Comments on: Storing sun and wind power

Several technologies are being tested to tie large-scale storage to renewable power sources.
Images: Making wind power that lasts all day

[WheelerCub]

Testing

Testing the system to ensure it works.

[kadsanat]

cool

[suyts2]

This is some promising news.

I like the compressed air idea but it doesn't tell us about the energy trade-off so we don't really know if it is worth it or not. Batteries, 50% more or not, still aren't the answer. One loses so much in the power conversion that I'm not sure that we wouldn't have to have a wind turbine or solar panel every square mile in the US. I'm sure, sooner or later, someone will come up with the proper way to store AC power, until then, we are stuck with the traditional power sources. Coal, gas, and now atomic.

[frflyer]

We aren't stuck with coal gas nukes

Solar power plant companies already have other ways of storing power. Some use hot water or oil, while the most effective seems to be molten salt. The compressed air in caverns idea is the one in a proposal to convert the U.S. electric grid to 69% solar by 2050 using solar thermal and concentrating PV power plants in the southwest U.S.

Scientific American A Solar Grand Plan
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan

Green Wombat has a bunch of articles about progress in California with solar thermal power plants.

http://blogs.business2.com/greenwombat/

Wind and solar complement each other. Wind is stronger generally at night, while solar obviously works only in daytime. Solar is strong during peak hours.

Using 1% of our southwest deserts with solar power plants would power the whole country.
1% of the Sahara Desert would power the whole world. Here's what Ausra, a solar thermal company says:

"Solar thermal power plants such as Ausra's generate electricity by driving steam turbines with sunshine. Ausra's solar concentrators boil water with focused sunlight, and produce electricity at prices directly competitive with gas- and coal-fired electric power."

"Solar is one the most land-efficient sources of clean power we have, using a fraction of the area needed by hydro or wind projects of comparable output. All of America's needs for electric power ? the entire US grid, night and day ? can be generated with Ausra's current technology using a square parcel of land 92 miles on a side. For comparison, this is less than 1% of America's deserts, less land than currently in use in the U.S. for coal mines."

There is an enormous amount of dis-information out there, trying to convince us that alternative energy can't do the job. Don't believe it.

Besides wind and solar there is a big potential with biomass to methane like Environmental Power Corp is doing.

"Wild Rose Dairy in Webster Township, WI is home to an innovative renewable energy facility powered by cow manure and other organic waste. The farm is home to 900 dairy cows, and an on-site anaerobic digester creates methane-rich biogas from their waste, which is used to generate 750 kilowatts of electricity per hour?enough to power 600 local homes 24/7."

"Environmental Power?s Huckabay Ridge is the largest renewable natural gas plant in North America, if not the world. Huckabay Ridge generates methane-rich biogas from manure and other agricultural waste, conditions it to natural gas standards and distributes it through a commercial pipeline. The purified biogas, called RNG®, is generated by Environmental Power?s subsidiary, Microgy, and is a branded, renewable, pipeline quality methane product."

All the existing forms of energy get bigger subsidies than alternative clean energy, so don't be fooled by arguments about subsidizing them.
Nukes, coal, gas and oil are heavily subsidized.
In the case of oil hugely subsidized.

[parolespedia]

Will be

Will be that true?
It's nice but who knows...
Paroles - http://www.parolespedia.com/paroles/r/ray-price/index.php
Pedia - http://www.parolespedia.com/paroles/r/roger-daltrey/index.php

[c|net Reader]

Geological Stresses

I don't like the sound of the underground compressed air storage. What happens when the pressure increases underground to store energy and then the air is bled off to use the energy later? Any time you push against a rock and release the force, something gives, even if only a tiny amount. Now repeat that process hundreds or thousands of times. The result will be underground collapses. Would you want such things occurring beneath your house or office?

[oxtail01]

More like hot air

Nothing innovative here. Just another take on storing energy for later use much like water pump storage but with very low practicality. Imagine the volume of compressed air need to generate any meaningful MW of electricity.

[frflyer]

Hot air?

The people who drew up a proposal to convert the U.S. grid to 69% solar by 2050 seem to think the compressed air in caverns idea is viable.

Scientific American A Solar Grand Plan
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan

http://blogs.business2.com/greenwombat/
Green Wombat has several articles on current progress with solar thermal in California. Just scroll down to see all the stories.

[wylde brumby]

storage of the aeolian kinetic as hydro potential

The neighbourhood generation and storage system I call "Aeolian Hydro" uses a vertical wind turbine attached to an Archimedes screw to lift water into a storage cistern.

The storage cistern can release water to power microhydro generation when there is an unmet requirement for power.

This would convert intermittent wind energy into reliable microhydro power to provide energy when the sun isn't available.