I would be happy with a cable or satellite service that didn't have severe functionality issues regularly. My Comcast STB had the eternal FF and REW issue, so I went to dish. Now I lose signal on my HD dish after ~30 minutes. After repeated phone calls and visits from inept tech support, I have nearly given up all hope that I will get reliable service. Maybe FiOS will deliver...in about 10 years... As for the gadget above, sounds like a great idea that will get little/no follow through. /rant
A good article, but you've made a couple of fundamental errors. Where you refer to 'CableCARD' you're generally referring to UDCP specifically, and not really CableCARD. CableCARDs are ALL two-way, and they're all compatible with SDV. It is the *host* platform, the UDCP, that has those limitations. Also, the Tuning Adapter for SDV is not a 'tuner', it is basically a transceiver. The TA provides a data connection with the cable head-end, via protocols like DSG (DOCSIS Set-top Gateway), to handle the back channel communication required to tune SDV channels. The actually tuning is still done by the on-board tuners in the UDCP, such as a TiVo HD.
And M-Card is very common now. While S-Card was deployed first, and it took a while for M-Card to hit and then ramp up, these days all of the major MSOs offer M-Card. Most users won't have a problem getting an M-Card, they're the default much of the time these days. A single M-Card supports six channels, but your host device needs to have the hardware. The best I'm aware of today are dual-tuner boxes.
Also, you said tru2way is effectively CableCARD 2.0 - without the card. That's very much false. tru2way, formerly known by the less snappy names OCAP (OpenCable Application Platform) and then just OpenCable Platform, is a programming platform, a set of standards and APIs. CableCARD is an access token system that provides authentication and authorization for the box. tru2way sits *on top of* CableCARD.
Boxes using tru2way still use CableCARD. tru2way/OCAP is what often used to erroneously be called 'CableCARD 2.0' - you still have the physical cards, but the added software and APIs supports two-way communication. And it is more than that, since it is meant to provide a Java-based 'write once, run anywhere' platform for STB software development. So instead of a myriad of different STB platforms to code for, developers can code for tru2way and (theoretically) have their software run on any tru2way host device.
The 'CableCARD without the card' is DCAS - Downloadable Conditional Access System - which is what has been proposed as the following to CableCARD, and is still in development. With DCAS the box would have a secure module built in and the access system code would be downloaded to the box, no physical cards required.
As for the UI issue with vendors such as TiVo, I think you've missed one of the key factors in the agreement. The big issue with OCAP *was* the problem with the UI, where OCAP devices would download whatever the cable company shoved at them. What good is supporting OCAP to TiVo if they lose all of their differentiation?
But the cable industry softened and TiVo was the first to announced a compromise, whereby the device could use a 'native' UI for all of the linear content (what a TiVo HD can do today, plus SDV), but would call upon cable MSO applications for advanced content like VOD and PPV. A hybrid basically. So you'd still get your TiVo UI most of the time, breaking out of it only when you go to access specific features. Not dissimilar to using one of the HME applications on a broadband connected TiVo, when you leave the TiVo UI and enter the HME-apps UI, which can be very different.
I think tru2way will be an improvement. Basic CD devices, like TVs, which really don't have their own EPG, UI, etc, will be able to use tru2way to add richer features. And the more advanced CE products, like TiVo, will be able to use the hybrid implementation to go beyond what they have today and add missing features like VOD & PPV - plus things like Called ID, Start Over, etc, when offered by the local MSO.
Hi! all, additional comments. UDCP and Tru2way were also referred to as OCAP 1.0 and OCAP 2.0 in specs published by CableLabs. While UDCP or OCAP 1.0 specified single stream CableCARD (e.g. the S-CARD) Tru2way or OCAP 2.0 indeed defines a multiple-stream CableCARD (e.g. the M-CARD). CableLabs renamed OCAP 2.0 as Tru2way early this year. However, CableLabs and major MSO were not all happy with CableCARD technology. That was the reason why a separated entity was created (by CableLabs and major MSO) to investigate and so to develop a software based competing technology (to CableCARD). Unfortunately, the new software based technology has not yet been approved by FCC. Personally, I think this is yet to see how well a new class of True2way devices will be delivered to the market and to be accepted by general viewer like us.
This is the most intelligent response I've read so far. It amazes me how someone can author an article and understand so little of the basic technology they are writing about.
p5surf: I agree with your general sentiments. A typical media problem. The power of the pen yet the holders of the pen often are not too smart or well versed in the very subject area they claim to be experts in. Nonetheless, I give the author a break...I understood what he wanted to convey while megazone did a great job of correcting him on the details.
Why merge all these components into the tv? I'm not going to buy an uuber expensive new tv with an 8+year lifespan that's got a ~2 year lifespan component stuck inside it.
I work for a Cable Company testing everything mentioned in this article and i can assure you that this is a VERY HIGH priority for all cable companies. True2way will offer a number of additional functionality such as CallerID to TV or PC (If you have Voice services) and other big things that are being rolled out over the next 2 yrs. The OCAP standard will allow vendors to write applications similar to what Google wants to do with cellphones on the 700MHz spectrum. This pretty much gives programmers a lot of different possibilities.
I think 5 years from now, TV will be very different than it is today. It will be totally interactive, youll be able to do things such as Vote and stuff like that, but the problem is really that society is obsessed and in love with their TVs, so cable companies are sort of put in a bind with development because of fear of disrupting service. This greatly slows down the development life cycle for new products but hopefully as this technology matures, that curve will decrease.
Hi! does anyone have idea on the progress of DCAS? Assuming we are buying a true2way compatible TV today and DCAS is rolled out later. What will happen to our TV purchased today? Thanks,
To follow on John and Megazone's points, a few comments and questions:
1. CableCARDs do indeed suck. However, tru2way really shouldn't be positioned as a replacement for CableCARDs. Although they work hand-in-hand in the retail TV scenario, CableCARDs address separable security requirements and tru2way addresses bi-directional signal functionality and interactive application capability.
2. A better solution than CableCARDs (seemingly) is DCAS -- downloadable conditional access. The cable industry has been working on this and it's my understanding that the FCC would have to approve it. Anyone have any updates on DCAS progress?
3. How does tru2way help to overcome the issues around switched digital video? I'm not seeing the connection.
4. How will tru2way interactive applications (not the UI but interactive content) work with DVR viewing? If I'm watching a baseball game and want to get a batter's stats instantly, will those stats be accessible if I'm time-shifting the game, or even if I've recorded it?
5. Tru2way deployment will move slowly. Panasonic and Samsung will have some HDTVs and DVRs available at retail in select markets by this holiday season. I doubt Sony could have HDTVs ready by this holiday season (notice they didn't promise any) but I suppose they could make a play for the digital transition in February.
6. Tru2way does not mean that we'll all be discarding set-top boxes anytime soon. The big set-top makers, Motorola and Cisco (nee Scientific Atlanta) and several market newcomers are building cable set-tops with tru2way bells & whistles, which cable ops will lease to consumers as they do now. Those manufacturers aren't jumping in to the retail market yet because the current thinking is that the better retail play (depending on price, etc) is to offer HDTVs with set-top capability inside for easy plug-and-play.
7. The real benefit of tru2way is to establish a broad platform for Java-based interactive applications and cross-platform capabilities. That requires that programming networks and third-party developers ramp up to create interactive TV applications and that they closely tie their development to the slow yet steady rollout of the tru2way platform over the next couple of years.
ITV - DCAS seems to have reduced priority. DCAS was pushed by cable as an alternative to CableCARD, but once it was clear they couldn't get out of CableCARD they seem to have focused on CableCARD and tru2way, with DCAS work taking a back seat. There has been some mention of DCAS, such as a few tidbits from the recent Cable Show, but tru2way is really dominating the news. With all the money being invested in CableCARD and tru2way, I suspect DCAS will be delayed several years. As for what happens when DCAS arrives, due to the investment in CC I don't see support for CC being dropped. And there has been speculation that a 'DCAS Card' could be used, some kind of DCAS module in a CC form factor that would allow legacy CC devices to work with DCAS. tru2way encompasses SDV. Any tru2way device automatically handles SDV. As for t2w applications - that's up to the individual application. It is certainly possible to put flags into the broadcast to tie into an application so that it could work from recordings, etc. In the end it comes down to the apps and how they're written and supported. There is no reason they have to be restricted to live TV.
you all are much more advanced than I in understanding all this...but can anyone answer a simple question?...i am a comcast subscriber, all i want is a 37" tv i can mount on a wall, get HBO, Showtime, Cinemax, and all my other premium channels without using a box...is there a solution today, or do I wait until this new technology hopefully comes out.?
galusi - You can install such a TV today BUT... if it just has a cable or QAM tuner, it will only receive the cable signals that are "in the clear" (not encrypted) by Comcast. If it also has a cablecard slot it will be able to receive ALL of the channels, including those premium ones like HBO that would be encrypted and wouldn't decode properly on your QAM tuner alone. Now, if your cable operator deploys some channels using Switched Digital Video (SDV) in your area, you wouldn't be able to get those channels (actually you would, but you wouldn't know where they were, since they change all the time, and you would only be able to watch them when someone else in your neighbourhood had asked for them via a STB). However, Comcast hasn't rolled out a lot of SDV yet, unlike TW and some others, so you're okay so far. However, once they do start rolling out SDV and assuming you care about those SDV channels (at first you might not, if its all specialty channels like Spanish or whatever that you're not interested in, but later when it starts being new HD channels...), you'll be somewhat screwed because your cablecard TV won't be able to tune those channels. And there's no real fix on the horizon. A "tuning resolver" has been proposed and will be supported by Tivos, but (a) its unlikely TVs will support it, (b) your TV probably can't support it since it won't have a USB port and the needed interfaces internally, (c) it'll look just like a STB anyway, so your STB-less setup won't be so nice and clean anymore.
Which is why cablecard TVs are pretty much dead at this point. I might stomach throwing out my $300 Tivo, but I'm not going to obsolete my $$$ TV anytime soon.
Will Tru2way make for a better cable TV experience? Or will it be the latest consumer electronics scheme to over-promise and under-deliver?
I certainly hope Tru2way will make for a better cable TV experience. I currently use a CableCard and I like that I don't have a cable box and yet another remote to keep track of and foul with. Though I have never liked the cable box idea, I do miss some of its features, while at the same time loving that I haven't lost the features inherent in my TV. If Tru2way truly delivers the promise of the cable card I, for one, will be an extremely happy camper.
Like the "less advanced" galusi above, I'm trying to research the functionality of CableCards, to avoid a STB on my to-be-purchased small digital TV, for the kitchen.
So, I've learned a lot, but want to know what the current and future status of Comcast service is, here in the East Bay (Oakland CA). Comcast says they are in the process of an "all digital roll-out", to be completed "toward the end of the year. How can I find out the technical specs of the current and to-be Comcast network in my area? Or does anyone know what the Comcast "plan" is?
A good article, but you've made a couple of fundamental errors. Where you refer to 'CableCARD' you're generally referring to UDCP specifically, and not really CableCARD. CableCARDs are ALL two-way, and they're all compatible with SDV. It is the *host* platform, the UDCP, that has those limitations. Also, the Tuning Adapter for SDV is not a 'tuner', it is basically a transceiver. The TA provides a data connection with the cable head-end, via protocols like DSG (DOCSIS Set-top Gateway), to handle the back channel communication required to tune SDV channels. The actually tuning is still done by the on-board tuners in the UDCP, such as a TiVo HD.
And M-Card is very common now. While S-Card was deployed first, and it took a while for M-Card to hit and then ramp up, these days all of the major MSOs offer M-Card. Most users won't have a problem getting an M-Card, they're the default much of the time these days. A single M-Card supports six channels, but your host device needs to have the hardware. The best I'm aware of today are dual-tuner boxes.
Also, you said tru2way is effectively CableCARD 2.0 - without the card. That's very much false. tru2way, formerly known by the less snappy names OCAP (OpenCable Application Platform) and then just OpenCable Platform, is a programming platform, a set of standards and APIs. CableCARD is an access token system that provides authentication and authorization for the box. tru2way sits *on top of* CableCARD.
Boxes using tru2way still use CableCARD. tru2way/OCAP is what often used to erroneously be called 'CableCARD 2.0' - you still have the physical cards, but the added software and APIs supports two-way communication. And it is more than that, since it is meant to provide a Java-based 'write once, run anywhere' platform for STB software development. So instead of a myriad of different STB platforms to code for, developers can code for tru2way and (theoretically) have their software run on any tru2way host device.
The 'CableCARD without the card' is DCAS - Downloadable Conditional Access System - which is what has been proposed as the following to CableCARD, and is still in development. With DCAS the box would have a secure module built in and the access system code would be downloaded to the box, no physical cards required.
As for the UI issue with vendors such as TiVo, I think you've missed one of the key factors in the agreement. The big issue with OCAP *was* the problem with the UI, where OCAP devices would download whatever the cable company shoved at them. What good is supporting OCAP to TiVo if they lose all of their differentiation?
But the cable industry softened and TiVo was the first to announced a compromise, whereby the device could use a 'native' UI for all of the linear content (what a TiVo HD can do today, plus SDV), but would call upon cable MSO applications for advanced content like VOD and PPV. A hybrid basically. So you'd still get your TiVo UI most of the time, breaking out of it only when you go to access specific features. Not dissimilar to using one of the HME applications on a broadband connected TiVo, when you leave the TiVo UI and enter the HME-apps UI, which can be very different.
I think tru2way will be an improvement. Basic CD devices, like TVs, which really don't have their own EPG, UI, etc, will be able to use tru2way to add richer features. And the more advanced CE products, like TiVo, will be able to use the hybrid implementation to go beyond what they have today and add missing features like VOD & PPV - plus things like Called ID, Start Over, etc, when offered by the local MSO.
I think 5 years from now, TV will be very different than it is today. It will be totally interactive, youll be able to do things such as Vote and stuff like that, but the problem is really that society is obsessed and in love with their TVs, so cable companies are sort of put in a bind with development because of fear of disrupting service. This greatly slows down the development life cycle for new products but hopefully as this technology matures, that curve will decrease.
It will be totally interactive..."
I'm sure it will evolve, but I doubt it will be as fast as you think;
see: http://community.livejournal.com/pacific_novelty/26016.html
[refers to the almost famous QUBE TV circa 1977]
1. CableCARDs do indeed suck. However, tru2way really shouldn't be positioned as a replacement for CableCARDs. Although they work hand-in-hand in the retail TV scenario, CableCARDs address separable security requirements and tru2way addresses bi-directional signal functionality and interactive application capability.
2. A better solution than CableCARDs (seemingly) is DCAS -- downloadable conditional access. The cable industry has been working on this and it's my understanding that the FCC would have to approve it. Anyone have any updates on DCAS progress?
3. How does tru2way help to overcome the issues around switched digital video? I'm not seeing the connection.
4. How will tru2way interactive applications (not the UI but interactive content) work with DVR viewing? If I'm watching a baseball game and want to get a batter's stats instantly, will those stats be accessible if I'm time-shifting the game, or even if I've recorded it?
5. Tru2way deployment will move slowly. Panasonic and Samsung will have some HDTVs and DVRs available at retail in select markets by this holiday season. I doubt Sony could have HDTVs ready by this holiday season (notice they didn't promise any) but I suppose they could make a play for the digital transition in February.
6. Tru2way does not mean that we'll all be discarding set-top boxes anytime soon. The big set-top makers, Motorola and Cisco (nee Scientific Atlanta) and several market newcomers are building cable set-tops with tru2way bells & whistles, which cable ops will lease to consumers as they do now. Those manufacturers aren't jumping in to the retail market yet because the current thinking is that the better retail play (depending on price, etc) is to offer HDTVs with set-top capability inside for easy plug-and-play.
7. The real benefit of tru2way is to establish a broad platform for Java-based interactive applications and cross-platform capabilities. That requires that programming networks and third-party developers ramp up to create interactive TV applications and that they closely tie their development to the slow yet steady rollout of the tru2way platform over the next couple of years.
Which is why cablecard TVs are pretty much dead at this point. I might stomach throwing out my $300 Tivo, but I'm not going to obsolete my $$$ TV anytime soon.
WHAT WILL HAPPEN ONCE "TRU2WAY" IS ACTUALLY REALIZED???
WILL I NEED TO GET CABLE-BOXES FOR MY SONY & PANASONIC HDTVs???
THANKS,
RIVERLEDGE
I certainly hope Tru2way will make for a better cable TV experience. I currently use a CableCard and I like that I don't have a cable box and yet another remote to keep track of and foul with. Though I have never liked the cable box idea, I do miss some of its features, while at the same time loving that I haven't lost the features inherent in my TV. If Tru2way truly delivers the promise of the cable card I, for one, will be an extremely happy camper.
- by roseave November 29, 2009 3:21 AM PST
- Like the "less advanced" galusi above, I'm trying to research the functionality of CableCards, to avoid a STB on my to-be-purchased small digital TV, for the kitchen.
- Like this Reply to this comment
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(19 Comments)So, I've learned a lot, but want to know what the current and future status of Comcast service is, here in the East Bay (Oakland CA). Comcast says they are in the process of an "all digital roll-out", to be completed "toward the end of the year. How can I find out the technical specs of the current and to-be Comcast network in my area? Or does anyone know what the Comcast "plan" is?