Comments on: Q&A: Canon's camera tech guru Chuck Westfall

Nikon and Sony are bringing competition to the full-frame SLR camera market that Canon once had to itself. Canon's Chuck Westfall sees imitation as the sincerest form of flattery.

[LoisLane907]

Unrelated but related

This is probably too sophomoric for the photog gurus here, however, I would like an attempted answer to an admittedly weird question.

I have a pretty nice (gasp) Kodak digital camera. One day my friend popped up with the same camera. He said he liked the way mine took pics of him, so he bought it. I, being me, was like surely you jest. Then another friend, took a pic of me with his Canon and a pretty basic one at that.

Initially, I thought all digi cameras were created relatively equal, however, I DID like the way the Canon camera captured me. So now I am considering investing in a Canon because I generally take lots of pics and was wondering if THAT brand just took better photos.

What would make a pic on one camera be better/or not from the same pic on another. Or am I just crazy? You probably think so. But I promise, I'm not.

My Kodak is a Z650 with 10x optical zoom lense and 6.1 megapix... Just to be clear, I'm not talking about the pic's clarity or definition, I'm seriously saying I looked different... same photo captured with two diff cams simultaneously...how can that be?

[carguy622]

So much is involved

There are so many variables when it comes to digital cameras
that it's not something you can single out. It is probably a
combination of things, but the two biggest factors are the way
the camera processes the image and the lens quality. Lens
quality is pretty straightforward. Image processing, however,
involves a lot of variables. Each company tweaks the image
differently before the data is turned into a jpeg file that you can
print and view. Some decide to increase the contrast or make
the colors pop more, and others may wipe out all image noise at
the expense of detail. The best thing you can do to insure good
image quality is to learn about all your cameras setting and the differences they makes in images, and keep the ISO speed as
low as possible.

Hopefully this answers your question.

[thaehn]

"The Look" could be color depth

Many people have noticed that the increased color depth of the new Canon cameras have made their snapshots look more real because of the gradule and subtile changes in color.

[aaydogan]

Excellent question....

one that should be asked more often. I completely agree with the
other two comments. Post image capture processing is a key
factor in how images look. It's interesting to note that for skin
tone specifically and portraits in general, Fuji and Olympus are very
pleasing, Nikon and Canon less and Kodak images quite often
seem over-processed (as if the images have been heavily
"photoshoped" in the camera!). Your question is important for
those about to purchase a camera at any level, consumer or pro.

[nicmart]

Not just pic quality

Other things are also key, such as the lag time for the picture to
be captured after you push the button. You don't want the
frustration of a lot of missed shots.

Between the following web sites and Consumer Reports, you can
come up with a pretty good choice.

http://www.dpreview.com/
http://www.steves-digicams.com/hardware_reviews.html

After doing my homework before Christmas, I concluded that
the best point-and-shoot option for my wife was a Fuji FinePix
F40fd, reviewed here:

http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/fuji/finepix_f40fd-review/

I hate shutter lag, which all the point-and-shoot cams suffer
from, so I use an SLR. If you are willing to deal with a larger
camera and can spend more money, an SLR is a better choice.

[pfletcher]

One thing

well actually several - but firstly, were the cameras using the same setting - ie aperture or shutter priority or full auto?

Next the lens makes a significant difference, followed by the processing. You may need to take a look at the pictures and see which is pleasing and which is true to life - often the two are different

[baddawg65]

Camera reviews

There are many differences between digital cameras. Here are several URL to digital camera reviews that compare them and you can be the judge:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/
http://www.steves-digicams.com/
http://www.dcresource.com/
http://www.imaging-resource.com/
There are differences in quality of the image like optics, sensor quality and other things but you, the user, is the one that needs to decide which one will work for you. These are websites shows each camera in the same light so you can compare them side be side.
BTW, I have had an Canon PowerShot S1 IS digital camera and it started to exhibit some some strange behavior where the image was scrambled and contact Canon and I had the camera returned for refurbished Canon PowerShot S2 IS. Here is the Canon URL for this recall:
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=PgComSmModDisplayAct&keycode=2112&fcategoryid=223&modelid=9824
I wish that Canon and other companies would know and allow devices that are out of warranty that have a known defects in manufacturing to be recalled and exchanged for a new or refurbished device. I see the previous comments about Canon and I understand why feel the way they feel if any companies wants to keep their customers they need to listen to their customers.

[Dan McC]

Pictures of you?

In my case, the manufacturers would have to radically alter the optics to get enough pictures of me to make pictures of me a deciding factor in purchasing. I tend to be on the wrong side of the CCD. People will be looking through dozens of pictures that I've taken of a gathering or event and then say "Wasn't Dan there? He's not in any of the pictures".

*sigh*

Dan

[nicmart]

Lost opportunity

It would have been interesting to know what Canon plans for us
proles who have spent money on very expensive lenses which work
only with SLRs with doomed partial-frame sensors. Will there be no
future for that $700 wide angle Canon lens I bought?

[skrubol]

Don't worry

FF sensors are still big bucks. It looks like the 1.3x crop may be going away by the sounds of the interview, but that's in a $4500 camera. The cost of a FF sensor isn't too major there. I'm sure there will be several more Rebels before APS-C goes away.

[Shankland]

Don't worry--APS-C is alive and well

Full-frame might have a rosier future now and APS-H doesn't look so great, but for the high-volume market, you can expect the APS-C sensors to prevail and for Canon, Nikon, Pentax, and Sony to continue to offer new SLRs that employ sensors of that general size. The chip manufacturing economics make them considerably cheaper. (APS-C sensors are used in Canon's Rebel XT, XTi, XSi, 20D, 30D, 40D, for example.)

If you're the kind of person who's considering upgrading to a full-frame camera in the future, though, think twice before buying Canon EF-S lenses such as the 10-22mm I presume you purchased or the 17-55mm or the 17-85mm or the 60mm macro. They won't work on a full-frame Canon that accepts only EF lenses. Of course, if you need a wide-angle lens now on your APS-C-based camera, then you pretty much have to buy one that may become obsolete to you later. You can always resell it, but that's small consolation, I know.

Here's are two blog postings I wrote earlier on the subject:

How Nikon bettered Canon with full-frame SLRs
http://www.news.com/8301-13580_3-9834860-39.html

Full-frame camera sensors: a tough technology
http://www.news.com/8301-13580_3-9765820-39.html

[Heebee Jeebies]

Canon hasn't had...

An innovative camera since the original Digital Rebel. They keep pushing the same lame technology with small nearly worthless upgrades.

Nikon isn't much better.

Robert

[JohanBlitzen]

I use cameras every day...

both for work and play, and I can tell you that the point of the upgrades is more about useability than "innovation". I can tell you that I would upset if the cameras since the d30 had some really snazzy new "innovations" but weren't any easier and smoother to opperate on a daily basis. Can you tell us what you would call innovations? so we have a better understanding of why these companies are so "lame".

[xcopy]

Not so fast...

I wouldn't go as far as you have suggested. The rebel was not innovative from anything other than a price point. It had fewer features, was less user friendly, and not up to the level of Canon's other digital SLRs.

As the previous poster suggested, it isn't about sheer innovation, it's about quality and usability. Canon does not provide the best they can, I think everyone recognizes that, but they make a very good product and the 5d brought affordable full frame performance to the masses. Other than that, Canon has rested on its laurels and done very little.

Nikon has not produced anything innovative until the D3; the rest, including the D300, are simply not anything to get excited about for almost 4 years.

[baldwinl]

Innovation examples:

Optical image stabilization: Panasonic
Sensor image stabilization: Minolta (before Sony acq)
Paired pixels for better dynamic range: Fuji
Hex pixel geometry (for reduced aliasing): Fuji
UV - IR sensitive camera: Fuji
Foveon image sensor: Sigma

There is innovation out there - as usual it comes from the smaller players.

[macphotos]

Pixel's not the Focus

While pixel's will determine the size photo you may print, the test
of a GREAT digital SLR's lies in the ability of 3 parameters, ISO,
Aperture, and shutter speed. A camera with a high ISO, aka the 1D
Mark III with an ISO up to 6400, and 16,000 colors per pixel, is far
more important than pixel's, aka 10 or 12 mega pix.

[pfletcher]

hmmm as a photographer I would say..

Aperture is a function of the lens - not the dSLR, and shutter speed - just how many images do you ever use that 1/4000 of a second for? As for high ISO - it is useless if it is noisy.

[TUROK2000]

CANON RELIABILITY

Hearing about the problems with the new SLR brought back some not so fond memories of my own experience with Canon equipment. I bought an A1-Digital video unit in 1990 for about $2000 (significant bucks in those days), added accessories, extra battery pack, and shot many feet of tape. That came to a screeching halt in 1997 when I found out the camera needed a new audio card/chip to the tune of $750 or so, plus installation.

I contacted Canon and promptly got blown off with a reply essentially stating that such equipment has a limited life span and was not even supported after 7 years. I decided on a Sony Super-8, which has served me well for the last ten years. I also own a five-year old Sony DSC-F717 which developed imaging problem, but that was recalled by Sony, repaired, and sent back, all on their nickel, in less than two weeks. Now that is what I call SUPPORT!

By the way, I was given a Ross Electronics AM-FM radio in 1954, which is probably one of the first consumer applications of the transistor, and IT STILL WORKS! My Zenith TransOceanic 7000 (40 years old) is also doing well, thank you. What is Canon's problem?!

I would love to upgrade to one of the new SLR's if and when the budget permits. My choice will be either the Nikon or the Sony, but Canon will never see the inside of my camera bag again.

Walt.

[pfletcher]

sorry you feel that way

I have used Canon equipment exclusively since 1976. Still have a fully functioning AE-1. I would only ever consider switching to Nikon if Canon went bust and would go to Pentax, Olympus or Fuji before Sony

[Doug Mein]

Canon reliabilty

Chuck,
Many thanks for your article. I had a similar experience with Canon when I complained about the E18 error that my Power Shot A70 developed. Canon doesn't want to admit that there is a flaw with the camera design! I loved my A70 but it lasted only 3.5 years before it became totally useless. My wife paid over $400 for it as it had just been put on the market and was touted to be "the best you can buy for the money". Anyway, I am bitter over the whole experience and I have vowed NEVER to buy a Canon again. Had the company admitted to existance of the problem and make available some kind of free or inexpensive repair service then I would probably be a loyal customer but they just don't seem to care. So Nikon, Panasonic or Sony, HERE I COME!!

Best regards.

Doug Mein
near Toronto, Ontario

[photobug56]

Chuck Westfall

I've known Chuck for nearly 18 years. Whenever I'd had questions about Canon products, whether I'd bought them already or was considering buying, he always had good answers. He even wrote a book on using one of Canon's best flash units, distributed to users who could take advantage of it. He is an amazing resource for Canon and its customers in the US.

[ewelch]

Incorrect numbers.

Canon is not the #1 manufacturer of DSLRs. Nikon is. Canon
sells more in the pro market, but overall DSLR numbers goes to
Nikon. This is a long-standing misstatement of fact that people
have just assumed to be true. But the fact is, Nikon sells so
many more amateur and prosumer cameras than Canon that the
overall DSLR crown goes to them, not Canon.

So if Canon leads in numbers of cameras sold, it's because they
sell more PHd (push here dummy) cameras, not DSLRs.

[agottschald]

Canon lost me years ago after the FD series

I have in the past invested thousands in buying Canon cameras and lenses. These were in the FD series of film cameras. just before they moved to digital they changed the lens mount format to such an extent that there could be no adaptor made to accommodate the FD lenses. If I wished to continue buying new canon equipment I would have to replace all I had already. This was and still is unacceptable. I have bought second hand canon but for my digital needs I have gone with Panasonic who have excellent lica lenses and fairly good electronics.

Other makers made the effort to make their lenses compatible.

I will NEVER buy or recommend Canon cameras.

What they did once they could do again.

[jbaviera]

FD Lens

Like you, I too have a lot in FD lenses (a couple of AE-1 bodies too). I've thought about upgrading to digital, but I see it as cost prohibitive (with my not being a pro!). If I were to sell everything I have (at the prices I?ve seen on eBay) I might have enough for the camera body alone. On the other hand, I have seen on eBay a lens adaptor for about $40 that will allow the use of the FD lens on the EOS series of bodies.

[murrays]

Full frame adapter for 35mm film cameras

I believe I once saw such an adapter advertised, but never again. Surely it would be possible and allow film photographers to continue to use their very capable equipment for digital images. Full frame sensor size is important to the proper functioning of film lenses. I like my old Canon FT and would seriously like to do digital work with it without going through the film processing steps first. Any prospect for this becoming reality?

[ewelch]

You're kidding, right?

You want to take a vintage 70s camera and adapt it to full-
frame digital? I can tell you explicitly that it will never happen.
Why? Because not even Leica could turn their R8 and R9 (which
were designed to take a digital back) into full frame bodies with
a dedicated digital back for them. Film cameras are just built in
a way that makes it impossible to put a sensor in there that's
full frame and leave the camera in a workable state.

Not only that, the FT has no provision (i.e. room) for electronics,
RAM or whatnot. And don't get your hopes up for that
vaporware digital camera inside a film canister that was going
around the Internet for years. It's to small. No room for
electronics and RAM. Handling would be a nightmare. It was
never going to happen. It was simply an impossible concept on
paper with no hope of ever working any time soon.

Besides, if they could add digital to your camera, it would
probably cost more than it would be for you to get a new full
frame digital camera.

[fosofos]

Somewhat Off Topic Wish List

Would be great to see focus distance in the viewfinder.

It would also be really cool to do a focus lock, and then have the
hyperfocal distance range display.

The focus distance is not universally supported by all lenses with
respect to EXIF data, and the utilities to extract this data are of the
command line variety.

[P. Boone]

Eye Activated Focus

I've been holding out for an EYE Activated Focus digital Canon, like my old ElanIIE.

How much longer do I have to wait? (I'm dying here!)