browser on a (64 bit) operating systems such as Suse 10 for X86-64?

As long as it doesn't work now on Opterons with 64 bit operating systems, it is not a solution for a growing segment of users.

[chassoto--2008]

We already have this

It's called the Java Runtime Environment. Works great. Cross-
platform.

[CommandHerTaco]

How can the JRE view flash videos?

Is there an API class that handles this?

[chuchucuhi]

well

I could see some use of this is these types of applications were to end up on something say a set top box or some kind device like that.

[brian.lee]

Isn't that Macromedia Director??? Oh wait..

Ya they tried this it's called Macromedia director flash is essentially Director Lite. Although flash has taken off and director has not it is or was cross platform until they stopped updating it. Flash has built a reputation for being pretty and pointless. Also their browser support SUCKS! for anything other than Windows it's slow as hell on Mac and recently made an appearence on Linux but neither of the pluggins are taken seriously on Mac/Linux, like MSN Messenger for Mac it's always a few versions behind a few bug fixes behind and never optimized. If Macromedia wants other platform users to take flash seriously please put some more resources into cross platform development.

[calbear--2008]

Flash Support

I agree that Flash is generally slow and bulky when on older computers and non-windows platform, but I wouldn't go as far as to say it's not widely adopted and deployed.

Take a look at YouTube, Google Video, almost all Rich Media, it's powered by Flash and it sure seems to work just dandily for millions.

[dikelmm]

Pretty but Pointless?

I thought that was Mac, not Flash, which is much more widely used on the desktop than Mac or Linux. If you coose to be in a niche you cannot expect the same level of support.

[kaisdaddy]

You can already do this...

...with mProjector from Screentime Media. It allows you to take
your Flash content and create cross platform stand-alone apps that
run natively on Mac or Windows. Also, it has access to system level
functions of the native OS, such as file copying and saving.

While it's true that this solution is not free, it does work well and
does not require the user to download another plugin.

[tipper_gore]

didn't they already try this?

It seems to me Macromedia tried this already with Flash. Maybe a couple of years ago. But I can't remember the details.

[Logomachist]

My thoughts exactly! What is new here?

That's what I was thinking too. In fact I have 2 Macromedia-based programs that give me realtime weather updates on the desktop, and they don't need a browser at all. Plus I have Macromedia Central which (though it never got very popular) let Flash-based programs run outside the browser.

Looks like is just a marketing push for Adobe's new tools. It would be nice if cnet bothered to report which parts of Apollo are actually new instead of just rehashing Adobe's press release.

[JEG2006]

Reserve airline tickets....offline?

I don't understand the airline ticket reservation example in the article. The data required to reserve an airline ticket is obviously somewhat timely. One minute you have a seat...the next you don't. Or the flight might get completely booked. I suppose you would receive some kind of notification (via the Apollo application) the next time you connect to the Internet, but if you have to go back and fix your reservation anyway, you might as well have waited until you could connect to the Internet to make your reservation in the first place!

I'm sure there are lots of other applications for this technology but something tells me Flash and Apollo aren't necessary to do it. In fact, I bet the required technology is already a part of Windows Vista and XP, or easily added. Thanks for sharing your innovative idea with Microsoft...!

[Dachi]

Can book offline for seats outside the plane

They cost half as much too.

I just bought a ticket for only $50 for a window seat not on flight 456 from Buffalo to Denver.

Gartner says that blogging was yesterday, MySpace is today, and offline airline tickets will be tomorrow.

For $10 extra/month AOL is going to offer a window that uses the Apollo engine but enhances the offline ticket buying experience.

If I were and investor I would get in early.

[technewsjunkie]

Internet connection needed, OS - no longer?

Hmmm. Looking into my crystal ball...

This seems to me to be (yet another) beginning of the end, of the OS. As long as a machine is connected to the net these programs (Flash) doesn't need an OS. It runs independently, correct?

[Jackson Pollock]

Rebranding is in order

In order to get this effort taken seriously, they'll need to do a major re-branding. Flash has too many awful connotations: dancing menus, unwanted animated banner ads, bad design...in a word, crap.
And the words "Flash developer/designer" are a sure way to get your resume tossed in the bin.

[Tomcat Adam]

Same as Photoshop?

Well, comeon, whenever most people say the word "photoshop", it's in regards to a (usually) tastless and/or humorous edited image, rather than in a proffessional view.

"And the words "Flash developer/designer" are a sure way to get your resume tossed in the bin."

I know about 5 people who have gotten pretty good jobs because they had this on their resume, as opposed to the average "web designer" resume.

[Dachi]

You can export flash as a .exe

Or at least you could, and I know they have a seperate version of flash player that is not just a browser plugin and enables you to just double click .swf files.

Macromedia already did this and this is NOT what Adobe is trying to do.

They want instead to find a way to be more in your face about it (like Reader) so they can make more money from it.

They only just aquired the company (Macromedia) and they are already finding ways to exploit their products at the expense of the consumer.

I cringe every time I accidently click a PDF file on a machine with Acrobat Reader. I just can't wait to get the same experience from Flash.

Burn Adobe, burn.

[threeDart]

Try Adobe Digital Editions Beta

Try Adobe Digital Editions Beta to see how much cleaner and less resource intensive opening pdf's using flash. You will cringe no longer.

[pekr]

REBOL/View ....

Hmm, no, when the world is talking web 2.0 with ajax, and us reboller's do use web 3.0 already, other get the idea too - Flash, and even Ruby now tries to copy Rebol/View :-)

cheers,
Petr

[RideMan]

Why not do it the easy way...

QuickTime already contains support for Flash 5; why not just
develop a QuickTime component for modern Flash content and go
that route. QuickTime Player is already a cross-platform stand-
alone app that already supports older Flash. Why reinvent the
wheel?

[Earl Benser]

Stay cautious....

..... Never trust Microsoft or Adobe,,,,,

[Logomachist]

Why should we not trust MS and Adobe? (particularly Adobe?)

Because... what?

They're probably the 2 most powerful companies on the desktop. That doesn't make them evil.

[K Aujla]

Sounds familiar.....

?Taking Flash beyond the browser? all sounds a bit familiar. Tools like MDM Zinc have been around for a while and allow you to build Flash projectors and deploy to Windows, Mac and Pocket PC platforms and doesn't require a plug-in (see www.multidmedia.com).

Will be interesting to see what becomes of Apollo and whether it?s just a re-hash of the failed Central from a few years back

[K Aujla]

Sounds Familiar

?Taking Flash beyond the browser? all sounds a bit familiar. Tools like MDM Zinc have been around for a while and allow you to build Flash projectors and deploy to Windows, Mac and Pocket PC platforms and don?t require a plug-in (see www.multidmedia.com).

Will be interesting to see what becomes of Apollo and whether it?s just a re-hash of the failed Central from a few years back

[CommandHerTaco]

I want a standalone Flash player for Windows.

Particularly, one that I can integrate with a web browser so I can watch Flash videos in places that do not have Flash installed and will not allow Administrator rights.

I found a workaround using old versions of flash plugins, but it doesn't always work. Basically, the new versions of Flash player demand Administrator rights to operate.

Flash flv player requires Flash already installed, Media Player Classic does not get stuff straight from the web. Is there a hack out there that does this one simple thing?