Comments on: The cell phone lifeline challenge: Reader feedback
There have been a few dozen good responses to the post I wrote about new technologies or services that could help find people who get into trouble while traveling.
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So, why don?t cell phones have the ability to display position? Sure, most people would not know how to use the info, but for the few cents cost this feature would add, why not splurge? And besides, the Kims would likely have been just the folks who would have benefitted.
I have read literally hundreds of comments regarding the Kims and I am surprised that this has not come up.
You see, the GPS which is built into most cell phones is AGPS ( "Assisted" GPS). This type of GPS uses the ability of specialized equipment located in the cellular base-stations to get its location. Since the base stations find their location on the globe due to their own equipment, they can then give the cell phone its rough location 'in relation to the tower'. That being said, you must unfortunately have reception on your AGPS capable cell phone from a tower which supports this service in order to utilize it.
So, why don?t cell phones have the ability to display position? Sure, most people would not know how to use the info, but for the few cents cost this feature would add, why not splurge? And besides, the Kims would likely have been just the folks who would have benefitted.
I have read literally hundreds of comments regarding the Kims and I am surprised that this has not come up.
You see, the GPS which is built into most cell phones is AGPS ( "Assisted" GPS). This type of GPS uses the ability of specialized equipment located in the cellular base-stations to get its location. Since the base stations find their location on the globe due to their own equipment, they can then give the cell phone its rough location 'in relation to the tower'. That being said, you must unfortunately have reception on your AGPS capable cell phone from a tower which supports this service in order to utilize it.
US, and Russian satellites already detect, locate, and send assistance for any signal received from an EPIRB, absolutely free (unless it's a false alarm, in which case it costs a $10,000 fine, plus costs). It costs nothing to send the signal, it is detected and located in about 4 minutes, and many of the devices contain a homing signal on the same frequency as aircraft distress signaling - which notifies and guides any aircraft in the vicinity to the location. The devices also have GPS built-in and operate on a lithium battery (5-year shelf life). The cost (for a personal model with all the stuff) is about $650 - somewhat more than a cell phone, about the same as a good PDA. There are only three problems left to amking them the solution - integration (with iPODS, cellphones, car radios, etc.), cost reduction (production cost/volume), and dealing with the thousands of false alarms triggered by faulty design or faulty people.
Mr. Kim had no expectation that he would be in a life threatening situation. Unfortunately, for all his love of gadgets, he had none that would save him. But the device *is* already available - and just as soon as I evaluate all the models, I will be another early adopter. This lesson is not lost on me.
US, and Russian satellites already detect, locate, and send assistance for any signal received from an EPIRB, absolutely free (unless it's a false alarm, in which case it costs a $10,000 fine, plus costs). It costs nothing to send the signal, it is detected and located in about 4 minutes, and many of the devices contain a homing signal on the same frequency as aircraft distress signaling - which notifies and guides any aircraft in the vicinity to the location. The devices also have GPS built-in and operate on a lithium battery (5-year shelf life). The cost (for a personal model with all the stuff) is about $650 - somewhat more than a cell phone, about the same as a good PDA. There are only three problems left to amking them the solution - integration (with iPODS, cellphones, car radios, etc.), cost reduction (production cost/volume), and dealing with the thousands of false alarms triggered by faulty design or faulty people.
Mr. Kim had no expectation that he would be in a life threatening situation. Unfortunately, for all his love of gadgets, he had none that would save him. But the device *is* already available - and just as soon as I evaluate all the models, I will be another early adopter. This lesson is not lost on me.
Neither will Onstar if the antenna does not have a clear view of the sky OR you have a camper on your new pickup truck and you find out it blocks the antenna which can not be moved
I deal with this all the time in boats and unless your VERY luckey bad happens to fast to turn anything ON
Tommays
Neither will Onstar if the antenna does not have a clear view of the sky OR you have a camper on your new pickup truck and you find out it blocks the antenna which can not be moved
I deal with this all the time in boats and unless your VERY luckey bad happens to fast to turn anything ON
Tommays
My idea is not extremely unique,though i favor it far better than not in time of danger.
As years have passed, have always thought that the idea of those microchips inplanted inside humans when they wanted it, could be of far greater value than not.
Logically, concerns about civil liberties, hard-headed thoughts of big brother occur in most responses,i would perceive.
But, had anyone with one of those small microchips been lost, all issues of sad news currently facing society's compassion for that tragic and courageous death may have been prevented had one of their family had one of those microchips.
applied digital solutions is the name i think about,cause one day several years ago, recall some big shot of that company or its parent company getting one of those chips installed in his hand,i think.
satellite finding chip, you get saved.
Now, years later had read that those chips are in pets when they would get lost, in cattle around the world when rancher wants to know where is that cow.
Why not consider in human with option to have removed as requested afterwards?
Could link health info...
Could even be used in time of war,though not probally legal.
Remember that Daniel Pearl reporter guy died by terrorists years ago? If he had chip,maybe special forces could have tracked him and maybe even saved his life?
Alot of ifs, but still an option,IMO.
The point is not that one needs to agree on idea,but maybe some future
My idea is not extremely unique,though i favor it far better than not in time of danger.
As years have passed, have always thought that the idea of those microchips inplanted inside humans when they wanted it, could be of far greater value than not.
Logically, concerns about civil liberties, hard-headed thoughts of big brother occur in most responses,i would perceive.
But, had anyone with one of those small microchips been lost, all issues of sad news currently facing society's compassion for that tragic and courageous death may have been prevented had one of their family had one of those microchips.
applied digital solutions is the name i think about,cause one day several years ago, recall some big shot of that company or its parent company getting one of those chips installed in his hand,i think.
satellite finding chip, you get saved.
Now, years later had read that those chips are in pets when they would get lost, in cattle around the world when rancher wants to know where is that cow.
Why not consider in human with option to have removed as requested afterwards?
Could link health info...
Could even be used in time of war,though not probally legal.
Remember that Daniel Pearl reporter guy died by terrorists years ago? If he had chip,maybe special forces could have tracked him and maybe even saved his life?
Alot of ifs, but still an option,IMO.
The point is not that one needs to agree on idea,but maybe some future
The systems that give others immediate access to your phone records are smart becuase going thru channels and geeting a subpoena is very sluggish going when time is precious.
If you're worried carry 2. Insurance, and cheap, considering the consequences. But they alert authorities damn near immediately, which makes finding them pretty easy, as long as you have a window open to a sat above you.
Of course, you'd have to know you were going off in the boonies and not on a regularly travelled road before you carried one. Would you have it in your trunk commuting back and forth to work? Not should you, but do you?
bb
The systems that give others immediate access to your phone records are smart becuase going thru channels and geeting a subpoena is very sluggish going when time is precious.
If you're worried carry 2. Insurance, and cheap, considering the consequences. But they alert authorities damn near immediately, which makes finding them pretty easy, as long as you have a window open to a sat above you.
Of course, you'd have to know you were going off in the boonies and not on a regularly travelled road before you carried one. Would you have it in your trunk commuting back and forth to work? Not should you, but do you?
bb
When traveling with my family long distances in areas that are unknown to me, especially in cold/harsh weather, I always carry an emergency duffel. (don't forget extreme heat can kill too, imagine being broken down on the side of the road in death valley!)
Please be prepared out there. It is not easy to pack along an extra bag and the chances of needing it are slim.... but the consequences are soooo grave that it is required not just advised. I pay $1,000 a year for insurance on my home. I don't know anyone who has had their home burn down (I know it does happen) but the consequences of losing my house versus the cost of the insurance is just too much. Buy your family some additional insurance and get prepared. This goes for travel and home emergencies. As we say "Welcome to the Church of Preparedness".
When traveling with my family long distances in areas that are unknown to me, especially in cold/harsh weather, I always carry an emergency duffel. (don't forget extreme heat can kill too, imagine being broken down on the side of the road in death valley!)
Please be prepared out there. It is not easy to pack along an extra bag and the chances of needing it are slim.... but the consequences are soooo grave that it is required not just advised. I pay $1,000 a year for insurance on my home. I don't know anyone who has had their home burn down (I know it does happen) but the consequences of losing my house versus the cost of the insurance is just too much. Buy your family some additional insurance and get prepared. This goes for travel and home emergencies. As we say "Welcome to the Church of Preparedness".
Please, Please find a way to upgrade cell coverage to S. Oregon. This will happen again & again, and in other spots. At best, I could get my relatives to regularly carry cell phones. There's a lot of bad roads down there with dense underbrush--you might be stuck for a long time and nobody can see you.
I saw the CNN story, and the video of the really bad road signs...It would be very hard to choose the right road. I saw the tiny goat-trail to the left (which is the road to the coast), and the nice big road on the right--which has now killed at least 2 people now. And the hard-to-read little sign with the even tinier "Coast" sign. And the gate that keeps Magically getting vandalized-- and people keep dying or near misses year after year. And nothing being done to fix it. How is this not negligent homicide?
I doubt anything will change regarding the roadsigns, upgrading the roadblocks, or making this area less of a killer. It doesn't look like people can count on the officials down there at all. Time for the people to re-take control, label the roads, form volunteer snowmobile/4-wheeler groups, fire some folks, more effectively block roads, etc.
Please, Please find a way to upgrade cell coverage to S. Oregon. This will happen again & again, and in other spots. At best, I could get my relatives to regularly carry cell phones. There's a lot of bad roads down there with dense underbrush--you might be stuck for a long time and nobody can see you.
I saw the CNN story, and the video of the really bad road signs...It would be very hard to choose the right road. I saw the tiny goat-trail to the left (which is the road to the coast), and the nice big road on the right--which has now killed at least 2 people now. And the hard-to-read little sign with the even tinier "Coast" sign. And the gate that keeps Magically getting vandalized-- and people keep dying or near misses year after year. And nothing being done to fix it. How is this not negligent homicide?
I doubt anything will change regarding the roadsigns, upgrading the roadblocks, or making this area less of a killer. It doesn't look like people can count on the officials down there at all. Time for the people to re-take control, label the roads, form volunteer snowmobile/4-wheeler groups, fire some folks, more effectively block roads, etc.
Could car manufacturers build one into the vehicle? Sure. They'll pass the cost along, and the economies of scale will drive the cost of the widget down to $250 or less. But that's still more money for a car. Would folks who just never stray off the beaten path want to pay it?
I actually own a personal EPIRB. I take it when I sail, even if I'm not leaving local waters. I take it when driving in the mountains. But I'm a suspenders'n'belt kinda guy, and I have the spare cash to pay full freight for that kind of peace of mind for my wife. That, after all, is what I'm really acquiring.
This kind of tragedy is, thankfully, rare. That very rarity makes it economically inappropriate to wire an EPIRB into every car. But if your personal behavior increases the odds of you getting stranded, then you ought to consider the investment.
family was just a lucky break. Another two miles on, or behind a hill, and
they'd be out of it. I don't know if the engineering would be much cheaper,
but maybe, if you just had a beacon that notified a central service of who you
were, where you were within a few feet, and that you were in trouble enough
to pull the pin, then maybe the cost could come down. Also, if all cars were
required to offer this, then a pile of people who travel in the country would
pay the price. And you can't tell me that a few years down the line, the price
wouldn't come down.
If you made it clear that, if you pulled the pin when it wasn't an emergency,
you'd pay for the rescue effort yourself, I'm sure it wouldn't be used often. It
would be good if you could rent them for a couple of weeks when you want to
go to the mountains for a few days.
- Personal EPIRB is the solution, but not cheap
- by jdzions December 12, 2006 5:48 PM PST
- A personal EPIRB (locater beacon) would solve this. The cost of the device is under $500; has enough battery to transmit your location for 24 hours, which is more than enough time for the satellites to get a pretty close fix on your location.
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- This can work, the cell phone thing, no
- by swift2--2008 December 12, 2006 8:03 PM PST
- I think the crucial thing here is, the cell phone tower that found the Kim
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- If sailboat may have it why not cars?
- by jfrosello December 13, 2006 7:48 AM PST
- I think the increase in price is not a problem compared to the price of a car (and you can offer it as optional). You may include offer a system similar to the boat of self activation in case the car is upside-down (in a figure like this you may not be able to activate your EPIRB (Argos or whatever it may be)). Celular phone may have its battery affected by low temp and a satellite phone is really expensive.
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Showing 1 of 2 pages (37 Comments)Could car manufacturers build one into the vehicle? Sure. They'll pass the cost along, and the economies of scale will drive the cost of the widget down to $250 or less. But that's still more money for a car. Would folks who just never stray off the beaten path want to pay it?
I actually own a personal EPIRB. I take it when I sail, even if I'm not leaving local waters. I take it when driving in the mountains. But I'm a suspenders'n'belt kinda guy, and I have the spare cash to pay full freight for that kind of peace of mind for my wife. That, after all, is what I'm really acquiring.
This kind of tragedy is, thankfully, rare. That very rarity makes it economically inappropriate to wire an EPIRB into every car. But if your personal behavior increases the odds of you getting stranded, then you ought to consider the investment.
family was just a lucky break. Another two miles on, or behind a hill, and
they'd be out of it. I don't know if the engineering would be much cheaper,
but maybe, if you just had a beacon that notified a central service of who you
were, where you were within a few feet, and that you were in trouble enough
to pull the pin, then maybe the cost could come down. Also, if all cars were
required to offer this, then a pile of people who travel in the country would
pay the price. And you can't tell me that a few years down the line, the price
wouldn't come down.
If you made it clear that, if you pulled the pin when it wasn't an emergency,
you'd pay for the rescue effort yourself, I'm sure it wouldn't be used often. It
would be good if you could rent them for a couple of weeks when you want to
go to the mountains for a few days.