Comments on: Nero Liquid TV: TiVo for your PC

Liquid TV from Nero turns any Windows PC into a real TiVo--with an interface and remote that's identical to the set-top DVR.

[plbyrd]

It is quite simple: I want Dish Network and DirecTV to release satellite tuner cards in PCI Express form factor. Having to come up with a device that can accept HDMI input which has already been transcoded twice (once at the satellite broadcast location, second in the HD receiver) isn't what I call optimal. I'd pay a monthly premium over a standard DVR offered by the sattelite companies. My living room PC is far and away more powerful than those DVRs and the ability to merge my TV content with my digitally stored movie collection is without a quest one of the best uses of my living room PC.

I whole heartedly agree and I would like a verson for PCMCIA as I am a Directv subscriber. It would seem as though the Satt. Companies are letting a vast resource going untapped. Please don't tell me it is a matter of hardware because it is not, but it is a matter of software for the PCs and maybe some hardware connections. If I am going to pay for these other pirates online I would rather be legal and get DirecTV for my laptop and all my desktops.

[pu2006]

I would love to see a Mac version. I've got a Mac Mini connected to an HDhomerun with elgato eyeTV and iTunes/Frontrow running all the media for my home theater. But I'm a little tired of eyeTV's interface and instability and it doesn't integrate with Frontrow very well. I mean c'mon, there's not that many models of Macs out there that they can't program a stable application. And Myth and XBMC are just too complicated.

Or maybe Apple could just add TV tuner support and recording features to iTunes or Frontrow if they can get past the fact that some people (like me) won't pay $3 to download a HD TV show and/or might want to watch live TV. I know they applied for a patent along these lines, so bring it on.

[RobertFHarwood]

Earlier Macs, I have two in my basement, have this functionality. RCA connectors along with a analog cable/antenna tunner. Very basic VCR like software. Low commpression really eat up the disk space. My wife, who is a teacher, still has a bit of material still in that format.

[Jerewhon]

Although I have a TIVo series 1 that works fine with my TV, I just bought an Elgato Hybrid Tuner which comes with EyeTV 3 software.
It is a Mac product and although I only got it a week ago, it is as good or even better than the TivO.

More info at:

http://www.elgato.com

PS: No monthly fees for program guide.

[Renegade Knight]

$13 A month for a TV Guide? Cable, and Over The Air providers should be giving this stuff away so we know what we can watch on their system. Heck TV guide can sell the service for far less like they have been doing for the past few generations.

[RobertFHarwood]

The TiVo subscription is more then just a guide. Two of the features I use most are the Season Pass and KidZone.
Season Pass sets up reccuring recording of shows by name, not day and time. If the show's schedule changes the recording tracks it. If the show is a repeat, and you are set for first run only it will be ignored, it will also pick a showing that doesn't conflict with other recordings by itself, no juggling.
KidZone starts out with picking a panel of experts who judgements you trust, then add and subtract from their list of shows. Then the only programming the kids can see are the ones on the list. Works better then just a parential control lock out.

[ianbnet]

I'm a little shocked at the article opening with "limited to the likes of..."

Each of the three products mentioned is significantly more full-featured than a Tivo, offers beautiful interfaces, and you don't have to pay $150/year for the TV guide that is a prerequisite of even using such a product.

While the Tivo is a game-changing device, with a slick and refined UI, this seems more like a gimmick than anything else, given the multiple better solutions already on the market.

[ducttape36]

amen

[djames42]

I'm glad to see the article mentions BeyondTV as an alternative. For me it's the *only* reason I still have a Windows box in the house. Not only is the interface beautiful, it pretty much supports everything TiVo does and more. It has community recommendations which likely compare with TiVo's recommendations. It creates DVDs complete with menus and chapters (and speaking of chapters, it also determines where commercial breaks start and end and creates chapter marks--and does a darn good job of it, allowing one-click skipping of the ads), and exports to virtually every portable device out there including iPods and devices that support mpeg1/2/4/DivX/WMV - I have a Mac Mini as a media center and subscribe to my recorded television programs via "podcast" which then automatically sync to my AppleTV.

For $150 you can buy a package complete with tuner card, remote and software, and unlike TiVo you don't have to pay anything to get the program guide. Granted there's a minimal cost to add the DVD and iPod support, but it's still cheaper than the initial TiVo investment.

My only two complaints with BeyondTV are that the iTunes export does not preserve chapter marks, and that it does not support a platform other than Windows. Otherwise, it's the perfect DVR replacement!

[djames42]

I'm glad to see the article mentions BeyondTV as an alternative. For me it's the *only* reason I still have a Windows box in the house. Not only is the interface beautiful, it pretty much supports everything TiVo does and more. It has community recommendations which likely compare with TiVo's recommendations. It creates DVDs complete with menus and chapters (and speaking of chapters, it also determines where commercial breaks start and end and creates chapter marks--and does a darn good job of it, allowing one-click skipping of the ads), and exports to virtually every portable device out there including iPods and devices that support mpeg1/2/4/DivX/WMV - I have a Mac Mini as a media center and subscribe to my recorded television programs via "podcast" which then automatically sync to my AppleTV.

For $150 you can buy a package complete with tuner card, remote and software, and unlike TiVo you don't have to pay anything to get the program guide. Granted there's a minimal cost to add the DVD and iPod support, but it's still cheaper than the initial TiVo investment.

My only two complaints with BeyondTV are that the iTunes export does not preserve chapter marks, and that it does not support a platform other than Windows. Otherwise, it's the perfect DVR replacement!

[zorrillaj]

Medicenter does all this already and there's no monthly fee. It has a beautiful and easy to use interface, plus you can use a microsoft remote or program your harmony for it. I don't see the point of this at all. Paying $100-$150/yearf just so you get the experience doesn't sound very attractive.

[ceeneter]

Tivo used to be the biggest media consumer ripoff. Now Nero is set to exceed them with this pile;) Existing PC products like BeyondTV and even some of the free software you can download out there, already provide this service for nothing or a very low one-time price. Why on earth would anyone pay 12-13 dollars a month for Tivo or virtual Tivo. I guess computer illiterate people? or the ones who like the way TI-VO rolls off their tongue so easily.

BTW BeyondTV started supporting HD recording ages ago. I've had three HD tuners now for over two years. If I wanted to I can add even more tuners.

[tethior]

I dont agree with the statement that "Tivo used to be the biggest media consumer ripoff". For those people who are no computer savy or who have experienced the poor signal quality from PC based solutions, Tivo is a good solution. It is an AV device first and as such provides better s/n ratio than a PC.

With the advent of the cable company provided DVR, the Tivo continues to proivde features and performance that the cable company's implementation cannot come close to.

I'm also a very happy Beyond TV user. I'm glad to see a competitive product in the marketplace!

[RobertFHarwood]

I have been a long time owner of TiVo. I bought my Pioneer TiVo with DVD burner within the first few months of it being availabe. The burner would cut a disc 4x speed. Back then TiVo had two tiers of service and the Pioneer came with Lifetime Basic included in its almost $900 price tag. For several years I didn't need cable service since I keep the TiVo at my mother-in-laws. She had cable and the TiVo recorded the programs I was interested in. On Sunday we would go over and during our visit I would burn it all to DVD-RWs.

I have a Series3HD now a days. We use TiVo To Go daily to store kids programs out to the NAS. 5 terabytes, The TiVo format files are transcoded to WMV by Roxio. Roxio does a superior job of converting to iPod, though slower. It also burns DVDs.

I find it interesting that the Pioneer doesn't seem to recognize the same broadcast flags of the Series3HD.

[dukeboy42]

One thing this does not mention is whether or not it will stream recorded show to/from existing Tivo boxes. This might fall under the paragraph that mentions it doesn't include all the "bells and whitles" of regular Tivos. That, to me, is what would make this device most useful to go with my Tivo HD.

[mados123]

Was interested when I first saw the article. Then realized that they must be kidding to think they will be competitive with this product and still have monthly fees. DIY's will not pay that much for a product like this and those probably interested in TiVo probably have their box already. BeyondTV for me also.

[fhegner]

I live in Thailand and cable and TV are PAL. What recommendations do you have for configuring a DVR? The shelf solutions are limited (there is a Philips DVR, but all it does is record live TV based only on the channel you are watching). Does Windows Media Center or the other software listed here have the ability to read the programming schedule of any cable provder?

[MisterMeister]

@fhegner

"Does Windows Media Center or the other software listed here have the ability to read the programming schedule of any cable provder?"

I have a MythTV server that handles cable schedules here in the United States with Schedules Direct for $20.00 per year. MythTV uses an XMLTV grabber for countries outside of the United States and Canada. In reality most of the PC DVRs use an XMLTV grabber and EPG data to populate the schedule database.

MythTV is a good option if your have multiple computers since you can have one machine as the server(backend) and the others as clients (frontends) or a combination of both. MythTV frontends are available for Windows, Linux, OSX, Maemo (Nokia), and there's even a frontend for the iPhone.

I would suggest using a distro such as Mythbuntu since it comes with additional dialogs and setup menus that make installation much easier. You can download it here:

http://www.mythbuntu.org/

[genemcd]

I agree with the "by plbyrd September 29, 2008 5:28 AM PDT " post.
DirecTV and Tivo are renewing an old relationship. I would like to see them take this product, add a couple of HD satellite tuners with HDMI output and run with it. Especially if the PC & Nero could work with a blu-ray burner...yeah! Give me all that and I'm there.
We currently have five (old) DirecTivos and yeah...as a tekkie geek, what is offered to the user doesn't seem to exploit the technology that much...but to my 75-year-old mother in law and my non-tekkie wife - they think the Tivo interface is the greatest way to watch TV that ever existed. If it gets too complicated, they're not going to care or use it.
I think this product is a great start, but I hope they keep evolving it. Maybe when the first "new generation" of DirecTivos come out in 2009, they'll be ready to do something like this that is DirecTV specific.

[cknouf]

There is absolutely no need for this product in the marketplace, especially when Nero Liquid TV offers ONLY the same features as Beyond TV, Sage, MythTV, GBPVR and Media Center but for a much more expensive ongoing cost for scheduling updates at an annual cost of around $99 to $156. The majority of the the previous comments already allude to this but I just wanted to add mine to the list and hope that Nero hasn't made a big mistake in developing and endorsing this product. I'm perfectly happy with my Beyond TV, SVideo input from my two DISH network receivers and will soon be adding a great new product, the Hauppauge HD PVR that provides true component video input and 5-1 Surround Sound to my PC setup.

[godzero]

FreeVo, and similar, has been around for years. No fancy box or anything but it's free. TiVo was just a ripoff of Replay anyway, and not quite as good.

[topher68]

the software might actually be worth having if you didn't have the $13 a month fee after the first year. ".......but company reps suggested that it will be less than the $13 per month that's the baseline for owners of the set-top TiVo boxes." i have snap stream's Beyond TV and for the $70 the software costs, it works just like tivo. i set it to record "all in the family" on tvland (now no longer on tvland) and when tvland changed the time slot, Beyond tv changed the recording schedule. i recorded season 4.10 to season 6.24 this way without a hiccup. and beyond tv will record a second airing (if one is available) if the computer doesn't record the first airing. also does "new/first run" or any on the recording setup

[vony__123]

thats soo cool i want one

[e-mail]

[dirk6665]

I'm going to write this from a consumers point of view. Having used MythTV, SnapStream, Tivo, Media Center, Freevo, Sonic Blue's Replay 500 and some other off-the-wall PVR software... The convergence of media into a PC format factor is getting the attention of many nowadays for sure. Let there be no doubt. My primary goal for my own HTPC is a one-stop-shop for all of my media on one remote - on one server - with an intuitive and low maintenance system that's available throughout the home. It has to have all the inputs and outputs for the general audience and us media uber geeks. The interface must be intuitive, smooth, informational without being over laden with too much frill. It should permit SD and HD video viewing and recording with all the features we have some to expect. It should support online media and have the ability to play a plethora of other digital media as well. The problem, for most, is the limits of each.

For instance, in the video realm as someone mentioned above, it's very difficult to bring the output from a 1080p HD stream from a DirecTV to a media PC. With all of the DRM going on this is going to become even more difficult as time goes on because DirecTV and the media moguls who get to decide what, where and how you can watch content are someday going to (try to..) prevent you from streaming that HD video to a capture device capable of receiving it. If it's not an authorized device ... poof! Too bad for you. Digressing from all of this and getting back on-topic of the nero LiquidTV.... I think nero is attempting to make it easier for those who want to have a media PC get into the game. Let's face reality - my parents (and probably most of yours as well) can use a computer, get email and do allot with their home PC's - but I could never see them putting together a MythTV HTPC. Mostly because much of the software out there doesn't come ready-to-go and bundled with both an easy-to-deploy hardware AND software solution. (Yes I know it exists, but read - I said EASY!)

My theory is the first developer to build an HTPC that works in a modular format - and one that can work with DirecTV/Dish/SomeCableCo. and can do this with minimal fuss and large presentation ... will take center stage in the market. Especially if the developer built it in modular fashion where you can add / remove features as needed. Need a MP3 streaming server? Select, Add, done. Don't need the RSS Feed module? Unselect, poof! Gone. DVD Recording? Select. Add, Available. Want to record a DirecTV HD program while checking out some good buy on eBay? -- you get the point.

The end result, in my opinion, is that all of these software PVR's bring some great must-have features to the table. But NONE of them have all the features one might need. In order to achieve this you go back to buildng a mosh-posh of software. Now what is the admin page for that uPNP media server again?

Once there is a marriage of hardware to meet the needs of the masses, and the software has the features needed by the audience of the world, then we can talk turkey. For now - its not the wheel re-invented... it's just a different looking tire.

My .02 cents, current value at world economy = .0001/cent

What would your perfect HTPC be?