Comments on: Microsoft's 'Apple Tax' faces another audit

This time it is Business Week taking issue with Microsoft's math. But while Redmond may be wrong in the numbers, it's finally picked the right area to focus its attack.

[go_live]

Microsoft is more like a Ford. Apple is like BMW. Heck Apple and BMW even have the same color scheme.

[go_live]

Microsoft is more like a Ford. Apple is like BMW. Heck Apple and BMW even have the same color scheme.

[tehrani625]

I love these things... The flame wars... My mac is a little devil, he never does anything fun, and lags honorably when I play the only real game for it, Halo 1. Then my macbook decides that it loves me no more and the HD dies. I lost almost everything but had the important stuff backed up on my PC and on gmail. I love my PC laptop, it was less $$$$ then the macbook, and I haven't spent a penny on security software. I like Vista, yes it has its quirks but it has personality and its really fun to play with, the mac is boring the only change is it crashes or something dies. On occasion my macbook surprises me with a mystery spot on the palm rest or some weird goo that has affixed itself to the lid. The mac is really hard to clean to, you can't use strong cleaners because you will ruin it and anything less then that just makes the case wet. My PC laptop is made of plastic, but its really easy to clean and is very resilient to whatever I have done to it thus far. I have parallels on my mac, I shouldn't have wasted my money, I had a copy of XP lying around so I paid for a copy of parallels and it is really slow, I feel sorry for the guy who ends up paying for parallels and a copy of XP then realizes that its not usable, and I wouldn't dream of trying vista on a mac. My iPod is good, iTunes is terrible, it looses files at random. Oh and my MacBook can barely handle the software that comes with it. I will also say that my mac is really slow to brows the web, and I have had many network issues, but my PC always comes to the rescue.

[blafouille]

People like to change their computers often and they evolve fast too...For 1 or 2 years why spend too much unless you do not have to worry about money...Now if you are into games you better build your own.

[Jollyroger84]

I read the article Ina is talking about, and his numbers are dubious at best. 1. Macs don't need antivirus software because they have so little market share that hackers don't write viruses for them. In fact, OSX is more insecure than Vista. In last years Pone to Own competition, the Mac was hacked in about 10 min, while the Vista machine lasted an entire day. And antivirus software doesn't cost $50. There are plenty of FREE options better than Symantec. 2. You don't need Photoshop! Again, Plenty of free options that are just as good as Photoshop Elements. Check out open source options like Paint.net and The Gimp. Also Windows Live Photo Gallery does a lot of this stuff. How about the Media Center capabilities Microsoft has built in. Plus if I want to upgrade my hardware, like say a new video card so I can play Hi Res games, I can do that with Windows. Can't with Mac. They want you in their walled garden where they tell you what you do and don't want to do with your computer. No so with Windows...do what you want, its your computer. There are plenty of FREE options that work on windows that more than make up for iLife. And iLife does not even come close to media center, which Apple has no answer for.

[kcotham]

@Jollyroger84
The fact remains that no Macintosh has been infected with a virus in the wild. Competitions are special situations that don't resemble the real world.

You are right in saying that one does not need Photoshop. There are plenty of less expensive alternatives for both Windows and Mac OS.

Yes, Windows has Media Center (if you have that version of Windows) and Mac OS has Front Row.

No, you can upgrade the video card on your Mac Pro if you like. You will have problems doing that with an iMac or Mac mini. You will also have trouble doing that with any manufacturer's all-in-one computer, moot point. You can play high-res games with just about any Macintosh quite well.

The only thing that Media Center does (once again, IF you have that version of Windows) that I'd like to see in Front Row, is the ability to record video from television. But hey, that's what a DVR or Tivo is for.

[pithenumber]

@kcotham
you can upgrade the graphiccs of the Mac Pro, but your options are limited because there is no xfire or SLi and the cards sold by Apple are overpriced ($300 for a Radeon HD 4870, PC'ers get them for $150-250)

if hacking only happens in competitions, it means that hackers don't find Mac OS worth hacking
security by obscurity

[kcotham]

@pithenumber
I've never bought parts from Apple. If I wanted to upgrade the processor on one of my mini-tower Macintoshes, I ordered a new card. And it doesn't have to be one of the ones in Apple's web store. You, of all people should know that, if you've been running Mac OS X on a non-Apple machine.

And security by obscurity is not a good defense, I admit. I hope Apple gets more proactive about security. But being obscure is better than being bombarded by viruses and other malware hundreds of times a day.

[mikestatic1]

C-Net must have a quota on Mac vs. PC stories each week to keep the site click count climbing to reap the advertising rewards.

I own a MacPro running OSX and XP, as well as a couple Dells running Ubuntu and Vista - all perform the tasks that I ask of them very nicely. There are some annoyances in Vista, but I haven't had any real issues using it, and I use it every single day. My business is audio, and after years of problems running a Pro Tools studio on the Windows platform I switched to a Mac and haven't looked back. Not 1 dropout, not 1 latency issue, no skipping or stuttering... it just works, which is why you buy a computer in the first place.

Paying $3,000 for a computer doesn't make you superior. Paying $500 for a computer doesn't make your choice any more intelligent. If, in either case it doesn't suit your needs, then you are a fool for buying it. Defending the purchase so ridiculously as some do here increases that foolishness tenfold.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Okay, this might be an interesting thought for the Apple Tax:

iSCSI

What's that? That's the technology protocol initiator that allows faster data transfer speeds over ethernet than even firewire 800 can provide. Companies like Drobo now are offering it as the top of the line technology for local data transfers that consumers can get.

Microsoft Windows has it included in the OS free.

Linux has it availble for free.

Apple did have it in prerelease versions of OSX, but have since yanked it out for the final products. But don't worry, you can still get it for $199 from third party vendors to replace what Apple took away from the product.

So if you are a graphics, video, or photography professional that uses the latest technologies for the fastest data transfer methods, you can use iSCSI free on Windows and Linux, but you'll have to pay $200 more for it on a Macintosh.

Please remember to add that $200 onto your Macintosh bill if you use that feature. If you don't, then it doesn't matter and can be removed from the table.

[kcotham]

Very, very, very few people need iSCSI. And even fewer external drives offer it as an interface. And I haven't seen one off-the-shelf computer that offers it as standard. Talking about an elitist argument!

[Vegaman_Dan]

@kcotham:

I'm rather surprised you would so non-chalantly dismiss professional artists, videographers and photographers using Macintosh products as unimportant. Somehow I would think those professionals might want to use product that is quickly becomine standard in that industry.

[kcotham]

And, I'm sure, Vegaman_Dan, that as soon as it becomes more common, Apple will include it in some of its machines. More likely than not, one of the higher-speed formats of FireWire, will supersede iSCSI in speed and popularity. And with a machine like the Mac Pro (a machine professionals would be more likely to have) can be expanded with a iSCSI card, if needed.

Most of the pros I know have FireWire 800 external drives.

[masterprogrammer73]

Microsoft has tried to create a monopoly in the software industry. They will stop at nothing to achieve this.

[kcotham]

It's in their mission statement, they ex-CEO has stated it publicly even. And yet, people defend them.

[SteveGoering]

I don't understand why Mac users don't love MS, If it wasn't for the 150 million dollar investment (can you say bailout) MS gave Apple in 1997 when it was poised at the brink of extinction, there wouldn't be an Apple or iAnything. Not to mention that MS continues to produce "Office for MAC", the number ONE selling software for Mac according to Amazon, I guess MS is protecting their investment. Quiz time what is the world?s No. 1 Mac System Utility? "Parallels Desktop for Mac" it makes it easy for iPeople to run Windows.

Apple makes great products, but the way they are promoted is severely damaging to the company. I will probably never buy a iPhone or iMac or an iAnthing. Not because the product is inferior but because I can't stand their arrogant advertising campaigns. Then throw in the fact, you have to give your iTeeth for the iThing. Seriously who is in charge of their advertising, trust me when I say you're not luring anybody I know.

[grtgrfx]

Same people responsible for advertising for...oh...Anheuser-Busch...Energizer Battery...Gatorade...Infiniti Motor Corporation...Nissan Motor Corporation...and on and on. Apple's advertising is and always has been brilliant, award-winning, and very memorable.

And the fact that Office is the #1 Mac app? Only proves that MS is better at marketing their applications, not their OS.

And what about the fact that most of Europe (EU) has slapped MS down with anti-competitive monopoly lawsuits? Oh, THAT's okay.

[kcotham]

@SteveGoering
You make your purchasing choices based on advertising? You do realise that even though a company commissions and signs off on marketing, they don't usually create it in-house.

[sjschaef]

you people are freaking crazy... we are talking about computers here...calm down!

Until December, I owned a windows machine.. all the way back to Windows 3.1 . They did what I needed them to do and I could upgrade them cheap, tons of software.. worked fine for me. I purchased a Macbook Pro in December because I do a lot of digital photography. Yes, it just works. I have no issues the OS X . I do run VMWare for Linux and XP Pro because there are some things that only work on each particular OS. Each has their advantages and disadvantages. It is called personal preference/ your opinions.. I am sick of all this "Fanboy" talk from both sides and the crazy threads and illogical arguments/snipes that go back and forth.. how old are you people?

It is good that both Apple and Microsoft exist.. it allows for competition and new technologies that we all want. Be thankful that each other exists so we get new toys/gadgets/operating systems...

[Raabscuttle]

It's pretty bad that this does nothing more than prove that a fool and his money are soon parted. I hope he enjoys that Quanta made laptop that has the Apple stamp rather than the HP stamp on it... It's no wonder that industry insiders refer to Apple users as "unusually retarded" in their internal correspondence.

[kcotham]

Not one single HP laptop is made the way an Apple is and vice versa. Apple's laptops were designed to Apple's specifications, and built to those specifications. HP (and others) design their computers and have them built to their respective specifications. It would be nice if these companies built (or at least assembled) their own machines. And it would be nice if they brought those manufacturing plants home, to the United States. But that would be the end of your $500 computer you all like to shout about.

[rcsskier11]

This is a very well played campaign by Microsoft. It all focuses on numbers. Price, How much of this, how much of that. To the average consumer, it makes sense to get a PC because it has more Megahertz for less. This does not factor in how the two platforms handle their resources, what kind of software it comes with, the services that each company offers, or the additional software you need to keep it running in tip top shape over time. Apple will need to come back with some solid ads, and soon.

[swissbird]

Apple is worth many times more than the PC. I know, because even though I've been a MacUser for 21 years, a few years ago I bought a $2K PC laptop (which is now being used as a doorstop). That first Mac II is actually still in use, donated to an art group. I still use my second one, and my PowerMac and my new MacBook Pro. I cringe at the time spent in fighting spam, worms, and viruses PC users have to endure - although I did finally get anti-virus programs about a year ago. Looking back to 1987 when I bought my first Mac, I wondered aloud "Why is the Apple so much more expensive than this one" (pointing to the row of PCs). The salesman replied "Do you want to spend your time CREATING or do you want to spend your time trying to get it to work? You can make up the difference in a couple of jobs". He was right and it stands true today. Mac is worth upwards of 2X the price of a PC any day of the week!

[mssoot]

Just got AV? Your part of the problem

[hpew]

OMG, here we go again. Comparing apples and oranges

Apple makes, and derives most of their (ample) income on well designed and quality HARDWARE.

Microsoft is the MacDonalds of SOFTWARE.

MS got their dominant position by lying about how the use of competitive operating systems (like DR DOS) would permanently damage your PC, and by strong-arming manufacturers to install MS DOS/Windows - or else they may not ever get to buy for resale another MS product ever again.

[mssoot]

Right, just like Ronald strong arms people in to eating Big Macs on the parking lot.

[mssoot]

You know, Microsoft missed the whole train all together. They should be selling their own propriety hardware that would eb the only system that windows 7 will work on. They should make it cool looking but last only about 3 years and be about 2 to 3 times the cost of the value of the hardware. They should dumb down the operating system to make it appeal better to the masses i.e. the common denominator. Wait a minute, thats apple's buisness model. I hope Microsoft doesn't read this!