Comments on: DHS wants green card holders' fingerprints

Department expands its biometrics-based border database, which requires all 10 fingerprints, a digital photograph, home address, and other information that privacy advocates have criticized as too intrusive.

[shinkat--2008]

I'm little bit confused. Why is this a privacy issue. DHS already have finger prints of green card holders. DHS already can and probably do track them through the alien registration number on the green card (for that matter they can also track US citizens' travel activity through the passport number). What is wrong with making sure that the person showing the card matches with what is in the database?

We lost privacy long time ago when the government formed DHS, or may be before that.

[Nemmindeggy]

There is no proof that I know of or have heard of that this measure would improve our collective safety. How would you, as an American citizen, like to be fingerprinted every time you come home from abroad? I do not think most people would agree to that. If so, why do you approve to do it to permanent residents who have been living here and contributing to this country in many cases longer that you have been alive. This is not a privacy issue, it is an issue of discrimination. Today we agree to fingerprinting, what form of discrimination are we going to agree to tomorrow?

[JoeF2]

"What is wrong with making sure that the person showing the card matches with what is in the database?"

The Greencard has the picture of the person on it. What is wrong with just comparing that with the person who presents the card???

[::G]

Japan does the same thing already. Even if you have a long-term or permanent visa, you get your fingerprints taken (just index fingers, though) and photo snapped. I think it sucks and does nothing to provide extra security, but who in the government is going to listen to foreigners' complaints? Resident aliens are pretty much 2nd-class citizens in Japan. Tourists are ok because they spend money then leave, but tourists don't have special visas.

This gripes me off, though. So why would DHS do this if the borders aren't sealed anyway? They're going to inconvenience people who enter via legal means, and ignore people who sneak in illegally? Brilliant. I feel safer already (that's sarcasm, in case you didn't catch it). The less government invasiveness the better.

[Nemmindeggy]

This is harassment plain and simple. They do it because they can, not to improve anyone's safety. There should be some congressional oversight ensuring that the DHS does things that make sense and improve safety, as opposed to just invent measures to look like doing something. I hope that the new leadership that Obama will install at DHS will change this and any other measures that are meaningless overreaches.

[SeizeCTRL]

How is it harassment? It should be considered a PRIVILEGE to be allowed to live in this country and if having your finger print on record bothers you that much, you are more than welcome to return your homeland. For christ's sake it's not like we are forcing anyone to LEARN and SPEAK English as a national language... even though I am sick to death of that Ronnie ****** tax law in Spanish commercial.

Perhaps you consider it harassment when going to a bar and they check your ID. The nerve of a bouncer to verify your age!

[JoeF2]

SeizeCTRL:
These people already have a Greencard. They already gave all the fingerprints and picture to the authorities. The Greencard has their picture right on it.
This is a colossal waste of taxpayer money. You should demand that the government spends their money wisely, and doesn't throw it out the window.

[shinkat--2008]

After spending few hours in immigration office two or three times for misidentification, I would chose a quick finger printing over waiting hours for a short interview. You are correct it is harassment, but if you watch and listen to some of questioning that goes on in the waiting room, you may learn to appreciate what they do.

[JoeF2]

People who have a Greencard don't spend a few hours in immigration. They are, except for the fact that they can't vote, pretty much the same as US citizens.

[jessiethe3rd]

DHS harrasses people on an ongoing basis. They are much like the IRS - above the law.

[PzkwVIb]

What else could we expect from the Department of Fatherland... er, Homeland Security. They just feel the need to be seen as doing something. It doesn't have to be something right, it just has to be something. Face it the Department of Homeland Security is an oxymoron. A 15 year old with an active imagination could think circles around the hidebound bureaucrats that classify one inch pocketknives as verboten, but cheerfully allow pencils and pens on board. Pointed sticks are, after all, not weapons.

[pokiri]

To increase the security, as a next step, the citizen also be finger printed and photographed , i don't think good citizen won't complain since this is being done to for security of USA.

[JoeF2]

Good one. Only then will the people who fail to understand this current idiocy wake up.

[Dalkorian]

Papers please.

I can't tell if you're kidding, stupid or ignorant. I hope you're kidding, but fear one of the others. If so, study more history.

[sythara]

I think you people miss the point. This is for non-citizens. If you're a citizen then you have nothing to worry about. But if its Ahmed from Saudi Arabia, I sure would want him to be tracked. And PzkwVIb (is your name a reference to tiger tank?), I don't really think you have a clue as to what DHS is all about. Sure they are not perfect, but they were formed in an imperfect time by an imperfect people. But to keep track of people entering my country is really not a revolutionary consept that should ahve people screaming 1984.

pokiri, citizens are already fingerprinted and photographed, its called a vitis to your local DMV.

shinkat--2008, completely agree with you.

[JoeF2]

If Ahmed from Saudi-Arabia is a Permanent Resident, the US government already has his fingerprints, and his picture. The picture is right on the Greencard. Also, he is tracked in the US.
So, this is nothing more than a waste of taxpayer money.

[JoeF2]

"citizens are already fingerprinted and photographed, its called a vitis to your local DMV. "

The same is true for non-US citizens, like Permanent Residents. Besides, this is about coming back from travel abroad. I don't remember having to give my fingerprints for a passport...

[freemarket--2008]

"citizens are already fingerprinted and photographed, its called a vitis to your local DMV. "

Maybe fingerprinted in your state, not in mine.

[Seaspray0]

I'm sure we all get that special feeling every time we go through the airport knowing that we are being protected by the department of homeland security. You have to wait till you get on the plane before you can access a barf bag.

[sythara]

And you felt safer pre 9-11 where you just rolled on through to the airplane?

travel and safety are not known to go good together.

[JoeF2]

What a waste of taxpayer money.
They already have fingerprints and photos of Permanent Residents. The Greencard has the photo right there...
I hope every Permanent Resident who is eligible to apply for citizenship does so, and calls his or her Congressperson to put an end to this ridiculous stupid crap. We can do better things with the money spent on this BS.

[topgun60]

It is interesting how the government which is instituted to protect its citizens is now finding an interesting way to obtain data on many future potential citizens. When many of these lawful permanent residents obtain citizenship, their data will already be secure in government data banks. Remember, this country impeached a President for a simple wiretap of the opposing party headquarters. A number of people were arrested, convicted and imprisoned for several years. Now, the government wiretaps its own citizens, with no consequence. Soon it will be getting our fingerprints at the border the same way they are requiring it of lawful residents. We Americans tend to forget the lessons of history much too quickly. In the same way we permitted outselves to be duped with regard to "Wall Street," we are slowy being duped into George Orwell's "1984." When will we learn.

[tppcnet]

Can I use my middle finger?

[neatdesign]

The US government wants American citizens to think that this policy will make them safer, because they're counting on the fact that most Americans are clueless about US immigration policies and procedures. I mean, let's face it: Your average American doesn't know that someone who originally emigrated on a visa and now holds a 10-year green card has already provided their biometrics THREE times to the US government. And all three sets of biometrics were taken digitally and can be accessed electronically. And all three sets were run through a number of databases and FBI background checks, etc, with the US government ultimately determining that the person is not a threat to the US and granting them US permanent resident status.

What people should be asking themselves is, "The US government already took exhaustive and expensive measures to deem these people worthy of granting them permanent resident status. So why is the US government second-guessing it's own procedures and decisions by implementing this redundant biometrics requirement? How does this make me safer and not be a wasteful use of my taxpayer dollars?"

The problem is that most Americans don't know to ask those questions, because they've never had any direct experience with US immigration. And as long as Americans are clueless about that, the more DHS and USCIS will be able to continue their wasteful and redundant policies.

[zapastor]

As one who has had to wait for up to two hours at the border while my I-485 application was being processed and was really excited when the approval took place and I was able to just show my Green Card and enter without having to stop for secondary inspection. I am terribly concerned that the waiting period is going to be horrendous.

I really think that this is an over kill that will totally overwhelm the CBP and frustrate Green Card Holders. Let us collectively ask the Obama Administration to review this one.

[hayuanmu]

This system is yet another vestige of the Bush administration's "jobs-through-fear" strategy that in this case will not even create minimum wage rent-a-cop positions for the McDonald's rejectees, but rather place a burden on the INS officers working and on us as taxpayers.

Ostensibly, the new layer of steps would be to verify that the Resident in question is in fact the same person on the Green Card. Photos aren't good enough... Fine. But then millions of US citizens (plus hundreds of thousands of short term Canadian vistors) don't need to go through this verification process. Their IDs are accepted at face value. That's kind of strange because US passports are much easier to obtain illegally than a Green Card. There is no background check (they ask for Boy Scout troop affiliations, charitable donations over the last decade, sports clubs, private night clubs etc. as part of the process for Residents). There is no fingerprinting, nor is there any secondary confirmation of identity.

In other words, you set up a filter of legal Residents and Citizens and as part of that filter, you tighten a few holes of the seive, while leaving the others open. Guess what happens?

I'm sure that in time this will be painless for Residents - although citizens and Residents alike will be paying for this. This is not the price of safety as this has clearly been shown not to be.

[lucaspeluca]

All of you blessing this stupid decision, I am a permanent resident may be older than the ones that made this rule , i was a federal employee i am retired the USA government has my fingerprints,pictures records, everything they want from me, house record, mortgage, insurance taxex.
So I think this is just BIGOTRY and a waste of tax payer money to fatten those fat ***** sitting in DHS office in Washington.

[ThomasWhitney]

In the state of Texas we do fingerprint a the DMV, as well as take photographs. Biometric are used widely as a way to identify validity in the U.S.

My concern is not this at all. I don't mind being identified. My main concern is "identity theft"and therefore my identity being less or more than I actually am. Not me.

To this end I have been thinking a great deal lately about how the new frontier of the digital world does need protection and policing.

Whether or not I am identified or not is just a course of the way we do things. For years, we have been using signatures. But that is less effective overall.

I want protection.