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June 17, 2009 4:00 AM PDT

Will new browsers really upgrade the Web?

by Stephen Shankland

Mozilla is exhorting users to "upgrade the Web" with Firefox 3.5 and variations on that better-browsing theme can be found with Google's Chrome, Apple's Safari, and Opera.

The hope is that the Web will evolve from a series of relatively static pages to a lively home for Web applications--everything from today's e-mail to tomorrow's spreadsheets. But it could take awhile for reality to catch up with the vision.

It's indeed a bright, shiny future for browsers, and the avant-garde is advancing rapidly. Web developers eager to invigorate their Web sites or build fancy Web applications have to reckon not only with the massive, slower-moving army of ordinary Web browsers, but also with inconsistent support for the latest technology.

Browsers of the future
Many of new browser features stem from HTML 5, the still-not-finalized next iteration of the HyperText Markup Language standard that defines how Web pages are described. HTML 5 has spurred the arrival of built-in video and audio, local storage that Web sites or applications can use, "Web workers" that can perform background processing tasks for a Web application, drag-and-drop for better user interfaces, and other technologies.

That's not all. Also on the frontier:

• Faster JavaScript--the language that powers Web applications such as Google Docs--is a public priority for all the top browsers except Microsoft, and performance has surged in the last year.

• Google wants browsers to use computers' processing power with Native Client and O3D.

• Through Opera Unite, Opera wants browsers to host their own applications by turning the browser into a server others can visit.

• And a variety of other standards--CSS (Cascading Style Sheets) and SVG (Scalable Vector Graphics)--stand to improve browsers' graphical sophistication.

• Geolocation technology can, with the your permission, let a Web site know where you are to tailor location-specific content accordingly.

Bumps on the HTML 5 video road
The case of video support is illustrative. HTML 5 includes the "video" tag, which holds the potential to make video as routine and easy to handle as images have been for more than a decade on the Web. Instead of having to rely on a browser plug-in such as Adobe Systems' Flash Player, Microsoft's Silverlight, or Apple's Quicktime, video becomes a native part of the Web.

In theory at least. In practice, HTML 5 video is rough around the edges.

One of the biggest issues is inconsistent standards support. For images, most browsers get by fine with JPEG, GIF, and PNG formats. But in video, Mozilla has built in support for Ogg Theora, while Safari and Chrome are inclined toward the H.264 standard. The former may be distributed without licensing and royalty constraints, but the latter is more widely used to supply video content today.

So, for example, video site DailyMotion is transcoding its 300,000 videos to Ogg, but at least for now, only Firefox will play them in that format. Other browsers revert to Flash, so the site still functions without Ogg support, but that's status quo for the Web. Is it the job of the operating system, a plug-in, or the browser to supply video-decoding software?

HTML video does offer a significant departure from Flash's embedded rectangular boxes, and it's arriving on advanced mobile devices such as Apple's iPhone and Google Android phones that presently lack Flash support.

"You can start to get the Web page interacting with the video," Firefox Director Mike Beltzner said in an interview Tuesday. For example, one video can be embedded within another, and JavaScript can control the video. In one demonstration, a face-recognition software learned who was in a running video, then identified those individuals later.

A different problem afflicts local storage, which lets browser-based applications store data on a person's PC or phone, for example letting Gmail work even without a network connection. The technology derived from Google's Gears project, which embedded the SQLite database software, but others have questioned whether SQL's syntax is the best interface for Web developers. Even relying on SQLite as a standard doesn't guarantee compatibility because browsers can use different versions, Beltzner observed.

Refresh rate
It doesn't just take time for standards to be hashed out. It takes time for users to update to new browsers and for Web developers to decide there's critical mass to support them.

The most notable example is Internet Explorer 6, which initially shipped in 2001 and still is in widespread use. IE overall has 66 percent market share, according to Net Applications' May 2009 statistics; IE's share breaks down to 41 percent for IE 7, 17 percent for IE 6, and 7 percent for IE 8.

Web programmers long have bemoaned IE 6. There's a Stop IE 6 campaign. More recently, John Martz attracted attention with his cartoon message created for use when IE 6 users visit the Momentile Web site; it depicts various browsers in the treehouse spurning IE 6.

One of the benefits of Adobe's Flash is that it sidesteps some of these issues. Of course, it's a proprietary plug-in, not an open standard, which raises some developer hackles. But Flash works the same on different browsers and different operating systems, and Adobe has a reliable mechanism to upgrade users relatively swiftly to the latest version.

"Flash's success paints a target on its back," Adobe blogger John Dowdell said in a blog post about Mozilla's publicity pitch. "'Upgrading the Web' is what happens with each new Flash generation."

But browsers are getting more fluid with auto-update technology. Though Microsoft, in particular, is held back by business-user requirements, all major browsers come with technology to download and install the latest versions relatively easily. Chrome updates itself automatically without giving users any say in the matter, making its upgrade cycle perhaps the fastest of all.

Until the large number of IE 6 and IE 7 users and conservative businesses can be persuaded to get on the fast-upgrade train, though, programmers will have to reckon with older browsers, too.

But the new-browser generation has one thing going for it: standards. HTML, CSS, SVG, JavaScript, and other technologies remain fluid, but they're in the driver's seat in a way they weren't in the days of Microsoft's unquestioned dominance.

More browser variety, along with IE 8's standards-mode default, means Web developers can rely more on standards than on whatever Microsoft chose to do in 2001. It's a long way to a faster, richer, more powerful Web, but the path is clear.

Stephen Shankland writes about a wide range of technology and products, but has a particular focus on browsers and digital photography. He joined CNET News in 1998 and since then also has covered Google, Yahoo, servers, supercomputing, Linux and open-source software, and science. E-mail Stephen, or follow him on Twitter at http://www.twitter.com/stshank.
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Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 2 pages (70 Comments)
by sadiq815 June 17, 2009 4:23 AM PDT
Honestly, how do they still use IE6, our computers at school still IE6 and they are running XP too! What happened to the upgrades. Thats why I use Chrome on the school PCs.
Reply to this comment
by SactoGuy018 June 17, 2009 4:40 AM PDT
Actually, most users have at least upgraded to IE 7, since that is a vastly more secure and better-featured browser than IE 6 (just the tabbed browsing mode is worth the upgrade).
by aMUSICsite June 17, 2009 4:59 AM PDT
Our company only upgraeded to IE7 about a month ago. We had to buy new terminal servers to cope with the memory and resources needed to run IE7.
by Shankland June 17, 2009 6:47 AM PDT
@aMUSICsite: Thanks for commenting. I get a lot of "Why don't they just upgrade?" remarks from people who have responsibility for administering their own PC and no others, but it's not always simple matter, especially in bigger businesses.
by LinuxRules June 17, 2009 6:57 AM PDT
Educated Zombees
by massfat June 17, 2009 7:29 AM PDT
I know lots of networks that still use IE 5...
by umbrae June 17, 2009 7:45 AM PDT
Most that do not upgrade are corporations. We have a key application that is required by most of the company to do business day to day. The application only works in IE and detects anything over IE6 as a non-IE browser. The application version we are using is unsupported and upgrading the product, and all the customized sub-applications, would cost several million dollars. The company can either upgrade or replace the application, but the cost is extreme. The business end sees staying with IE6 a more cost effective solution.

The fact is that past IE versions created a lot of laziness in the development community and that makes it hard to upgrade when applications need to be replaced or upgraded just to support the newer browsers. I think once we get past IE6/7 this may become less common.
by abcd9009 June 17, 2009 9:52 AM PDT
I agree with @umbrae. I blame the software developers for apps used by Large Corporations. This can be in-house apps or third party Apps but it's because of those Apps that large companies are so reluctant to upgrade since upgrading might break those apps which are considered the lifeline for the Companies. Although it can be resolved by some minor patches to the Apps which can be in-expensive it's those wonderful Sales Reps trying to convince the Top Mgmt to upgrade just so they can make a Sale and those people in the Top Mgmt have no Technical clue but have the power to make decisions and people below have to support those mistakes.
Even today when IT is supposed to be as important to any business as Sales & Marketing, IT is still considered as a step-child and any expense towards IT is either delayed for as long as possible or is undermined by the Top Mgmt.
I don't blame Microsoft completely for the non-compatibility issue. They cannot innovate because they are obligated to support the legacy systems used by Large corporations unlike Mozilla or Google or Apple. Google is entering the Enterprise market with the Google App and they too will soon end up with this problem of supporting Legacy systems.
by Mergatroid Mania June 17, 2009 11:51 AM PDT
I agree 100%. I still use IE6 in my business. For internet browsing I use Firefox, but because mane companies we deal with use older browser apps that will not work in anything newer than IE6 we have to keep it around.

IMHO This is what happens when people make applications that work in browsers. Browsers are constantly updated while the applications may not be. This leads to older applications breaking in newer browsers.

For my business, I have been using all applications on our computers that do not require a browser to operate.

I see a cool future where we have 3d browsers and cool video and other stuff on the web, but I'll stick with local applications.
by techmagick June 18, 2009 12:08 PM PDT
I think it all boils done to the apps and programmers writting to the browser instead of the standard. Once this is done the costs to upgrade all the code is through the roof. The general corpthink is if it ain't broke don't fix. This works OK in the short term; but, for lomg term strategic applications you end up with things like a dependency on IE6.
by tsm26 June 20, 2009 9:06 AM PDT
It is as much the fault of the IT that bought into the apps as much as the developers. Especially if you made those apps an integral part of the company without a proper upgrade plan. IE 6 should not be used by any company, big or small. It is IT's job to have a plan, and if they didn't, they only have themselves to blame. Additionally, the costs to upgrade referenced above are a complete exaggeration, but IT likes to do that (I work in IT, I know it well) On my sites, I am now only doing simple testing on IE6, and any support done if they call in with issues on it is only worked on if they use IE7+, Firefox 2+, Safari etc.
by silverdoctor2000 June 17, 2009 5:07 AM PDT
I personally can't wait for IE6 to drop off the face of the planet :) But until then I am swearing allegiance to no one - I'll pick the browser that does what I need it to do the best whoever it comes from... And use more than 1 as necessary - there is no reason why you can't run more than 1 or 2 browsers at the same time http://richelectron.blogspot.com/2009/05/google-chrome-browser-download-firefox.html
Reply to this comment
by Shankland June 17, 2009 6:51 AM PDT
I use three or four browsers most days, but that's more out of professional curiosity than any necessity. I generally find it easy to switch, except that passwords, bookmarks, and more important, browsing history isn't synchronized across them. There are a few cases where I can't use a particular browser (usually Chrome, especially the very raw Mac OS X version) with a particular site, but for me that's unusual.
by massfat June 17, 2009 7:30 AM PDT
I can't wait for IE 5 to seriously just **** 'cause that browser is ancient yet people still use it...
by forever4now June 17, 2009 5:09 AM PDT
There should be a global campaign to get people to upgrade their browsers. This would help new web technologies advance more quickly & make the lives of web developers easier.

Perhaps global governments should fund awareness programs (major newspaper ads, etc.) that highlight the issue to normal consumers. After all, global internet commerce depends heavily on the internet & its related technologies & standards.
Reply to this comment
by TV James June 17, 2009 11:44 AM PDT
Chicken and egg. People need to upgrade their browsers before app developers will recognize that there are better browsers out there and develop for them. People can't upgrade their browsers as long as there are certain applications out there that only work on older browsers.

Our organization is stuck on IE6 because there are a number of web applications that are mission critical for HR, payroll, accounting, business continuity, etc., that are optimized for IE6 and don't render at all with IE7 or other standards-compliant browsers.

Yes, the applications are sloppy hacks run by companies who don't know anything about the web and purchased by groups here who don't know anything about the web, so we're kinda stuck. (Even upgrading your browser on your own to IE7 here messes up applications installed on the computer.)
by Aaron Kempf June 17, 2009 12:53 PM PDT
there should be a global campaign to stick all the firefox / chrome journalists to cuba.
and the poor college students that somehow think that firefox is 'faster'

firefox isn't faster.
it's not more secure

it doesn't half half the features of IE.

and now google is jamming their own version of rich clients down your throat-- so you guys think that somehow-- IE has been _WRONG_ for doing this.. and now chrome wants to do the same thing?

Most web developer that primarily use firefox are 100% out of touch with reality.
go get a new job if you want to use obsolete netscape tech!!
by forever4now June 17, 2009 2:39 PM PDT
@ Aaron Kempf

Wow! You made a couple of VERY emotional IE statements, in the comments for this article. Are you an IE developer?

This comment was not about IE. It was simply suggesting that there be a campaign to get people who are using outdated browsers to upgrade them, so that web developers can start making use of some of the latest features of HTML5, etc.
by Paldasan June 17, 2009 5:17 AM PDT
Global governments? They are going to be one of the last groups (as a whole) to upgrade anything. Quite aside from cost justification you also have to provide training for up-skilling and the downtime associated with that and there is the security factor, having to constantly vet new browsers every time they upgrade will be a nightmare.
Reply to this comment
by zeroplane June 17, 2009 12:56 PM PDT
Your joking right?

IE6 is over 8 years old and has over 20 security hole in it right now, even if you install all of Microsoft's security patches. To play the security card when justifying not upgrading IE6 for a corporation is just appalling if not totally ignorant at best.

Here is some light reading.. scroll down to the security vulnerabilities section http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer#Security_vulnerabilities
by philoanchisaurus June 17, 2009 5:18 AM PDT
Just a comment for Stephen Shankland's editors. You might want to take a look at paragraphs 3, 4 (last sentence), 10 and 12.
Reply to this comment
by dave_p_1 June 17, 2009 6:47 AM PDT
The one problem that is rarely addressed in articles about the new web frontier is the minuscule limits on data traffic. As one who accesses the web for several hours per day via EVDO, I regularly bump up against the monthly data limit in "unlimited" plans (and that is with normal browsing - not YouTubing). Having sites pushing video at me is not going to help.
Reply to this comment
by LinuxRules June 17, 2009 6:55 AM PDT
Flash should be based on the server not the desktop. That way fou never need to upgrade flash again only the server will have to. If you do not have the 'latest' flash you are basically screwed.
Reply to this comment
by MadLyb June 17, 2009 7:09 AM PDT
So what renders the Flash stream and how does that client evolve to support changes that inevitably occur?

Perhaps you do not fully understand how Flash works.
by Random_Walk June 17, 2009 8:33 AM PDT
No can do... for MadLyb's reasons, and because it would seriously slow down the client side every time the client browser had to stop, download the updated code, and implement it.
by Aaron Kempf June 17, 2009 12:49 PM PDT
wow dude, that's just plain dumb.. do you know anything about how the web works?
by jture June 17, 2009 6:56 AM PDT
If you want to use a fancy term, at least spell it right. It's "avant garde," not "avante garde."
Reply to this comment
by Shankland June 17, 2009 7:26 AM PDT
Thanks! Fixed that up.
by MadLyb June 17, 2009 7:14 AM PDT
It's all about standards, features and bloat.

FIrst, the standards are pretty loose resulting in issues wit interpretation and the only real interoperability testing is ACID which isn't bulletproof.

Then, we have browsers trying to out feature each other which results in:

Bloat and what should be a nimble document and light application container becomes one of the largest resource hogs on my machine.
Reply to this comment
by Shankland June 17, 2009 7:26 AM PDT
At what point should browser makers decide the Web is good enough? 1995? 2000? 2009? I agree bloat is a problem, but personally I enjoy and benefit from a lot of the new features. The lighter the application container, the lighter the applications, more or less. For that matter, should we stop with new operating systems, new applications, new network protocols? They all add bloat, too. Bloat is a problem, but I think it's pretty unrealistic to expect the computing industry to embrace stasis.
by Aaron Kempf June 17, 2009 12:49 PM PDT
who cares about ACID?

I want firefox and chrome to be able to do everything that IE does before I begin to care!!!
by MadLyb June 17, 2009 1:53 PM PDT
Hey Stephen,

I am not saying that things should not evolve, but it is the combination of a broken standards process combined with proprietary implementation of what standards we have that leads to the headaches we have in cross-browser functionality.

I worked with the groups that established the standards for EDI-Int (Electronic Data Interchange over the Internet) and it was quickly recognized that the key to making the standards successful was to establish interoperability testing and certification and I think the browser market could stand a good dose of this process.

Of course, who should do this testing is another matter. 8^)

BTW, thanks for being active in the conversation after you post. It really adds to the discussion.

Matt
by Shankland June 18, 2009 8:04 AM PDT
@MadLyb: I thoroughly agree with you on the imperfections of standards processes for browsers. It's been a mess for years--remember XHTML? I do feel like HTML 5 is working a lot of bugs out of the standardization system, though. One of the classic standards problems is of course that they're so slow-moving, and the browser market is anything but that right now.

Having watched a lot of standards, successful and otherwise, I have concluded there is a big gap between standards and reality. Reference designs can help clear up the inevitable ambiguity in the spec, at least, though. Certification is a nightmare, of course. Handy tests like ACID3 are a help, at least, even if they're imperfect. Certification? That's going to be tough.
by Shankland June 17, 2009 7:15 AM PDT
Thanks! Fixed that up.
Reply to this comment
by BtmnHatesRbn June 17, 2009 7:30 AM PDT
Since I tour many big and small business offices and workstations, here's what I've seen in Arizona, California, Nevada, and Utah:

Most companies are still stuck on Windows 95/98/2000/Me/XP. 98 and 2000 have the largest amount of installs.

Occasional law firm or hobby shop still using Windows 3.1 or DOS.

Windows Update hasn't been applied to most of those installs. Ever. The company simply doesn't care.

Unless it was a media company, and most of them have switched to either Harris or Apple systems, people are still stuck on old Windows without updates or anything upgraded about either IE6 or IE5.
Reply to this comment
by SJ2571 June 17, 2009 7:34 AM PDT
That's because 98 and 2000 work perfectly fine, and can be just as secure as Vista or Win 7. To believe otherwise shows total ignorance on how to lock down a PC, and it's what Microsoft wants you to believe through their propaganda.
by TV James June 17, 2009 11:50 AM PDT
@SJ - I highly doubt the same people that have not seen fit to upgrade are going to generally be the same people that know how to correctly lock down 98 or 2000. 2000, maybe, but locking down those are pretty oppressive to the end user and time-consuming and easy to completely foul up the system.
by saintseminole June 17, 2009 7:39 AM PDT
"Why don't they just upgrade?" This question only makes sense to the developers of new web technology, and young persons who are anxious to try anything new. Keep in mind that a large portion of the web-using public has other stuff to do -- go to work at non-tech jobs, shop at stores -- not online, meet with friends/family, etc.

So many people find what works for them and stick with it. "Why should I upgrade?" is the question they're asking, "as long as the old tech works for me?"
Reply to this comment
by June 17, 2009 7:41 AM PDT
Internet Explorer first shipped in 2001? I can remember using IE at least back in 1997, and it was already in version 3. Perhaps you meant IE6?
Reply to this comment
by Shankland June 17, 2009 8:18 AM PDT
Yes, thanks, I meant IE 6. Corrected.
by __cpm__ June 17, 2009 8:58 AM PDT
This article is an embarassment to journalism. I notice that Mr.Shankland has already corrected some glaring mistakes, yet the article is still chock-full of obvious spelling errors and missing words. If he can't be bothered to even re-read his article for typos, what does that say about the quality of the content?
Reply to this comment
by bourgtai June 17, 2009 9:16 AM PDT
There is a plethora of grammatical, syntax, and spelling errors in the "Browsers of the Future" and "Bumps on the HTML 5 Road" sections. It was really bothersome reading about "'Web workers' that can perform background processing tasks so a Web application.'
Reply to this comment
by C.Schroeder June 17, 2009 9:33 AM PDT
Interesting article, but it could use some editorial cleanup.
Reply to this comment
by m.meister June 17, 2009 10:24 AM PDT
Face it, with a little guts, we could easily rid ourselves of IE 6. All it would take is for 10-15 major sites to block IE 6 (with links to alternative, more modern browsers). I'm betting if that happened, IE 6 usage would drop down to single digits in just a couple months time. Same could be done with IE 7.

When you can no longer access major sites, users will switch browsers. It does require a bit of guts, because your pushing away users. Unfortunately, corporations are generally spineless in this area, so they aren't willing to take the risk -- even if it would quickly pay off for all.

For example, while Microsoft is happy to push Silverlight contents on you, it won't force you to upgrade to IE 8 to access their site.
Reply to this comment
by thelemurking June 17, 2009 10:32 AM PDT
Other than Apple, does anyone really still use QuickTime for web video? I hate QuickTime, I hate how when it inadvertedly gets installed, it wants to play MP3s in my browser when instead of downloading them. Why does Apple insist on using it when Flash is clearly the winning standard for video.

It will be interesting to see how the video tag comes into play and how that will work... specifically for required codecs and such.
Reply to this comment
by kelmon June 18, 2009 4:05 AM PDT
I will hear nothing bad said about QuickTime - the H.264 video codec is excellent at produces high quality video at low file sizes and bit rates. The Player for Windows could certainly use an upgrade but the underlying technology is sound and I wish it was used a lot more. The only reason why it isn't is most likely due to the need to have QuickTime installed on the client and therefore it isn't particularly common compared to the likes of WIndows Media Player.
by David Stamps June 17, 2009 10:52 AM PDT
Upgrades to Microsoft products might generate more enthusiasm if they often didn't require massive retraining and/or reconfiguration. After upgrading one WS to IE8, I had to spend 10 minutes figuring why several websites suddenly stopped working. I remember one update Outlook Express that blacklist all pdf files unless the user dug into options to unset the checkbox.
Reply to this comment
by FearNo1 June 17, 2009 10:53 AM PDT
I did not know there was a royalty with h.264. I thought it was an open standard.
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