Comments on: Yelp user faces lawsuit over negative review

Community reviewer who suggested a chiropractor was less than honest in his billing practices is accused of defamation in a lawsuit.

[renGek]

There is always someone who is going to say you're the best and someone who will say you are the crud. I never look at one user opinion by itself as proof. But if 50% of the people say the same thing then its credible. If 1000 people on amazon gave a 1 star you have to stop and think about it.

Granted there are phony reviews. I have seen restaurants with reviews on both ends and nothing in the middle. But people are careless and you can see fake reviewers.

But I don't think individuals should be sue-able for their opinion. If the person being reviewed don't like it, they should file a protest with the site operator and let them be the mediator. If they can prove the review is unwarranted then remove it. If someone goes to that length of clear themselves then its worth the time of the operator to take a look at it. If your restaurant is crud and 100 people said so, the restaurant is not going to go after all 100 reviews and if they do I doubt the site would agree.

[kzil]

Man, this Biegel needs to read Groundswell. What a completely moronic way to handle this "problem". Also, if I were the insurance company I would get a few laywers to check out Biegel's billing habits.

[chantelwilliams]

Unfortunately no one has commented on Yelp actually supressing bad reviews if you advertise with them and listing only bad reviews at the top of the post if you don't.

Interesting business practices all around.

[luisgosalbez]

Hopefully, everybody knows that you can hardly avoid anyone to suit you if he's really determined to do so. I believe these are not bad news, but a good milestone to check the real status of the freedom right in internet. Don't be scared by lawyers -I'm an attorney myself-, and fight those who want to shut your mouth unfairly.

[allnamestaken]

Only a couple of you have recognized the fact that the doctor had no drop in business until he filed the lawsuit. He did this to himself.

[RickBullotta]

I have three words to say to anyone who posts opinion on the internet in any way, shape, or form: Umbrella Liability Policy. I was involved in a similar scenario a few years ago, and my State Farm policy covered my legal defense. Also, be aware that the content hosts (in my case, Yahoo), will roll over in a second when subpoenaed.

[BiegelDC]

My name is Steven Biegel, D.C. I am the Chiropractor named in this article. Due to the attention this story has received, I now feel compelled to tell my side of the story in relation to the libel issue I have with Christopher N.
Christopher N. was treated in our office for a couple of visits due to injuries sustained in an automobile accident. He presented us with his Kiaser card, and Geico insurance card. The person who hit him was uninsured, and Christopher had uninsured motorist coverage on his auto insurance. During his first visit he signed paperwork authorizing us to bill his insurance for treatment provided in our Chiropractic Center.
Approximately one year after being treated in our office Christopher N. made an anonymous phone call to our office. He stated that he was a new patient who had no insurance, and made an inquiry as to our rates. I told him that we offer a reduced rate of $80 for the initial visit and $45 for additional visits. (I offer these lower self pay rates as a benefit to our uninsured patients, and they are set approximately at our operating costs, and are lower than the usual and customary rates that I am contracted with most insurance companies. My office manager and I are careful to be very clear that these discounted rates must be paid at the time of service.) He then revealed himself as a past personal injury case patient, and expressed outrage that he could not that pay the reduced rate. I informed him that billings provided to his insurance company (that his personal injury attorney requested, and Christopher saw prior to the settlement of his case) were reasonable and necessary, and he should just wait until his case settles so he can pay the bill. He then went on to me that his personal injury law suit did not settle.
Due to my perception of his financial hardship and his statements leading me to believe that his case fell through, I forgave the total billings amount of $520.
Later that day, we received confirmation from his insurance company that his case did, in fact, settle, and that an insurance check of $11,900 was mailed out several weeks earlier. The adjuster also made a point of stating that this amount was more than sufficient to cover all of his health care expenses. My office manager later left a message to Christopher regarding this conflicting information and requested that he make payment. Even in doing so, I only requested that he pay $125. Unfortunately no good deed goes unpunished. He responded by publishing malicious, defamatory, and factually incorrect comments on a well known internet review site (Yelp). I wrote him a very pleasant letter outlining the inaccuracies of his statements and asked him to reconsider. He admitted to receiving the letter, and chose to ignore my request. After over a month of this untrue, defamatory posting being displayed, and Christopher's intentional refusal to remove or modify it; I decided to hire an attorney to draft and issue a cease and desist letter. He again responded with malice in posting the review that is up today. This review also intentionally expresses false statements of fact. After going through inordinate lengths to resolve this issue, I felt that I had no recourse other than to file suit.
While I am a proponent of an individual's right to free speech, I believe those who cavalierly publish (in any medium) malicious, untrue statements of fact in order to defame one's character, cause financial harm, or for self serving interests should be held accountable. I am not suing Christopher for a bad review. I am suing him for intentionally publishing false statements of fact with malicious intent. I work very hard to provide the best possible care for my patients. I do so skillfully and ethically. I love what I do, and am deeply saddened by the course that this issue has taken.
Sincerely,
Steven Biegel, D.C.

[Bob0874]

Bravo Steven Biegel!!! You will be first to enforce the rights of those defamed. I think you are doing the right thing. I think many more people who are standing by are going to join in similar suits as they get fed up with the lack of inaction and policing by companies like yelp.com.

You should look into suing yelp.com as well. If you read the literature below you will see how yelp.com directly contributes to shaping the reviews and I believe they are personally responsible for it. They are not immune to third party issues. Yelp.com manipulates algorithms and also has questionable sponsorship program. There are also many ex-yelp employees who have been critical of the company as well. Yelp.com is a multi-million dollar business (although I think they are in a huge loss) and you can certainly recover some of that money from them. Perhaps there is a way for you to join in a class action lawsuit against yelp.com.

My reading is that Dr. Biegel is in the right and Norberg is a greedy person who doesn't want to share what is legally owed to the chiropracter. Keep up the good work! I will certainly refer people to you Dr. Biegel.

[jmoran]

Hey Steve, why didn't you just write this response to Christopher's original Yelp review and move on?

[Bob0874]

I am all for free speech, but there should not be defamation of character on the internet. This guy NOrberg is highly vindictive and writes everything in a very annoying and picky way. I think the chiropracter will take this guy down and yelp along with it.

IF I WAS THE CHIROPRACTOR, I WOULD ADD YELP.COM AS A PARTY TO THE LAWSUIT.

Yelp.com has a bad reputation on the internet and a followup story needs to be done on them by CNET. Here are the links:

1. CBS

http://cbs5.com/consumer/yelp.business.complaints.2.820867.html

2. CBS

http://cbs5.com/wrapper_consumer/seenon/Yelp.Internet.ratings.2.787400.html

3. UK REGISTER

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/13/yelp_sales_pitch/page4.html

4. PERSONAL ACCOUNTS FROM BUSINESS AT PHILLIPS BLOG "YELP MESS"

http://phillips.blogs.com/goc/2008/07/the-yelp-mess.html

5. SEARCH ENGINE ROUNDTABLE

http://www.seroundtable.com/archives/018762.html

6. Cre8site - Something smells at yelp.com

http://www.cre8asiteforums.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=68597

7. RipOff Report on yelp.com

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/370/RipOff0370489.htm

8. Sola's blog

http://www.solaswebdesign.net/wordpress/?p=369#comment-108028

9. Yelping for dollars - Business week

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/dec2006/tc20061207_915943.htm

10. Techdirt - yelp.com

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080708/0001581617.shtml

11. Rosecantine

http://www.rosecantine.com/2008/07/04/user-generated-dis-content-yelp-pulls-suspicious-reviews/

12. Yelp Day never happened - yelp got dissed for deleting reviews - 1)outside in 2) SF gate

http://outside.in/San_Francisco_CA/tags/yelp%20day
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/12/04/BAMG14H0O6.DTL&type=printable

13. Yelp Truther - yelp lies extortion and more

http://yelptruther.wordpress.com/2008/10/16/yelp-lies-extortion-and-more/

keep searching...there is a lot more on the yelp.com team.

[kika2000]

"If enough of the cases come back where individual posters are being sued, that could chill the desire of people to go on and post their opinion," Morris said. "But all they have to do to protect themselves is to make sure there is some truth to what they are saying."
...And come up with the money to defend themselves in a possibly protracted legal battle. This may be a free-speech issue, but it is disingenuous to pretend that money has not been the weapon that businesses have used to silence their critics for years.
Many business owners are happy to reach a wider market through the web, but react with rancor and threats when that same tool is used to disseminate negative information about them.
Does Yelp offer conflict mediation? Customer review web sites which do mediate disagreements between posters and their subjects can go a long way to making sure everyone retains their right to speak - not just the guy with the most expensive lawyer.

[kika2000]

"If enough of the cases come back where individual posters are being sued, that could chill the desire of people to go on and post their opinion," Morris said. "But all they have to do to protect themselves is to make sure there is some truth to what they are saying."
...And come up with the money to defend themselves in a possibly protracted legal battle. This may be a free-speech issue, but it is disingenuous to pretend that money has not been the weapon that businesses have used to silence their critics for years.
Many business owners are happy to reach a wider market through the web, but react with rancor and threats when that same tool is used to disseminate negative information about them.
Does Yelp offer conflict mediation? Customer review web sites which do mediate disagreements between posters and their subjects can go a long way to making sure everyone retains their right to speak - not just the guy with the most expensive lawyer.

[yelp-a-phobic]

I too am considering a Yelp Lawsuit. Someone mistakenly posted a poor review of my competition and placed it under my Buisnesses name.
Yelp, (specifically Stacy at Yelp), refused to remove the post. Stating:
Thank you for inquiring about the reviews of your business on Yelp.
We've looked at the reviews of Haunted San Diego Ghost Tours, and after careful evaluation, we have decided to leave them intact. Reviews are ultimately the responsibility of each reviewer. Because we don't have firsthand knowledge of a reviewer's personal experience, we are not in a position to verify your claims that these reviews have been erroneously posted to your business listing. To the extent that a review appears to reflect the personal opinion and experiences of the reviewer, we allow the reviewer to stand behind his or her review.

Yet the opinions of the 'reviwer' are not 'facts' about my business.
So I can relate to this chiropractor. Are the reviewers comments Opinions or False Statements?
That is what is in question here and very well should be. Freedom of speech does not mean we get to lie about someone or something that we know nothing about. Yelp needs a quick lesson about these differences and the consequences of allowing an internet free for all that can have unfortold impact on a undeserving Business.

SHAME ON YELP and SHAME ON IGNORANT YELPERS

[AdrianosFacchetti]

Many people mistakenly believe that only facts are actionable defamation. Opinions may be actionable as well, however, if they imply provably false facts. This is typically a question of law, and therefore one that a court must decide.

[jmoran]

You can call me an a$$, dummy, no good nut job or jerk but I'll sue the first one to call me a chiropractor!!

[mypointofview]

Yelp seems to censor and give too much attention to the business owners. Here's my experience with Yelp. They took down my opinion although it was first hand and in no case in conflict with the business owner. If I'd repost it on their service, I guess the hit man of Yelp will show up at my door?

--

Hello,

We're writing to let you know about our decision to remove the review you've reposted of The Cheese Store. Your review was flagged by the Yelp community, and our Support team has determined that it falls outside our Review Guidelines (http://www.yelp.com/faq#great_review) because it appears you have a conflict of interest with this business. As such, we ask that you not repost reviews of this business in the future.

We review every situation with detail and take the removal of reviews very seriously.

Regards,
Lucy
Yelp User Support
San Francisco, California

Yelp Official Blog | http://officialblog.yelp.com
Yelp Frequently Asked Questions | http://www.yelp.com/faq

Removed Review:
My review is based on a first-hand experience. I wanted to have an authentic "French Salami". You know, the ones wrapped in rice paper and made of pure pork. Nice and dry, great for lunch with french cheese. The sales man at the Cheese Store offered a "Fabrique Délices - Saucisson Sec"

1. It was packaged in plastic which is never good for drying and prone for molding. 2. It looked molded at one part although it may not have been mold. 3. The flour came partly off very strongly - it was not evenly covered. 4. I tasted it -- it tasted like an old shoe on Charlie Chaplin's plate. 5. I am from Europe (Bavaria) and so I studied the package a bit closer, still wondering what was going on here. It said as ingredient "Beef Casing." Say what? The solution was clear: it also said in fine print that it was a Product of the USA. No wonder I said to myself - cliches are true.

I had hoped that the Cheesestore beyond all other stores out there spare me THAT first-hand experience. What's sad here is this degree of falseness!

This is not only misleading packaging but incompetence in sales. Maybe it's a question of taste? On the manufacturer's side -- the package never claimed to be a "pork sausage", never showed the french flag or even bleu-blanc-rouge colors. YET I feel pulled over the table. Maybe it's just me, but I advise anybody who want's to get serious with European foods to pay close attention - meaning to bring their reading glasses and perhaps a loupe.

Because my first-hand experience showed me, that you just can't trust too much the sales person at the Cheese store either. They may be good folks, but are possibly just too overwhelmed by too many and too often changing products.

Product info: LOT: 4111 ITEM: 83-1 http://www.fabriquedel... Distributed by SAPAR USA HAYWARD, CA 94544


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