As ethanol takes first steps, Congress proposes giant leap

Congress is on the verge of telling business to create a huge new industry capable of converting agricultural wastes and plant material into automotive fuel.
The New York Times

The story "As ethanol takes first steps, Congress proposes giant leap" published December 18, 2007 at 9:42 AM is no longer available on CNET News.

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[Commander_Spock]

Who says so!!!

"the economics are uncertain"

Has the Economic Rate of Return (ERR) been applied. Show the recommendations of the analysts for the various project scenarios (along with their RANKINGS) based on international considerations!

[Commander_Spock]

""It's not clear that it is doable,...

... but it wasn't clear you could send a man to the moon, either," said Mark Flannery, head of energy equity research at Credit Suisse. "You don't know until you try." Hey Mark, the gut feeling is that landing a man on the moon was much more complex than producing ethanol; and, if the former was successfully achieved much less grappling with activities on the surface of the Earth. What do you do at "Credit Suisse"... Are you the CTO or the most Senior Financial, Economic and technical Analyst there? Technology Rules The World.

[FutureGuy]

algae???

How could the author forget to mention Algae which has been show to have the most postential as biofuel. http://www.scribemedia.org/2007/12/12/algae-biofuel-valcent-vertigro/

[Commander_Spock]

Why the; "if it worked" in...

... "To reach that goal, the nation's scientists and business leaders will need durable political and financial support to overcome a host of technical, environmental and logistical obstacles.

The end result, if it worked, would be the sort of energy transformation that was promised in the 1970s and 1980s, until government and industry lost their motivation when oil prices plummeted.

Congress says this time will be different. The new legislation would oblige farmers to grow new crops in new ways, automobile companies to produce more vehicles capable of running on a high-ethanol blend, and the oil industry to retrofit its refining and distribution networks to deliver the new fuel..." If the Brazilians down in South America can achieve an 85/15 (E85) Ethanol/Fossil Fuel Ratio then why can't the United States of America? Why not "learn" from the "Brazilians" if it comes to that.

[ragner]

Its about time

I think congress is scared about what is going to happen when gas goes to 4.00 a gallon. I would still like congress to make sure ALL cars run on E85.They should also mandate that all cars run with higher compresion ratios; enough so they have to run premium gas [92 octane]. Cars would then run better with E85 then they do now. Also,with higher prices on premium, people would naturally gravitate to cheaper E85. We wouldn't need to give any tax breaks for business because the market would be DEMANDING more E85. If you really wanted to drive the market, put a .50 tax just on premium gas. A .50 cent tax on premium would not effect to many existing cars and would be far more palatable to congress and the public. However, any way we can do it is good.

[Commander_Spock]

Geez... Why all the "ifs"

"The bill does contain an escape clause, allowing the government to modify the mandates if they do not prove feasible... Which anyway? Financially Feasible, Economically Feasible or Technically Feasible - Which of these? One, Two or all Three? Also, where are the "Computerized" Analytical Tools... ;-)

Live Long And Prosper.

Commander_Spock

[bildan2]

Iso octane not ethanol

Ethanol is not a good fuel from an engineering point of view. Low energy content, corrosive action and affinity for water are just a few problems.

If we are going to fund a "Manhattan Project" for biofuel production, why not go for perfect motor fuels like iso octane for spark ignition engines or bio-diesel for compression ignition.

Iso octane is the laboratory reference fuel for 100 octane. It would run in all existing engines without problems.

Why not bio engineer bugs to produce iso octane instead of ethanol.

[Commander_Spock]

How can this just be a "Manhattan Project"...

... when a number of other countries in this hemisphere are chasing after the objectives (battling climatic change...) - Brazil, Columbia, Guyana, Mexico... with the support of the Inter-American Development Bank (IDB).

http://www.iadb.org/NEWS/articledetail.cfm?artid=4211&language=En

http://www.iadb.org

[fokwp]

Sequester, don't burn

Rather than creating all the environmental mayhem from building all these new factories, just pass a law requiring all this biomass to be *harvested and buried locally*. That means, instead of processing and burning carbon, sequester it locally. And keep burning fossil fuel as necessary for vehicles. Probably save much more carbon this way. The problem with creating alternative fuels is that fossil fuels will become less in demand and therefore less expensive, the very opposite of what we need to achieve reduction. We needed to be vying (peacefully) for oil and coal resources with the rest of the world to keep prices up and scarcity high, not supplementing fossil fuels by burning what we should be sequestering and thus reducing demand and driving down prices. At least don't make it worse by expanding the biomass industry - sequester, don't burn.

[Commander_Spock]

A better idea!

Recycle all the recyclables, burn some of biomass (baggase) from sugar-cane as it make good "plant" manure then use the residue to build up the earth's land masses that is disappearing. When you bury all that toxic stuff then what happens to the drinking water?

[kgsbca]

the problem with this legislation

There is no way the politicians are smart enough to write this bill, they just don't understand the technology or even the economics of ethanol enough. So the question then is, who wrote the bill? Lobbyists, of course. Lobbyists for special interest groups, whose members will benefit from how the law is written.

I am as big of a proponent of biofuels as there is, but I am just as strongly opposed to letting lobbyists write new laws. I know that former house majority leader bohner said Congress couldn't exist without lobbyists, but that's only because we have elected the wrong people to congress.If we had elected smart and resourceful people, instead of scheming and devious, they might be able to do their jobs without help from people who make their living helping special interest groups get laws written for their benefit.

So we're going to transition from a government that has been driven by the oil, gas, and coal industries to one that will be owned by giant agribusinesses. At least they'll keep most of the money here. or maybe not. with all the debt racked up by Americans, who knows who will own all of these new companies?

[Commander_Spock]

The Bill Has Been Passed!

"Congress is on the verge of writing into law one of the most ambitious dictates ever issued to American business: to create, from scratch, a huge new industry capable of converting agricultural wastes and other plant material into automotive fuel..." Read the subject line - this is according to the latest ABC News. WOW! The Way To Go!

[suyts2]

Now congress can tell us who they expect to

pay for all of these mandates.

[K A Cheah]

Chasing after the "Wrong Technology"

Nikola Tesla the Greatest Inventor of the last century had invented the Technologies to run cars & power stations without fuel one Century ago and these technologies might still be classified top secret immediately after his death.

Stanley Meyer had invented the Technology to turn Water into unlimited amount of fuel for making Unlimited Power Supply, but unfortunately he was murdered. He had about more than 40 patents in this Technology. No one Car/Technology Company has pursued this technology further by buying up his technology and put them to good use to save our this planet Earth from Global Warming causing adversed climatic changes and disasters and hardship owing to unlimited and unrestrained use of Fossil Oils and Fuels, releasing & emitting enormous quantities of green houses into the atmosphere. I think some company like Google should buy this Patented Technologies from Stanley Meyer's family and make this open source technology for the world to improve on and make good use of this Technology to save our world call Planet Earth.

Also those Technologies invented by Nikola Tesla should be declassified to run cars and power-stations to save our Planet Earth from destruction and doom owing to unlimited and unrestrained use of Fossil Oils and Fuels for the last Century.

[K A Cheah]

Chasing after the "Wrong Technology"

Nikola Tesla the Greatest Inventor of the last century had invented the Technologies to run cars & power stations without fuel one Century ago and these technologies might still be classified top secret immediately after his death.

Stanley Meyer had invented the Technology to turn Water into unlimited amount of fuel for making Unlimited Power Supply, but unfortunately he was murdered. He had about more than 40 patents in this Technology. No one Car/Technology Company has pursued this technology further by buying up his technology and put them to good use to save our this planet Earth from Global Warming causing adversed climatic changes and disasters and hardship owing to unlimited and unrestrained use of Fossil Oils and Fuels, thus releasing & emitting enormous quantities of green house gases into the atmosphere. I think some company like Google should buy this Patented Technologies from Stanley Meyer's family and make this open source technology for the world to improve on and make good use of this Technology to save our world call Planet Earth.

Also those Technologies invented by Nikola Tesla should be declassified to run cars and power-stations to save our Planet Earth from destruction and doom owing to unlimited and unrestrained use of Fossil Oils and Fuels for the last Century.