Comments on: Cingular accused of duping ex-AT&T subscribers

Lawsuit says wireless carrier degraded service, commanded fees after 2004 acquisition. Company disputes those claims.

[john55440]

Both T-Mobile and Verison are Better

If memory serves, even before the merger both Cingular and AT&T wireless had poor satisfaction ratings.

The two best are T-Mobile and Verison. (I have T-Mobile.)

[chuck_whealton]

Re: Both T-Mobile and Verizon are Better

At least T-Mobile (currently) enables the Bluetooth Object
Exchange profiles in their phones - correct me if this has
changed - and doesn't try and screw you over for every last
photo you take by forcing you to send it over their network.

Other carriers aren't quite so "generous" in what they "allow" you
to do with your OWN camera photos.

I like T-Mobile. Unfortunately, their signal coverage just isn't
where I'd like it to be yet. If/when it gets there, I'll definately
consider them.

Charles R. Whealton
Chuck Whealton @ pleasedontspam.com

[john55440]

Both T-Mobile and Verison are Better

If memory serves, even before the merger both Cingular and AT&T wireless had poor satisfaction ratings.

The two best are T-Mobile and Verison. (I have T-Mobile.)

[chuck_whealton]

Re: Both T-Mobile and Verizon are Better

At least T-Mobile (currently) enables the Bluetooth Object
Exchange profiles in their phones - correct me if this has
changed - and doesn't try and screw you over for every last
photo you take by forcing you to send it over their network.

Other carriers aren't quite so "generous" in what they "allow" you
to do with your OWN camera photos.

I like T-Mobile. Unfortunately, their signal coverage just isn't
where I'd like it to be yet. If/when it gets there, I'll definately
consider them.

Charles R. Whealton
Chuck Whealton @ pleasedontspam.com

[kidboodah]

What a load of crap

I'm sorry, but every argument they make is a big load of crap. The $18 fee was never a "transfer fee" - it was a upgrade processing fee that Cingular charges every customer, just like AT&T Wireless charged their customers $15 to upgrade their phone. Most wireless companies charge such fees. As far as the early termination fees, once a customer was migrated over to Cingular - if they cancelled within the 30 day return policy, they weren't charged a early termination fees, mainly due to technical limitations and the separation between the two customer care units. The "degradation" of service was not due to the merger, but actually a continuation of AT&T's movement to shove people off of the TDMA network, which they haven't built out since 1998 - nothing to do with the merger...they just happened to occur at the same time. The only arguments that could even come close to being supported: 1.Cingular requiring people to purchase new phones - though Cingular has always given people the option to use unlocked GSM phones purchased somewhere else. and 2. Requiring a move to a "less favorable" plan - which was unfavorable mainly due to the fact that towards the end of its life, ATTWS was giving away the farm trying to keep its customers from jumping ship and scuttling the merger.

[lampietheclown]

Do you have to have your own shovel...?

... Or did Cingular give you one when they hired you? You're
slinging quite a big load of crap yourself.

Yes At&t charged me $15. I upgraded to an expensive Bluetooth
GSM phone. Now tell me, what was Cingular's $18 upgrading
me to? I already had a GSM phone. Cingular wanted me to toss
it in the trash, buy another one just like it, and pay them
because it's an upgrade?
Not bloody likely!
The only reason my GSM phone would not work with Cingular's
network is that they refused to give me a sim card for it. They
said I had to buy another new phone, and sign a new contract,
and pay an $18 fee, and loose the great contract I already had.

As far as the 30 day cancellation loophole you mentioned, was
that posted on the website? Was that something that customer
service would point out to customers when they switched? No.
It was a little known loophole, and when I heard about it on
these forums, I called Cingular and asked if it was true. They
said it was not. I guess they were lying?

The degradation of service was obvious to me on my GSM
phone, and the whole TDMA argument is a red herring. AT&T
had switched most of it's customers over to GSM long before the
merger.
Cingular sold off some of the AT&T towers, and let the leases
run out on some towers that AT&T didn't own. On the ones they
still have, they are moving the control signal from 1900 MHz to
850MHz, which effects AT&T's mostly 1900 MHz network in a
bad way while strengthening Cingular's mostly 850 MHz
network. See? No TDMA involved.

As for AT&T selling the farm, I'm sure you are correct. If
Cingular thinks my contract is losing them money, they are free
to cancel it, and I'll get my service somewhere else. The thing is,
they won't cancel it, or hold up their end of it, but if I cancel it, it
will cost me $175.00
I didn't choose Cingular. They bought my contract. They have
no right to whine about it not being a good deal for them or
having to hold up their end of it.
Kid, I think your boodah has lost it's Mojo.


LampieTheClown

[kidboodah]

What a load of crap

I'm sorry, but every argument they make is a big load of crap. The $18 fee was never a "transfer fee" - it was a upgrade processing fee that Cingular charges every customer, just like AT&T Wireless charged their customers $15 to upgrade their phone. Most wireless companies charge such fees. As far as the early termination fees, once a customer was migrated over to Cingular - if they cancelled within the 30 day return policy, they weren't charged a early termination fees, mainly due to technical limitations and the separation between the two customer care units. The "degradation" of service was not due to the merger, but actually a continuation of AT&T's movement to shove people off of the TDMA network, which they haven't built out since 1998 - nothing to do with the merger...they just happened to occur at the same time. The only arguments that could even come close to being supported: 1.Cingular requiring people to purchase new phones - though Cingular has always given people the option to use unlocked GSM phones purchased somewhere else. and 2. Requiring a move to a "less favorable" plan - which was unfavorable mainly due to the fact that towards the end of its life, ATTWS was giving away the farm trying to keep its customers from jumping ship and scuttling the merger.

[lampietheclown]

Do you have to have your own shovel...?

... Or did Cingular give you one when they hired you? You're
slinging quite a big load of crap yourself.

Yes At&t charged me $15. I upgraded to an expensive Bluetooth
GSM phone. Now tell me, what was Cingular's $18 upgrading
me to? I already had a GSM phone. Cingular wanted me to toss
it in the trash, buy another one just like it, and pay them
because it's an upgrade?
Not bloody likely!
The only reason my GSM phone would not work with Cingular's
network is that they refused to give me a sim card for it. They
said I had to buy another new phone, and sign a new contract,
and pay an $18 fee, and loose the great contract I already had.

As far as the 30 day cancellation loophole you mentioned, was
that posted on the website? Was that something that customer
service would point out to customers when they switched? No.
It was a little known loophole, and when I heard about it on
these forums, I called Cingular and asked if it was true. They
said it was not. I guess they were lying?

The degradation of service was obvious to me on my GSM
phone, and the whole TDMA argument is a red herring. AT&T
had switched most of it's customers over to GSM long before the
merger.
Cingular sold off some of the AT&T towers, and let the leases
run out on some towers that AT&T didn't own. On the ones they
still have, they are moving the control signal from 1900 MHz to
850MHz, which effects AT&T's mostly 1900 MHz network in a
bad way while strengthening Cingular's mostly 850 MHz
network. See? No TDMA involved.

As for AT&T selling the farm, I'm sure you are correct. If
Cingular thinks my contract is losing them money, they are free
to cancel it, and I'll get my service somewhere else. The thing is,
they won't cancel it, or hold up their end of it, but if I cancel it, it
will cost me $175.00
I didn't choose Cingular. They bought my contract. They have
no right to whine about it not being a good deal for them or
having to hold up their end of it.
Kid, I think your boodah has lost it's Mojo.


LampieTheClown

[kidboodah]

What a load of...

I'm sorry, but every argument they make is a big load of crap. The $18 fee was never a "transfer fee" - it was a upgrade processing fee that Cingular charges every customer, just like AT&T Wireless charged their customers $15 to upgrade their phone. Most wireless companies charge such fees. As far as the early termination fees, once a customer was migrated over to Cingular - if they cancelled within the 30 day return policy, they weren't charged a early termination fees, mainly due to technical limitations and the separation between the two customer care units. The "degradation" of service was not due to the merger, but actually a continuation of AT&T's movement to shove people off of the TDMA network, which they haven't built out since 1998 - nothing to do with the merger...they just happened to occur at the same time. The only arguments that could even come close to being supported: 1.Cingular requiring people to purchase new phones - though Cingular has always given people the option to use unlocked GSM phones purchased somewhere else. and 2. Requiring a move to a "less favorable" plan - which was unfavorable mainly due to the fact that towards the end of its life, ATTWS was giving away the farm trying to keep its customers from jumping ship.

[LarryLo]

Dude, you're sooooooooo wrong!

I had an ATT GSM phone, I had the same problems as they talk about in this article.

Everytime I called Cingular to try and fix it or maybe get credit for my 2 days without phone service, they would tell me the problem is due to the fact they are "merging networks", BUT miraculously the problem would go away if I switched to a Cingular plan, which was around $30 more a month than my plan with AT&T.

Whether or not ATTWS was giving away plans, when Cingular bought them they were still required to honor those contracts. In my opinion they did not and I personally felt like all they knew how to do was to shove the new "cingular plan" down your throat.

It's simple to me it looks like Cingular bought ATTWS to get rid of the competition and ultimatley jack up rates, which surpringly... they did. Hence I took my unlocked phone and went to T-Mobile.

[kidboodah]

What a load of...

I'm sorry, but every argument they make is a big load of crap. The $18 fee was never a "transfer fee" - it was a upgrade processing fee that Cingular charges every customer, just like AT&T Wireless charged their customers $15 to upgrade their phone. Most wireless companies charge such fees. As far as the early termination fees, once a customer was migrated over to Cingular - if they cancelled within the 30 day return policy, they weren't charged a early termination fees, mainly due to technical limitations and the separation between the two customer care units. The "degradation" of service was not due to the merger, but actually a continuation of AT&T's movement to shove people off of the TDMA network, which they haven't built out since 1998 - nothing to do with the merger...they just happened to occur at the same time. The only arguments that could even come close to being supported: 1.Cingular requiring people to purchase new phones - though Cingular has always given people the option to use unlocked GSM phones purchased somewhere else. and 2. Requiring a move to a "less favorable" plan - which was unfavorable mainly due to the fact that towards the end of its life, ATTWS was giving away the farm trying to keep its customers from jumping ship.

[LarryLo]

Dude, you're sooooooooo wrong!

I had an ATT GSM phone, I had the same problems as they talk about in this article.

Everytime I called Cingular to try and fix it or maybe get credit for my 2 days without phone service, they would tell me the problem is due to the fact they are "merging networks", BUT miraculously the problem would go away if I switched to a Cingular plan, which was around $30 more a month than my plan with AT&T.

Whether or not ATTWS was giving away plans, when Cingular bought them they were still required to honor those contracts. In my opinion they did not and I personally felt like all they knew how to do was to shove the new "cingular plan" down your throat.

It's simple to me it looks like Cingular bought ATTWS to get rid of the competition and ultimatley jack up rates, which surpringly... they did. Hence I took my unlocked phone and went to T-Mobile.

[Michael Massey]

I have to agree with the complaints in the story

I purchased an ATT Wireless cell phone with the pay as you go option for my teenager in August of 2004. It was amazingly inexpensive when you purchased the $100 card. It worked out to about 7 cents a minute. We still had 400 minutes left on the phone when Cingular took over. Our problems ran very parallel to what the story ran with one addition. Cingular terminated the $100 card for the pay as you go service. Now, the largest amount that you could purchase at one time was $50. The per minute cost for that was over 30 cents. All Cingular customer service reps would tell us the same thing. They claimed that no one was purchasing the $100 cards so they dropped them.

[Michael Massey]

I have to agree with the complaints in the story

I purchased an ATT Wireless cell phone with the pay as you go option for my teenager in August of 2004. It was amazingly inexpensive when you purchased the $100 card. It worked out to about 7 cents a minute. We still had 400 minutes left on the phone when Cingular took over. Our problems ran very parallel to what the story ran with one addition. Cingular terminated the $100 card for the pay as you go service. Now, the largest amount that you could purchase at one time was $50. The per minute cost for that was over 30 cents. All Cingular customer service reps would tell us the same thing. They claimed that no one was purchasing the $100 cards so they dropped them.

[Callian]

Cingular/AT&T

I purchased a phone from AT&T right before the merger. The phone was obsolete just a few months later.

The other issue I have with all of this is you cannot just walk into any Cingular branded store and get service. My Blackberry died, and I went to my local Cingular store to replace it. They told me because I had an "AT&T account, I would have to go to a former AT&T store."
I went to that store, and I could not just replace my unit, I had to purchase a higher end model because mine would not work on the Cingular platform.

[Callian]

Cingular/AT&T

I purchased a phone from AT&T right before the merger. The phone was obsolete just a few months later.

The other issue I have with all of this is you cannot just walk into any Cingular branded store and get service. My Blackberry died, and I went to my local Cingular store to replace it. They told me because I had an "AT&T account, I would have to go to a former AT&T store."
I went to that store, and I could not just replace my unit, I had to purchase a higher end model because mine would not work on the Cingular platform.

[wshepard]

Cingular / ATT Service

A long time user of ATT it was OK. Forced to switch to Cingular due to tower consolidation and service went south. And I live in Alabama and you can't get much further south. I agree with the article since it happened to me.

Go get em

[T bradle]

I agree with what you said

I was an At&t custormer and about 1 month later my phone was having trouble getting a signal. I live in Tnn. So Ihad to switch over to cingular . I had to get a phone from them in order for me to have service.Thanks for letting me make a comment.

[wshepard]

Cingular / ATT Service

A long time user of ATT it was OK. Forced to switch to Cingular due to tower consolidation and service went south. And I live in Alabama and you can't get much further south. I agree with the article since it happened to me.

Go get em

[T bradle]

I agree with what you said

I was an At&t custormer and about 1 month later my phone was having trouble getting a signal. I live in Tnn. So Ihad to switch over to cingular . I had to get a phone from them in order for me to have service.Thanks for letting me make a comment.

[erci0116]

It's True

I had a phone that was failing, so I needed a new one. They stopped selling them for AT&T. They wanted to charge per phone to switch to the "Cingular" network even though we were given no choice. That would have been almost $60 for my family phones! Its not like I was switching companies. It was an obvious they were forcing people to switch to more expensive plans and then making an extra $20 a phone from it.

[erci0116]

It's True

I had a phone that was failing, so I needed a new one. They stopped selling them for AT&T. They wanted to charge per phone to switch to the "Cingular" network even though we were given no choice. That would have been almost $60 for my family phones! Its not like I was switching companies. It was an obvious they were forcing people to switch to more expensive plans and then making an extra $20 a phone from it.

[erci0116]

It's True

I had a phone that was failing, so I needed a new one. They stopped selling them for AT&T. They wanted to charge per phone to switch to the "Cingular" network even though we were given no choice. That would have been almost $60 for my family phones! Its not like I was switching companies. It was an obvious they were forcing people to switch to more expensive plans and then making an extra $20 a phone from it.

[Silver_2000]

Merger problems

The merger was done very poorly and Cingular clearly attempted to abandon the ATT customers. Since calling Cingular got you NO WHERE if you were still blue. I can however blame them for incenting people to migrate so that they could consolidate billing.

When you were told that Blue devices were not available that was a lie - They were still seling Blue devices to corporate accounst until a month or 2 ago

As far as comments about treatment at stores. You understand that the majority or Cingular stores are franchises. Meaning they just sell phones. Thats ALL. They are NOT Cingular employees. They dont make any money unless you buy a phone and a NEW rate plan. So since it costs money to keep the lights on and it costs money to pay the person you spoke to a $20 change fee isnt that bad. Also keep in mind that a different store might have different rates...
Thats the same for all retail cell phone sales

[erci0116]

It's True

I had a phone that was failing, so I needed a new one. They stopped selling them for AT&T. They wanted to charge per phone to switch to the "Cingular" network even though we were given no choice. That would have been almost $60 for my family phones! Its not like I was switching companies. It was an obvious they were forcing people to switch to more expensive plans and then making an extra $20 a phone from it.

[Silver_2000]

Merger problems

The merger was done very poorly and Cingular clearly attempted to abandon the ATT customers. Since calling Cingular got you NO WHERE if you were still blue. I can however blame them for incenting people to migrate so that they could consolidate billing.

When you were told that Blue devices were not available that was a lie - They were still seling Blue devices to corporate accounst until a month or 2 ago

As far as comments about treatment at stores. You understand that the majority or Cingular stores are franchises. Meaning they just sell phones. Thats ALL. They are NOT Cingular employees. They dont make any money unless you buy a phone and a NEW rate plan. So since it costs money to keep the lights on and it costs money to pay the person you spoke to a $20 change fee isnt that bad. Also keep in mind that a different store might have different rates...
Thats the same for all retail cell phone sales

[nerantzis]

net neutrality

This and other telcos don't want net neutrality?

Because they would never ever never do the same thing to
boardband as they have done to phone seervices!

[nerantzis]

net neutrality

This and other telcos don't want net neutrality?

Because they would never ever never do the same thing to
boardband as they have done to phone seervices!

[timgrubb]

Exact Situation

I had ATT for 4 or 5 years and traveled the contry never having a problem. Within months of the take over I started having issues where my phone would drop every call after about 2 minutes. I ordered a new phone but had the same problem. Switched to a completely different phone and still had problems. These happened while I was just sitting in my house! Ultimately I just switched to Verizon and have had no problems.

[timgrubb]

Exact Situation

I had ATT for 4 or 5 years and traveled the contry never having a problem. Within months of the take over I started having issues where my phone would drop every call after about 2 minutes. I ordered a new phone but had the same problem. Switched to a completely different phone and still had problems. These happened while I was just sitting in my house! Ultimately I just switched to Verizon and have had no problems.