Comments on: Sorry, but I'm sitting out Earth Day--and the next one and the one after that

The fix is in. We're getting scammed big time thinking that we're on the right track. Credit industry lobbyists for knowing how to push the right buttons.

[zimmcomm]

First of all, why pick on just ethanol? You say there will be ?several culprits? and ethanol is the worst. What are the others? I do agree that Earth Day is just a feel-good bunch of baloney.

Second, you say ?we've footed the bill for more than $50 billion in corn subsidies in the last decade.? I?d like to know what you are including in that number and where you got that figure. It?s unfortunate that people throw numbers like that out giving the impression that the government is just writing checks to corn farmers for growing corn. Farm programs are like the tax code ? couldn?t explain it in one paragraph if my life depended on it. However, I can tell you that government payments to corn growers have declined and are continuing to declining because demand has increased and prices are higher.

No doubt that increased ethanol production and higher corn prices are contributing to higher food prices ? but only contributing. They are not the sole cause by any means. Higher energy prices are by far the largest contributor to higher food costs. Other factors are the increased demand for food in China and India, as well as back-to-back droughts in Australia, and increased speculation in the commodity markets. It is disingenuous at best to lay all the blame at the feet of ethanol.

Finally, in response to Spartan regarding the cost of making a gallon of ethanol ? how much do you think it costs to make a gallon of gasoline? Consider the diesel and natural gas used to drill, process, ship, blend and transport petroleum. The answer is that it costs MORE to make a gallon of gas than it does to make a gallon of ethanol. Ask an economist. And ethanol production will continue to become more efficient if we don?t throw the baby out with the bathwater because it?s not good enough.

[jscottupton]

The reply's to this are right on. It is time for common sense. Ethanol from corn continues only because the government is pushing it. Let the market do it's thing. In fact, one reason (there are several) that gasoline is so high is because of (economic) fascist government policies.

[Davewithe]

It currently takes about a gallon of gas to produce a gallon of ethanol, farm equip etc. and then you have to ship it by truck. Ethanol actually makes "greenhouse gas" emissions worse.

But take heart Globalwarming is one of the biggest hoaxes that the ultra rich have concocted to fleece us little guys in decades. The same rock groups (read rich entertainment brats) who aree now flacking for Global Warming only three decades ago were flacking for the Global Cooling hysteria (read we're gonna have an ice age by the mid-1970's).

I know I was there, I was a charter subscriber to Shelter Magazine. That was one of the priemere mag's to teach us all how to survive the coming world freeze up.

Does anyone understand that the world temp fluctuates "naturally" according to the laws of physics and ecology. And also um something called the Solar Maxima/Minima cycle.

(PS don't buy Carbon Credits; Algore prints them in his basement.)

[guywayne]

Considering the amount of petroleum that is used in producing corn in this country, I find it hard to believe that it is truly cheaper to produce a gallon of ethanol than a gallon of gas.
But, even if it is. Why not use a better technology? There are others available. I'm not advocating any particular one, but there are wind, solar, hydro and geo. Also, we have biodiesel, biomass, and several ways of producing ethanol that are superior to using corn.
But, ADM and Monsanto have the lobby, and make a lot of profit from corn, so we'll probably be killing ourselves burning it up in our cars for the next couple of decades.

[BSinton]

A serious outbreak of Common Sense , and Intelligence.
Will wonders never cease.
However , may I say Amen.

[charlie cooper]

that wasn't the point this time. if you're interested, i've written in the past and put forward an idea we should consider - namely, take a serious look at nuclear energy.

[nextcube]

Why is Earth Day on V.I. Lenin's birthday? Is there a connection there? Hmmm....

[1957joe]

I read an article the other day that represents my feelings on ethonal.
It said we should be ashamed to be using a food product for fuel. Not that it's just driving the cost of food up and up and up.
While there are starving people in our country and around the world. In my opinion, it's just one more reason the rest of the world calls us "The ugly American"

[awaldo]

As an active farmer, I have more than once heard the comment of using "food for fuel". Question I have is this: when was the last time you ate #2 yellow corn? It isn't food, it's feedstock.

[1957joe]

awaldo, so your telling me that growing #2 corn in place of corn that the consumer can eat does not contribute to rising food cost.

I DON'T THINK SO.

[NWRCS]

I still have my Teak reel-to-reel (three of them, to be precise), including factory recordings and ones I have made.
I still have a functional 8-track.
I still have my turntable, and vinyls.
I stll have cassettes, player and all.

I refuse to do any more.
No CD's or CD players, no MP whatevers.

I drew my own personal line on technolgy, and don't want to proceed.
My 58-year-old automobile and pickup, of which I have owned the car for over 38 years, keep on going, and I even have an old Western Electric dial phone, and several vacuum tube receivers that all work just fine.

Nope.

[Zimminger]

So you want to blame China, India, and the ethanol industry? Next time you're out on the road, look around. There's the soccer mom's SUV--a Hummer--a Range Rover--an Explorer--your typical full size van--a manly pickup--mostly, only one occupant. When you pump gas, you should pay accordingly. The first quart should be cheap. The second quart, a bit more. A higher rate for the next couple. That's a gallon. It should satisfy the moped and scoot owners. The next couple gallons, a bit higher. And it should ramp up according to how much you buy at one time, because those who buy 20 to 40 gallons at a time and drive off with one or two persons in the car are the REAL problem. They should pay accordingly.

[sonymaster101]

well zimminger, most MANLY PICKUPS run of a real engine, a diesel, which even though it can be twice the size and twice the hp and 4 times more tourque than a typical gasser, gets 25 mpg hw. Oh, and it has a 6.6 litre engine. a toyota celica only gets 30 mpg hw, for a 2.5 litre engine. By the way, did you ever consider that big big trucks ship your food to you, and if a stupid rule like that was enforced, how do you think that might affect your fuel and food prices? did you even consider that extremely large vehicles make your life what it is? If they "pay accordingly", they will just pass the cost on to you and you will then "pay accordingly".

and yes, whether you are willing to accept it or not, china, india and the ethanol industry are what are causing prices of food and fuel to go up accross the board.

Also, does that mean you are one of those people who just because he always has 5 people in his car thinks everyone else has to? thats not the way things work.

And dont just blame people like yourself. Big oil is behind a lot of this. did you know that diesel is cheaper to make than unleaded, but sells fo 60 cents more? Did you know that with fuel prices at record highs, oil companies also made record profits?

just remember people will respond to comments like yours.

[DOSpower]

Spot on. The deceit of the green movement to influence government policy is having dire economic (and probably social) dificulties based on a false premise. Polluting the environment is not good but will renewable fuels change that?
The impact of man on climate change is yet to be convincingly detailed as the models are selective and the 'evidence' circumstantial at best.
Lets not make the same mistake with the environment and renewable fuels as was done with DDT. The banning of that product because a minority were abusing the substance resulted in the preventable deaths of half a billion people from malaria. All those lives lost were in sub-Saharan Africa. If we can't learn from the mistakes of history then we are doomed to repeat them.

[sonymaster101]

Finally. Someone told it for what it really is all about. Lobbyists. Money. OUR MONEY. Unless we want to pay 5 times more for grain, ethanol will never be a solution. the current input/output ratio of ethanol is 1/1.3, meaning you need one gallon of oil to make 1.3 gallons of ethanol. wow. americans really need to learn to get over their driving habits, AND convert to a diesel automotive fleet. Algea grown biodiesel is easily hundreds of times more efficient than corn ethanol. And guess what? when all the cars in the us run off corn, fuel will be 4 dollars a gallon. again.

Thank you for writing this article.

[mnmidnight]

Before someone starts ranting and raving about ethanol and food prices, you need to study the whole Ag subsidy industry/complex.


For example
1. Domestic sugar producer have got a law passed that 80% of he sugar used in the US must be grown in the US.
2. Check out how much money the sugar beet industry from a section of NW Minnesota spends lobbying Congress to keep out imported sugar and the price of US sugar high.
3.Since the price of sugar in the US is multiples of the world price, US food producers have replaced sugar with corn sweeter.
4. To verify this, go to your kitchen food shelves and the grocery store and see how many foods have corn syrup or fructose ( sugar from corn) in them.
5. It?s only in the last generation that fructose has replaced sugar.
6. Slowly reduce and then eliminate the subsidies for domestic sugar production and sugar imports.
7. The percentage of corn used as a sweeter will drop like a stone.
8. This will free up a large percentage of the US corn crop to be used for ethanol and animal feed which is what corn should be used for ( in my opinion)
9 . The price of food and ethanol will drop dramatically
10. The current process(es) for producing ethanol from corn are very energy and water intensive, there are new technologies being developed the use less energy and water to produce ethanol from corn and use plants ( ex switch grass) other than corn to produce ethanol.

As an aside, check and I think that you will find that allergies to corn is one of the fastest growing food allergies in the US because it is only recently that food producers have substituted corn for sugar. Which is a strong argument for advocating for the end of the protection of the domestic sugar industry. Plus we will put a lot of people in 3rd world countries to work.

Finally, I think most people realize that the current method(s) for producing ethanol are an interim or temporary solution to reducing out dependence on foreign oil.

So people should focus on:

A. What is the current subsidy for corn ethanol, is it permanent or temporary. What action can I personally take to see that the subsidy is not permanent.
B. What is the next technology for producing fuel from plants and how soon will it be here.
C. What is the subsidy for the next technology for converting plants to fuel and is it permanent or temporary

[Dango517]

What! The rise in food prices is due to last years drought undoubtedly caused by global warming. How can anyone with a straight face blame this on Ethanol. With all the tall talk, little if nothing has been done to up Ethanol usage since the 1980's. Have you considered that many of those that are starving maybe starving due to the effect of global warming that is already occurring. Average global temperatures have been rising since the advent of the automobile, wonder if there's a correlation. Think prices are high now just want till this years drought maybe that will make a believer out of you.