Comments on: Sending Uncle Sam back to school

CNET News.com's Declan McCullagh reports on the latest move by Silicon Valley's mandarins to improve U.S. competitiveness.

[wazzledoozle]

100 billion for Iraq

Yet our school system remains second tier to many other countrys which entire economy is less than what we are spending in Iraq.

[hardedge]

Bad broken record

At last count, 9-11 cost our economy $2.5 trillion. Just think of all the senseless projects the revenues derived from that income could have been spent on!

Our schools are bad, where they are bad, for a variety of reasons --one of which is that out government gave out draft deferments to teachers willing to work in inner city schools. Those folk are still in the system. Many of them are there to wait out their pensions.

Another reason is because of social engineering attempts during which basic learning skills were replaced by attitude and concept "learning." This has nothing to do with money. It's simply a matter of bad policy using wistful criteria to teach the wrong material in the wrong way. That's why people who scream about underfunding "No Child Left Behind" make me laugh. It's an oversight program that's attempting to put schols back on course and what those folk are asking for is the government to fund what the local schools should have been doing all the while --actually teaching the kids.

Money is not the solution in the school system. The more you think it is, the worse the problem will get. You don't fund incompetence.

[wazzledoozle]

100 billion for Iraq

Yet our school system remains second tier to many other countrys which entire economy is less than what we are spending in Iraq.

[hardedge]

Bad broken record

At last count, 9-11 cost our economy $2.5 trillion. Just think of all the senseless projects the revenues derived from that income could have been spent on!

Our schools are bad, where they are bad, for a variety of reasons --one of which is that out government gave out draft deferments to teachers willing to work in inner city schools. Those folk are still in the system. Many of them are there to wait out their pensions.

Another reason is because of social engineering attempts during which basic learning skills were replaced by attitude and concept "learning." This has nothing to do with money. It's simply a matter of bad policy using wistful criteria to teach the wrong material in the wrong way. That's why people who scream about underfunding "No Child Left Behind" make me laugh. It's an oversight program that's attempting to put schols back on course and what those folk are asking for is the government to fund what the local schools should have been doing all the while --actually teaching the kids.

Money is not the solution in the school system. The more you think it is, the worse the problem will get. You don't fund incompetence.

[hardedge]

Money, money, money

Just because our college students rank 19th in 8th grade math skills doesn't mean they're bad people. I'm sure they all feel good about themselevs and their ability to be non-competitive. Lord knows, we've been training them to be that way for at least the last decade.

By the way, more tax dollars for basic research? No way. In fact, not at all. You want to talk about underachievers then you have no where else to go but the government. When it gives my money to researchers it has such low expecattions that some of the resulting projects are just plain silly --and then funded anew!

Science needs the accountability demanded by private sector funding, not government welfare programs.

[Slylencer]

What accountability?

Enron, Worlcom, Tyco, and Andersen Consulting are just the latest a long line of private sector failures showing that corporations cannot be counted on any more than the government. The last time I checked, government programs never destroyed someone's 401k.

The fact is that the corporations are putting themselves into this situation. Why would anyone want to pursue an education in these fields if the only job oppurtunities are being offshored? Even the research is starting to be offshored. Corporations only pander to the almighty dollar. The farcical whining by these corporations is only perpetrated to cover up their greed.

[hardedge]

Money, money, money

Just because our college students rank 19th in 8th grade math skills doesn't mean they're bad people. I'm sure they all feel good about themselevs and their ability to be non-competitive. Lord knows, we've been training them to be that way for at least the last decade.

By the way, more tax dollars for basic research? No way. In fact, not at all. You want to talk about underachievers then you have no where else to go but the government. When it gives my money to researchers it has such low expecattions that some of the resulting projects are just plain silly --and then funded anew!

Science needs the accountability demanded by private sector funding, not government welfare programs.

[Slylencer]

What accountability?

Enron, Worlcom, Tyco, and Andersen Consulting are just the latest a long line of private sector failures showing that corporations cannot be counted on any more than the government. The last time I checked, government programs never destroyed someone's 401k.

The fact is that the corporations are putting themselves into this situation. Why would anyone want to pursue an education in these fields if the only job oppurtunities are being offshored? Even the research is starting to be offshored. Corporations only pander to the almighty dollar. The farcical whining by these corporations is only perpetrated to cover up their greed.

[MyLord]

Need to distinguish real problems and solutions from pseudo ones

IT employment, Jobwatch.org is off 25% from the peak and at the current rate of growth, will take a decade to reach prior levels. The problem is not too few entering these fields but too many. There simply aren't the jobs for them.

Educational investment and R&D could help in providing skills and employment to fit the labor force to opportunities, if they exist and could create them if they don't. Think e-government, e-medicare, biomedical, and energy research. These make sense. Educating people for jobs that don't exist doesn't.

[MyLord]

Need to distinguish real problems and solutions from pseudo ones

IT employment, Jobwatch.org is off 25% from the peak and at the current rate of growth, will take a decade to reach prior levels. The problem is not too few entering these fields but too many. There simply aren't the jobs for them.

Educational investment and R&D could help in providing skills and employment to fit the labor force to opportunities, if they exist and could create them if they don't. Think e-government, e-medicare, biomedical, and energy research. These make sense. Educating people for jobs that don't exist doesn't.

So, they want more people to enter these fields ...

But why? Many of the jobs in these fields are being outsourced overseas. If my kid was nearing college age, I'd tell him to pick a career that cannot be outsourced. Like psychologist or policeman ... or something.

So, they want more people to enter these fields ...

But why? Many of the jobs in these fields are being outsourced overseas. If my kid was nearing college age, I'd tell him to pick a career that cannot be outsourced. Like psychologist or policeman ... or something.

Should have added something ...

As I said in my prior comment, many of these jobs are going overseas. Which, as I also said, is the reason I would NOT recommend such fields to my children.

The only way to get people to go into these fields is to guarantee them jobs. But since protectionism is such an evil word, this will never happen. That and that fact that corporations make tons of money by using cheap overseas labor. They would definitely be against it, despite the fact that since the upper 20 percentile of Chinese workers make $1440 a YEAR (based on a recent PBS show I watched), they are definitely NOT going to be able to buy HDTVs ...

They are making money on the short term and will lose it in the long term.

And the government will foot the bill for all the unemployed ...

Should have added something ...

As I said in my prior comment, many of these jobs are going overseas. Which, as I also said, is the reason I would NOT recommend such fields to my children.

The only way to get people to go into these fields is to guarantee them jobs. But since protectionism is such an evil word, this will never happen. That and that fact that corporations make tons of money by using cheap overseas labor. They would definitely be against it, despite the fact that since the upper 20 percentile of Chinese workers make $1440 a YEAR (based on a recent PBS show I watched), they are definitely NOT going to be able to buy HDTVs ...

They are making money on the short term and will lose it in the long term.

And the government will foot the bill for all the unemployed ...

[doctored5]

tax cuts are not the answer

Improving technology needs to begin much earlier-- hence the low math scores in middle school. Technology needs to be pushed in middle school & high school. People need to be prepared with the option of a tech career when they leave HS. No one switches from pre-law into engineering in college.

Second, research by Richard Florida & others has shown that tolerant urban communities foster creative workers. Policies focusing on small scale development, not big factories, need to be promoted.

[doctored5]

tax cuts are not the answer

Improving technology needs to begin much earlier-- hence the low math scores in middle school. Technology needs to be pushed in middle school & high school. People need to be prepared with the option of a tech career when they leave HS. No one switches from pre-law into engineering in college.

Second, research by Richard Florida & others has shown that tolerant urban communities foster creative workers. Policies focusing on small scale development, not big factories, need to be promoted.

Closed meeting. It's a sham

Hmmm. Republicans and greedy CEOs meeting behind closed doors to discuss solutions. My bet is they will want to "import" as many guest workers as their hearts desire all in the name of remaining competitive. Any takers?

If there was a "true" shortage of talent we would be hearing about fat salaries and benefits being offered to attact it. But it would be much cheaper to import it and that is their aim. Too bad, because rising salaries would attract more students which builds our capabilities, not some other country's workforce.

Those who point out China and India graduate five times more engineers than the U.S. should be whacked up side the head (and sent back to school); their populations are about that factor larger that ours.

There are solutions that need to be found for the U.S. to be competitive but racing to the bottom isn't one of them. Don't support short-sighted solutions that benefit the few.

Closed meeting. It's a sham

Hmmm. Republicans and greedy CEOs meeting behind closed doors to discuss solutions. My bet is they will want to "import" as many guest workers as their hearts desire all in the name of remaining competitive. Any takers?

If there was a "true" shortage of talent we would be hearing about fat salaries and benefits being offered to attact it. But it would be much cheaper to import it and that is their aim. Too bad, because rising salaries would attract more students which builds our capabilities, not some other country's workforce.

Those who point out China and India graduate five times more engineers than the U.S. should be whacked up side the head (and sent back to school); their populations are about that factor larger that ours.

There are solutions that need to be found for the U.S. to be competitive but racing to the bottom isn't one of them. Don't support short-sighted solutions that benefit the few.