Comments on: Seinfeld and Gates hit the road for Vista

In the second installment of the new ad push, the Microsoft chairman and the TV star move in with a family. Spoiler alert: This time Gates does the "robot dance."

[MaggieRed]

The core problem with Microsoft is they cannot think for themselves. They are always copying someone else, or in some cases just buying the other's idea's. There is no originality of thought in all those thousands of people up there in Redmond.

That is the big difference between Apple and other companies, especially with regards to Microsoft.

[mooreoftom]

Personally, I am a fan of both PC and Mac. Alex wrote about choices, so why not chose both? Both have distinguished software which can be used for different purposes. For example, If I were to give a presentation would I use power point which has been overused as of late, or would I use keynote which hasn't been seen as much therefore it has a freshness about it?
Like Alex mentioned, if I were going to a LAN party such as LanWar you wouldn't see me there even with Apple's fastest MAC PRO: two quad core cpu's with 32gb of ram with a GeForce 8800GT. Friends that is one smokin' tricked out compute; but it wouldn't run the favorite 3d games on OSX running a virtual copy of windows as well as a PC running the same games on Windows without virtualization.
The point being, I am looking at getting a Macbook when they redesign/upgrade them next and using it for keynote presentations, syncing with my iphone, light video editing, etc. and I'll use my PC desktop for my 3d games that are only available on the PC.
We all need to learn to take the good from people and not just the bad and apply that same principle to companies. Just because you might not like Vista as much (I am in that camp) doesn't mean you should never use a Microsoft product ever again, and just because Mac's can't run 3d games because the titles aren't available for OSX doesn't mean you have to bash Mac's and say they're overpriced garbage. In other words don't throw the baby out with the dirty bath water - take the good from each company and put it to use.
As far as these comercials go, we'll have to see where Microsoft takes them, meanwhile just enjoy them as you would enjoy watching Napolean Dynomite - known for its uniquely humorous scenerios.

That's all I've got to say!

[Alex Alexzander]

It's pure perception. Ask anyone in IT if those Apple ads sway them in any way. The answer is no. In fact, I was a field tech for 9 years. And I was one of maybe 2 other users out of 7,000 engineers that had used a Mac.

Corporate America is vastly different and most don't even know Apple exists. I mean, they know who Apple is, like the iPod, but many are more savvy than people think. I remember being pretty impressed as I waited to speak with someone in New York at SONY BMG about a project, which was regarding graphic design by the way, and the manager there was talking to a few people in a phone meeting. I couldn't help but over hear. And she was telling them how to connect and share. I remember being pretty impressed. I also remember thinking about how Microsoft had a lot of built-in tools and though I had been out of the tech industry for a good while that conversation reminded me that business users use the tools Microsoft makes available as default in their operating system. Once one user figures them they take many others with them for the ride, and it becomes a company thing.

Microsoft does a good job at keeping things in the system and compatible from OS release to the next release. Apple isn't seen as business friendly fr the reasons I describe above. They are not forth-coming over their future plans. Businesses have been burned many times with Apple making sweeping and seemingly stupid changes for the sake of design.

The thing, no one should consider Microsoft to be the PC industry. They are a large part of it, yes, but they are not the industry itself. I'll give you an example of what I mean by that. Samsung has a new laptop coming out that is a far better design than the Apple Air. Lighter, more ports, and a killer pro and finished look. In every way it beats Apple. A lot of people like those Area 51 laptops as well. My point is, there are plenty of cool PCs to go around. There are choices. Big, small, light, heavy desktop replacements, etc. Think about that new ad. Bill Gates asks, didn't we have this yesterday? referring to dinner at the dinner table. Jerry says, put some cheese on it. Now, think about that in regards to Apple. How many times has Apple sold exactly the same laptop to people, with merely a small blip of an upgrade to the CPU or the hard drive, and called it a new Mac? Didn't we have this yesterday? Look at it historically if you like. The G4, every model they made before the G5. Just minor processor upgrades, more hard drive, and the so-called super-drive. And that made Apple customers sell their old Mac to get a new one. Now contrast that to the PC you buy from anyone like Dell or HP. Right in the store, you pick the parts you want and pretty much build anything you want. I'll ask it another way. Can you buy a Black MacBook for anything less than $1,499? If you want Black, you have to buy into that SKU. And you pay a premium. Why are there 3 models of MacBooks? There are 2 white, and 1 black. Look at Dell or HP. They have and various pre-configurations with discount packages. But you can make anything you want. You choose the processor, OS, the screen res, the memory, etc. It's completely up to you.

So far, that's the way I see these ads. There are little comments in them. Meant to make you think about what they mean. Would you eat for dinner today what you had yesterday? No. You'd want something else. And not just cheese either. You'd want something totally different.

How long is Apple going to sell those iMacs? The same machine over and over and over again. First it was plastic white. Now glass and aluminum. Maybe they will make it black next. Oh boy, call a press conference, looks news guys, we changed the color! How exciting! I'm so impressed.

The best iPod Touch Ever. And what did they do? They changed the back from black plastic to shiny metal.

Excuse me, but when the industry publications start to fall for this? When I was in my teens, good magazines like BYTE and television shows like The Computer Chronicles would have been critical of these facts. But these days, heck, STOP THE PRESS. Apple added different colors to their iPod line up and went back to the Gen 1 Nano design. I'm sorry, they rounded the edges. My bad. That's a change worth being excited over.

There is nothing great here but an ad that says "we're cool" and somehow because you hear it often it becomes what? Real somehow? I guess because I don't watch television I don't get drawn into this. I have not watched TV in years. So when I do see an ad I'm not used to it and see it perhaps differently. I see Apple's ads as pathetically stupid. And I think a lot of folks are waiting for Microsoft to create two characters that basically say the opposite of what Apple's ads say. People don't like negative ads. And that's what Apple is doing. Look at Microsoft's ads. The kids are impressed with a game. When is this coming out. Gates, Never, and you didn't get it from me. But the reality of that is that they are having fun on a PC with a game that is so new, no one has it. And surely no Macintosh will have it. All they do is fun stuff, like make movies with iMovie. When was the last time you watched a movie a friend made and liked it? Never for me. But Mac users can be sold easily. Apple says, hey, we have iMovie, and you can make a movie. Go buy a camera. Not a good idea for most folks. And even worse for us poor friends that have to watch the garbage they make in the name of friendship. It's worse than watching pictures of your friends lame vacation. Here is the sunset. Here is me. This is a cool tree I saw. It looked big in real life, but I couldn't capture that with the camera. Sorry, but it's all so stupid. Buying a Mac and a camera doesn't make you creative. If you are creative, you just are. I have drawing paper, charcoal pencils, stiff paper used to smudge, and tons of other supplies. Take the computer away and I'm still creative. I can still write. I can still draw. The computer doesn't make you creative. It's a $2,000 pencil and paper. The creativity comes from you.

Anyway, at this point, I think people are missing the point. I think the more of these ads you see the more the point will become realized by the masses. Perhaps it's meant to spark the very conversation we're having now. Whatever the answer is, I like the ads a lot better than Microsoft with their baby music in the background. If anything, those Apple ads are insulting. As if we're not intelligent enough to see right through them.

PC guy feels inadequate... Why, because he is the choice of 90% of the world? Because that platform sells like crazy and provides more choice than anyone else? Gosh, the poor fella. And who do you want to be really? A kid making stupid home movies or the guy in control of his future because he understands the tools in front of him? Last I checked no one had to tell me my computer was fun. "the mac is better at fun stuff" Since when? Better at creative stuff? Sorry, last I checked, we have more editors to choose from on the PC than the Mac has. Be have more games. More "fun stuff".

I personally like where these ads are going. I like the message of "keeping it real". I think people will warm to it as they start to understand it and get used to it. At least I hope so. Otherwise the insult of having to listen to baby music might not be an insult at all. Treating the audience like they are three-year-olds might be right on the money.

In any case, Apple needs to keep iPods selling well. After all, prior to the iPod, they were selling just 800,000 computers world-wide in a quarter. But if their MP3 player is great, then by association so the computer must be, right?

Alex Alexzander

[Norseman]

Alex, Alex. Go lay down with a cold cloth on your head, and you'll feel a lot better in a little while.

[Zaunto]

You definitely made some good points here and after reading your post, I had to take a second look at the second add and I see things I didn't see the first time I looked at it. There are bits and pieces that are starting to fit together and make sense if you think outside the box.

Maybe what we should have an ad in which someone like me, who records his music on his PC with Mixcraft Studio software recording an album? Maybe we should have an add similar to that part of the second add, but like you said, with kids playing a game that only runs on PC's at a LAN party that Mac kids are prevented from getting into by security, because the game doesn't run on the Mac (CRYSIS). If these ads are going in the direction I think they are going, I am willing to admit being wrong in my understanding of them and disregard my comment on the add and not getting it. I think I'm starting to understand what's happening.....

[AJ Pants]

These ads are dated and kinda sad to be honest.

A bit like Windows, no?

[Penguinisto]

Re: business - Macs are still finding their way there, simple enough. OTOH, when you have Parallels installed on a Mac, you can get the stability and ease of using a Mac, with the apps that seems to almost always be Windows-based by default. All the arguments about how Macs don't do business suddenly disappear.

LAN Parties? Funny you should mention that - I've taken my old dual G5 to LAN parties for years now (as I have mentioned often before). While obviously I don't have "all the games", I seem to have no problems getting hold of the most often played ones, with no sweat. I sometimes get a kick out of informing whomever I face and beat down that they just got beaten by a Macintosh user - just to see who yells out "W T F!?" It's also funny to have folks wander by and notice that I'm playing a game on one screen at nice framerates, while a video is playing full-screen on another monitor. Even funnier - while in 2004 or so I was pretty much the only Mac user there, nowadays I'm nowhere near alone - not by a long shot. Dunno which parties you go to, but in the decent-sized ones I find at least a dozen or more Macs of various types up here. It's not that you don't see Macs at LAN parties, it's that you don't see the kids with Macs at LAN parties...

You mention that a Mac is somehow "underwhelming" - yet I find all too often that to get the same hardware 'oomph in a PC, you either have to build it yourself, or you spend far more money at an OEM store. Anyone can confirm this by comparing online, and choosing the options to match between the two.

Finally, OSX is far more stable, doesn't need an A/V solution sucking down resources, and all the flexibility and power this old *nix admin could ever want or need is as close as Applications -> Utilities -> Terminal. Dunno what you're on about, really.

Sure, the old NetWare is dead - but it wasn't so much a triumph of NT, as it was a combination of two different things:

1) Novell's reliance on Windows at the client end, and

2) Novell's own slide into being (for a time) a moribund, selfish, demanding little snot of a vendor.

Anyone who's actually done IT (not the help desk, kids - real IT) during that time will tell you that.

--

As for the ads? *shrug* - I've gotten past the point of caring. I doubt they work, because they focus too much on the personalities, and not on the product. The complexity of the ads only compounds the errors.

Sure, Bill Gates is a nice guy... but his products are still substandard, bloated, and expensive. His company still blames everyone but themselves for the Vista debacle. No amount of advertising will change the mediocre and sluggish nature of the products that Microsoft still sells.

That's a shame, too - because there are some products that do stand out in MSFT's lineup, but unfortunately they're buried under a mountain of mediocre, buggy, virus-prone crap that they force you to buy in order to use the neat stuff that you do find.

[dascha1]

COMEDIANS - People Behind The Laughter

From what I understand Think this last Comedians new
media title (circa 1995) cost $1.2 million which from this
budget could've built over 200 of these productions, "so
cleverly designed" as TIME Magazine puts it:

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,299166,00.html

Yet I hear one of their developers seined-off not that long
ago:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fasterforward/2007/08/post_6.html

It's a shame that one ego trumps them even today. Go
New Media folks!!

[Alex Alexzander]

I run XP Pro on an HP2133 because of the ultra lower power VIA processor on that 2.6 pound mini-note. It was a $699 laptop, which has a Express Card slot, 8.9" screen with 1280 x 768 display, 2GBs of RAM, and a 250 GB hard drive. Show me the 2.6 pound mini-note from Apple. Show me any Apple notebook with an express card slot for less than double the price of my HP.

NewEgg has an Acer with better specs than the MacBook, and half the price. I can do equal configs easily and blow the Mac away in speed, quality, and performance. If you can't, you're not trying at all.

I can't remember the last time I had a PC blue-screen. But my Dual 1.8 GHz G5 crashes often. My MacBook's keyboard doesn't see every keystroke. A known problem that needed a firmware update, which doesn't completely solve the problem.

And I own Macs, and I own VMWare for the Mac which supports both cores in the processor where Parallels does not. And even with VMWare the video is not very good and just going through pull-down menus is sluggish. That's not a recipe for a good enterprise experience.

Novell lost NetWare because people are used to Windows. If you can manage the familiar Windows interface, you could manage NT. It's as simple as that. And by the way, I was Director of Engineering at Winstar Broadband, and the Senior Consulting Engineer with VanStar, the largest VAR in the world.

I don't see Windows as substandard as you put it. If anything, look at the Mac software. You have Mail.app as an example. Compare that to any Windows Email client from Microsoft, and you will find the Mac client is substandard. Safari browser? Gosh, how to set it up to block pop ups from one site, but not another? Oh it can't. Sounds sub-standard to me. Good thing FireFox is out there.

Flash performance on the Mac vs. PC. PC easily wins, making for a better web experience. Do basic compression for digital media. You'll find the PC screams in performance at this. Look at the business software. Look at the editing software. Scenarist, the standard for all hollywood DVD authoring. Mac version? Never. Sonic Creator, dead. Sonic Fusion? Dead. DVD Studio Pro. No Blu-ray. PC, Blu-ray for the last two years and the only platform used in blu-ray mastering. How do replicator's test with Eclipse? PC only, sorry Mac.

64 bit Adobe software, PC first, by about 2 years again. See the theme here? Substandard, I don't think so. If anything is substandard, it's the Mac.

Alex

[sderf]

Does this junk make Vista work any better. I think not

[bcas400e]

Sparkplug,

It's already happened... Bill was assimilated in Season 5 therefore he is no longer Bill Gate of Earh, but 'LoDoofus' of Borg...

I also happen to think that Jerry's old pal George Castanza is the genius that devised and sold this ad idea to MS. Makes perfect sense doesn't it?

[rapier1]

Something to keep in mind is that these ads are not aimed at *you*. These are not ads for the geek or the technophile. What they are doing is trying to reach out to the average customer. If they went in with a heavy handed approach touting the tech upfront a lot of people would just tune it out. Instead they are trying to appeal to people's moms, dads, and other people who aren't wrapped up in one technology camp or the other. I don't know if they'll be able to do it with these ads but they are building interest amoung average people who want to know what comes next.

[bcas400e]

from the ads it seems the stoner demographic is one they are interested in.

[Kreuzer33]

So, when will we see Bill Gates on SNL???

http://kreuzer33.wordpress.com/2008/09/12/new-vista-ad-stars-bill-gates-jerry-seinfeld/

[Zaunto]

This ad is no better than the first one. Random bits of humor that really aren't funny. Yes, the Windows logo is present on a bag, but I don't see either of the first two adds as having "disarmed" anyone but Microsoft. Watch an Apple ad then watch this nonsense and you ending asking yourself how you can get yourself paid 10 million dollars for randomly cobbling together bits of humor that do nothing more than leave me with a reaction that is little more than "Huh"...

Hopefully they will get around to actually talking about what Vista does doe well rather than continue these random comedy bits that aren't getting the job done.

[The_happy_switcher]

They should re-name these ads the "Has-beens Tour of '08."

[calcompcare]

Prediction: The American consumer will love these ads! As soon as they see Seinfeld or Gates, folks will know that they have plenty of time to go to the bathroom and take a leak.

[larryennis18466]

They should fire Bill & Jerry and hire the Grandmother. This commercial was better because of her. She was the only funny one. Microsoft is so LAME.

[MemphisDriver]

I think its pretty funny.

[ppgreat]

If you have to spend an inordinate amount of time explaining your advertising and trying to decipher (or interpret) it, you're not doing good advertising. Period.

[mabradford]

Sorry Bill - no can do. You may as well get on the Linux Train if you want to compete with Apple. Windows as it is will never compete with a full grown corporation like Apple using BSD (Berkeley Unix) which is much stronger than any adopted C++ OS creation of Microsoft. Oh - I forgot - you are using an adaptation of Sys-V and that is why you are now paying Novell royalties or license or patent fees for the use of Sys-V. Well - you need to do what many are saying and forget Vista and move on to Windows 7 or better yet call it Windows 2008 or Windows 2009. Microsoft use of numbers seems to and always has seemed to - sell much much better than your goofy names like Vista or whatever. The only way Microsoft is going to come back and compete with Apple or keep Linux down is to fully admit that Windows itself is a Unix house! The only thing Microsoft has anymore that is better than everyone else is its stolen goods like it's multimedia system that it had to pay for in court and Active Directory which is stolen from the Unix/Linux world. When Microsoft makes all its stuff Linux and Apple compatible - it might make a comeback. Until then - it's a slow death to M$!

[nicceg]

I am surprised to see what a billionaire puts up with to get a few more. He should retire as he promised. No good to bring him back anymore.