Comments on: Mozilla CEO says Apple's Safari auto-update 'wrong'

The Firefox browser is updated automatically, too. But that's different because people downloaded it on their own in the first place, says Mozilla chief John Lilly.

[whocaresaccount]

2 thumbs up

I'm for any entity that can rid the world of IE6 and get us all on
web 2.0 standards. That should be the issue. The internet is
completely held back by supporting the bugs in IE5 and IE6 and
my statistics show that 60% of the users are still using these
browsers. So I give Apple 2 thumbs up for jamming a better
browser down everyone's throat. FireFox should do the same
and force Microsoft to get their **** together. Most people never
upgrade to IE7 because of the whole "process" they put you
through. Apple at least knows how to make it easy.

[The Meddler]

Updating non-existing software

You can't talk about updating software when the original software is not on the system. I have never had iTunes or Safari on my system, but Apple wants to update Quicktime with them. That is plainly not an update.

[mavnu91]

I completely agree with Lilly

I've been ticked off at Apple for months for trying to get me to install iTunes when I upgrade QuickTime. I had no desire for iTunes on my system (my wife and I own non-iPod mp3 players) until my daughter finally pressured us into buying her an iPod.

Of course, then there's the annoying requests to upgrade to (i.e., pay for) QuickTime Pro every second or third time you try to play a QuickTime movie with the free player.

[JJ609]

If I wanted Safari I'd have a Mac

Because Apple has the world's ugliest software, bar none. And while I do have iTunes installed, Safari is no exception. I'm not even going to read all the pros and cons about this "update", I did it because I wanted to see what the software looked like, and to see if it's as fast as purported. Doesn't matter. I don't want to use anything as ugly as this on a daily basis, it's uglier than Opera.

When I first saw the update window I thought, boy is Apple getting sneaky. What's next? An "update" to their OSX? After all, if Macs are being built with "Intel inside", then why can't their whole OS work on a garden variety PC?

I'll keep iTunes, but I'm kicking Safari. I'm quite pleased with Firefox, although it has some youtube problems for which I have to use IE7, but between these 2 I'm covered.

[there can be only one]

Oh JJ609

You so crazy!!!!
World's Ugliest Software??
Shut your pie hole you moron.
You're an embarrassment to your randomly chosen profile name.

[Riquez-001]

This story is mis-informed

The program that is running on your PC is "Apple Software
Update" it is informing you that new Apple software is available.
In the list are all the latest versions of Apple Software available
for your computer.

People are confusing this with "Update iTunes only" - in that
case, I would expect only iTunes to be updated, but this is
different - its all Apple software updates.
Its the same program that runs on your Mac to let you know of
all available updates & its the same behavior as the one from
Microsoft that lets you know about Windows updates.

"Apple Software Update" is the standard program that lets you
know about new software, on Mac or PC. Each Apple Application
does not have its own separate update program, it runs from the
central program called "Apple Software Update"

If you want to disable the program "Apple software update" you
can do so in your scheduled tasks on Windows.

[JayMonster]

A for Effort, but still wrong

You are correct when you say it is Apple Update, and should Update any software on the system, including Safari, IF THE USER HAS IT ON THEIR SYSTEM. If they don't, well then it isn't really an UPDATE is it?

No matter how you try to shake it out, or twist it around, Apple tried to slide this one by, and on a good many systems, I'll bet it worked. (People SHOULD look before they install, but it is sadly apparent to anybody paying attention that a vast majority of the public does not).

People had FITS when Microsoft attempted to update users from IE 6 to IE 7, and those users had the software, so technically is WAS an update. Jobs gets away with a lot more since the Apple market share was (and is) minuscule. That does not in any way however, make it right.

[savagesteve13]

Safari isn't competing with Mozilla

Everybody wants a chunk of the IE pie, thank goodness there's yet another reason for someone to switch.

[JayMonster]

But Apple likes to think it is

Despite the fact that even on a Mac, Firefox is the better browser, Apple since the launch of the iPhone has apparently been overcome with delusions of grandeur when it comes to Safari.

[JayMonster]

But Microsoft did get bashed

First of all, Microsoft was sending IE 7 to PC running Windows XP. Those machines all already had IE 6 installed (Whether or not it was used is another issue, but it was installed), so by comparison Microsoft was updating their software.

That being said, more than enough people were quick to take Microsoft to task for including this as a "critical" update. So yes, Microsoft got bashed for it, and Apple more than deserves at least the same treatment (if not worse, since most PCs do NOT have Safari installed)

[JayMonster]

Not true

IE 7 was included as a "critical" update, but it was never "forced" I still have machines running with IE 6.

[Seaspray0]

bye bye quicktime.

Quicktime is now malware... a program that not only installs itself but will install other software you DID NOT WANT!

[zaznet]

Not a new trend...

If you have downloaded the QuickTime installer in the last 3 years it would have come bundled by default with Itunes. At one point it was actually very hard to find the stand alone installer that didn't bundle with other Apple products. Complaints have made sure that Apple provides a stand alone installer that is as easy to find as the bundled one.

No doubt, that will happen again with this new practice. You MUST pay attention to the customers, not just throw your software in front of them when they didn't ask for it.

[smiller987]

Uninstalled

Yes; my response to seeing Safari appear as an "update" was to uninstall QuickTime and iTunes. I believe that Apple calling this an update is a ridiculous misuse of the term, since I do not have any version of Safari to be updated.

[g15host]

Whiners

If the software download start acting in the background or do
something they did not state, like updates from many companies
like Sun, Norton or Real, then it is bad. But even if you've didn't
notice you've installed Safari, it DOES NOTHING until you open it.
And then it does not ask to be the default browser, unlike other
browsers. It's a lot less deceptive than the Firefox/Google
bundle. Apple has use the same update scheme on the Mac for
years, no different than Windows Update. I'm surprised Mozilla
CEO family does not use Linux, then they would not see Safari
offer at all.

[feranick]

Definition of update

"The act or an instance of bringing something up to date." So, even if transparent, why does Safari need to be under the "update list", even if it's not installed in first place? If I want Safari, I'll download it. If I don't, it means I don't want it. End of story. I don't really see what the other bundles have to do with it.

[clsmithj]

Mozilla: Apple's Safari auto-update 'Smart'

I believe Mozilla CEO is jealous that Firefox does not have any updating functionalities.

I am all forward free web browsers. I currently use IE7 and Opera 9.

I don't really like Firefox, I am disappointed that the Netscape browser is now officially dead.

I haven't tried Safari on Windows since the beta release.

[jaytee0]

You're completely wrong

Firefox DOES have an auto-update mechanism. What are you talking about?!

[chamber25]

Updater for new programs!

First of all It is Apple software update program we are talking about. My problem here is that it is not an Update if a person has never installed the program in the first place. So first to disguise the software in a updater hoping the that the less technically inclined people will just press install, is pretty bad. Then Apple goes as far as to assume that consumers will want anything they give, by defaulting yes in the check box. Then to top it off Apple will continue to badger you everytime you update if you dont download Safari.

I know people will say it's the peoples responsiblity to know what they are downloading but that is just not realistic. The truth is most people are not as technically savvy as the people posting here. Another truth is most people trust that what ever they get from Apple Software Update is integral to the Apple programs you already have. Maybe it is wrong for a person to trust a big company like Apple but isn't that what Apple has been trying to establish between it and its customers for years.

And really saying that other people do it, does not make it right.

[mikestatic1]

Too Microsoft-ish for me...

I am an rabid Apple user, but this smacks to me of Microsoft business practices. If you want to give people the OPTION, fine. If you are preselecting the installation, that is a giant step in the wrong direction - especially when the inferiority of the Safari browser is taken into account.

Bad move, Apple.

[eeee]

Pay Attention As If It was Your Dinner Plate !

--Some people are the world's most picky eaters and examine and sniff their food before they eat it in a restaurant or a diner: same tactics should apply to any downloads offered BY ANYONE!
---Stop all this uselss waste of energy whinning and moaning and spend the time paying attention to what tries to sneak in as an update
---TAKE OFF THE CHECK MARK ! DUH !

[bbneo2]

Firefox ~= Safari?

I've been using Firefox for several years, but I am planning to move away from the Windows/Vista platform soon. Downloading Safari would be a way to get an introduction to the Apple world.

I have been using Safari for less than a week, and it seems remarkably similar to Firefox. I haven't discovered any amazingly "unique" features yet. Tabs and menus work much the same, the bookmarks are a bit different, the bookmark toolbar is interesting, the fonts aren't as sharp on my Windows Vista PC.

Safari is nice, but not revolutionary.

[jaytee0]

Safari 3.1 doesn't come close to Firefox 3

nt

[www.hdgreetings.com]

Par for the course

This bait and switch has been done by so many companies, I guess the only difference is don't trust the tier 1 guys either.

We need some kind of "Do no Evil" certification that companies can display if they don't do this and 100 other things.

[ciparis]

John Lily should recuse himself

It doesn't really matter if he has a point or not; he's not the one to
be making it, especially using such presumptuous we-own-the-
moral-high-ground tone as that. It comes off as self-serving and
arrogant.

Both they and Apple are after the same thing on the PC: IE
switchers. He needs to let someone else make this case -- and they
need to try using a bit more tact.

[zaznet]

Sure...

He is self-serving, we all get that. But why would he just sit back and be quiet about a competitor jumping into his space the way that Apple has?

It's the same thing that we saw happen when IE was a labeled a "security update" by Microsoft for windows computers that didn't already have IE installed. Back then it was Netscape who complained and started to lose market share in the browser wars.

This is Browser Wars II and we are back into the trench warfare we saw years ago.

[jypeterson]

Safari takes my business = Apple is bad...

Just don't install it if you don't want it...

If you inadvertently install it, uninstall it.

If you install it without realizing, don't uninstall it, and blame Apple for being "anti competitive" with bad ethics, just shut up and point the blame to yourselves for not reading what you are doing.

Whiners...

[MrStuckless]

Google and Yahoo are even more guilty

I work in Tech support and the number of people that installed the
google taskbar or Yahoo taskbar with the pop-up blocker etc, by
mistake is enormous. This doesn't only happen with software
owned by the two companies. Totally unrelated software comes
with the install google toolbar or google desktop automatically
checked off. So I don't think Apple is a villain here at all. Mozilla
may be jealous... but there is nothing wrong done here.

[jumpjetta]

Safari is the root of all evil!

Safari destroyed my marriage! Safari caused me to default on my
mortgage payments! Safari caused global-warming! Safari killed
the Easter Bunny.