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September 13, 2007 2:56 PM PDT

Mossberg's Ubuntu Linux verdict: Nope

by Stephen Shankland

Walt Mossberg, the influential Wall Street Journal reviewer who strikes fear into the hearts of computing and gadget companies, has weighed in on Ubuntu Linux.

And it's bad news for Linux fans.

Despite Dell's endorsement of the Canonical-sponsored software and its decision to sell PCs with it installed, Mossberg thinks Ubuntu isn't ready for mainstream folks.

His conclusion: "Even in the relatively slick Ubuntu variation, Linux is still too rough around the edges for the vast majority of computer users. While Ubuntu looks a lot like Windows or Mac OS X, it is full of little complications and hassles that will quickly frustrate most people who just want to use their computers, not maintain or tweak them."

Specifically, Mossberg griped about having to download codecs to play ordinary audio and video files, and some codecs were labeled "bad" or "ugly"; an oversensitive but unadjustable touch pad; and a lousy time connecting an iPod.

"Open source is a two-edged sword. While it draws on smart developers from many places, nobody is ultimately responsible for the quality of the product, and open-source developers often have an imperfect feel for how average people use software," Mossberg said.

Originally posted at Underexposed
Stephen Shankland writes about a wide range of technology and products, but has a particular focus on browsers and digital photography. He joined CNET News in 1998 and since then also has covered Google, Yahoo, servers, supercomputing, Linux and open-source software, and science. E-mail Stephen, or follow him on Twitter at http://www.twitter.com/stshank.
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Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 2 pages (37 Comments)
Agreed
by mjm01010101 September 13, 2007 3:55 PM PDT
I agree.

But as a techie who is sick of monopolist behaviors by Microsoft, and RDF by Apple, I've jumped ship at home. My kids are learning on Linux, and I have no issues with continuing that tradition forever.
Reply to this comment
But Ubuntu IS catching up
by CompEng September 14, 2007 7:05 AM PDT
I'm probably not the target audience here, but I found it pretty pleasant when I set up my game machine to dual-boot with Ubuntu. I did have a few hiccups getting Ubuntu ready, mostly because I had to use ndiswrapper to get my wireless network card working and because of the codec issues the reviewer mentioned. Also I must have done something to lose my OpenGL hardware support for my ATI card, and had to reinstall that, which was a tad trying. There were frustrations I just didn't have with Windows.

But if you buy a new Dell with Ubuntu, you probably won't have these issues. And it's not like my work laptop or my wife's Windows machine that slow to a crawl after a year or so without "proper maintenance" and need 12 varieties of firewall, antivirus, antispyware, etc.
And finding free software for darn near any purpose is so pleasant with Ubuntu. Web-based package installs are just the greatest thing ever. I just hit "sudo aptitude" and I feel like a kid in a candy store.

For myself, I picked up linux because I thought it might be fun to program a couple small computer games for my kids. I might be biased by my work experience, but I found the programming tools for linux/KDE to be freer, richer, and all-around much more pleasant than working with the M$'s giveaway adware compiler.
Unfortunately, I agree...
by ukukwi September 13, 2007 4:02 PM PDT
I'm a software developer (for 20 years now). I have used Windows for many, many years. I used Unix in the late 80's and early 90's. I am fairly experienced.

I found just the installation of Ubuntu on my fairly new HP laptop to be a major disappointment. Primarily because it wouldn't. Things that are taken for granted with Windows, OS X, or any other commercial OS are not necessarily available in an Open Source OS because the developers just haven't had time to build the right drivers or whatever.

I really, really wanted Ubuntu to work for me. But in the end it didn't and trying to fix it was more hassle than it was worth. There's not enough payoff...

I'll try again in the future, I'm sure, but for now I'm sticking with M$.
Reply to this comment
that's interesting... but
by ethan.shepard September 13, 2007 4:32 PM PDT
I'm NOT a developer. I've loaded two HP's (zt3000's - varying in a number of options) with Ubuntu - and had absolutely no problems! One HP had become so unstable with XP Pro - it was hard not to attribute it to "hardware" problems. The Wireless LAN was done. Ubuntu Feisty - 20 minutes - working without any - I repeat - any issues. But I agree - Linux is not for the masses. So what?
View reply
This is dumb...
by cidman2001 September 13, 2007 4:24 PM PDT
The whole point of Linux was to offer an alternative OS that you didn't have to get Redmond or Cuppertino's permission to use and modify. It was never intended to be "approachable" by the average consumer. Although I may agree with Mossberg's assesment, the whole "Is it ready for the masses" question is a no brainer, as nobody claims it's completely polished in any form available. Hence the label "alternative OS".
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pfft masses
by devilsclaw September 13, 2007 5:09 PM PDT
I'm happy that Linux is not ready for the masses.

People in general are lazy, impatient, stupid, and don't really care if its secure, as long as it works. this attitude is what has made Windows what Windows is today. Bloated and insecure.

I have used Microsoft software since DOS 3.03 until Windows XP SP2. You can make your system secure by getting a router and setting up its firewall settings, and then making sure your not a stupid user who downloads things like Limewire, fake codecs to watch porn, and other things that you have no clue what they do on your system.

The person who reviewed Ubuntu must have been the impatient or lazy type if he didn't get his/her new laptop working with it.

If the masses used Linux a lot of them would want to be the root user since its just easier and then opening them self to the same stuff windows is basically. With more people doing that, more viruses would work in Linux and then we will get to hear how insecure Linux is even though its the stupid people who just want things to work and don't care what it cost.
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Disagree
by ecartman0 September 13, 2007 5:20 PM PDT
Well Im not a software developer, but I have played with computers since my vic20. I have tried Linux at various times over the years and just didn't have the time to invest. Well I got a bleeding edge gamer with Vista pre-installed and hated it. Wallpaper disappeared the first day and never came back, tried Premier and U Lead to do some video work, but no luck, wouldn't install. Nero worked perfectly though. When the DX standard was upped and I realized my 500 dollar Nvidia video board (8800gtx) was already a step down I stuck a Feisty cd in the drive and have had fun ever since. Yeah the time I used to spend gaming is now spent learning a new system but hey I spent 20 years learning the in's and outs of Windows. I had my bleeding edge(lol) gamer with its dual core 64 bit AMD, and like I said nice video card and my 22" LCD monitor, up and running in 15 minutes and had it playing my MP3 files and watching videos on CNN by then too. Oh and my Ipod now works fine also. That took maybe 10 more minutes. I'm almost 60 now and the old brain ain't what it used to be, but installing Ubuntu is like falling off a log. Can't say it will work as easy for you but with the "live cd's" and programs out there like Wubi, give it a shot, there is really nothing to lose.
Good Luck
Cart
Reply to this comment
Right on Cart!
by MerlinsLair September 14, 2007 6:43 AM PDT
Agree 100% with you. If Mossberg had given it any decent amount of time to get used to the new OS, he would have had something else to say. But I, like many others out there, suspect this article of his had more to do with the timing of Ubuntu's next release instead of being an objective observation.
I agree
by beubanks7507 September 13, 2007 5:30 PM PDT
Linux isn't for the masses yet in any form. Even Red Hat's
Enterprise Linux, which is supposed to be end user ready at
some level, isn't ready for the average consumer.

I use Mac OS X version 10.4.10 and I think it is polished enough
for anyone to use but, there are a few features here that are
essential to an end user system (listen up MS):

1). Remove the option to run as root. There is no need to run
as root 95% of the time. I think OS X has it right in this respect.
They have a 3 way split for user privileges: root, super user,
user. This means that you have to "sudo" in to do anything as
root because, you by default can't run as root automatically.
This split has started to show up in some linux versions.

2). A polished interface. End users have to be considered dumb
when it comes to computers. So you have to have a GUI that can
do nearly everything that you can do in a terminal window
because, you don't want someone who doesn't know what they
are doing playing in a terminal window. Here, OS X fails a little
because you still have to go to the terminal window to do some
stuff efficiently. Linux is just as bad or worse. MS barely even
has a terminal window but, their interface sucks already.

3). Technical Support. People need to know that if they get in
trouble on their machines, there is someone they can call. Linux
doesn't have this unless you count the 12 year old computer
geek next door.

4). Windows Driver Compatibility. As there aren't many
companies that put out linux drivers for their products, why not
make a conversion program that can utilize the windows drivers.
This would allow the use of nearly any accessory with Linux and
would provide a bridge until the time that Linux drivers become
common.

IMHO, these are the four areas that Linux needs to improve in to
be competitive in the OS "market".
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RE: Mossberg's Ubuntu Linux verdict: Nope
by protagonistic September 13, 2007 7:35 PM PDT
I have to say his experiences pretty much parallel mine. Don't
get me wrong, I like Linux but it is still not for someone with
limited computer experience. And some things don't "just work"
out of the box.

Maybe I was just spoiled by using BeOS for quite a few years, but
I use a computer as a tool and I don't have time to be tweaking
things all the time. So for now I use OS X to get most of my work
done and PC-BSD to have some fun. And I still keep a HD empty
to install new Linux releases and other OS's on. Call me an
optimist, but I keep hoping one of them will finally make the
grade.
Reply to this comment
what would you expect?
by MadBrainiac September 13, 2007 10:56 PM PDT
Well I didn't expect Mossberg to say anything less than what was said. But honestly, lets look at something called objectivity for one moment. The guy sits next to Steve Jobs and Bill Gates in brunches and you'd want him to say, yes Linux is good and Ubuntu is ready for the desktop so that other people won't buy a Windows or god forbid an Apple based OSX desktop system. First and foremost, Linux was never for the average user and its sad to think that some journalists keep trying to convince people that its ready. Its not yet ready but its definately more powerful than your average Windows or OSX desktop for that matter. And when people are going to realise for once, this is a FREE operating system. Its built by people who want to promote technology and improve people's lives and not make you pay for it. Ubuntu has never asked people for money, never said hey give me 10 dollars and I'll give you a really nice looking operating system with features that are provided in 300+ euros/dollars/whatever currency operating system made by professional companies. Yet people like Walt Mossberg come out and say well its not as easy as Windows or OSX and its not up to par. Linux has evolved hugely over the past decade simply because people around the world want to improve the OS. There will be a time very soon, where there will be enough tooling for Ubuntu and enough open source projects that will produce software that will satisfy even punters like Walt Mossberg (at some level although I doubt it). And for goodness sake sometimes you just have to experience something on your own before you get an opinion on something. Sometimes you have to not listen to any techevangelist out there and have your own say in the matter. If you really want to find out about Ubuntu get the CD use it and check for yourself if its really that bad or not.
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What is your point?
by ewelch September 14, 2007 6:40 AM PDT
Linux is not ready for the mainstream or it's not. You couldn't
take on Mossberg's criticisms directly, because he's right. And
the whole point about open source software is very clear. It's not
ready for grandma. Or people who want to do work on their
computers, not work ON their computers.

Again, what point? The old saying comes to mind. "A camel is a
horse designed by a committee." Only OS X has a singular vision
directing how it should work. Steve Jobs. That's been the genius
of Apple. The iPod, iPhone, etc. Agree with him or not, that's the
best part of OS X. The OS is designed to be used. Not tweaked,
like Linux. Even codec updates are simple, not to mention
firmware and OS updates. Click a button, type in an
administrators password (it's easy, not unsafe) and it's done.

Windows' biggest problem is that it's designed by a bunch of
very smart people, but it's a bunch of people. Thousands. How
could it possibly be put together well? Same with Linux. The idea
is great, the execution after all these years is that it's still not
ready for prime time. Too much work to make it function.
Computers need to be like refrigerators. They should do what
they do without any necessary intervention by most users.
Hobbyists need not apply. They can play their mix and match
games and it makes them happy. Most computer users don't
want that nonsense. It's like expecting people to buy cars based
on how easy it is for them to replace the timing chain
themselves. Insanity!
View reply
Funny
by arunsub September 14, 2007 7:44 AM PDT
I agree that there are certain rough edges to be fixed, but I don't agree with his reasoning.
First, he should understand that unlike Windows, Most of the companies don't provide drivers for Linux. If you think of Windows without 3rd party drivers, then Windows will suck more than Linux.
Second, he complains about playing mp3. He should understand that mp3 is a proprietary format, so there are legal issues involved using it. Ubuntu makes using mp3 easier by automatically downloading the codecs and installing it.
Third, he wrote about his kodak and iPod problem. I'm using my iPod with Ubuntu without any problem for the past 1-2 years. I'm using my Nikon camera with Ubuntu without any issue. It must be something wrong with his installation/hardware combination.
He needs to come out of Windows mind. I agree there is a lot to be done, but Windows without 3rd party support will suck much more than Linux. Linux is doing a wonderful job without much support from the hardware industry.
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DVD
by arunsub September 14, 2007 7:47 AM PDT
I forgot to add the DVD part. Windows won't play the DVD by default. You have to use the 3rd party DVD player that comes with your system or the DVD drive else you have to install the codec for Windows Media player to play the DVD. Similarly, you have to install the codec to play the DVDs in Ubuntu. Once you install the necessary files, Totem, MPlayer, VLC etc can play the DVDs without any problem. Totem comes as default with Ubuntu.
Ugh
by ev5unleash September 14, 2007 7:45 AM PDT
Who is this guy anyway. Ubuntu works perfectly and most complications usally happens though the person who's running it. For the most part if your looking to really tweak any Operating System you'd have problems.

Even if you do have problems that mostly occors with hardware Ubuntu has the best fourm out there (ubuntuforums.org). And who is mossberg to say this stuff about Ubuntu Linux.
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Who is mossberg?
by rapier1 September 14, 2007 8:01 AM PDT
Well, he's someone that is actually really quite smart, very
influential, and looks at the larger issue. Oddly enough, he also
happens to be correct. Linux, not even Ubuntu, is quite ready for
prime time. Why anyone is surprised by this I have no idea.
Keep in Mind
by rapier1 September 14, 2007 8:11 AM PDT
There is more to the computer experience than just how well or
quickly something installs. There is more to it than just how
much hardware it supports. The experience is the entire process
of using the system - the human interaction with the system
(aka Human Computer Interaction - HCI). The interface, the
responsiveness, the consistency, and support. If everything
comes to gether well then you have a top notch experience and
*this* can happen under almost any OS as it is very subjective.

I think a *very* important point is that, for the most part, there
is no consistency in the user interface with many linux GUI
applications (and even less for CLI apps). Each developer makes
their own assumptions about how to do thngs - usually with
*very* little insight into the entire process of interface design or
HCI. Since there are very few UI design docs for linux and evebn
fewer people adhering to them you end up with a hodgepodge
of interface methodologies. This is *very* frustrating to a lot of
people.

I believe that if someone scould impose a consistent and
standard interface on a linux core it would be a very very strong
contender. Until that happens I believe it will remain a niche
product vis a vis mainstream users.

BTW: Citing personal qualifications on here is generally
pointless. I could say that I'm a nobel laureate after all. So take
what I say on its own merit.
Reply to this comment
I agree sort of
by dswatik September 14, 2007 8:31 AM PDT
Well I agree its not ready for the masses but nothing ever is really...Windows has its draw backs too and learning curves.

But there is one thing that has bothered me about Linux and that is no matter what distrobution I have tried there is always some piece of hardware that gives me grief, if its not my wireless card its my video....

But I have not ruled it out yet, I do plan on getting a new machine with Ubuntu already pre-installed at least then I know it will work out of the box.
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Mossberg?
by destreet September 14, 2007 8:50 AM PDT
I've always wondered why Mossberg is so influential. A few months ago I saw an ad by Ask.com (AskJeeves) quoting some positives things he said about their search engine as a real alternative to Google. I thought "How did the worst search engine EVER make such a dramatic improvement?" Well, in 5 minutes, I determined that it may no longer be the worst, but it can't come close to Google. The results are displayed much "prettier", but the richness of the content is far less.

My conclusion. Mossberg is a moron.

BTW - I've used Ubuntu exclusively for the past 3 months on my laptop. I'm never going back.

Sure, I've had some glitches to deal with, but no more than with Windows. A big difference is that if I stumble into something that doesn't work, I visit the Ubuntu forum and find a solution in a few minutes. With Windows you get no real support from the computer vendor and you have to pay for help to get MS to solve one of their short comings.
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Ubuntu?
by cary1 September 14, 2007 11:17 AM PDT
"I visit the Ubuntu forum and find a solution in a few minutes. With Windows you get no real support from the computer vendor "

Really? For every Ubuntu Forum, there are a hundred Microsoft Forums. There are more forums about Freecell than there about Ubuntu!

I have tried Ubuntu forums... they are not as helpful as you think. In most of the forum entries, they assume I already know a lot. For example, when I was reading documentation on Samba, it said "login as root". How do I login as root? I have never used Linux before and I don't know.

"I've used Ubuntu exclusively for the past 3 months on my laptop. I'm never going back."

I used Ubuntu for two weeks, before I reinstalled Windows on my computer...
Understand - Why Linux in the first place?
by ArtInvent September 14, 2007 8:59 AM PDT
Mossberg is typical of many people in that they just don't seem to get the whole reason for the existence of Linux in the first place: it's about freedom and the advantages of free software. Nowhere does he mention that there is this big divide in philosophy and approach, and of course he never gets beyond the point where one adapts to the system as a beginner and then starts to enjoy all the fruits of free open source software, which are very real. Like being able to download tens of thousands of applications at the click of a mouse. Like getting off the paid upgrade merry-go round. The end of bloatware. Having a system not crippled by DRM. Not having to read and agree to long and preposterous restrictive licenses. Not having to enter in a 24 digit key code and call up the vendor for permission just to install 'your' software. Asking a question on the Ubuntu forums and getting a reply from an actual developer, who doesn't want to charge you for the answer.

Yes, it's true that Linux is still a bit less convenient at first in ways where MS and Apple are quite polished. I would still hesitate to throw Ubuntu at my mom or dad, since they're quite set in their computing ways and have enough trouble just remembering what ctrl-c does. The philosophical and practical problems of proprietary software - not even on their radar. And I absolutely love Ubuntu and use it every day.

This is the fundamental problem free software needs to confront before people will adopt it - to show people why it's truly different and why we need to use it and promote it and help advance it. If all they care about is that they can pick it up and use it right now and it's pretty, then they will of course stay with all the candy on a stick purveyed by the proprietary world.

One thing I do know: Vista didn't do much for me, it's a big reason I took the plunge into Linux, and it ain't improving in any significant way any time soon. On the other hand, Ubuntu is well on it's way to erasing the last 5% of hassles and rough edges it still has. A significant new release every six months, like clockwork. Tick tock. Ubuntu is only just getting warmed up.
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Some of you just do not get it...
by ncftech September 14, 2007 9:02 AM PDT
You ALWAYS have to plan for the lowest common denominator, when it comes to the end user. Can I use Ubuntu and other linux distro's with out problem: Yep. Can my mom: Nope. And thats the problem that no one seems to get.

Why do you think there are so many windows viruses? Because the same end users that can't use Linux, can't use Windows right either. I can run a windows XP box directly to the internet, and be totally secure. As long as I am not doing stupid things or "alternative" website browsing, then I will be ok. Of course, YOU NEED AV protection.

Is it easy for virus/spyware makers on windows: Absolutely. Am I defending M$: No Way.

Not everyone who uses a computer is a techie. But M$ has made it easy, at least before vista, for their end users to be able to go right out of the box. Apple has done this as well. How come it is so hard for Linux? In my opinion, the Linux community is a free-for-all. For example, the fact that they have multiple standards groups.

Linux runs my website(s), I have Ubuntu on my laptop, and I have found it to be great. But that means nothing to the MAJORITY of end users out there, who are not tech savvy.
Reply to this comment
He's right on. Most geeks don't get it.
by technewsjunkie September 14, 2007 12:14 PM PDT
It's called the Mom test.
Reply to this comment
huh?
by umbrae September 14, 2007 12:15 PM PDT
I still have to download codecs all the time for Windows. And I still have not been able to successful play an H.264 file yet.

Does this guy actually use computers at all?
Reply to this comment
Yes, Linux is for early adopters at present
by alizardx September 14, 2007 1:22 PM PDT
Mossberg did us a favor. Even Ubuntu isn't "grandma friendly" at this point, and WE DO NOT WANT large numbers of Windoze users who have never seen a command line trying to use Linux.

Especially on a laptop.

There are lots of 'little things' that are show-stoppers for unsupported Linux n00bs, and they need to be fixed before Walmart starts selling Linux boxes to end users totally unfamiliar with Linux.

It's a good thing for us to have Mossberg point them out, they need to be fixed before Windows users find them out from experience and decide that "Linux suxx0rs" and run screaming back to Microsoft.

Though the idea of being annoyed at having to download codecs via point-and-click dialog boxes. . . Mossberg should be embarrassed.
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This guy is a retard
by The_Decider September 14, 2007 2:42 PM PDT
Install a retail copy of XP, completely update Windows Media Player and try to play a commercial DVD.

WMP will point you to a page of expensive codecs.

You have to install a third party player like PowerDVD or pay for a cedec before WMP can play commercial dvd's.

At least the Linux codecs are free.

Linux is much more easy to install, tweak and use then Windows. Just because this guy ignores all the third party apps that Windows requires and is too stupid to use the most dumbed down Linux distro in existence, means nothing.
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Agreed
by jc364 September 14, 2007 6:44 PM PDT
Unfortunately, after installing and using Ubuntu, I would have to agree with Mossberg. Installation of Ubuntu is not easier than a Windows installation; I had to do some research and enter several commands in text mode after installation just to get the GUI to run correctly. Even after getting the GUI running, I had to make frequent trips to the forums and a lot of time just to get everything working just the way I wanted it. Most users would quickly become frustrated by that. Don't get me wrong, I am looking forward to the future of Ubuntu. It is exciting to see such progressions in open source, and I think that there will come a point where Ubuntu is ready for the general user. However, that time has not yet come.
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