Comments on: What Google should learn from Apple

Resignation of Google's visual-design leader suggests that Google's obsession with data blinds it to some human realities. Perhaps it should look at how Apple balances tech and taste.

[myles taylor]

A lot of companies could learn that from Apple. Why does Apple get away with these things? Because they buck trends and they aren't afraid to do something that might fail (and sometimes does) in order to catch someone's eye. A recent example might be the new Shuffle and an old example is the Newton. But in the end it pays off. Of course, everyone accuses people of drinking the kool-aid, etc but in the end, people go for looks and what's cool. Why do you think designer clothes, bags, etc are such a successful business? Why is the cosmetics business so successful? Like the author said, people are "irrational, contradictory, capricious and, sometimes, just plain nuts". It means that you have to be all those things to appeal to people. Even the most rational and sensible people are completely nuts in some way shape or form.

I thought this was a really interesting article. It's called "How Apple did everything right by doing everything wrong." Very interesting read.
http://www.wired.com/techbiz/it/magazine/16-04/bz_apple

[bigpicture]

You are making a sad comment on the human condition. Most of the shallow people today believe that who and what they are is defined by the coolness of the things that they own. (display in public) That is because they really don't know who and what they are. Like a lost generation of spiritually, morally, and materially bankrupt sheep making up a bankrupt nation.

[Perry_Clease]

"A recent example might be the new Shuffle and an old example is the Newton."

I never had a Newton, but I have had one of the new Shuffles for a week now. Except for the earbuds that fall out too easily I really like the Shuffle and that includes the online controls and VoiceOver. Will all future iPods not have onboard controls, probably not. However, we will probably have both so you can use your favorite ear buds with traditional controls or the new design. Innovation begets innovation, as well as imitation.

[professionaladventurer]

I had a newton and I loved it. It was pretty much out of date by the time I got one for $100, but it sure as as cool as properly useless.

[artistjoh]

This article fails to differentiate between Apple the company and Steve Jobs. Unlike other companies who employ legions of "designers" yet still manage to produce ordinary looking products, the design sense at Apple is dominated by the sense of taste of Steve Jobs. Hence so-called Apple design was far less interesting at Apple during the years that Jobs was out of the company.

There is an often overlooked aspect of this - while Bill Gates was doing business studies at university Steve Jobs was doing calligraphy. He immersed himself in the simplicity of an oriental aesthetic philosophy.

That is not to say that Jobs designs everything personally (even if his input is reputed to be significant) but it is also his taste which has enabled him to nurture the talents of design genius Jonathan Ives and encourage design (as the Japanese traditionally do) down to the most humble of objects such as packaging.

It is said that Jobs considers such minute details as the size and style of screws on the underside of devices and forces the engineers to consider artistry at every stage of engineering decisions. Consequently an Apple device tends to be tastefully arranged even on the inside where only technicians are likely to look so Apple devices can be said to have beauty that not just skin deep but are beautiful to the core. There is no obvious economic reason to do this really (although it is possible that a clean and simplified arrangement may allow for greater efficiency in repairs and servicing and possible reductions in associated costs).

No other major technology company has a leader with a background in calligraphy and none has an all encompassing commitment to the aesthetics of industrial design. Since most artists and calligraphers tend to lack the financial and marketing wizardry of Steve Jobs it seems unlikely that other company's will be able to successfully follow Apple's example beyond simple surface treatments by simply hiring calligraphy graduates or similar and Apple is likely to retain their lead in industrial design so long as Jobs is around.

[tehrani625]

You have a very good point. I am wondering what is going to happen now that Jobs is not there.

[ChrisMatyszczyk]

@artistjoh,

Please don't think I underestimate the massive influence of Steve Jobs. When I said that someone took a decision about thinking and feeling, who else might I have been talking about?

Thank you for commenting.

Chris

[elllroy]

good article. good points.

[WRHarrison]

"The fact is that human beings are astoundingly, depressingly, maddeningly human. Which makes them irrational, contradictory, capricious and, sometimes, just plain nuts."

They are also subject to influence and look to their peers rather than inward in their quest for self esteem. This is where Apple's marketing is as important as their design. Whether their prodicts are better or not, the marketing barrage tells those humans that possession of an Apple product will win them praise among their peers.

I'm not discounting the efforts and successes of Apple. Their products and software really do look superb. The real power is in the brand and the perception of what is attached to that brand.

Some brands like Wal-Mart, Stanley and Microsoft carry a functional, nuts and bolts familiarity. Others like Apple, Starbucks, BMW and [insert clothing label here Izod, jordache, Calvin Klein, Armani, Hilfiger etc] carry the "in" , "worldly" and "celebrity in waiting" feel.

Again not to speak against the great work they've done but I've found that the majority of the people i've polled about there Apple products are more enthused about having one than what it actually does for them or how it works. The conclusion I draw is that while the design teams and craftsman are truly outstanding, it is the marketing people that should get more credit.

I also believe this is a major reason for the pricing. Part of it is demand but the rest is not to devalue the brand. It adds a dose of exclusivity which supports the marketing which starts the cycle all over again. As soon as the Mac marketshare gets too high, this point goes away. This is why it is so important for new versions to come out. Everybody has an iPod but only some have the latest iPod.

I just thought that the Apple Marketing Dept. deserved mention.

[fjpoblam]

Your comment's spot on, at this moment, for me. Maybe I'll think not, tomorrow. That's how human beans are, no tellin'. And Go Ogle with all its science ain't gonna predict me. Right? No.

[ChrisMatyszczyk]

@fjpoblam,

You are right today. And you will be right tomorrow.

Chris

[Vaioleto]

Please don't confuse someone who worships Apple as someone who has "taste". Owning an Apple is a status symbol, most people who own Apples do so because it gives them a false sense of technical and artistic superiority, while the rest of us sensical people who actually know a thing or two about style see them as nothing but pretentious and wasteful victims of silly fads.

[Perry_Clease]

Caca de toro

[rwm72]

Good point Vaioleto.
Many people do buy Apple as a status symbol. This does not mean that Apple as a brand is devalued, but it does affect the brand's perception. The perception of any business as cool or as a status symbol is fuelled by those who are always seeking to follow trends or try to be popular, or even just imitate those who they think are popular (sounds like high school!).
BMW is a great car brand, who are leaders in automotive engineering. Yet sales reps and real estate agents buy them as a status symbol, and contribute to the idea that BMWs are only driven by '*****' as Jeremy Clarkson from Top Gear would say. This doesn't make them any less of a great car company. It is just those who adopt their product form a stereotype associated with the BMW brand. BMW continually win International engine of the year awards in many categories, but the real estate agents don't know or don't care. They just see the badge on the hood, and their colleagues who also drive BMWs.
Apple is the same. They have won many industrial design awards, perhaps more than any other tech or consumer company, but many buyers just see the badge, like it's an Armani or Hugo Boss suit. Those who truly get it, are seen as religious zealots in the hippie church of Steve Jobs. Those who don't get it, just see a fancy box, containing parts they can buy cheaper and put together themselves.
Perhaps the only people who buy Apple computers and really get them are those in Desktop Publishing and Graphic Design, the same groups that embraced them in the mid 80s, or students who love using them at school (before they go on to work in the corporate world and are chained to the black or beige box on the desk)
The only ones who truly appreciate BMWs are often the ones who can't afford them unfortunately. Apple Macs may be more expensive but at least they are cheaper than a BMW... and real estate agents probably don't use them :)

[timhodgson]

More than that, I have friends (people whom I have known for years) make comments like, "You don't own an Apple? I thought you were smart". Time to throw out the SAT as the measure of academic achievement. Does it make me want to own an Apple. Not really, because, like them, I am bucking the trend.

P.S. I own an iPhone (love the inexpensive games) and prefer a PC.

[PokerBill]

I'll give you IPhone but 4% of PC market? That's "making it work?"

[Ilgaz]

Let me give couple of names. Solaris (not Open one), IBM AIX, OpenVMS and HP/UX. They all have UNIX 03 certificate which requires thousands (if not millions) strict tests and controls.
That cool looking OS X Leopard on Intel is a certified UNIX Operating System which passes all the tests as the above ones. Apple gathered 4% of market with UNIX, plain UNIX, it still calls Terminals as tty (teletype!).
Making it work while it is beautiful and easy along with all that zero tolerance to security issues? I wonder how many Apple fans actually think about such a miracle which they achieved or actually aware that they are running NeXT, a very new one but still NeXT.

[fazalmajid]

Counterpoint: the "Flower power" iMac. I rest my case...

[xim1970]

Loved the article, and also read Bowman's post. I say, good for him! I'm a print designer, and I can't tell you how many times people have wanted to tell me that they want this color "a little bluer"...What?!? Do they really think that because it's a slightly different color that it will make people want to look at the brochure a bit more closely? If you want blue, you'll get blue. Will it be as attention getting as red? Probably not, but these people don't get it. It's not the shade of color, it just IS the general color that will get your attention. I completely understand his frustration. Let a graphic designer design. Designers don't go to engineers (or clients, in my case) and tell them how to do their jobs.

[madmongol]

The post is good as is the discussion. The designer that left Google made good points. And while there are many who would argue the case of Apple in particular cannot really argue the larger discussion of blending subjective perceptions with concrete science. A good case for this would be many of the consumer electronics, automobiles, etc. If it were left up to the engineers and data alone many of the things we use and interact with today would be very different.

The question in particular with Google is their decision to override human subjectivity and values for more concrete science. This as mentioned seems to be a very far cry from their inception and roots, and could be perhaps interpreted as a sign that the company is taking themselves far too seriously. While I think it is interesting that scientific approach and methods are doing a lot of great things, it is the humanity in all of us that makes these things great. I think Google and many of those tending towards the more mechanical/clinical/technology side need to keep this in mind.

Great post!

[stuxstu]

To preface, I generally like Apples eye for design, but billions in marketing as a "cool" product has a lot to do with Apple's success (well its iPod line success). Yes the designs are nice (don't buy that they are extraordinary), but in reality few care. The 4-8% share of the PC market proves it. Linux is much truer competitor to Apple than Microsoft.

Apple may dominate, for now, the MP3 player market, but that won't last forever. Apple is very much moving from the PC market to the consumer entertainment market... I wonder if they will really be making PCs in 10 years time. God forbid anything happen to Steve Jobs; Apple is too linked to his cult of personality.

[Ilgaz]

Apple does care about how it looks at deep OS level, on system.log which no average user would care about.
For example they give Hawaian names to their ATA controllers as Kauai etc. or actually lecture developers about what they should use, what they should give up just like a experienced developer looking for them almost in plain english.
It is not just logo or anything, it is the complete package.

[timhodgson]

I hate to break it to you, but this is not unique to Apple products.

[nicmart]

Google seems to be doing some things quite well, thanks.

[willpeavy]

I like the way Google's minimalist design looks. I dislike the Mac style - it looks like over-designed fluff to me.

[HappyPhil]

I have been using Apple computers since 1986, and they all still work. I began using gmail and the associated Google products in 2007. It's clear that the Apple products have sophistication and style that eludes the PC people, but I find Google apps fit right into the elegant design of Apple. (That is if you use Firefox rather than Safari.)

[websterphreaky]

"What Google should learn from Apple" .....

What, how to OVER CHARGE their lemming like FUDS for Chinese Sweatshop made garbage that comes off the same assembly line as low-end Dells, eMachines and Gateways???

Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ...... (it's true, AppleTards).

[tzx4]

Sir, your comment makes me feel embarassed for your sake.

[ecotony]

As someone who grew up in a Mac environment, Apple OS's are just easier to use on a day to day level. Things work, and look good at the same time.

Now, as an adult who has worked in a Microsoft environment for the last 12 years, I have grown to disdain the Apple "premium" for what is basically the same thing - a computer. I have 2 multi-core PC's running currently running Vista at home and every computer in my office has XP or 2000. Why? Macs are too expensive for what they ultimately do -- word processors, web browsers, video and music, games, presentations, and spreadsheets. Apple has lost me and my desktops & laptops to the PC world because of their silly brand premium.

All that said: I use my iPhone everyday. When I do, I am reminded of what I'm missing not owning a Mac anymore.

[timhodgson]

I have an iPhone too - traded in my Blackberry for one. Better apps on the iPhone.

Ease of use? Nay. Try setting up the AirPort Express. It looks good, but functions like a brick.

[design4usability]

Google's lack of fashion is in itself a fashion statement.
As software and infrastructure become commonplace and more complex then an individual cares to understand, much like consumer industries the differentiating value is design and speaking to the customer experience. Any industry goes through an evolution of usefulness > usability > delightfulness, and in some cases the industry Google is in is still stuck between usefulness and usability.

It appears that in some cases Google has chosen to optimize for the mechanical, measurable parts of the experience first, because is the easy way out and scales better on a fast schedule across many products. By making that part best of class at a huge and free scale and before anybody else it succeeds despite a lack of visceral and visually delightful experience.

[CoolRik]

Your article is right on the spot! I agree: Google was more on the "intuitive" side few years ago (and I guess much of its success is explained by that).
In contrast, Apple has kept a nice balance between form and function by really 'listening" to their target customers' needs, desires and why not, whims.
As a disclaimer, I am neither pro-Apple or pro-MS, just analyzing from a marketing perspective. (For the record, I use a Vista PC and an iPod Touch, and frankly, I love the simplicity of the iPod, even if its OS 2.0 is still missing the mark ...!)

[anonymous500r]

@myles taylor It's not really Google's job to be innovative and trend-setting. Their jobs are to create designs that will please the majority of people and do something useful while being efficient in a band-width and loading time sense. Apple's website, while beautiful, takes a long time to load on my connection. Google reader meanwhile loads up like a snap, simply because it doesn't have all those fancy graphics. I personally applaud Google to be moving away from a bloated and slow world plagued with featuritis.