Comments on: $100 laptop 'will boost desktop Linux'

The head of the One Laptop per Child project says he must be doing something right if he's upsetting Microsoft and Intel.

[Maccess]

Make Intel an ally

Create a version of the $100/135/whatever that uses an Intel chip.

No sense in making enemies of Intel when they can very well make a compatible chip.

[Maccess]

Make Intel an ally

Create a version of the $100/135/whatever that uses an Intel chip.

No sense in making enemies of Intel when they can very well make a compatible chip.

[lingsun]

It's a scam that won't help anybody

The $100 laptop is a scam. Governments are going to pay for a useless item that isn't going to help anyone's education. It's a joke to think $100 laptops are even needed when desktop computers are everywhere. It's a joke to think computers will make kids smarter when all the evidence shows that billions of dollars were completely wasted. It's just another perfect liberal idea: somebody gets something useless; somebody else gets to pay for it; the idiots in charge of it all act like they just saved the world.

[lingsun]

It's a scam that won't help anybody

The $100 laptop is a scam. Governments are going to pay for a useless item that isn't going to help anyone's education. It's a joke to think $100 laptops are even needed when desktop computers are everywhere. It's a joke to think computers will make kids smarter when all the evidence shows that billions of dollars were completely wasted. It's just another perfect liberal idea: somebody gets something useless; somebody else gets to pay for it; the idiots in charge of it all act like they just saved the world.

[rlaw68]

Things people need more than $100 Laptops...

First off, full disclosure: I consider myself a liberal, but a pragmatic one. The dreamy ones can go f*ck themselves...oh wait, they're already doing that.

Anyway, this whole thing, as many have said, is just a Linux rah-rah stunt. There are only about 200 things that these kids need more than a cheap/free laptop. Like:

1) Literacy (can't read, can't use a computer, much less build a just society, stay out of harms way, become a leader, etc.)
2) Clean water (in case this isn't a "well, no duh" point, trying going without it for about 36 hours are see if you change your mind)
3) Vaccinations / basic healthcare (including birth control). Say what you will about big bad Bill Gates, but he's putting real muscle behind this effort.
4) Sustainable agriculture (can't ruin the only land you've got with bad crops/techniques -- need desalinization tools and modern methodology to feed more people)
5) Infrastructure (including some vestige of the kind of telecom system you'd need to make lots o' shiny laptops anything more than doorstops)
6) Civil rights (even/especially for those w/o oil under their poor soil -- doesn't have to be a "democracy" by the way, just an increase in the level of just treatment)
7) Local economies above subsistence level (microfunding, community banking, knowledge transfer -- see literacy above).

Those are just a few, but I challenge anyone here to argue that $100 laptops deserve even to be mentioned in the same discussion as these issues without being roundly dismissed as a wholly feeble, if not even destructive diversion to the real issues at hand.

The person who said that any money that goes to cheap laptops comes directly out of the same pot that could go to addressing the issues above was right on the mark.

[ScottMo]

Inertia

You're right. There's so many other basic needs other than education. We should stop doing anything for people who already have basic needs met. Just tell 'em "Sorry, we've got to meet basic needs ofthe next village" and let them stay right where there are. Who do those poor nations think they are, trying to actually *improve* their future instead of making sure the basics are covered for every living sole on earth.

Damn greedy poor. Always trying to get a head via education. Tehy ough to be happy with subsistance farming.

/sarcasm

[gdmaclew]

Absolutely Bang On!

You've said it better than I could have.
Finally...someone besides me gets the point.
Thanks.

[rlaw68]

Things people need more than $100 Laptops...

First off, full disclosure: I consider myself a liberal, but a pragmatic one. The dreamy ones can go f*ck themselves...oh wait, they're already doing that.

Anyway, this whole thing, as many have said, is just a Linux rah-rah stunt. There are only about 200 things that these kids need more than a cheap/free laptop. Like:

1) Literacy (can't read, can't use a computer, much less build a just society, stay out of harms way, become a leader, etc.)
2) Clean water (in case this isn't a "well, no duh" point, trying going without it for about 36 hours are see if you change your mind)
3) Vaccinations / basic healthcare (including birth control). Say what you will about big bad Bill Gates, but he's putting real muscle behind this effort.
4) Sustainable agriculture (can't ruin the only land you've got with bad crops/techniques -- need desalinization tools and modern methodology to feed more people)
5) Infrastructure (including some vestige of the kind of telecom system you'd need to make lots o' shiny laptops anything more than doorstops)
6) Civil rights (even/especially for those w/o oil under their poor soil -- doesn't have to be a "democracy" by the way, just an increase in the level of just treatment)
7) Local economies above subsistence level (microfunding, community banking, knowledge transfer -- see literacy above).

Those are just a few, but I challenge anyone here to argue that $100 laptops deserve even to be mentioned in the same discussion as these issues without being roundly dismissed as a wholly feeble, if not even destructive diversion to the real issues at hand.

The person who said that any money that goes to cheap laptops comes directly out of the same pot that could go to addressing the issues above was right on the mark.

[ScottMo]

Inertia

You're right. There's so many other basic needs other than education. We should stop doing anything for people who already have basic needs met. Just tell 'em "Sorry, we've got to meet basic needs ofthe next village" and let them stay right where there are. Who do those poor nations think they are, trying to actually *improve* their future instead of making sure the basics are covered for every living sole on earth.

Damn greedy poor. Always trying to get a head via education. Tehy ough to be happy with subsistance farming.

/sarcasm

[gdmaclew]

Absolutely Bang On!

You've said it better than I could have.
Finally...someone besides me gets the point.
Thanks.

[Joe Blow]

Speaking of Literacy, Try Reading the Freakin' OLPC WWW Site ...

and you just might start to "get it". First, as one sane (and, apparently, literate) poster said, these are not for those in dire need of water, food, shelter, etc., they're for the people who have those needs met, but will slide down into extreme poverty if they don't become educated, more self-sufficient economically, and connected to the rest of us living the life of Riley in the 21st Century.

Next, the $100 to be spent on each laptop is already being spent today on each of these kids for books and other school supplies that have lifespans of well under a year due to usage, climate, etc., and the laptops will be able to not only be updated via the built-in mesh network (you only need one external network connection to one local laptop, even on an occasional basis, for everyone to get the updates), but when full-time Internet access can be provided at a later date (via satellite, microwave, etc.), all of the laptops will immediately become portals to the Rest of Us, and a whole lot of useful, free information (e.g., MIT's entire curricula for every major is being put on-line for free access - you only pay tuition if you want to take exams, get credit for classes, and get a diploma, and they have vastly reduced rates for those in the target countries for the laptops - essentially the cost of providing the service on the WWW, which is next to nothing).

Additionally, the laptops can be configured for local languages, so they can be more culturally acceptable right out of the box, but the option will be there to expand to the use of other languages over time, and as students' interests evolve. Of course, surfing the WWW exposes users to things they could never get from already-outdated books. Even the educational fundamentals can be taught via the laptops at least as readily as via books, but with graphics, animations, simulations, etc., books just can't compete. Reading is reading, and writing is writing, and I guarantee you that kids quickly learn to do both much faster in an unrestricted on-line environment than bare-bones classrooms - heck, kids in the developed world are inventing entirely new languages via cell phone text messaging and on-line instant messaging/chat (my favorite is POTS - "Watch what you type, Parent Over The Shoulder"). If it's fast enough to handle VoIP, then the addition of a headset with a mike means that each user would then have their own phone, without the costly infrastructure of a landline or cell system. This wouldn't need to be done in Year One, but when the users start generating income, such accessories can't be far behind (especially after they discover voice chat).

On top of all that, we can only hope that some percentage of the kids _do_ learn science and math skills that eventually lead them to also learn software development skills, network communications concepts and, gasp, even Linux system administration and custom applications development (or for any other OS provided free of charge - if Bill Gates were as smart as he's supposed to be, he would have been first in line to donate a viable OS version, but, no, they can't be giving away even an older version of the company's crap - gotta make money off even the underpriveleged). Any skills that the users pick up will be useful for the rest of their lives, and knowledge is power, the power to get a job (much less a better one, and that's just a matter of time, once you've climbed over the first job hurdle), the power to communicate intelligently (I'll bet that when they join us here, they'll be better-behaved than some of the posters here), and the power to develop their own local, regional and national economies that will no longer need to rely on handouts.

Finally, the name of the project is One Laptop Per Child, not One Laptop Per Poor Wretch Without A Hope Of Ever Achieving Anything. No one involved in the project is calling any of the recipients poor, or anything even remotely denigrating in any way. This isn't just a pie-in-the-sky academic research project, either - prototypes of various configurations have already been put into the field, literally, often in small communities that, in some cases, have never had electric light (the backlighting for the screen can provide minmal safe, cool, non-toxic illumination in lieu of open-flame candles/lanterns). The crank on the side of the computer was just an intermediate idea, and it didn't cut the mustard, so that function is being moved to pedal-powered generators - the source of the muscle power is legs, instead of arms, but the generator specs are the same. Anyone who's ever watched TV or read while on a treadmill or stationary bike can attest that this can work just fine (pedal-powered mechanical sewing machines have been in use for well over 100 years, so this isn't anything radically new). Plus, they'll short-circuit the lesson we need to learn - that sedentary computing is not a good thing for your personal longevity. We should all be so lucky as to have a pedal-powered laptop (as I've said before, I'd even buy a slightly more expensive version of this kind of device, to help defray the cost of the freebie units for the intended recipients and further bring the price down through economy-of-scale, to toss under the seat of my car as a backup WiFi-capable system that can be powered anywhere.

BTW, Negroponte was speaking at a Linux conference when he made his remarks about Linux vs. other potential OSes. So, you might expect more than a bit of pandering to the crowd - when in Rome ... I'll bet other speakers were a heck of a lot more parochial and vocal about Linux's role in the world, present and future.

Sometimes, you just have to throw the spaghetti against the wall to see if it will stick. The project is making progress in figuring out what works and what doesn't, and once these start showing up in significant numbers, you can bet your sweet bippy that everyone in the target countries will want one, even if it's "too slow", "lacks storage capacity", "has too small a display", "is too hard to keep powered by pedaling" and all of the other nits that we spoiled brats can pick apart without making a single person's life better somewhere else.

All the Best,
Joe Blow

[Joe Blow]

Speaking of Literacy, Try Reading the Freakin' OLPC WWW Site ...

and you just might start to "get it". First, as one sane (and, apparently, literate) poster said, these are not for those in dire need of water, food, shelter, etc., they're for the people who have those needs met, but will slide down into extreme poverty if they don't become educated, more self-sufficient economically, and connected to the rest of us living the life of Riley in the 21st Century.

Next, the $100 to be spent on each laptop is already being spent today on each of these kids for books and other school supplies that have lifespans of well under a year due to usage, climate, etc., and the laptops will be able to not only be updated via the built-in mesh network (you only need one external network connection to one local laptop, even on an occasional basis, for everyone to get the updates), but when full-time Internet access can be provided at a later date (via satellite, microwave, etc.), all of the laptops will immediately become portals to the Rest of Us, and a whole lot of useful, free information (e.g., MIT's entire curricula for every major is being put on-line for free access - you only pay tuition if you want to take exams, get credit for classes, and get a diploma, and they have vastly reduced rates for those in the target countries for the laptops - essentially the cost of providing the service on the WWW, which is next to nothing).

Additionally, the laptops can be configured for local languages, so they can be more culturally acceptable right out of the box, but the option will be there to expand to the use of other languages over time, and as students' interests evolve. Of course, surfing the WWW exposes users to things they could never get from already-outdated books. Even the educational fundamentals can be taught via the laptops at least as readily as via books, but with graphics, animations, simulations, etc., books just can't compete. Reading is reading, and writing is writing, and I guarantee you that kids quickly learn to do both much faster in an unrestricted on-line environment than bare-bones classrooms - heck, kids in the developed world are inventing entirely new languages via cell phone text messaging and on-line instant messaging/chat (my favorite is POTS - "Watch what you type, Parent Over The Shoulder"). If it's fast enough to handle VoIP, then the addition of a headset with a mike means that each user would then have their own phone, without the costly infrastructure of a landline or cell system. This wouldn't need to be done in Year One, but when the users start generating income, such accessories can't be far behind (especially after they discover voice chat).

On top of all that, we can only hope that some percentage of the kids _do_ learn science and math skills that eventually lead them to also learn software development skills, network communications concepts and, gasp, even Linux system administration and custom applications development (or for any other OS provided free of charge - if Bill Gates were as smart as he's supposed to be, he would have been first in line to donate a viable OS version, but, no, they can't be giving away even an older version of the company's crap - gotta make money off even the underpriveleged). Any skills that the users pick up will be useful for the rest of their lives, and knowledge is power, the power to get a job (much less a better one, and that's just a matter of time, once you've climbed over the first job hurdle), the power to communicate intelligently (I'll bet that when they join us here, they'll be better-behaved than some of the posters here), and the power to develop their own local, regional and national economies that will no longer need to rely on handouts.

Finally, the name of the project is One Laptop Per Child, not One Laptop Per Poor Wretch Without A Hope Of Ever Achieving Anything. No one involved in the project is calling any of the recipients poor, or anything even remotely denigrating in any way. This isn't just a pie-in-the-sky academic research project, either - prototypes of various configurations have already been put into the field, literally, often in small communities that, in some cases, have never had electric light (the backlighting for the screen can provide minmal safe, cool, non-toxic illumination in lieu of open-flame candles/lanterns). The crank on the side of the computer was just an intermediate idea, and it didn't cut the mustard, so that function is being moved to pedal-powered generators - the source of the muscle power is legs, instead of arms, but the generator specs are the same. Anyone who's ever watched TV or read while on a treadmill or stationary bike can attest that this can work just fine (pedal-powered mechanical sewing machines have been in use for well over 100 years, so this isn't anything radically new). Plus, they'll short-circuit the lesson we need to learn - that sedentary computing is not a good thing for your personal longevity. We should all be so lucky as to have a pedal-powered laptop (as I've said before, I'd even buy a slightly more expensive version of this kind of device, to help defray the cost of the freebie units for the intended recipients and further bring the price down through economy-of-scale, to toss under the seat of my car as a backup WiFi-capable system that can be powered anywhere.

BTW, Negroponte was speaking at a Linux conference when he made his remarks about Linux vs. other potential OSes. So, you might expect more than a bit of pandering to the crowd - when in Rome ... I'll bet other speakers were a heck of a lot more parochial and vocal about Linux's role in the world, present and future.

Sometimes, you just have to throw the spaghetti against the wall to see if it will stick. The project is making progress in figuring out what works and what doesn't, and once these start showing up in significant numbers, you can bet your sweet bippy that everyone in the target countries will want one, even if it's "too slow", "lacks storage capacity", "has too small a display", "is too hard to keep powered by pedaling" and all of the other nits that we spoiled brats can pick apart without making a single person's life better somewhere else.

All the Best,
Joe Blow