Comments on: Sources confirm Apple laid off salespeople last week

An Apple spokesman twice denied reports that the company laid off enterprise salespeople, but sources have stepped forward to confirm they lost their jobs last week.

[ddhboy]

Enterprise sales haven't ever and more than likely will never be strong for apple, since hardly anyone outside of the creative industries like design firms and film production companies use them, save for schools. I feel that the cuts were inevitable, and I think that this is a small move in a larger chain at apple to overtime remove itself from direct enterprise sales, and apple hopes that it can get rid of a few people in enterprise sales as quietly as possible so that they don't send the shareholders in a tissy over fears of apple not making a profit.

[getwired]

They could be strong. But Apple's enterprise strategy is fundamentally confused. Until Apple views the enterprise as a distinct goal, they will always suck at it. At this point, Apple doesn't care about enterprise sales for some reason. So they are failing at it. If you don't believe you can succeed at something, you will fail.

[contentcreator--2008]

Few companies sell to both true consumers and businesses. Apple has concentrated on consumers---the lifestyle apps/iTunes/App store, etc They could certainly aim to dominate the home like Microsoft owns non-datacenter business. That would be make sense; we can all admire that kind of reasonable focus.

But that's a bit ominous for Apple's pro apps area. At least we've got a new Mac Pro for now. Certainly as a coherent business, it's a different focus than consumers. Evidence of Quicktime becoming only a playback system is a potential problem. Hopefully Apple will continue to want the halo effect from Mac's use in digital media industries.

[zumpa1]

So um, this was originally reported here before it went mainstream: http://f2.anonboard.com/bbs/show_topic/94003

[The_happy_switcher]

I still have my job.

[Mr. Dee]

Being annoying and obnoxious is not a job, its being a nuisance.

[YankeePoodle]

Trolls always have their job, here we pay you with our patience

[The_happy_switcher]

Just stating a fact, not trolling. How are you two doing at Mickey Ds?

[Vegaman_Dan]

Still curious what exactly that 'job' is, AppleRocks. It certainly isn't with Apple- no company would allow their employee to post such malicious and misleading things as you do in the name of the company. You would be a horrible representative of Apple, for example.

What company do you work for?

[The_happy_switcher]

@Vega, Like I'm gonna tell you that information in a forum. Ha ha.

[rapier1]

You may have your job but I'll bet you hard money that it ain't working for Apple.

[bananaphonerules]

Is that you Steve? I thought you were on sabbatical for health reasons?

[Vegaman_Dan]

AppleRocks1963 wrote:

"@Vega, Like I'm gonna tell you that information in a forum. Ha ha. "

Well then without any shred of evidence to back your story up, nobody can possibly believe you work for Apple. As such, you get branded a troll.

You have an easy way of fixing that however- come clean. :)

[The_happy_switcher]

You guys crack me up. Just because I said "I still have my job" you jumped to the conclusion that I work for Apple. I wish I worked for Apple. I was merely stating a fact that I STILL HAVE MY JOB. lol

[kojacked]

He couldn't work for Apple. AppleRocks1963 is only 4 years old. Can't you tell from his postings?

[dbrohamTV]

with all due respect I don't believe that "Tech Media" is all that important to Apple

[jypeterson]

50 positions cut, and some of them offered severance pay or the option to move to open positions in organization? This sounds more like a normal business strategy alignment than an "economic" layoff. This can be punctuated by the fact that Apple denied the layoffs to begin with. I am in an industry where there are many changes and restructurings regularly, and while positions are cut, there are numerous positions open in other areas where HR attempts to fill with the employees that are effected.

Also, if you want to look at it as a "true" layoff like Microsoft, Dell, Cisco, and others have done, what is the actual percentage of the laid off employees in terms of the total number of employees? My guess is that the percentage is less than 1/2 of 1%...

[Vegaman_Dan]

You can spin it all you want, but at the end of the day, 50 people no longer have their jobs and that is called a layoff.

[jypeterson]

@Vegaman
As the article states, "Those affected were given severance packages and the opportunity to apply for other jobs inside Apple."

Therefore, we don't know if they are truly unemployed. Their positions were cut, but they can apply for other positions within the company. I bet that there will be very few who will opt for the severance package instead of taking another job within Apple.

So, there is no spin here, the number will be far lower than 50 jobs lost. Attrition will always be there so there should be positions available. A good HR department should be able to find positions for each of those effected within a corporation the size of Apple's. I am not saying it's not bad that people had their positions cut, just merely pointing out the fact that it really isn't a layoff, just a restructuring of current business units.

Next time, actually read the article.

[Vegaman_Dan]

@jypeterson wrote:

"Next time, actually read the article."

I did... the question becomes, did you? You are trying to put a spin on a story by trying to use facts that are simply not there. You can imply that people took the job offers in other departments- but you cannot possibly believe that every single person was offered a position in another location.

If we applied your logic to the recent Microsoft layoffs, then we could say there were no layoffs at all. 5000 job positions were targeted for elimination by the end of the year. 1400 people were elminated. Most of those were contract positions that were not part of the actual MSFT payroll. Those same positions were converted into FTE jobs. So, but your very own logic, one could say that Microsoft *increased* their headcount by more than a thousand positions.

Would that be responsible? No, of course not. That would be spinning the facts... without facts. This is what your comments are perceived as.

It's a good try, but I would have you ask those people who are now without jobs if they volunteered to quit on their own since Apple won't acknowledge them being laid off.

[David Dudley]

Cuts would not be necessary if there were high volumes of enterprise hardware sales. The numbers and results would be speak for themselves.

[chatins]

Sounds like the standard realignment of an underperforming and troubled group. Corporate politics on two levels can be intense.

[georgiarat]

Smells like a Tim Cook initiative.

When Steve Jobs is gone Apple will be like Dell when Kevin Rollins took over. Cook and Rollins are okay when they are under control but disasters as number one.

[The_happy_switcher]

I must have part about how M. Dell came back and resurrected Dell. Oh wait, he did come back but the company has tanked.

[topgunb2]

so did apple, the company is doomed

[YankeePoodle]

Why is Apple spineless to admit something like this? What are they afraid of? I do not like this bunker mentality. To tease people by keeping products secretive is one thing but to keep lay-offs secretive is fine if you do not want to effect the morale, but outrightly lying about it, is not cool. I dont like Apple following the footsteps of Dubya.

[xcal78]

Apple conducts closed door shareholder meetings with no internet allowed. They've been very secret about everything forever. It's no shocker now.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Apple would be well advised to admit to the layoffs and put this into a positive spin, acknowledging the current economy, plans to ride it out, show leadership, etc. The continued denials in the face of the people who were terminated just makes them look very bad in the public's viewpoint.

Take charge of the situation or you'll let your lack of forthcoming allow the media to run right over you. Easiest way to defeat them is with open honesty.

[sciontcya]

I'm sure Steve thanks you Dan.
How DO they operate without your insights?
Any company not trimming right now would be stupid.

[Vegaman_Dan]

@sciontcya:

It would appear that Apple *could* use someone with that insight or else this article woudln't have been noteworthy with the point made that Apple has denied twice that these layoffs happeend and have yet to come clean about it.

Make of it what you will- the media sure is.

[websterphreaky]

Ha ha!!

Not surprising that the Big Bad Wolf crAPPLE PR Machine can't admit when their SPIN MACHINE can't stand to admit that the Apple BS ain't working with a public that has tight pockets and won't pay the MAC PREMIUM for essentially the same Chinese Sweatshop crap that is Dells, eMachines, Lenovo and Gateways LOW END computers.

A MacBook is nothing more than a $500 Lenovo and a MacBook Pro is nothing more than a $1000 Dell Inspirion. Well except BUGGIER!

Enjoying your Spinning Beach Ball of Wait ********?? All those flaky OS X updates that kills hardware and software???

OK, Krazit and the CNut Apple Hacks, make sure you censor out this post of the truth too.

[ckh1272]

My oh my!! The run on sentences have run amuck!! Nice to know that the ignorant still have their soapbox! Thanks for the laugh BTW!

[topgunb2]

I agree with webstrekphreaky, apple is crap and overpriced and is very buggy

[gefitz]

With the stock price having lost over 50% of its value over six months or so, you'd think Apple would be wary by now about misleading its holders. Withholding information about something as small as this is crazy...after the major Jobs snafu, something like this is only magnified.

What else is going on there that stcokholders should be worried about?

[sciontcya]

Are you high, or just stupid?
Most of the market has lost more than that - hold one now - there's a global recession!
Come on, have HOPE for CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN!
DImwit.

[darkstar32170]

The price is back to approximately where it was a year ago before the market sharply rose to its early 2008 high. During the period since March 08 the Dow has gone from 13000 down to 6500. Apple has gone from just above 100 to the 80's. That's quite a bit better than the market as a whole.

[mbenedict]

Nice spin. But the reality is Apple went from $192 to $83 in less than 10 months, with much of the decline blamed on lack of transparency and poor management decisions.

[Jonathan]

Apple too much of a ****** to announce that so obviously the only people who will announce it would be the ones to be canned. This is why I stopped using Mac. I don't support ********* companies.

[sciontcya]

And we are glad to have you gone.

[xcal78]

"And we are glad to have you gone."

And this is why the stocks and company is losing value.

[sting7k]

OMG Apple laid off workers! The sky is falling! Run for cover!

Who cares?

[Vegaman_Dan]

Apparently Apple does as they aren't acknowledging the issue. That alone makes it noteworthy enough to have a story written about it.

You cared enough to read the article and post as well, so someone cares.

[Zaunto]

Spin it any way you want, 50 people lost their jobs and Apple denied the layoffs. They is a clear and obvious deception. The rationalization that lying about any level of layoffs would protect the stock price just doesn't cut it. It's deception and apparently they have been found out. Even if the laid off employees "apply" for available jobs within Apple, they were still "laid off" from their current jobs and have received severance from those lost jobs. Anyone who loses a job in this current economic climate is going to be stressed over the ability to find a new job. In the end, it's about right and wrong and right now, the public appreciates honesty over deception. Apparently Apple didn't learn that lesson yet. Let's see how the stock does now that they have been caught with their pants down on the subject of these layoffs. Remember HP's "stealth layoffs"? They laid off 50 people here... 20 people there... in order for it to fly under the radar of the media. That didn't work, as those HP layoffs still got reported. Let's hope these clowns don't screw up too much while Jobs is away. It's nice for Microsoft to have a viable competitor or more to the point, for the public to be able to choose the lesser of two evils...