Comments on: FAQ: Will your Intel-based Mac run Windows?

Since both the Mac OS and Windows now run on Intel-based hardware, shouldn't it be easy to run them on the same computer?
Ten thoughts on the new Intel iMac

[djemerson]

Paging Ty and Earl

Commence bickering!

[Earl Benser]

Nothing new....

.... and I'm not sure that Ms Ina has all her information correct. Any
how, so far, nothing has been written that I would argue with at the
moment. But the story may yet develop in more ways. We'll see.

By the way, you really don't want to get Ty started on any set of
posts.

[zaznet]

ROFL!

Oh, both of them found this article without your help I am sure! :)

I see posts from both, have yet to read them all but it's going, it's going! :)

[djemerson]

Paging Ty and Earl

Commence bickering!

[Earl Benser]

Nothing new....

.... and I'm not sure that Ms Ina has all her information correct. Any
how, so far, nothing has been written that I would argue with at the
moment. But the story may yet develop in more ways. We'll see.

By the way, you really don't want to get Ty started on any set of
posts.

[zaznet]

ROFL!

Oh, both of them found this article without your help I am sure! :)

I see posts from both, have yet to read them all but it's going, it's going! :)

[k2skiing]

full os x IS available

you can buy a full version of os x unless something has recently changed. Just walk into any apple store. Cost $129 for the full version or $69 if you have an education discount.

[dwaite40]

Full OS X Is _not_ available

That is an upgrade copy of OS X. There is no such thing as a retail
full version of OS X, since there is no such thing as an OS X-less
macintosh.

[capfan12]

nope

and what are you going to install the 129 yearly upgrade onto? a machine that already has OSX because it came with it from the factory.

[samkass]

Only upgrades

Every Macintosh ships with a version of MacOS. You can only buy upgrades to that version from your local dealer. How do they enforce the fact that it's an upgrade? The computer is a $2,000 hardware dongle for the OS.

Basically, with Apple, their hardware likely subsidizes their software development, so if you like having MacOS X exist, don't pirate it onto non-Apple hardware.

[jscott]

It's a legal issue. It's not about bits on a disc.

I hate to point this out, but whether an application is considered
an "upgrade" has nothing to do with whether it requires the
previous version to exist on a computer's hard drive at the time
of installation. Many apps have (and do) simply replace the
existing app with a full copy of the new version. The license is
all about a legal contract. And when it comes to Mac OS, you
"agreed" to the terms of Apple's license when you started using
the machine -- regardless of which Mac OS was installed on it.
As someone accurately pointed out: the machine itself is proof
that you had (or were originally entitled to) a legal, licensed
version of Mac OS. So Mac OS X is just an "upgrade" -- even
though it can be installed on a clean hard drive. Your
previously-licensed version is either on a disk in your desk
drawer, or happened to get lost somewhere in time. But once
upon a time, that Mac had a licensed copy of Mac OS on it --
every Mac and even the short-lived Mac OS clones did. So don't
get so hung-up on whether it'll install on a clean HD. That has
nothing to do with it. It's all about the legal license agreement.

[k2skiing]

full os x IS available

you can buy a full version of os x unless something has recently changed. Just walk into any apple store. Cost $129 for the full version or $69 if you have an education discount.

[dwaite40]

Full OS X Is _not_ available

That is an upgrade copy of OS X. There is no such thing as a retail
full version of OS X, since there is no such thing as an OS X-less
macintosh.

[capfan12]

nope

and what are you going to install the 129 yearly upgrade onto? a machine that already has OSX because it came with it from the factory.

[samkass]

Only upgrades

Every Macintosh ships with a version of MacOS. You can only buy upgrades to that version from your local dealer. How do they enforce the fact that it's an upgrade? The computer is a $2,000 hardware dongle for the OS.

Basically, with Apple, their hardware likely subsidizes their software development, so if you like having MacOS X exist, don't pirate it onto non-Apple hardware.

[jscott]

It's a legal issue. It's not about bits on a disc.

I hate to point this out, but whether an application is considered
an "upgrade" has nothing to do with whether it requires the
previous version to exist on a computer's hard drive at the time
of installation. Many apps have (and do) simply replace the
existing app with a full copy of the new version. The license is
all about a legal contract. And when it comes to Mac OS, you
"agreed" to the terms of Apple's license when you started using
the machine -- regardless of which Mac OS was installed on it.
As someone accurately pointed out: the machine itself is proof
that you had (or were originally entitled to) a legal, licensed
version of Mac OS. So Mac OS X is just an "upgrade" -- even
though it can be installed on a clean hard drive. Your
previously-licensed version is either on a disk in your desk
drawer, or happened to get lost somewhere in time. But once
upon a time, that Mac had a licensed copy of Mac OS on it --
every Mac and even the short-lived Mac OS clones did. So don't
get so hung-up on whether it'll install on a clean HD. That has
nothing to do with it. It's all about the legal license agreement.

[nicmart]

No standalone OS X?

What does Fried mean, "...Apple doesn't sell standalone versions of
its operating system." They certainly do. It does seem that Cnet
writers too often don't have mastery of their topics.

[capfan12]

why would there be?

you can only get OSX through apple with the purchase of a mac. why would one buy a "Full" copy of OSX when you already have a "Full" copy if you have a mac in the first place and you only need upgrade editions?

[norman619]

Are you daft?

LOL show me where you can buy a vill version or the Mac OS for sale anywhere. You can only buy upgrades not a full blown OS you can install on a bare bones system w/o an installed OS. No such beast exists. It's how Apple maintains control of their OS. I think it sucks but oh well.

[Betty Roper]

Cnet News is Not

CNet is not a journalism company. It's a marketing company that provides "News" to pull in eyeballs for its advertising clients. There is no stated policy divorcing advertising from editorial, for example.

Don't be surprised by the quality of what you read here. And keep an eye on the banners and interstitials when evaluating the subjects they deem worthy of consideration...

I use it as a "heads up" on things that might be interesting to explore elsewhere. No more, no less.

[nicmart]

No standalone OS X?

What does Fried mean, "...Apple doesn't sell standalone versions of
its operating system." They certainly do. It does seem that Cnet
writers too often don't have mastery of their topics.

[capfan12]

why would there be?

you can only get OSX through apple with the purchase of a mac. why would one buy a "Full" copy of OSX when you already have a "Full" copy if you have a mac in the first place and you only need upgrade editions?

[norman619]

Are you daft?

LOL show me where you can buy a vill version or the Mac OS for sale anywhere. You can only buy upgrades not a full blown OS you can install on a bare bones system w/o an installed OS. No such beast exists. It's how Apple maintains control of their OS. I think it sucks but oh well.

[Betty Roper]

Cnet News is Not

CNet is not a journalism company. It's a marketing company that provides "News" to pull in eyeballs for its advertising clients. There is no stated policy divorcing advertising from editorial, for example.

Don't be surprised by the quality of what you read here. And keep an eye on the banners and interstitials when evaluating the subjects they deem worthy of consideration...

I use it as a "heads up" on things that might be interesting to explore elsewhere. No more, no less.

[sempercliff]

ummm, yes there is

As previously stated, there is indeed a standalone version. While it
is true that most people use it as an upgrade, it's also a full,
standalone version - even if your harddrive is empty you can install
a full running copy of OS X. I've done it before. Sounds like more
than an upgrade to me.

[norman619]

Hmmm

I will have to try that cuz I was asking myself that same question as I wrote my last post. What do you do if you loose everything. Even the ghost image you may have backed up?

[Mark Morrill]

But does the 'full' install require Mac ROM's?

I could be out of date here as I have not interest in hacking a
regular intel box, but would you not require a copy of the Mac ROM
to install Mac OS X on a non-Mac box?

[sempercliff]

ummm, yes there is

As previously stated, there is indeed a standalone version. While it
is true that most people use it as an upgrade, it's also a full,
standalone version - even if your harddrive is empty you can install
a full running copy of OS X. I've done it before. Sounds like more
than an upgrade to me.

[norman619]

Hmmm

I will have to try that cuz I was asking myself that same question as I wrote my last post. What do you do if you loose everything. Even the ghost image you may have backed up?

[Mark Morrill]

But does the 'full' install require Mac ROM's?

I could be out of date here as I have not interest in hacking a
regular intel box, but would you not require a copy of the Mac ROM
to install Mac OS X on a non-Mac box?

[rcrusoe]

Who would want to run Windows on a Mac?

That would be like winning a gold medal in the Olympics,
and having it bronzed.

[capfan12]

plenty of reasons

because not all software can be run on mac that I use on windows, and I don't want to have 10 computers sitting on my desk.

there is no mac equal to a custom developed piece of software for a corporation that runs on windows

I duel boot linux and windows for exactly that reason I develop for both platforms.

[Earl Benser]

I would agree...

... except I prefer not to run a crappy OS like Windows on a gem
like a Mac. That's why I have PC's to run Windows.

To each his own

[samkass]

Workers everywhere

If you could boot Windows, run a virtualized Windows, and/or run a native-speed Windows on a Mac, then Apple becomes a viable vendor for millions of companies around the world. I need Windows for work, and would love to just be able to use a Mac 90% of the time and switch to Windows for the necessary stuff.

[rcrusoe]

Who would want to run Windows on a Mac?

That would be like winning a gold medal in the Olympics,
and having it bronzed.

[capfan12]

plenty of reasons

because not all software can be run on mac that I use on windows, and I don't want to have 10 computers sitting on my desk.

there is no mac equal to a custom developed piece of software for a corporation that runs on windows

I duel boot linux and windows for exactly that reason I develop for both platforms.

[Earl Benser]

I would agree...

... except I prefer not to run a crappy OS like Windows on a gem
like a Mac. That's why I have PC's to run Windows.

To each his own

[samkass]

Workers everywhere

If you could boot Windows, run a virtualized Windows, and/or run a native-speed Windows on a Mac, then Apple becomes a viable vendor for millions of companies around the world. I need Windows for work, and would love to just be able to use a Mac 90% of the time and switch to Windows for the necessary stuff.

[epiac1216]

FAQ: Will Your Intel-Based Mac Run Windows

Yes, under ths sky, everything is possible. Tell Steve Jobs it can't be done, and you can be sure it will be done.

The problem lies in the legal domain. Apple will fight tooth and nail to protect MAC OS. They have been quite successful in doing it all these years.

I don't think it would be legal to run Mac computers using Windows. Ask the "Man", and he will say; No way, Jose.

[anarchyreigns]

They've already stated...

You don't know what you're talking about, nor did you read this article. Apple has already stated numerous times that they have no problem with a Macintosh running Windows.

[epiac1216]

FAQ: Will Your Intel-Based Mac Run Windows

Yes, under ths sky, everything is possible. Tell Steve Jobs it can't be done, and you can be sure it will be done.

The problem lies in the legal domain. Apple will fight tooth and nail to protect MAC OS. They have been quite successful in doing it all these years.

I don't think it would be legal to run Mac computers using Windows. Ask the "Man", and he will say; No way, Jose.

[anarchyreigns]

They've already stated...

You don't know what you're talking about, nor did you read this article. Apple has already stated numerous times that they have no problem with a Macintosh running Windows.

[Mark Morrill]

Native Virtual PC?

I think I'd rather have something like virtual PC running natively.
That way it is running in a nice controlled sandbox. The worms and
other crap that sprout can be contained.

[open-mind]

Yes, one way or another.

If Microsoft takes too long, vmware will probably jump in and beat them to the punch.

http://www.vmware.com

And if not, Darwine may be even better:

http://darwine.opendarwin.org/

[Mark Morrill]

Native Virtual PC?

I think I'd rather have something like virtual PC running natively.
That way it is running in a nice controlled sandbox. The worms and
other crap that sprout can be contained.

[open-mind]

Yes, one way or another.

If Microsoft takes too long, vmware will probably jump in and beat them to the punch.

http://www.vmware.com

And if not, Darwine may be even better:

http://darwine.opendarwin.org/

[samkass]

Not EFI

The latest hangup with installing Windows for the hackers seems to imply that the real sticking point so far is the disk partition format. Windows install media doesn't come in the GPT format that Intel Macs need to boot from. I think experiments with moving it onto a bootable media for install are ongoing.

[samkass]

Not EFI

The latest hangup with installing Windows for the hackers seems to imply that the real sticking point so far is the disk partition format. Windows install media doesn't come in the GPT format that Intel Macs need to boot from. I think experiments with moving it onto a bootable media for install are ongoing.

[ajbright]

We Are Microsoft, your life as it has been is over..

Resistance is futile. Your life as it has been is over. Your culture will adapt to service ours. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. You will be assimilated.

[ajbright]

We Are Microsoft, your life as it has been is over..

Resistance is futile. Your life as it has been is over. Your culture will adapt to service ours. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. You will be assimilated.

[Mark_Smith]

Who would install a Windows in a Mac?

From what ive heard in ten years using a PC, ppl say mac rules. I dont agree in 100%. I would like to see, yes, a PC running a MAC OS. It would be a good point to break the Microsoft monopoly over the pcs.

I dont know, Jobs can plan a MacTel computer but, imagine the damage he can do to MS if his MAC OS runs in PC with the same quality as it runs in a mac?

[open-mind]

Answer: Virtual PC and VMWare customers.

Opening OS X to run on any Intel box would hurt Apple a lot more than it would hurt Microsoft. In fact, it would probably destroy Apple.

They might license it to exclusive partners (like they did the iPod with HP), but open it completely? Forget about it. Not going to happen.

[Mark_Smith]

Who would install a Windows in a Mac?

From what ive heard in ten years using a PC, ppl say mac rules. I dont agree in 100%. I would like to see, yes, a PC running a MAC OS. It would be a good point to break the Microsoft monopoly over the pcs.

I dont know, Jobs can plan a MacTel computer but, imagine the damage he can do to MS if his MAC OS runs in PC with the same quality as it runs in a mac?

[open-mind]

Answer: Virtual PC and VMWare customers.

Opening OS X to run on any Intel box would hurt Apple a lot more than it would hurt Microsoft. In fact, it would probably destroy Apple.

They might license it to exclusive partners (like they did the iPod with HP), but open it completely? Forget about it. Not going to happen.