Comments on: Vista draining laptop batteries, patience

Microsoft's attempt to improve power management in Windows Vista hasn't made up for the pretty but power-hungry Aero interface, causing battery life to suffer.

[MSSlayer]

MS engineering at its finest

My laptop has dual boot XP/openSUSE. OpenSuSE has all the bells and whistles, and then some, of Vista.

My battery lasts twice as long in Linux as it does in XP.

I shudder to think how quickly that bloated monstrosity known as Vista would drain the battery.

[Thomas, David]

DOH!

eom

[open-mind]

Aero vs Aqua

OK, so Microsoft has Aero and Apple has Aqua. Both offer
similar eye candy ... shadowed windows, translucency, glassy
buttons, window animations, etc. And both OS X and Vista have
many similar features now.


So why does Aero need such a power hungry GPU while Aqua
works well even on old used hardware with relatively slow GPUs?

For example, a friend of mine recently bought his first Mac, a
used $200 G4 Mac tower running the latest OS X. There are tons
of them on ebay. He said it runs Aqua way better than he
expected, and he loves it. His frame of reference is Windows,
since he's only owned Windows machines since about 1990.

[bluvg]

Because they are not the same

First, "Aqua" is an umbrella term that covers many technologies that have been introduced and have evolved over time--they certainly weren't all there in OS X 10.0. In OS X 10.4, Quartz 2D Extreme is not enabled by default because it still has issues (it apparently will be enabled on 10.5). Since Aero already performs the function that Quartz 2D Extreme will perform for Aqua, from a checklist standpoint (not to mention from an architectural standpoint), Aero is more advanced than Aqua. If you take a look at the requirements for Quartz 2D Extreme, they are far greater than that of the standard 10.4 requirements.

Even now, if you look at the required specs, they aren't much different. Vista "requires" 128 MB of VRAM... but that can be shared RAM (as in the case of integrated graphics solutions). At some point, both Aero and Aqua are dealing with the same issue--they need to store windows in memory. At 1920x1200 resolution and 32-bit color depth, that's over 9 MB per full-screen window. Neither OS can perform magic--if those windows are going to be buffered, there are only so many places they can go (first in VRAM, next in system RAM, then--gulp--to disk). In terms of GPU utilization, neither Aero or Aqua is very taxing on a modern GPU.

As with most sets of "required" specs, they aren't so much a hard lower limit as they are a satisfactory performance bar based on what the system is doing. Aero is doing more than Aqua, and thus requires more. Keep in mind that Aero represents a graphics platform/subsystem, not just a look and feel... comparing superficial details such as "shadowed windows, translucency, glassy buttons, window animations, etc." is just that--a superficial comparison. Dig deeper, and you will find that they are definitely not the same. We are only beginning to see what Aero can do--take a look at the coming Vista-specific version of Yahoo Messenger to get an early idea.

[Win NT User]

Its Windows NT 6 and aero is optional

Before we get to Aero issues, forget for a moment all the marketing things like the name Vista - I find Windows NT 6-Home Basic to be a major improvement in many ways over Windows NT 5.1, the latter known as XP. The improvements are under the hood, in file searching, other aspects of file management, and simply how it feels to use it. Merely realizing that Vista is a nice new version of NT can put this in perspective - its not a new sports car its an OS, but it is a major improvement over the previous version.

I run the Basic version on a notebook (that is NOT Premium-capable) and the only thing I really needed to add was 512 MB more RAM (which nowadays is not so expensive) and the performance is just fine.

At home on the more hardware-endowed (but by no means premium) desktop is the Home Premium version of Windows NT 6. I like the aesthetics of Aeroglass and it does also offer some file viewing advantages, but I have learned by using both versions that Aeroglass is NOT what draws me to the new OS even though Aero, thumbnails and the rest are nice.

And about the notebook, if I had Home Premium on that I would only turn on Aero while on AC power. The Basic interface works just fine for most work tasks.

Most people doing real work on a notebook under battery power are writing or manipulating data. Writing is about content not formatting, which can always be added later. You can even do lots of work in notepad and later on paste it into Word and format it. You dont need much horsepower to run notepad just like it takes less when you turn off Aero. Almost all of the work a processor (CPU or GPU) does nowadays is devoted to the interface and other graphics.

[hateislov]

Its always the same...........

Seems like the same excuse when dealing with Vista,

"said Richard Shim, an analyst with IDC. "When you look at a new operating system, battery life tends to be worse. When Windows XP came out, that was true, and when Windows 98 came out, that was true."

Say something negative about the OS and this is said over and over....it was the same way with blah blah blah.

What a headache.

[ZeroJCF]

WANTED: Talented Engineers

Location: Microsoft
Who would of thought they would do MistakeEdition all over
again....

[genotypewriter]

No! We need smarter users!

Everyone's so quick to blame Microsoft for everything but if it weren't for them, only nerds will be using computers right now.

Microsoft has taken the challenge of bringing everyday idiots to computers... in doing so they might have sabotaged themselves in some ways but it's still the greatest achievement! But selfish, illiterate, small-minded everyday people can't make sense of this.

[alanmalm]

WANTED: Talented Engineers

Anyone saying things like this has obviously never programmed anything before (let alone an operating system used by millions of people worldwide).

If you can do any better, feel free! If not, please keep your negative comments to yourself.....

[ggordonliddy]

Aero is garbage

You have to be a complete moron to use Aero. Why not just switch to a Mac while you're at it. Who could be stupid enough to enjoy looking at the ridiculous highlights put on all window edges, etc... Windows Classic mode is far better.

[Gunady]

Disagree

Aero is a very pretty look of OS. I cannot say that it's better than Mac, but it certainly put windows on one of the better graphic OS, and most of the end users I know (non techie), quite amazed of Windows Aero.

[chichimecca]

well same problem vista,battery conflict

i just bought a dell inspiron 1720 and burns the battery like there was no tomorrow, what can we do?

[LCDMan]

Battery Life Really Important?

Our company and employees just rarely use a battery for any extended period of time.

Years ago we were concerned with battery life but that has changed with power sources available on planes, airports, car adapters and other places.

I really think the only ones that should be concerned about battery life would be tablet users.

[Ngallendou]

And to us in the 'developing' world where...

... electrical blackouts remain a near-daily reality. Battery life alone often saves the day and gets the work done. Oh, there is still not enough battery life for cross-country train and plane trips.

[RompStar_420]

Vista suck big fat donkey!!!

I hate it, no more OSes from crappy MS. OS X all the way baby, I
love my G5 that I have owned for the past 2 years and my next
computer will be the next generation Power Macs and for the wife a
laptop.

F!@@# Microsoft, I hate them.

[Hardrada]

DRM *WILL* drain power, cpu cycles

because it takes time to prevent you from being the owner of the device.

[su_do]

Unefficient processing

with all the fancifully extras, means more backend processing, means my battery will drain up faster.

[Llib Setag]

Why Vista OS at all?

If you have to ( or want to ) shut off all the "features" of the new
& improved VISTA OS just to make it work efficiently or to be
more convenient for you as a computer user...

then why spend all that time & money to upgrade or buy Vista
OS at all?

Seems to me that you would be better off sticking to Win XP...

[jleemc44]

Choice

Your acting as if people have a choice as to what OS they get when buying a PC these days. For the most part, vista is going to be loaded on most PC you find in the store.

[StargateFan]

Agreeded That this Is A Problem But...

Since when has any version of Windows been fantastic right from release. Don't get me wrong I love XP just as much as the next guy, but even so when you think about with the software base that Microsoft is accounting for they are bound to make a few short comings in their software. Frankly it is not like a hardware company where the pc is made for you and only you Windows is built for 80 +% of the pc world. That's a lot of people.

Honestly is it annoying, yes Microsoft should have things like laptop battery consumption down correctly. But it's not like this can not be fixed with a Service Pack. Just because battery power consumption on Vista sucks does not mean that the OS sucks and that it should be dropped. It was just released a few months back give it some time to mature, give Microsoft some time to get comfortable with the OS being used by users.

However I do feel that battery life and battery technology is general needs to imporve as well as software utiilization of that battery power. I also would like to point out that you don't need to have sub processes like Aero running, you can shut it off. As well as other behind the scenes operations such as file indexing, or readyboost. Just be aware that shutting things off sacrafices functionality, shutting off file indexing will not permit search to run.

Bottom line, give it some time. It will eventually all work out with updates.

[MSSlayer]

really?

"Since when has any version of Windows been fantastic right from release."

has any Windows version ever been fantastic?

[Llib Setag]

Give Vista OS some time...

Right...
SIX YEARS & BILLIONS in man hours + R&D development,
trashing, starting over, delays, delays, delays, rename,
regrouping & doing this OS over & over & over again...

This is the best & most secure OS we've ever made...Citizen
Gates.

PLUS it's MICROSOFT PEOPLE...
You know, the monopoly with the huge brain trust & wallets &
best employees ever assimulated into the mega-collective MS
BORG ever known to man.

IF they cannot put out a good product that WORKS they way
they've advertised & promised people for six years ( instead of a
half-baked BETA OS that will need endless service packs to "fix
the bugs") then they do not deserve the monopoly that they have
illegally gained throughout the world ( per the US DOJ & EU
investigations & compliance mandates).

PC users are so used to have inferior products as the norm that
they expect this to be the normal day to day computing
experience...WRONG!

Thank God that MS does not make autos or jets or military
devices that would work as well as any MS-OS has throughout
their history of crime & deception....(yet)

But they are expanding into robot design & production with AI in
the future...God help us all.

This is how the Matrix, the Robot Clone Wars & the Borg started.

[Thomas, David]

You know what, You could Not be More Wrong!

My clients will not allow me to ship, or install ANYTHING they don't
consider 100%. People do not accept this constant, inexcusable
flood of bad solutions, or products in the rest of their lives. What
asteroid smashed into this planet, and suddenly the ONLY piece of
crap we always put up with is Microsofts incomplete, not fully
tested, poorly documented, corner painting software!! WHY
DAMNIT WHY!

[Ian Joyner]

Aero takes the puff out of PC

Can't wait to see the Mac vs PC ad on this: PC with air pipes all over
him still out of breath while Mac walks effortlessly on water (aqua)!

[BrianFH]

Live TV

Don't know if this will drain your battery or brain faster, but anyone who wants to try the new free TV beta from JOOST, email me for an invite, at this address:
brianfh01 @ yahoo dot ca

There are about 150 channels so far, with more coming. Heavy on the sports, music, documentary, etc. right now, but news and other categories are building fast. Minimums are XP, 500MHz, 500MB RAM, hi-speed lite, and 48MB video.

[OffBeatMammal]

luckily someone bothered to fix it...

Clint got fed up with the *******' and produced a neat little app to make the problem go away - have a look here for the app (and source) http://betterthaneveryone.com/?p=517
I tweaked it a little to add an easy on/off switch for aero at any time - until Clint integrates the changes it's available at http://blog.offbeatmammal.com/blogs/obm/archive/2007/05/09/better-battery-life.aspx

[starwarstrio]

Batteries Don't Last

After making sure the battery was fully charged, and using it only to surf the net...and had it on 'Power Save', and on lowest settings..it was ridiculous. I barely got an hour, barley.

[21stcs]

Solution to Vista problem...

Sadly, after you make sure that your laptop is Vista Capable, then waiting months for the free upgrade you find that you simply don't have enough juice to enjoy Vista for any length of time. The solution should be to uninstall vista and go back to XP, but once again Microsoft has sucked us so far in that instead we look for ways to improve our battery or upgrade our laptop.

[Amer Jarrar]

Welcome to Microsoft !

From the time they did the firs webcast, i knew that this problem will happen, The problem is that companies have been enhancing the user experience in all means from graphics and more powerful hardware, but on avg. battery capacity and types didn't progress and improve at the same pace, and thats whats leading to the current situation, New battery types have to be developed as soon as possible to try to catch the hardware and software progress. Microsoft should be a little more transparent with the world. especially in their webcasts.

[tobarra]

Please look this two Sony laptops features, both are the same hardware machine, only the Operating System is diferent:

Vista: http://vaio.sony.es/view/ShowProduct.action?product=VGN-SZ4MN%2FB&productFilters=retired&site=voe_es_ES_cons&pageType=Overview&category=VN+SZ+Series

XP: http://vaio.sony.es/view/ShowProduct.action?product=VGN-SZ2XP%2FC&productFilters=retired&site=voe_es_ES_cons&pageType=Overview&category=VN+SZ+Series

Both have the same battery model.

Windows Vista realy eat battery!!!!