Comments on: Microsoft aims to 'Elevate America'

Amid the severe economic conditions, Microsoft is announcing a program to give technology training to up to 2 million Americans.

[dlowe402]

So, I guess they are gonna try to fund this with the "refunds" they're trying to get back from the 1400 workers they laid off. Brilliant! How bout they just hire back those people with the money they were going to spend training new ones.

[ironsmithfe]

Those 1400 workers may have deserved to be laid off. Microsoft employed nearly 90,000 and this is its first ever company wide layoffs. Unless your a brainless liberal you know that not everyone that works a job is deserving of the wages they receive. The funds that they are using to provide vouchers for training is great advertising, well worth the dollar amount they are going to spend.

[Penguinisto]

Hint: it isn't a question of "deserving" a wage - it is a question of paying an agreed-upon wage for work performed.

[Inconnux]

just like they disbanded Ensemble studios? Made Age of empires, Age of mythology and the latest halo wars. An award winning studio with games that always sold well... they 'deserved' to be let go? How about Aces, the studio that made MS Flight Simulator, the PREMIER studio that does flight sims... of course they don't deserve their wages... both studios made microsoft money and were considered top tier game development studios. If I was a stock holder I would be calling for ballmers head. Ballmer is so incompetent that he makes me want Bill Gates back!

Now what do they want to do? give away more certification... Just what we all need more McSystem Engineers

[Dango517]

"Unless your a brainless liberal you know that not everyone that works a job is deserving of the wages they receive."

I think I know of one, always could be mistaken. This guys an ogre. Real genius type, thinks he's got it figured out. The rest of us just laugh at him. Yep, in this one instance you might be right.

[homercles82]

It is 25 workers you dope. Read the dam facts before posting this garbage.

[ericyen]

MS just trying to buy good PR while laying people off and off-shoring jobs.
Oh you forgot to mention any training provided in this manner is a full write off for MS.
Please don't think MS is anything but a cold business.

[Saint07]

Well.. tell me what Apple doing to help people ?,..building new laptop for $5000 ..so nobody can afford
.Even if MS will benefit from this action, will help someone for sure.

[pj4614]

Hey Saint07 - You're off topic but I'll follow up on it.

I'll tell you what Apple is doing to help people. It's providing an operating system and computers that work. Almost two years ago I started my own consulting company. During the starting phase, my MS Windows machine got viruses and I had to reinstall everything from scratch 4 times in 3 months. Despite paying for virus protection and patiently downloading MS updates constantly every dang patch Tuesday. I lost ground, time and money trying to start my business so I got to thinking about Apple.

I learned that the Mac is actually priced about the same as Dell computers if you are looking at similar spec machines. Apple just doesn't play down on the no profit cheap end of the market. My upfront cost was a bit more. But oh my god what value! No viruses! No worries! No junkware to remove! Excellent useful software bundled! And my productivity has soared. I get so much done that I can even take time to read news stories and add my own comments once in a while. :)

I've had two semi-retired people working as part time contractors for me. I'm now looking to hire my first full time employee. And I'm looking at office space. My hard work and determination have lead to this.... and my efforts were magnified by tools that gave me leverage and didn't get in my way. I will never buy a MS Windows machine again.

You ask what Apple is doing to help people. Well how about investing through the down turn. Turning out phenomenal products. Providing exceptional service. Providing tangible and meaningful value.

I'll be ordering a new laptop for my new employee - and it'll be a Mac.

[Vegaman_Dan]

PJ4614:

"Almost two years ago I started my own consulting company. During the starting phase, my MS Windows machine got viruses and I had to reinstall everything from scratch 4 times in 3 months. "

This alone would tell me that I would not want you as a consultant. Anyone who has this much trouble is not qualified to be in the business. It's not hard to keep a system virus or malware free- you just need to be up to date and do proper system maintenance.

Your clear and obvious bias also discredits you as a consultant. You need to be unbiased when you hear your client's requirements, then advise them of the various options available without pushing them towards one or another system because of a predetermined biased which influences your advice.

It might save you time if you just put on your business cards, "Macintosh Only"

[Penguinisto]

@Dan:

You do realize that not all consultants are IT-related, right?

Maybe you should think before you type next time?

[jabberwolf]

"Hey Saint07"-
". It's providing an operating system and computers that work. Almost two years ago I started my own consulting company. During the starting phase, my MS Windows machine got viruses and I had to reinstall everything from scratch 4 times in 3 months."
That means you were irrisponsible on the OS you had. Did not install virus protection, opened email unprotected and visited websites you should not have at work.

""MS updates constantly every dang patch Tuesday. "
As does OSX on a regular basis but sometimes Apple doesnt even alert you to changes it makes in the OS!

"I learned that the Mac is actually priced about the same as Dell computers if you are looking at similar spec machines. " FLAT OUT LIE - that or utter idiocy as the price is the same when looking at the first page but not actually pricing things out.

"I get so much done that I can even take time to read news stories and add my own comments once in a while. :) " I doubt you actually have a business as this seems to ALREADY be the habbit of Apple users that pretend to work but really have no jobs and live at home with mother.

"I've had two semi-retired people working as part time contractors for me. I'm now looking to hire my first full time employee. And I'm looking at office space." Might one be mother still? A 1 man business = still living at home.

"You ask what Apple is doing to help people. Well how about investing through the down turn. Turning out phenomenal products. Providing exceptional service. Providing tangible and meaningful value."
More like selling drugged coolaid to incompitent people that seem to try and blame everyone else for their mistakes. So when a restrictive product, uncompatibility, and limited creativity are presented replacing some thought process and independence - they spring for it to make themselves feel and look pseudo-intelligence. But as with all Apple products, this comes at a higher price.

"I'll be ordering a new laptop for my new employee - and it'll be a Mac." Talk is cheap, and it appears to be a very small business, so we'll wait when you actually do something.

[macewan_]

Microsoft is a cheesy company. After 20 years their operating system shouldn't be considered bloated or difficult to use. And that asking for money back from laid off workers... so typical of what you'd expect from Microsoft. Again - a cheesy company.

[sal-magnone]

Hey PJ4614,

"During the starting phase, my MS Windows machine got viruses and I had to reinstall everything from scratch 4 times in 3 months."

I'm writing this on a Mac, but I hope you are not a technology consultant. If so, you should try the 'Elevate America' program from MSFT, cause you need help... Since the late 80s I've had one virus (an e-mail worm) on a Windows box. I haven't even run the entire time with an AV. I don't buy the PC is an unusable or irrevocably flawed platform. My take.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Penguinisto wrote:

"You do realize that not all consultants are IT-related, right?"

That's a good point- I did make an assumption that may indeed be a mistake. PJ4614, if you are not an IT consultant, then I must apologize. When a person makes a mistake of this nature, it is only responsible to own up to it and apologize.

"Maybe you should think before you type next time? "

Excellent advice- and something you may want to take to heart yourself.

[wangbang]

"During the starting phase, my MS Windows machine got viruses and I had to reinstall everything from scratch 4 times in 3 months. Despite paying for virus protection and patiently downloading MS updates constantly every dang patch Tuesday."

I'm sorry, but that tells me that either you're a complete moron or you are a liar. If you had antivirus software and you updated the patches, there's no way in hell you would be having so much problems with viruses. What is your consulting business--visiting porn and warez sites all day long?

[ZetaZeta_]

OS X is more like a piece of firmware since it only works on Apple machines. Since they never had to build it to work with anyone else's machine, of course it works. Just throwing that out there. I would never say their OS justifies the price of their hardware, and I don't think their hardware does either.

It's a good system. It works. I agree with this. However, no Apple machine is worth the amount they charge for it.

[Thomas, David]

Shameless

[dixonpete]

Umm, I'm thinking all this training is all about indoctrinating people to use MS products, right?

[t8]

Of course it is. Microsoft would never help anyone for that sake alone, it is not in their DNA.

[Vegaman_Dan]

The very same reason Apple sponsors machines to be put in public schools.

[hawkeyeaz1]

My thoughts exactly. I don't see anything immediate (even on MS' site) to indicate if it is technology in general or MS specific, but MS' history would indicate the latter.

[homercles82]

The same way apple licenses their computers to public schoolss and colleges along with opening stores on college campuses?


You freaking black shirt thing goatee wearing latte sipping yuppies need a life.

[spacydog]

Y'all are so cynical it's disheartening. Let's take a look at the program.

"The most significant part of the program, in which Microsoft is offering free certification and other technical training"

Let's assume certification is for Microsoft technologies. Yes, Microsoft is definitely benefiting out of this. They are paying for this program, nonetheless. Why would they pay for people learning other technologies? Shouldn't those companies pony up the same way Microsoft is?

The goal here is to get more people trained and certified in software and computer technology. Although it is slanted towards Microsoft technology, this will benefit the whole tech field as these people graduate to other areas of the tech field. Joe Plumber who just lost his job can now learn skills in a new field and potentially have a chance at other job because of that.

"The second component of "Elevate America," available online immediately, is a Web site designed to help people with the basics such as creating a resume and send e-mail."

This will help anyone no matter what field they are in.

If other companies are willing to pony up the money to help people like Microsoft, I applaud any and all companies that do so. The economy sucks right now, we all agree, so it's always refreshing to hear any company, profit or non-profit, or individuals stepping up to help out others.

[Penguinisto]

"Why would they pay for people learning other technologies? "

Funny, but most other folks at least teach students about underlying technologies, and not just "The Gospel According to Bill"

Hell, as someone who has taken and passed the MCSE coursework and certs multiple times, I can tell you for certain that most of MSFT's "knowledge" requires that you suspend all disbelief and think like a Microsoft salesman when trying to solve technical challenges... and that's not what makes a competent tech, admin, or architect.

Little wonder that the acronym is worthless in the real world these days.

/P

[Vegaman_Dan]

I'm afraid this is true of any certifications these days. Security certifications are even worse. HR departments only look at letters and acronyms in order to help winnow out what resumes they are going to look at without any regard to what those letters may actually mean.

Unfortunately before you ever get a chance to get to that in person interview with someone who is actually knowledgable about the tech, you have to go through several levels of fluff like this.

The certifications are easy to pass- you study for the answers they want you to have and have no bearijng on reality. It doesn't matter if it is CompTIA, MCSE, RHE, or GIAC- unless you actually know what you're doing, then people who have these certs are nothing more than paper techs and those are worthless in my opinion.

[t8]

Elevate America?

Elevate Microsoft more like it.

We don't need Microsoft and there supposed goodwill.
The world and the Internet would be better without them.

[Vegaman_Dan]

If MSFT wasn't around, personal computers will still be sitting in your parent's basement and workstations at the workplace would be terminals only.

Hate Microsoft all you want, but they got the machines into the places where they needed to be and the industry wouldn't be the same today otherwise.

[Penguinisto]

"If MSFT wasn't around, personal computers will still be sitting in your parent's basement and workstations at the workplace would be terminals only."

False.

DOS wasn't written by Microsoft. Others would (and at the time already were trying to) step up to the plate. Without IBM (esp. on the hardware side), Microsoft would have gotten approximately nowhere. Apple was already selling like gangbusters, and the only reason IBM sought - and MSFT filled- the need for PC's was due to the fear IBM felt from the growing threat that Apple's then new products represented.

IOW, it would have happened anyway.

Meanwhile, please keep your worshipful revisionism to yourself, Dan - thx.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Interesting points you made. You have an opinion that I do not believe many people would agree with, but that is your right.

"Meanwhile, please keep your worshipful revisionism to yourself, Dan - thx. "

Oh shove a sock in it, loser. You're not funny to anyone.

[Thomas, David]

@Vegaman_Dan

Actually he's correct. It's not so much an opinion as fact. If you recall, and I'm sure you can. The first IBM pc was supposed to be running CPM as the OS. DOS was little known, and Microsoft closed the deal when the owner of the CPM OS was unable to finish with IBM (rumor is he was skiing in France, and IBM took its time back then, but when they are ready to move, the move).

The personal computer wave was in full gear (from a standpoint of beginning to ramp up) back then. Enough professionals were clamoring for a PC, but didn't know who to trust. It was the fact that IBM created a PC (though it was a series of mis-fitted hodge podge machiines), that gave businesses the confidence to purchase personal computers for business, thus paving the way for their increased use through exposure.

If it wasn't Microsoft, it would have been someone else (not Apple because they were publicly at odds with IBMs philosophies).

[ZetaZeta_]

@Penguinisto:
"DOS wasn't written by Microsoft. Others would (and at the time already were trying to) step up to the plate."

If Microsoft wasn't here today, someone else would have been, sure. Then again, we'd be hating them instead of Microsoft. There had to be "A Microsoft." In this line of time-space, that "Microsoft" happens to *be* Microsoft.

Microsoft filled the role of the big business deal-maker. If someone else had, they'd be in similar shoes today, I'm sure.

[joekrahn]

Of course Microsoft will steer people towards Microsoft technology, but that doesn't make it a bad thing, even if they are only doing it to improve their public image. Maybe it will encourage some other companies to offer a similar service, and then people have different choices of how to be indoctrinated. RedHat could offer help in writing resumes in OpenOffice.

[Vegaman_Dan]

This is a good point. If Apple, Red Hat, and others want to do this, there is nothing to stop them. It's up to those companies to decide if they want to offer similar programs or not.

[itprousa]

What a bunch of crap! Microsoft is all about cheap labor i.e. h1,l1, and outsourcing. The recent 5000 worker layoff issue and years of saying there is no talent in the US brought their fraud into the light.

Kudos to Senator Chuck Grassley for stepping up to the Microsoft machine and their lies!!

I'll give her credit for her ability to pitch the BS. If I wasn't an IT veteran who's been in the trenches for 15 years, I may have even believed her.

There is no shortage of IT professionals in America. There is however a shortage of companies/corporations who do not favor cheap 3rd world labor substitutions for their own greed and profit at the cost of American worker prosperity.

[bensobel]

So many haters wasting their life criticizing every single thing Microsoft does...

[bsharkey]

training is always good. even if it is "only" Microsoft training... but the selection and offerings aren't very meager, to me.

I think MS has to be careful they don't **** off too many of their partners, but by making them voucher-based, I think this problem is mostly avoided.

[ewelch]

How about not raping people you laid off Microsoft? You screwed up by giving them a bit more money than you planed to?

It's not like it will hurt you to swallow it and get on with "elevating America."

This is such a cynical way to draw attention away from their take money back from laid off employees debacle. I can imagine the pain they have inflicted on former employees. And now they want to help the rest of America?

No thanks.

[jabberwolf]

Maybe its an effort to stop retarded mac users from posting on blogs and alert people to how stupid and retarded they reall are!

How? By showing everyone just how easy it is to do the same tasks you do on the MAC. Actually showing many times how much more you have to do on the Mac, many times, more so than on windows.

Maybe showing just how many MORE softwares and hardware that simply is not available or the MAC?!

Reality is a good education. For mac users reality is poisen to spit on and stamp out - how dare MS actually show people how stupid ******** really are!!! Not by insults, but by simple education.

Bravo MS !

[nickh2]

Alright. You think MS are going to do this "Not by insults". Fine.

Perhaps you should follow their example. You seem more than willing to throw insults around.

[polrai14]

I'm an Uruguayan who has beeen using Ventanas for almost 15 years now and can say that having to continually re-install, repair, update, upgrade and fight against Microsoft viruses is LOADSA FUN !!! (No, I'm not being sarcastic, I really like it !!!). I absolutely don't like Manzana, no sireee!
Bill G er I mean Guillermo Puertas

[Drew.0]

Did any of you fud mongerers even bother to read the frickn microsoft website?? The first two sites they direct you to are not at all MS sites.

http://www.comptia.org and http://wwww.nwcet.com

Does every article related to microsoft always have to go straight to the pits in the comment section??!!

[Vegaman_Dan]

There are those who live to hate everything Microsoft and will post without actually doing any research.

It's not about the subject at all- only their need to belittle others to feed their own insecure egos.

[sal-magnone]

I think this is great - the private sector giving to the public sector for mutual benefit - I like it.

[sundance808]

nothing new here.. Microsoft has been sponsoring this type of training and "certification" for microsoft products in third world countries.. the reason? to counter open source alternatives. They're doing that in the mainland now for the same reasons.

[Voice_Of_Logic]

BOHICA! This does NOTHING to help the average Joe. This is like the stimulus bill - its a big fat ZERO. Provide the regular (non state/local government employee) with these resources and now we're talking. More proof that the US government will eventually EMPLOY AND CONTROL every US citizen in the next decade if we do not start fighting back. Time to revolt. Sorry. This ******** just cant go on. Our nation is in a downward spiral and it has NOTHING to do with a bad recession, which we've had plenty in the past... This time, its different - yes... we have Nancy JACKASS Pelosi in charge and her mouthpiece puppet Obama on her lap. We're getting screwed.

[Wookiee-1138]

A chance to brainwash more people to be slavishly reliant on MS products, you mean.

MSC"X" certificates are useless.

I'll stick with Cisco's training standards, thanks.

[kapsuryc]

As a vocational education teacher of 20 years, teaching computer applications, I have been trying to get Microsoft to provide a free live chat for computer teachers and students who wish to ask specific questions regarding Microsoft products. Microsoft's greed has prevented it from providing us such a resource. I hope this 'Elevate America' program is for real and that it starts with computer teachers at different school districts! Also please be mindful that vocational training without connection to local avaialble jobs and team work with the employers who are using the same tools which are being taught will be non-focused and futile. So please America get it together and don't use schools as dumping ground because you do not have decent jobs for our beautiful and bright people.

[DrtyDogg]

Have you checked their website, there are a lot of resources on there for learning, including live chats.

http://www.microsoft.com/communitiEs/chats/default.mspx

There are 13 of them scheduled between now and June

[MPanetta]

It would serve everyone here who has negative views of Microsoft to simply refuse to buy their products. Its a lot better than getting into arguments with Microsoft supporters and Apple Supporters(Apple really isn't much different than Microsoft or any other corporation).

The awful and hideous truth of it all is that companies exist to generate wealth. Some of them engage in benevolent activity from time to time, sure, but at the end of the day they are about generating wealth.

If you feel that software and information are part of a greater human good and find constant fault with modern business practices then you need to delve into the world of open source where knowledge is something shared by the community for the benefit of everyone. Arguing with one another in forums doesn't stop the frightening amount of voting with dollars that happens to the benefit of both Microsoft and Apple, along with a host of other corporations that have behaved in less than ethical fashion over the years.

I personally use Linux at work and at home. I will only use open source software and will not buy a Mac or a Machine with Windows on it. Not spending money is how I fight. People here can disagree with my stance and that's fine; we are all entitled to live as we will. The important part is that you take action when you see something that does not agree with your convictions personally or professionally. If you don't like Microsoft, don't give them money. If you don't like Apple, don't give them money.

Have a great day!!