Comments on: Flash, HTML, Ajax: Which will win the Web app war?

Web applications are getting richer and more widespread, but it's unclear which of several competing technologies will power them.

[michaelo1966]

I think when the author refers to Flash he probably means SWF delivered applets, which includes Flash and Flex. That he didn't mention this makes me think he didn't know it which makes me think this article is about the same quality level as the Paris Hilton one that posted over the weekend. That aside, it seems to be a lot easier for Adobe to push out updated versions of the Flash VM and get them adopted than it does for browser makers to pump out new, compliant browsers and have the masses -- especially companies -- adopt them. Post Vista there's too much distrust from developers for Silverlight to become a strong contender: MS massively dropped the ball with Vista and neither admitted it nor did anything to mitigate it; it'll be a long time, probably never, before I use an MS-specific technology. Given that, I'm guessing it's going to be Flash for RIA's and a lot of new content for the foreseeable future. Client-side Java's been a basket case since it was invented and I don't see any momentum that will change that anytime soon. One addition that'd make SWF tech more attractive is the ability to install a trusted SWF, like a trusted Applet, that can break out of the sandbox (with appropriate security in place); this would be a genuine Windows killer.

[Thomas, David]

Ultimately ... none of the above, if we do our jobs right in this field.

Read a book, called "Snowcrash", or simply watch a sci-fi film like lawnmower man.

Of course this article has little to no meaning because it attempts to compare Apples to Oranges, and to compound it's meaningless, illustrates the authors lack of understanding in the field itself.

[mattquinlan]

Ignore all of the haters who want to show how smart they are by ridiculing the author as ignorant. It's a good article and timely as well.

As RIAs (rich internet applications) become an assumption when building a new website (instead of a conscious choice to differentiate) there will likely be a "winner' who establishes a dominant mindshare of web developers. It may be a single vendor (like Adobe or MSFT) or it may be the open web (with supporters like Yahoo, Google, & Apple). This doesn't mean the others just disappear, it just means that they become secondary players.

My money is on Ajax because of it's widespread support of well-established standards. The biggest challenge has been that it required ninja-level JavaScript knowledge to build webapps comparable to Flex/Silverlight. However, with the introduction of JavaScript/AJAX frameworks like Appcelerator, DOJO, Prototype, JQuery, Scriptaculous, ExtJS, etc. this is no longer the case (thank god!). The introduction of Firebug has been an incredible improvement as well for web developers.

-Quin'
VP, Community
Appcelerator
http://www.appcelerator.com

[gggg sssss]

VBscript woudl have been way easier

[gggg sssss]

Of course the accessibility Gestapo will say that none of the neat features of new -HTML will be allowed because some POS DOS based screen reader has not been updated to deal with any of the newer technologies. No Ajax or flash or silverlight for you. And the W3C will claim that anything that they did not think of in typical socialist group think mindset is bad. And any advances made by Microsoft will be branded as anti competitive, even though MS/IE are the defacto browser standard, will be equally dismissed. Why allow VBscript when the butchered hack job that is JavaScript can be foisted on the programming world. tragic.

[ambigous]

I agree with maverick nick. There is no war here. AJAX and Flash complement each other by virtue of their differences. HTML is a standard non-dynamic mark-up language required to place content in web browsers - hardly a discretionary "app."

[mossyblog]

Just like to iterate that Microsoft Silverlight compliments JavaScript exceptionally well today. In that with Silverlight 1 and 2 folks whom wish to use HTML and AJAX can do so in a more natural way than Flash.

As with Flash a developer needs to proxy calls inside the SWF file via External Interface API, which further illustrates how closed source the SWF format really is.

In Silverlight, this is not required, in fact we've provided access both inside Silverlight via the HtmlWindow Class and outside via the getElementById('YourSilverlightControl').Content API. Which allows folks the ability to reach into the Silverlight runtime without an External Interface API / Firewall.

Further, you are not restricted to just .NET, using the DLR folks have the ability to pick and choose which language they would like to use. If you will, people have the ability to add languages they wish to Silverlight (ie so far IronRuby, IronJava etc).

-
Scott Barnes
Rich Platforms Product Manager
Microsoft.

[gggg sssss]

can I have VBscript or some other incarnation of VB?

[Imalittleteapot]

Awesome. Now, AJAX is free to work in. What about those inventive amateurs that want to get their hands dirty or just developers that would like to try Silverlight before they buy? I haven't checked in a while. You got any Silverlight support in those express versions of your development tools yet?

[cauri]

It's strange that the article does not talk about Adobe Air which aims to bridge the gap between desktop and web by giving flash apps access to local resources among other things. Also it does not mention Adobe Flex as an enabling build environment for programmers. These kinds of tools and technologies give flash a distinct advantage over the other technologies. However, it will take a while before one technology takes over from another and, much like today, a lot of rich app sites will have a mash-up of different technologies, such as an html/ajax interface with a flash video player for example.

[kchecker]

all this is bull ****
the fight really is about whether html should build in the functionality that flash was providing all these years or not
flash was never intended to be an application platform by itself..
however AIR a not so old launch from Adobe is a disruptive technogy for the web..
the wear really is between conventional browser technology .. (yes all of it) and the new AIR platform

now go figure

also keep an eye at
http://defuturo.blogspot.com/

[gmclean0402]

Who cares which on-line technology will dominate. If your apps are all on-line, when the power goes out, the server goes down, Time Warner/Roadrunner goes out and all you have left is a MacBook Pro with a full battery, you will fall in love with MS Office all over again.