Comments on: Flash Player 10 beta coming to most smartphones this fall

Adobe confirms an October beta version for Windows Mobile, Android, Palm WebOS, and Symbian smartphones. One platform noticeably missing from the list: iPhone OS.

[seven7dust]

maybe iPhone owners need to wait
but with youtube ,dailymotion, Tv.com and a host of others + itunes
I dont think it's as killer of a feature as everyone is making it out to be

plus flash = hog of CPU resources {it not even optimized for dual core Pcs/Macs }
No matter how much they optimize it they are still phones with tiny processesors and low memory
Imagine a pre running 5 web pages that use flash ads and video
battery will probably last 30 minutes and it'll probably run out of memory in the mean time and crash !

[iroq321]

rrriiiggghhhtt...you probably own an iphone.

[seven7dust]

nope have a ipod touch
but overall other than HULU which I use on my Apple TV
I dont see that much use for flash

[iroq321]

what i'm trying to say is your trying pretty hard to justify why flash isn't a big deal, which is what lead me to believe that you had an iphone (or an apple device) or maybe even blackberry. it's a big and welcome step in the right direction and just because you might not use it much, doesn't mean everyone else won't either.

[seven7dust]

I'm one of those people that hate flash to the core
and I hope it dies and gets replaced with open source stuff like HTML 5 etc.
that closed proprietary bloatware has bugged me long enough on my Computer
I would rather not have it on a mobile device !

[FourWheelVibe]

Hilarious that an iPhone owner knocks Flash for being "closed/proprietary". Apple is the epitome of proprietary - they control the HW, OS, App store/distribution channel and lockout anyone they don't want. If this is such an "open" platform, remind me again why developers need to get their apps approved by Apple and they only distribution channel is Apple's app store?? Apple's board should consider changing the company name to the Communist Republic of Cupertino. Face people, the reason Apple doesn't want Flash on the iPhone is to continue to exert control over the platform. Allowing Flash would open the device to a significant number of developers that Apple wouldn't be able to own/control which would severely cut into their app store revenues. Stop being Apple's sheep - this is not about technology (performance, battery life, blah blah blah), this is about dollars and cents and Apple protecting it's golden goose.

[kaibelf]

At the end of the day, flash isn't THAT pivotal. Why in the world do I need to watch ridiculously overwrought and often poorly-designed sites on a tiny screen? Ick. I've been fine without it this long, and honestly no longer miss it.

[-Roddly]

There are so many flash based players and flashed based sites nowadays that not having it is the biggest shortcoming of smartphones and the most limiting part of web browsing on mobile devices. It's a huge disadvantage no matter how you try to spin it or downplay it. It's way too common to ignore.

[aMUSICsite]

A lot of the games I've been getting from the app store in the 50p price range would be replaced by free flash games.

Movies and music I hardly ever stream anyway so that would not bother me.

[lk335]

I guess blackberry needs to release an update to the dated browser they got out now before us BB users get to get flash...

[wmurch3]

here comes all the iphone users commenting on how they don't really need Flash and how it hogs this and that blah blah blah

Can't wait to get this on my Pre!

[Jeffg3601]

Well, that will make what? 31 applications?

[Maxwell Studly]

@Jeffg3601

That's cute, you're worried about how many applications the Pre has when it's only been out on the market for ~2 weeks. Being that the Pre home-brew development community is already on fire and that the official SDK will see release by summer's end, the # apps the Pre has should be your last concern. How about running more than one app on the dumbest smart phone around (iPhone), that should be more of a concern for you. Knee-jerk replies coming from apple-fangirls in ...3...2...1...

[cathwachs]

Actually, I'm pretty upset Apple iPhone will not have Flash. Most videos are in flash now. Not sure about the memory thing, but it would be nice to have. I have been locked out of several sites because of it. Maybe the Android phone will be a better buy next time.

[Constable Odo]

Yup, lack of Flash will have everyone dumping their iPhones just to get their hands on a WinMo or Android device. Truthfully, I wish Flash could be implemented on the iPhone, but that isn't going to change much if it doesn't. The iPhone is more than just a Flash enabling device. iPhone users will do without it and survive just as they did without cut, copy and paste or video recording.

By the time Flash final gets to the rest of the handsets, the iPhone will have about 80,000 apps and people will have other things to keep themselves occupied with. Yes, go run your Flash on a Pre and see your battery take a hit. I know you don't care because it's swappable. The iPhone doesn't have that option so it's better not to use Flash on the iPhone. I can live without it.

[iPhoneFanBoy]

Youtube is like flash on the iPhone. The iPhone is so popular that it doesn't have to adopt anything. The web will have to adopt the iPhone. What I'm saying is that the web will adapt to the iPhone, not the other way around. Palm will be out of business in two years. Sprint too.

[adasha76]

what an accurate user name you have

[kaibelf]

He's right, adasha, and I'm not at all an Apple *****. No one makes a big deal about any phone except the iPhone. The LONE exception was the Pre, and the big question was "Can it compete with the iPhone?" And now it's out, and I have yet to see anyone call it anything but a decent clone.

[Qtechbg]

You look at the sheer number of iPhones Apple sells _now_. But you forget that there are billions of other operational gsm devices. Yes, iPhone is the top seller but not the only one model in use. Same goes for the apps - iPhone does have a huge app store but compared to the millions of flash based games, apps and services currently present in Internet - it is a tiny drop. Same is the ratio of flash developers vs iPhone developers. In general your calculations are anything but correct.
At the end - the 99% of the users will benefit and you, the apple boys will have to put up with this. One can only feel sorry for you...

[Cirothe]

I would like Flash on the iPhone, but only if (and I'm sure it would be done) there was a way to disable it whenever you want. That way you could leave it off and only turn it on when you really need it.

[aMUSICsite]

I like the idea of a 'flash app' like the way youtube works on the iphone. You see a place holder and if you want to run the plugin it takes you to a seperate app.

That way you can ignore all the adverts that would take up processing power, but still get the games, chart and interactive content you want.

But almost everyone in the know can see that Apple don't want us iPhone users getting free games, music and movies from the web when we could be buying them from the app/itunes stores.

I would guess the 'to demanding' argument Apple used has been somewhat removed by the faster 'S' model. Flash on this would be a BIG insentive to upgrade, for me anyway.

[Seanambers]

Flash for mobile devices is probably a great step in the right direction, i dont expect the experience to always be great as even on my desktop and laptop thing tend to slow down on flash heavy sites, however this is just another step in making mobile devices more versatile and in turn more useful.

One cannot argue with the trend that computing power is going mobile, this is just a step along the way to deliver the same user experience as on a computer.

[uros2012]

What about Flash for BlackBerry?

[bonnie.cha]

Good point, uros2012! Unfortunately, Adobe didn't mention anything about BlackBerry either so the post has been update with that info.

[MadLyb]

The sad thing is the iPhone is probably the best equipped Smartphone for Flash in terms of H/W, especially the 3GS, but allowing it would bypass the cash cow that is the app store.

[kojacked]

Bingo! +1

[jpleau74]

With the new release of Safari having HTML 5 support, which includes native support of video and other flash-like element tags, I can't see Apple ever getting Flash on the iPhone. Most flash use on the web is for content delivery (i.e. video), and if this can be done by simple HTML tags then I would guess that Flash will become less and less relevant. The major mobile device vendors all seem to be adopting the Apple "AppStore stategy", which will further marginalize Flash.

[FourWheelVibe]

You're missing a couple of important points. 1) HTML 5 is still a ways off and there is considerable disagreement in the community about how to support video - i.e. which codecs, etc. among other things related to the "standard". Even once HTML 5 becomes a standard, it will be several years before in can be consistently implemented across browsers and platforms 2) Adobe's Open Screen Project - http://www.openscreenproject.org/ - which is the leading driver behind bringing Flash to devices has brought together most of the major device manufacturers and a large number of content producers and mobile carriers with the #1 goal to support Flash across devices. Why is this important? Because Flash provides a consistent common runtime for applications (i.e. what Java initially set out to do but failed miserably because of the fragmentation of the runtime). It is not scalable or cost effective to have to build apps for individual devices/platforms - i.e. building apps to target just the iPhone (or the next flavor of the month).

Granted Apple has done a great job of controlling the keys to the kingdom through their app store, but content producers, carriers, developers and ultimately consumers want choices and need to leverage economies of scale. Apple dictates what it's customers can put on their devices by controlling the SDK/app store and maintaining explicit control over their platform. If MSFT did this, people would be screaming from the tops of buildings about their anti-competitive business practices. The only reason Apple gets a pass is because they have less market share and have convinced their customers that this explicit control is really "in their best interest". Enabling Flash across PC's and devices open these platforms up to over 1 million + developers to write once and deploy anywhere thereby bypassing the control that Apple has on it's platform. Again the fact that Apple is resistant to Flash has nothing to do with the technology and everything to do with Apple's revenue streams. Think about it, if Flash was so bad on devices do you think you would have companies like Motorola, Nokia, Samsung, Sony Erickson, etc. etc making *significant* investments in this platform? The reality is that Flash and RIA's in general pose a significant threat to OS vendors as it democratizes the platform.

[codynews]

The only thing I'd like Flash for is hulu... Since so many other sites seem to be able to stream video to my phone with out using flash, why the hell can't Hulu?

Cody

[kaibelf]

Agreed. 100%. I do wish Hulu was available sometimes, but usually I can wait a couple of hours to watch that Family Guy clip ;)

[clamenza]

Anyone else not being able to support Flash would've been slammed but it's Apple, so "This doesn't rule out Flash support on iPhones in the future, however."

Don't hold your breath, folks.

[eswinson]

I think it is more the case that Flash can't support Apple. It runs like crap on even the high end macs. Knowing that they have refused to optimize the code for MacOS intel or PPC I don't think they have a chance of getting it right for OSX on the iphone.

If they could write a Flash plugin for the Mac that didn't put my MacBook air into meltdown watching a youtube video then maybe Apple would have a little confidence that they could write a resource optimized player for the iphone. If I was Apple I would tell them to make it right on the Mac first and then we can talk about iPhone. If I were Adobe and looking at Html 5 / CSS and a more and more optimized video codecs for quicktime and other players I might take the hint to pony up and rewrite the plugin to avoid irrelevance on a growing platform that is influencing the hottest cell phone in ages.

[ExWinUser]

I wish Adobe AIR could be installed also. That way I could bypass having to use the web browser to access my database online and just use my Flex apps instead. It's just so much fun to create your own apps, well for me anyway.

[joelFiser]

Stick around, my friend.
AIR was designed with smart phones in mind. AIR comes with its own database, allows read / write access on the phone's file system (given permission, of course), can handle Javascript, HTML and, of course Flash.
After we get Flash on all the smart phone browsers, next comes AIR. Then it's develop once, deploy everywhere.

[tgrenier]

It seems ironic to me that the personal computer (MAC and PC) has been minimized over the years by putting forth the idea that nobody needs applications or an OS because everything will be done over the internet. "All you'll need is a browser." Well along comes the Iphone and once again it's all about applications. You need an APP for everything. MLB =need and app. Youtube = need an app. Facebook = need an app. All of these things and many many others run in a browser on computers, no? The iphone is doing a real nice job at bringing back the operating system and following the Windows model. I expect to see Mr. Jobs doing a monkey dance and chanting DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS as soon as he is healthy enough.

[cosuna]

@tgrenier. Remember what McLuhan said back on the sixties "Every new medium build on an old medium". Just as I.B.M. ruled the microcomputing world when it invented the P.C. and latter lost the market to Compaq and Dell, so could the iPhone be onto a similar fate.

I used to be a "Developer" but mainly for enterprise Web apps. There's nothing inferior about apps done in the Net. They are fast, distributed and clean. But they can't do everything. Try playing "Super Monkey Ball" on the Web. Flash is kind of a middle ground being able to do some Rich Application Work while still being browser based.

The "real" reason Flash not coming to the iPhone any time soon is because it opposes Apples' controlled environment of App deployment through the App Store, not because the iPhone needs apps.

So the day would come when Flash comes to BlackBerry and iPhone, but that day will mark some changes from both companies. For now, we are still in the Commodore 64 vs Apple DOS vs PC-DOS vs CP/M era, smartphone-wise.

[mailbox001]

Its not available for the iPhone because Flash is only available for Smartphones. Anyways, when is Adobe going to create a 64 bit version for Windows 7 or Vista? Its annoying using the 32 bit browser on a high end machine.

[solu1978]

Good no flash for iPhone.. after all Apple's iPhone does not have to be like other smartphones.

[malmedia]

I hope the PSP gets this too :)

[Nael]

Since the iPhone has html 5 support, why is there a need for flash ? HTML 5 has native video tag, which allows you to embed video into html pages without use of flash and combined with open video codecs.

http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/video.html#video-and-audio-codecs-for-video-elements

Why does the iphone need flash with HTML 5 in place already ?

[joelFiser]

Here's a good breakdown of the actual FACTS regarding HTML5. This should answer your question.
http://www.davidtucker.net/2009/06/19/an-honest-open-discussion-on-web-standards-and-html-5/

[jimx2]

aww what about the sidekick? :(

[afox86]

i wanna try it