Comments on: TV industry frets over high definition

High-definition gear doesn't come cheap. And that's just one of the things clouding the HD picture for broadcasters.

[byl01]

The $64,000 chicken-or-egg question

If a $250 camcorder can have both digital (500-530 lines) and analog video out, adding a converter to an existing system cannot be THAT hard - technically. It's mostly a matter of logistics - of getting enough paying customers for the economy of scale to kick in. So there's been this chicken-or-egg situation for the last 10 years or so: who has to switch first - consumers or TV stations? And, since the law originally mandated the switch AFTER a certain percentage of consumers bought digital eqiupment (that's right, we were supposed to buy digital equipment in advance and marinate it...), it's a miracle we're finally making this switch.

[byl01]

The $64,000 chicken-or-egg question

If a $250 camcorder can have both digital (500-530 lines) and analog video out, adding a converter to an existing system cannot be THAT hard - technically. It's mostly a matter of logistics - of getting enough paying customers for the economy of scale to kick in. So there's been this chicken-or-egg situation for the last 10 years or so: who has to switch first - consumers or TV stations? And, since the law originally mandated the switch AFTER a certain percentage of consumers bought digital eqiupment (that's right, we were supposed to buy digital equipment in advance and marinate it...), it's a miracle we're finally making this switch.

[JJIndy]

HD

Wow, you would think people would do a bit more research before
writing a piece like this, guess not. On the Mac even the FREE
applications iMovie and iDVD are fully HD functional. The only real
issue is when the cost of HD cameras will get down low enough to
let the average person use them.

[saz4landl]

HD

That's why small production companies like mine or those we hire to do our films have been renting digital equipment for each job for a long time. Doing it for HD will be a logical next step.

[saz4landl]

HD

That's why small production companies like mine or those we hire to do our films have been renting digital equipment for each job for a long time. Doing it for HD will be a logical next step.

[fakespam]

HDTV folly

I think the forced switch is going to blow-up in their faces.

try to convince many people to switch who's concept of a TV is to
last 30 to 50 yrs.

we'll see

[fakespam]

HDTV folly

I think the forced switch is going to blow-up in their faces.

try to convince many people to switch who's concept of a TV is to
last 30 to 50 yrs.

we'll see

[nfildes]

dtv -vs- hdtv! You missed a key detail!

the fcc mandate is for digital mode broadcasting. nobody is REQUIRING hdtv, although it may make a big impact on viewership, but that is a competitive matter not a government mandate!

[nfildes]

dtv -vs- hdtv! You missed a key detail!

the fcc mandate is for digital mode broadcasting. nobody is REQUIRING hdtv, although it may make a big impact on viewership, but that is a competitive matter not a government mandate!

[tanis143]

About time

Well, I'll be the first to say its about time that broadcasters switched to a digital signal vs an analog one. For one, it takes up less space. One digital channel bandwidth can hold up to 12 channels vs 1 channel in an analog channel bandwidth. Also, for the consumer, the picture has less distortion than analog, its either there or its not.

I work for my local cable company and we will dance in the streets when the analog channel bandwidth is gone. This means we'll have less ingress on our cable lines (normally from customers using sub-par quality cable while doing their own cable outlets and squirel chewwing on our lines) and less problems with our products.

I believe with the monetary concerns aside, most people (both consumers and broadcasters) are afraid of is spending all this money to go HD and/or digital, only to find 5 years down the road something newer comes along and the need to upgrade again. I bet the same thing happend when the switch from b/w sets to color happend.

[baswwe]

BOOST THE SIGNAL MAN

not enough boost on the signal

[ddesy]

Really?

You say, "Also, for the consumer, the picture has less distortion than analog." That really depends on the signal level.

Given a good strong analog signal, you get a clear picture with no macroblocking or other artifacting. Given a weak signal, you get a poor picture, but still no macroblocking or other artifacting.

Given a good strong compressed digital signal, you get a relatively clear picture with both macroblocking and other artifacting. Given a weak signal, you get a relatively clear picture unless the signal fades... then you don't get any picture.

[markdoiron]

About B/W-Color Transition

"I bet the same thing happend when the switch from b/w sets to color happend."

the benefits of color TV over B/W were obvious to virtually everyone. Not so with HDTV. Most folks who have an HD set think they're watching HD when, indeed, they aren't, either because they don't have HD content or because they don't have a fully HD system. On top of that, more and more anecdotal evidence is suggesting that HD is best for sets that are 42" or larger--much larger than most homes need for a typical living room. So, comparing the benefits of upgrading to HD from standard def TV to the transition from B/W to color TV is really inappropriate. A better one would be the transition from CD to . . . what were those new, killer formats? Oh yeah, SACD and DVD-Audio--also rans.

mark d.

[tanis143]

About time

Well, I'll be the first to say its about time that broadcasters switched to a digital signal vs an analog one. For one, it takes up less space. One digital channel bandwidth can hold up to 12 channels vs 1 channel in an analog channel bandwidth. Also, for the consumer, the picture has less distortion than analog, its either there or its not.

I work for my local cable company and we will dance in the streets when the analog channel bandwidth is gone. This means we'll have less ingress on our cable lines (normally from customers using sub-par quality cable while doing their own cable outlets and squirel chewwing on our lines) and less problems with our products.

I believe with the monetary concerns aside, most people (both consumers and broadcasters) are afraid of is spending all this money to go HD and/or digital, only to find 5 years down the road something newer comes along and the need to upgrade again. I bet the same thing happend when the switch from b/w sets to color happend.

[ddesy]

Really?

You say, "Also, for the consumer, the picture has less distortion than analog." That really depends on the signal level.

Given a good strong analog signal, you get a clear picture with no macroblocking or other artifacting. Given a weak signal, you get a poor picture, but still no macroblocking or other artifacting.

Given a good strong compressed digital signal, you get a relatively clear picture with both macroblocking and other artifacting. Given a weak signal, you get a relatively clear picture unless the signal fades... then you don't get any picture.

[markdoiron]

About B/W-Color Transition

"I bet the same thing happend when the switch from b/w sets to color happend."

the benefits of color TV over B/W were obvious to virtually everyone. Not so with HDTV. Most folks who have an HD set think they're watching HD when, indeed, they aren't, either because they don't have HD content or because they don't have a fully HD system. On top of that, more and more anecdotal evidence is suggesting that HD is best for sets that are 42" or larger--much larger than most homes need for a typical living room. So, comparing the benefits of upgrading to HD from standard def TV to the transition from B/W to color TV is really inappropriate. A better one would be the transition from CD to . . . what were those new, killer formats? Oh yeah, SACD and DVD-Audio--also rans.

mark d.

[baswwe]

BOOST THE SIGNAL MAN

not enough boost on the signal

[punterjoe]

digital definitely, hd? eh. (shrug)

Most people think their 480i DVDs are HD. IMO, stations don't need to sweat the transition aside from the ATSC transmission. Put out a 16x9 480i signal & the vast majority of people will think they're getting hi-def. And you'll also avoid that annoying side effect of 1080i programs switching to 480 commercials and the dreaded 'digital postage stamp' (4X3pillarbox within a 16x9letterbox on some display).
I'm not saying don't transition to HD, but it buys time for a gradual, affordable transition since most viewers likely will not notice the difference.

[punterjoe]

digital definitely, hd? eh. (shrug)

Most people think their 480i DVDs are HD. IMO, stations don't need to sweat the transition aside from the ATSC transmission. Put out a 16x9 480i signal & the vast majority of people will think they're getting hi-def. And you'll also avoid that annoying side effect of 1080i programs switching to 480 commercials and the dreaded 'digital postage stamp' (4X3pillarbox within a 16x9letterbox on some display).
I'm not saying don't transition to HD, but it buys time for a gradual, affordable transition since most viewers likely will not notice the difference.

[rcbrooks]

out of date

I can't believe the comments re Hd TV, especially from net users who are usually early adoptors. I'm probably older than most of you but I have a 57" screen. and believe me analog tv looks lousy on it. Maybe all you folks want to watch tv on your cell phones but there are a lot of us who want a big picture. You haven't even mentioned sports on ESPNHD or over the air.
I watched the bowl games and the superbowl on HDTV and they were stunning. The networks have already made the investment in cameras.

[rcbrooks]

out of date

I can't believe the comments re Hd TV, especially from net users who are usually early adoptors. I'm probably older than most of you but I have a 57" screen. and believe me analog tv looks lousy on it. Maybe all you folks want to watch tv on your cell phones but there are a lot of us who want a big picture. You haven't even mentioned sports on ESPNHD or over the air.
I watched the bowl games and the superbowl on HDTV and they were stunning. The networks have already made the investment in cameras.

[Joe Blow]

What About All The D/A STBs That People Will Need to Buy ...

who aren't going to go HD Anytime Soon? Where is the story about how broadcast-only consumers (i.e., not on digital cable or satellite) are going to take it in the shorts when _they_ are going to have to go out and buy a set-top box by February 2009 to convert all those lovely new ATSC signals to the NTSC (Never The Same Color :) garbage that their existing TV sets can only receive, and that they've come to know and love/hate over the last 60+ years? Have any of the prospective manufacturers of these STBs said how much they're going to cost, what the forecast demand is expected to be, and how many food stamps are expected to be traded for them for the "needy" who just have to be able to watch soap operas, game shows, "reality" TV, overpaid jocks molesting each other (sports _and_ DJs/VJs ;) ) etc.? Will there be yet-another government give-away program that lines the pockets of the industry and placates people who are too lazy to improve themselves so that they can pay the freight, like everyone else (I'm not talking about the few who have genuine debilitations, but those who think they're entitled to something, just because everyone else has it)?

How about it, C|Net, where is this story at NAB?

All the Best,
Joe Blow

P.S.: I don't even want to think about who's going to have to explain to D/A STB users how the remote control that comes with it can't operate the mechanical volume control and on/off switch on their 1949 Philco B&W TV.

[Joe Blow]

What About All The D/A STBs That People Will Need to Buy ...

who aren't going to go HD Anytime Soon? Where is the story about how broadcast-only consumers (i.e., not on digital cable or satellite) are going to take it in the shorts when _they_ are going to have to go out and buy a set-top box by February 2009 to convert all those lovely new ATSC signals to the NTSC (Never The Same Color :) garbage that their existing TV sets can only receive, and that they've come to know and love/hate over the last 60+ years? Have any of the prospective manufacturers of these STBs said how much they're going to cost, what the forecast demand is expected to be, and how many food stamps are expected to be traded for them for the "needy" who just have to be able to watch soap operas, game shows, "reality" TV, overpaid jocks molesting each other (sports _and_ DJs/VJs ;) ) etc.? Will there be yet-another government give-away program that lines the pockets of the industry and placates people who are too lazy to improve themselves so that they can pay the freight, like everyone else (I'm not talking about the few who have genuine debilitations, but those who think they're entitled to something, just because everyone else has it)?

How about it, C|Net, where is this story at NAB?

All the Best,
Joe Blow

P.S.: I don't even want to think about who's going to have to explain to D/A STB users how the remote control that comes with it can't operate the mechanical volume control and on/off switch on their 1949 Philco B&W TV.

[vminvic]

cart before horse

Time to get some horses !

Almost everyone I speak to has an HDTV capable set, yet have little or no access to HDTV signal source. Yes they regret it ! Some don't realize just how much of an improvement it will be, but would opt for it if given choice.

I have not yet bought a set, because I see no point, if I can't get a better picture than I have due to abscence of HDTV format video. If broadcasters see no advantage, perhaps equipment manufacturers should take the lead and offer inducements, to get format in use, so that they can get new customers like myself. I am sure that we number in the tens of millions !

[fakespam]

upconvert

i'm glad my LD player has a comb filter and component out (set me
back with import duties to $3800 two years ago)

i'm also glad my DVR Cox Cable box upconverts everything to
1080i, so things look really clear and good, not blurry like it was
before I installed the DVR box.

but this small post hits on a point, and people like the rest of my
family and friends see no need for HDTV, or DTV for that matter

[vminvic]

cart before horse

Time to get some horses !

Almost everyone I speak to has an HDTV capable set, yet have little or no access to HDTV signal source. Yes they regret it ! Some don't realize just how much of an improvement it will be, but would opt for it if given choice.

I have not yet bought a set, because I see no point, if I can't get a better picture than I have due to abscence of HDTV format video. If broadcasters see no advantage, perhaps equipment manufacturers should take the lead and offer inducements, to get format in use, so that they can get new customers like myself. I am sure that we number in the tens of millions !

[fakespam]

upconvert

i'm glad my LD player has a comb filter and component out (set me
back with import duties to $3800 two years ago)

i'm also glad my DVR Cox Cable box upconverts everything to
1080i, so things look really clear and good, not blurry like it was
before I installed the DVR box.

but this small post hits on a point, and people like the rest of my
family and friends see no need for HDTV, or DTV for that matter

[Michael Arnold]

Waiting

I'm usually always for a better picture, new tech, etc... But as a
former longtime broadcast employee and tech ops person. But,
I'm sitting this out for several more years until things settle
down. I just can't spend big money to see what's on commercial
TV ? especially any newscast along with the usual fare they serve
up. Same goes for my small production company.

There probabaly won't be enough outstanding material on
commercial tv anyway... much of the new "space" will be eaten
up with the other "sub" channels, leaving little for HDTV.

I think this "switch" is gonna take a lot longer than they're
predicting.

As for now, I'll continue to take to the local theaters for anything
that needs the big screen experience and stay with my
(standard) 32" set. (And I watch THAT less and less as each day
passes.

When things settle down.. and I mean settle down, I'll buy the
BIG set. Until that day comes (if ever) I'll pass on the hype.