Comments on: Trial software trying PC users' patience

More and more PC real estate is up for sale to application vendors, and that can mean a slower box for consumers.

[Zymurgist]

Refuse pre-installed software.

In the past, there have been instances of
adware, spyware, and various other things
installed by vendors too. The solution? Buy the
computer without an OS pre-installed, and
install the operating-system(s) and
application(s) you want yourself.

OS and application installation can be time
consuming (particularly Windows, ugh!), but it's
otherwise straight-forward. And the benefit is
you get a lean system with just the bits you
want there.

[Razzl]

Some of you guys don't get out much

Some of you guys are tripping off these glib easy suggestions because you haven't been computer shopping in a while and aren't familiar with the current marketplace. If you're shopping in retail places like Best Buy or Circuit city you aren't going to find a pc without the os loaded; you aren't going to get a reinstall disc because that info is now embedded on your D: partition drive on the pc; if you send to the manufacturer for a backup disc it will have all the freeware junk on it; you won't be able to completely uninstall the freeware because much of it will be reconstituted at startup from hidden files; and if you try wiping your disc clean to start from scratch you will be screwed because some of your hardware will require newer drivers that aren't generic and aren't on standalone Windows discs. No, it isn't as simple as it was 5 years ago, and anyone who thinks it is can go shopping to prove it to yourselves...

[Zymurgist]

Refuse pre-installed software.

In the past, there have been instances of
adware, spyware, and various other things
installed by vendors too. The solution? Buy the
computer without an OS pre-installed, and
install the operating-system(s) and
application(s) you want yourself.

OS and application installation can be time
consuming (particularly Windows, ugh!), but it's
otherwise straight-forward. And the benefit is
you get a lean system with just the bits you
want there.

[Razzl]

Some of you guys don't get out much

Some of you guys are tripping off these glib easy suggestions because you haven't been computer shopping in a while and aren't familiar with the current marketplace. If you're shopping in retail places like Best Buy or Circuit city you aren't going to find a pc without the os loaded; you aren't going to get a reinstall disc because that info is now embedded on your D: partition drive on the pc; if you send to the manufacturer for a backup disc it will have all the freeware junk on it; you won't be able to completely uninstall the freeware because much of it will be reconstituted at startup from hidden files; and if you try wiping your disc clean to start from scratch you will be screwed because some of your hardware will require newer drivers that aren't generic and aren't on standalone Windows discs. No, it isn't as simple as it was 5 years ago, and anyone who thinks it is can go shopping to prove it to yourselves...

[Norseman]

Free PCs

With all the advertising that's being crammed into PCs, why not just let the advertisers subsidize the whole cost of the boxes and give the things away for free?

And people wonder why Macs cost less than PCs.

[Norseman]

Whoops

Make that "And people wonder why PCs cost less than Macs."

[Norseman]

Free PCs

With all the advertising that's being crammed into PCs, why not just let the advertisers subsidize the whole cost of the boxes and give the things away for free?

And people wonder why Macs cost less than PCs.

[Norseman]

Whoops

Make that "And people wonder why PCs cost less than Macs."

[gggg sssss]

Short memories - E Machines

Once upon a time there were e-machines - loaded with crapware. Supposed to be the new business model. Look where it got them. But maybe they patented this "business process" Now there is a thought. Release the lawyers. If not, I claim a patent pending.

[Pongidae]

Re: Short memories - E Machines ... actually

Yeah, what it got them was a Gateway buyout. They bought this little company to replace their once direct market giant. Boo-hoo how society turned on them for the use of crapware bloat, bull$#!t they did just fine and another company that was failing had to buy them to bolster their own failing business model. Here is an interesting take on the Gateway - eMachines buyout/merger. http://www.billpalmer.net/com000181.html

[byl01]

The self-restoring ball & chain

After a couple of years, my eTower (remember these?) became reeeeaaal sloooooowww. I went through the startup and service lists (under msconfig) and found all these quick-start, auto-update, etc. pieces from Real, QuickTime, Acrobat Reader - you name it. I unchecked them, and it was like getting a new PC. Trouble is, some of these ball-and-chain pieces re-enable themselves when you update the software. Hence - a background check :) and a restart or two whenever v.7.05.01 gets updated to v.7.05.02, which is pretty often.

[gggg sssss]

Short memories - E Machines

Once upon a time there were e-machines - loaded with crapware. Supposed to be the new business model. Look where it got them. But maybe they patented this "business process" Now there is a thought. Release the lawyers. If not, I claim a patent pending.

[Pongidae]

Re: Short memories - E Machines ... actually

Yeah, what it got them was a Gateway buyout. They bought this little company to replace their once direct market giant. Boo-hoo how society turned on them for the use of crapware bloat, bull$#!t they did just fine and another company that was failing had to buy them to bolster their own failing business model. Here is an interesting take on the Gateway - eMachines buyout/merger. http://www.billpalmer.net/com000181.html

[byl01]

The self-restoring ball & chain

After a couple of years, my eTower (remember these?) became reeeeaaal sloooooowww. I went through the startup and service lists (under msconfig) and found all these quick-start, auto-update, etc. pieces from Real, QuickTime, Acrobat Reader - you name it. I unchecked them, and it was like getting a new PC. Trouble is, some of these ball-and-chain pieces re-enable themselves when you update the software. Hence - a background check :) and a restart or two whenever v.7.05.01 gets updated to v.7.05.02, which is pretty often.

[Heebee Jeebies]

This is why....

You build your own computer that away you get to decide what crapware goes on it. In my case none.

I find it amazing how many companies feel that it is perfectly all right to high-jack some one elses computer and property.

What's next bumper stickers for companies on the rear of your new car?

Robert

[The user with no name]

well

I am sure that some people would be overjoyed to have a bumper sticker put on their car, or maybe even a few, if they were told that it would cut thousands of dollars of the price of their vehicle.

Heck you seem to forget that some people are selling their BODY SPACE for tattoos advertising casinos and whatnot!
lol

[slim-1]

True Build your Own

You will be much happier.

[Stan Kee]

Car Dealership

They already put the name of the car dealership on the back of the car you paid for. FREE ADVERTISEMENT.

[Heebee Jeebies]

This is why....

You build your own computer that away you get to decide what crapware goes on it. In my case none.

I find it amazing how many companies feel that it is perfectly all right to high-jack some one elses computer and property.

What's next bumper stickers for companies on the rear of your new car?

Robert

[The user with no name]

well

I am sure that some people would be overjoyed to have a bumper sticker put on their car, or maybe even a few, if they were told that it would cut thousands of dollars of the price of their vehicle.

Heck you seem to forget that some people are selling their BODY SPACE for tattoos advertising casinos and whatnot!
lol

[slim-1]

True Build your Own

You will be much happier.

[Stan Kee]

Car Dealership

They already put the name of the car dealership on the back of the car you paid for. FREE ADVERTISEMENT.

[aabcdefghij987654321]

What's needed is a better model

It does help reduce the cost of PCs if companies pay to have their software placed on them but it ought to be done differently than it is now.

The vendors shouldn't pre-install any extra software, instead they should provide an interview process where the user can run down a checklist of software that's available for installation and decide whether they want to install it or not. Once the user has made their choices then the software they chose could be installed and all the install packages removed to save the user's disk space.

Of course that's exactly what those vendors *don't* want.

The article also neglected to mention the other extremely bad habit of certain vendors, the "pre-load" our software background application (no thanks to MS who invented this bad idea). It seems the media players are the worst offenders, Quicktime and RealPlayer both have huge background applications that save you a half second of load time for viewing a video at the cost of many additional seconds of system boot time. Frankly I end up booting my systems a lot more often than I play a Quicktime or Realplayer file and you can bet I don't use either of those piggish and awkward applications to play videos, they both stink (in different ways). (For you iIdiots out there, Quicktime stinks because Apple tries to make it's application work like a Mac application instead of conforming to the standard Windows interface and conventions, that's every bit as wrong as if MS were to make MS Office for the Mac look and work like a Windows application).

[aabcdefghij987654321]

What's needed is a better model

It does help reduce the cost of PCs if companies pay to have their software placed on them but it ought to be done differently than it is now.

The vendors shouldn't pre-install any extra software, instead they should provide an interview process where the user can run down a checklist of software that's available for installation and decide whether they want to install it or not. Once the user has made their choices then the software they chose could be installed and all the install packages removed to save the user's disk space.

Of course that's exactly what those vendors *don't* want.

The article also neglected to mention the other extremely bad habit of certain vendors, the "pre-load" our software background application (no thanks to MS who invented this bad idea). It seems the media players are the worst offenders, Quicktime and RealPlayer both have huge background applications that save you a half second of load time for viewing a video at the cost of many additional seconds of system boot time. Frankly I end up booting my systems a lot more often than I play a Quicktime or Realplayer file and you can bet I don't use either of those piggish and awkward applications to play videos, they both stink (in different ways). (For you iIdiots out there, Quicktime stinks because Apple tries to make it's application work like a Mac application instead of conforming to the standard Windows interface and conventions, that's every bit as wrong as if MS were to make MS Office for the Mac look and work like a Windows application).

[Get_Bent]

Buy a new PC, break out the bucket and shovel

My company buys consumer PCs to save money. After the mail-in rebates (which are watched like a hawk), we end up with good machines for about $400 each.

The only drawback to this approach is that every PC carries a boatload of crapware installed at the factory. I spend an hour per machine just uninstalling the garbage, including the 30- or 60-day trial packages, to free up RAM and disk space. This also speeds up the machine by jettisoning the associated "drag anchors" that load at startup.

I know of very few people who actually _use_ any of the extraneous software. In the end, computer vendors are only wasting their money and time to install this junk on the machines.

[eBob1]

Faster Solution

Would it not be faster to simply wipe the hard drive and re-install Windows? Just get an OEM copy of the same version of Windows that was originally installed. If it is like most computers with XP pre-installed, it should install without asking for the license key. Download the drivers from the manufacturer's website. It should be much less painful than sitting in front of the computer and manually uninstalling each piece of unwanted software. If your company is just buying very basic machines, it is also possible to assemble your own for around $400 in parts. If you can get away without Windows, you can save about $90 by not buying the OEM license.

[Get_Bent]

Buy a new PC, break out the bucket and shovel

My company buys consumer PCs to save money. After the mail-in rebates (which are watched like a hawk), we end up with good machines for about $400 each.

The only drawback to this approach is that every PC carries a boatload of crapware installed at the factory. I spend an hour per machine just uninstalling the garbage, including the 30- or 60-day trial packages, to free up RAM and disk space. This also speeds up the machine by jettisoning the associated "drag anchors" that load at startup.

I know of very few people who actually _use_ any of the extraneous software. In the end, computer vendors are only wasting their money and time to install this junk on the machines.

[eBob1]

Faster Solution

Would it not be faster to simply wipe the hard drive and re-install Windows? Just get an OEM copy of the same version of Windows that was originally installed. If it is like most computers with XP pre-installed, it should install without asking for the license key. Download the drivers from the manufacturer's website. It should be much less painful than sitting in front of the computer and manually uninstalling each piece of unwanted software. If your company is just buying very basic machines, it is also possible to assemble your own for around $400 in parts. If you can get away without Windows, you can save about $90 by not buying the OEM license.

[gerhard_schroeder]

Carefully vet my ass

I recently bought a Dell. It was a good price - about $500, free shipping, included a flat screen, and fairly good specs.

I had the machine up and running within 10 minutes of getting the delivery. However, it took another 90 minutes to get all the garbage uninstalled.

One of the biggest offenders was Symantec. That bloated piece of cr@p had like 5 different auto-load applications, and all these "layers" to prevent you from removing it. I swear, it was worse than any virus I've ever seen. And totally useless also. A simple 50k Zone Alarm file and common sense makes it redundant.

If Dell truly does need to peddle this junk, at least they should make it easy for the consumer to wipe it.

[Mister C]

Yep!

I think you summed it up perfectly! Now, what are the chances anyone at Dell will listen?

[gerhard_schroeder]

Carefully vet my ass

I recently bought a Dell. It was a good price - about $500, free shipping, included a flat screen, and fairly good specs.

I had the machine up and running within 10 minutes of getting the delivery. However, it took another 90 minutes to get all the garbage uninstalled.

One of the biggest offenders was Symantec. That bloated piece of cr@p had like 5 different auto-load applications, and all these "layers" to prevent you from removing it. I swear, it was worse than any virus I've ever seen. And totally useless also. A simple 50k Zone Alarm file and common sense makes it redundant.

If Dell truly does need to peddle this junk, at least they should make it easy for the consumer to wipe it.

[Mister C]

Yep!

I think you summed it up perfectly! Now, what are the chances anyone at Dell will listen?

[Jeff Putz]

a:> format c:

This is precisely the reason I format every new laptop I buy as soon as I get it out of the box (except for my MacBook Pro, which was crap free). I'm just thankful that I have enough expertise to do this, as most people don't.

[Jeff Putz]

a:> format c:

This is precisely the reason I format every new laptop I buy as soon as I get it out of the box (except for my MacBook Pro, which was crap free). I'm just thankful that I have enough expertise to do this, as most people don't.

[jgemberton]

Recovery discs

I didn't mind so much in the a few years ago when the manufacturers provided an OS disc instead of the now, more common "recovery disc" as I would usually re-format the system and do a clean install, essentially re-moving all the bloat-ware. Now we're stuck with the recovery disc that simply replaces the bloat-ware. I just build my own now for that reason (amongst many others).

[jgemberton]

Recovery discs

I didn't mind so much in the a few years ago when the manufacturers provided an OS disc instead of the now, more common "recovery disc" as I would usually re-format the system and do a clean install, essentially re-moving all the bloat-ware. Now we're stuck with the recovery disc that simply replaces the bloat-ware. I just build my own now for that reason (amongst many others).

[d-R-k]

Alienware, how it should be

I nearly fainted when i saw my Sentia's Desktop. I was used to having lots of unwanted software pre-installed with my previous vendors.

Though i agree people need to make money, i still believe we need to have more of a choice on this. After all we're paying for a fast unbloated system, as i dont see anywhere in shops advertising some of the software pre-installed.

[d-R-k]

Alienware, how it should be

I nearly fainted when i saw my Sentia's Desktop. I was used to having lots of unwanted software pre-installed with my previous vendors.

Though i agree people need to make money, i still believe we need to have more of a choice on this. After all we're paying for a fast unbloated system, as i dont see anywhere in shops advertising some of the software pre-installed.