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February 4, 2010 9:16 AM PST

Panasonic admits plasma TV black level change but says picture quality still 'excellent'

by David Katzmaier

Panasonic says black level increases are automatic as part of normal operation.

(Credit: Sarah Tew/CNET)

Update March 3, 2010: CNET testing points to the extent of the black level increase in affected plasmas. Click here for details.

In response to complaints reporting a loss in black level performance in its plasma TVs over time, Panasonic has issued a statement.

It admitted that "background brightness will increase," but described the change as "automatic" over the TVs' lifespan and part of normal operation in order to "achieve the optimal picture performance throughout the life of the set."

It also said that newer plasma TVs will include a "more gradual change in Black Level over time," but made no mention of a fix for existing plasma TVs, whose owners first noted the issue at enthusiast Web site AVS forum.

Here's the entire statement as e-mailed to CNET, entitled "Automatic Control of Contrast over Operational Lifetime."

Panasonic Viera plasma HDTVs deliver exceptional picture performance throughout the lifetime of these products. Various elements and material characteristics of all electronic displays change with use over time. In order to achieve the optimal picture performance throughout the life of the set, Panasonic Viera plasma HDTVs incorporate an automatic control which adjusts an internal driving voltage at predetermined intervals of operational hours.

As a result of this automatic voltage adjustment, background brightness will increase from its initial value. After several years of typical use, the internal material characteristics will stabilize and no additional automatic voltage adjustments are required. The Black Level at this stabilized point will yield excellent picture performance.

The newest Viera plasma HDTVs incorporate an improved automatic control which applies the voltage adjustments in smaller increments. This results in a more gradual change in the Black Level over time.

More questions than answers
I first contacted Panasonic seeking comment on January 11 , and the company has not responded until this statement, which was e-mailed to me Wednesday, February 3. Though arguably better than silence, the statement leaves too many major questions unanswered.

I have followed up with Panasonic seeking those answers, asking, among other questions, if/when a fix is planned for current TVs to address owner complaints; at what "predetermined intervals" do the the voltages increase; when do the materials stabilize; what the quantitative difference is between the initial black level and the "stabilized point"; which are the "newest Viera plasma HDTVs" referred to in the statement; and what should owners do who are unsatisfied with the picture quality of their TVs. I'll update this story when I receive a reply.

The big picture for plasma
As I mentioned in the original report, I haven't seen a Panasonic plasma affected by the lighter black levels yet, so it's impossible for me to reply to the big question of whether the loss of black level performance is significant enough to make the TV pale in comparison to its competitors. Many eyewitnesses believe it is, judging from the original thread at AVS forum and from a few of the comments on the report, but other owners are less definitive or report no change.

I began a long-term test using two 2009 Panasonic plasmas in my lab, but it will be at least a month before I can expect to notice any change in black level. Of course, I'll report back when that happens.

I'll also report that since 2005, my main TV at home has been a Panasonic TH-50PHD8UK plasma, and I've never noticed a change in its black level performance. At CNET, we didn't hear of this issue until we read the reports on AVS forum, and to our knowledge, past Panasonic plasmas, as well as models by LG, Pioneer and Samsung, have delivered basically consistent black levels over time.

That's why, despite Panasonic's statement that "all electronic displays change with use over time" and that after said change its sets still have "excellent picture performance," I tend to believe owners who describe the black level increase in the company's latest plasmas as unusual and ultimately detrimental to picture quality.

A quote included in my original report accords perfectly with much of Panasonic's eventual statement, enforcing that belief. In it a respected calibrator who goes by the screen name D-Nice, citing sources within the company, called the too-aggressive voltage increase a "goof" on the part of Panasonic engineering. The closest Panasonic has come to admitting as much is contained in its reference to an improved, more gradual change in new models.

Now what?
My main job at CNET is to provide buying advice regarding TVs, and Panasonic plasmas were one of my go-to recommendations. The 50-inch G10 was the most popular TV on CNET during 2009, and the V10 series earned the only Editors' Choice award I handed out to any flat-panel TV last year. In fact, after I reviewed the 2009 models, my dad bought a TC-P42X1, two of my colleagues at CNET, Matthew Moskovciak and John Falcone, bought TC-P50G10s and another, David Carnoy, bought a TC-P65S1 (we're keeping tabs on the black levels of those sets, too). It's safe to say that many readers of this Web site did the same thing dad, John, Matt and David did: buy a solid-to-excellent HDTV for a good price, and be perfectly happy with the picture quality. Judging from reader reaction, that happiness may be in jeopardy.

Nothing halts a shopper's reach for his wallet better than doubt, so I believe it's in Panasonic's best interest to answer those lingering questions. Until that happens, it's going to be hard for me to recommend the company's TVs without a degree of uncertainty.

David Katzmaier reviews HDTVs for CNET. E-mail David or follow him on Twitter @katzmaiercnet.
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Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 5 pages (140 Comments)
by Nascar_Dog February 4, 2010 10:22 AM PST
So why don't they just decrease the voltage slightly instead of increasing it?
Eventually they would reach KURO black levels. :-)
Reply to this comment
by Notjub February 4, 2010 11:37 AM PST
My guess is that once they go lighter, it can't go back to previous levels. The only solution would be to stop it BEFORE it happens.
1 person likes this comment
by HHaller2 February 4, 2010 10:25 AM PST
Good job sticking with it, DK.

What a disappointing, ho-hum response from Panasonic. Not the kind of thing you want to hear from a company that was supposed to pick up the torch.
Reply to this comment 2 people like this comment
by blusky08 February 4, 2010 11:24 AM PST
Sounds similar to what we hear about bad pixels, buzzing and poor screen uniformity--just another normal occurance within operating specs.
2 people like this comment
by mbenedict February 4, 2010 4:47 PM PST
My guess is Panasonic wont fully admit to ANY problem until AFTER the Super Bowl this weekend.

Keeping quiet on this issue == lots of large screen TV sales.

Sad but probably true, but that is the perception they are creating.
4 people like this comment
by PineappleUnderTheSea February 4, 2010 6:14 PM PST
I wish I hadn't heard about this: I've been researching TVs for the last 3 months or so, looking at the best LCD and the best plasma for my price range. The Panny was the one that came out on top, however there's no way I'm buying one now until I know if the "fixed" models will also have the issue.

Maybe I'll just grab the LCD and be done with it...
1 person likes this comment
by aidoroboo February 4, 2010 10:27 AM PST
So, Panasonic doesn't admit that it's a problem and instead says that the brightening is purposeful?

I can understand that companies screw up sometimes. However, the bests thing to do is move forward and acknowledge that they messed up and apologize. Look at Toyota, they definitely dropped the ball but have come back and said ?Oops! We?re sorry and we?ll fix it.?

Their response also makes me wonder about their new product line. It will be a while before the new sets will show the same issue. It would be better for them to say, "We messed up but this problem won't occur in our new products." That would at least make potential customers feel reassured even if it doesn't help the current owners.
Reply to this comment 7 people like this comment
by r_presner February 4, 2010 10:44 AM PST
Toyota recalled because it was life threating...know what your talking about before you post. It needs to put you danger to be recalled. Lets spend billions because a few people dont like there set.. There are reasons these sets still sell like hot cakes. Kuro tech is still only tv that beats my v10 in blacks...
3 people like this comment
by aidoroboo February 4, 2010 10:50 AM PST
This is a customer service issue, it doesn't matter if it is a life threatening situation or not. Customers have been let down by companies that they thought they could rely on.
3 people like this comment
by r_presner February 4, 2010 11:09 AM PST
I am just speaking in terms of a recall. that will never happen. Look at the THX problem, either happened or not, but it was clear and concrete whether or not you needed it. If 1% of people experience a doubling in blacks levels I would hope panasonic would exchange that set for a new. since the percentages are so low on people who see this I would suspect you could get a new set and have no problems.. i have many friends who owns 11-12g panasonics with not oneperson having this issue with most of the them doing a black meter test. my v10 after 1000 hours reads .007 which is damn good.
by aidoroboo February 4, 2010 11:41 AM PST
You're right it doesn't need to be recalled and this might affect less than 10%. However, that still means that a lot of 10% of the owners will be unhappy.

Panasonic needs to respond to this in a way that makes customers feel that they are a value to the company. Sure Panasonic might have to fix 10% of their product line but that still makes them look good even if they caused the issue. Then the current owners get their sets fixed and that potential customers that they should be able to rely on their products.

Say only 1,000 people have this issue and Panasonic could fix each set for $300. Sure Panasonic would be out $300,000 but when those 1,000 people go to buy $2,000 TVs again, that could be $2 million if those customers decided to stick with Panasonic.
3 people like this comment
by Notjub February 4, 2010 11:46 AM PST
aidoroboo, they've already said their future sets wouldn't have that problem. It's the current users who are hung out to dry, and knowing you'll have to buy a new set doesn't assuage the ire.
by aidoroboo February 4, 2010 12:00 PM PST
Notjub - The released statement said the problem would affect the new TVs to a lesser extent, not that it was fixed.

I was actually in the market for a plasma but I am going to wait and see what the outcome of all this is before I buy one.
by szguyer February 4, 2010 10:27 AM PST
Thanks for following up on this issue, David. I think it makes a huge difference coming from someone like you. My feeling is that you should factor these issues into your ratings (assuming you see them). I don't think Panasonic will be motivated to fix these problems unless it really hurts their bottom line or reputation.
Reply to this comment 11 people like this comment
by Renegade Knight February 4, 2010 11:30 AM PST
You would think if they tune their TV's to optimize black levels several years from now, they would be able to tune them to stay at optimal black levels both now and later.

Either way ratings should reflect actual performance. Not future performacne.
by Notjub February 4, 2010 11:48 AM PST
I second this motion; drop their rating until they fix the issue.
8 people like this comment
by chrkeller February 5, 2010 6:41 AM PST
Yeah, I think until Panasonic fixes the problem, give all their sets 1 star.
1 person likes this comment
by katzmaier February 5, 2010 6:56 AM PST
"Assuming you see them" is the key point. As I said in my original report, my reviews are based on my own experience, and if I can't confirm a problem (or a good characteristic) personally, it doesn't get factored into the score. That's why I placed "Editors' Notes" on the reviews of relevant Panasonic plasmas, to let buyers know about the problem but remain clear that it's not something I've seen myself (yet). Changing ratings or conclusions based on factors outside my own experience would go against the whole point of a hands-on review, and be essentially irresponsible IMO. On the other hand, I think the note does a good job of informing readers about the issue as it currently stands.
8 people like this comment
by lordnykkon February 5, 2010 1:16 PM PST
DK, I think we all understand and respect your concerns about the ethics involving hand's on reviews, but I humbly disagree and ask that you carefully consider where to draw the line. I know a guy who's Xbox 360 has eluded the RROD. In fact, I think another cnet editor recently blogged about a similar experience. But, just because such individuals haven't had the RROD occur on their own device, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Likewise, was your rating of the Panasonic TC-P50X1 affected because of "grayish diagonal lines"? I only ask because my buddy recently picked up the P50X1 on a super sale (not the P50X1N) and he has yet to have a problem. So, if he gave a review on his own blog, it'd be in contradiction with your findings and rating. Obviously, this is a difficult question, about how a trusted news and media source should properly advise consumers of such potentially faulty devices, especially after partial admittance by the device manufacturer. Please take these examples into consideration. I appreciate your time.
1 person likes this comment
by tmo-user February 4, 2010 10:43 AM PST
Sadly, this sounds like they have no intention of fixing the problem. Panasonic needs to put a disclaimer in their ads which boast of superior black levels. Something like, "Superior black levels for the first six months to a year" seems more accurate.
Reply to this comment 7 people like this comment
by Syed117 February 4, 2010 10:49 AM PST
It would be one thing if the black levels decreased slowly over time. That would be much more acceptable than waking up one day and finding your blacks have become gray.

This sounds like Panasonic isn't willing to do anything about the problem because according to them it's something that is supposed to happen.

My 54G10 was amazing for a month and now the black level performance is comparable to a cheap LCD. I didn't pay almost $2000 for a TV that would within a month lose the ability to perform it's main selling factor.

Based on my recommendation, four close friends and family members bought Panasonic plasmas after I bought mine. I don't think I'll ever be comfortable buying another Panasonic product. I won't let anyone I know buy one either.
Reply to this comment 11 people like this comment
by chrkeller February 5, 2010 6:43 AM PST
I am in the same boat. Panasonic lost a customer for live. I paid a lot of money for their plasma because of the black level. Samsung LED will probably be my next pick.
3 people like this comment
by Donniebrasco February 6, 2010 7:50 PM PST
I was going to replace my 650 Samsung with 54" Panny when the time came. This is a pretty crappy response IMO. "We think our TVs are just fine. The picture does change, but we think it is still good. Newer TVs won't have this same programming". So if its so great, why do the newer TVs need to be adjusted?

Maybe I can still find a NIB Kuro floating on the old interweb. Probably Samsung LED for me too.
by sticks1839 February 4, 2010 10:54 AM PST
I'd like to add another thanks for following up with this, and I really hope they answer your follow-up questions.

I suspect my V10 is very close to one of those predetermined use levels, and I hate to think of seeing significantly lighter blacks.
Reply to this comment
by hynguyen02 February 4, 2010 11:17 AM PST
David, thanks for the follow-up!!!
I was planning to buy another plasma set from Panna by the end of the year, but now I'm not sure anymore. If Panna doesn't fix this, it's time to go with LED.
Reply to this comment 4 people like this comment
by blusky08 February 4, 2010 11:17 AM PST
Commendable reporting, and it'd be nice if you went after other manufacturers just as hard for issues like mura and buzzing. You are in a position to embarrass manufacturers into producing quality products but we don't see enough of it.
Reply to this comment 9 people like this comment
by dark662 February 4, 2010 11:17 AM PST
Thank You David for following up with Panasonic. I hope Panasonic will help the consumers that have been negatively affected by this issue. Such as myself.
Reply to this comment 6 people like this comment
by Mergatroid Mania February 4, 2010 11:34 AM PST
I am amazed that Panasonic, a top-of-the-line plasma manufacturer would gave such a glib attitude toward this problem.

All that is required here is a firmware update. A simple thing to reset the black level back to where it was and change the aging routine for smaller increments. They could also add a small routine to allow the consumer to roll back the black level setting if an aging increment causes a decrease in picture quality (in the consumers opinion).

A lot of people spend a fair dime on getting these things calibrated, and this aging error is just throwing that money out the window (although I'm not a fan of paying people to calibrate a TV that any consumer with a brain could calibrate themselves).

Perhaps those people who paid for the calibration could suggest to Panasonic that maybe Panasonic should reimburse them for the cost of the calibration?
Reply to this comment 4 people like this comment
by george_liquor February 4, 2010 2:35 PM PST
"I'm not a fan of paying people to calibrate a TV that any consumer with a brain could calibrate themselves"

I've never had mine calibrated either, but it's not something Joe Schmo could do accurately. Good calibrators use colorimeters and reference-quality signal generators to calibrate the TV subjectively, and they typically do so in the TV's service menu. I've been in my TV's service menu--it's a scary place to be!
by AVaddicted February 4, 2010 8:00 PM PST
Not only that, but they actually change the internal settings of the onboard computer through the service port on the TV. Also, that calibration equipment they use costs thousands - tens of thousands of dollars to buy. A consumer can only do so much with the user controls. I swore the calibrator gave me a different TV when he left my house, amazing differences, and I had the AVS recommended settings!
1 person likes this comment
by dogmat6 April 9, 2010 9:40 PM PDT
Where can we find out how to calibrate these tv's before we buy one?
by dzhuk February 4, 2010 11:50 AM PST
As a result of Panasonic's unsatisfactory response, I will purchase HDTV's from Panasonic's competitors.
Reply to this comment 14 people like this comment
by versailles5033 February 4, 2010 5:57 PM PST
Yeah, I think I will be looking at Samsungs this year...
2 people like this comment
by AVaddicted February 4, 2010 8:02 PM PST
I just bought a Samsung 860 Plasma today....I was going to buy a Panny V10 before reading this issue.
1 person likes this comment
by stuntman_mike February 4, 2010 11:55 AM PST
I'm an owner of a Viera. I thought that I was seeing a lighter black level before I ever read any of this, but I wasn't sure if it was my imagination. Then after seeing the previous articles and other comments on the net, I thought that maybe I wasn't crazy. I then studied my TV harder and thought that I was sure, but in the back of my mind, I also thought that it could be group think. Now after the response by Panny, I have no doubt that I was right all along. I will be putting a call into Panasonic tomorrow (have school tonight and i won't be home till after customer service closes).

This is unacceptable.
Reply to this comment 4 people like this comment
by george_liquor February 4, 2010 2:07 PM PST
I noticed the same thing on mine, a TH-58PZ800U, before I read this article. The difference isn't huge, but it is noticeable. Letterbox bars, for example, used to disappear into the black bezel, but now they're noticeable, even with the room lights on.
by swoosh071 February 4, 2010 12:18 PM PST
Well this has created a lot of doubt in my mind now. I was on the verge of purchasing a V10 model when this story came out. Now I'm quite reluctant to purchase the tv if all I can get form Panasonic is a statement that basically states the problem will fix itself.
Reply to this comment 1 person likes this comment
by discoverE February 4, 2010 12:28 PM PST
Panasonic - Firmware update (soon) please.

Good job DK.
Reply to this comment 3 people like this comment
by berobert February 4, 2010 12:29 PM PST
I gotta say, this is troubling. I have two Panasonic plasmas - both were given solid reviews from Cnet which I trust highly enough to make thousand dollar and higher purchases based off of. I have a 42PWD8UK from 05' which I still love that I haven't noticed any black level issues on (although it's a professional model) and then I just bought a TCP 50X1 a few months back, which subsequently from my high regards and strong recommendations: my mom bought one, I bought one for my dad for Christmas, my wife and I's close friends bought one and then my best friend bought one... all of this in the last 6 months and every one of them bought the EXACT same model, the Viera TCP 50X1. If this really does turn into some kind of blow out big issue, I'm going to look like an ass for getting everyone close to me to buy one on top of owning one myself. The only solace I can take is that I didn't buy a G series or any other Panasonic set that was more expensive. Panasonic's response is quite troubling because as pointed out, it only raises more questions (which models are affected, is this a firmware issue or hardware, how much lighter do the black levels become?). I don't know if I can ever recommend their TV's again comfortably if they don't issue some sort of a real response, and I'm the guy just about everyone I know calls to ask buying advice for ANYTHING electronic. My one 50X1 purchase ended up being 5 plasma TV sales for Panasonic. I really hope they come through here...
Reply to this comment 2 people like this comment
by kalel130 February 4, 2010 12:29 PM PST
Another reason I'm glad I went LCD
Reply to this comment
by mdouglas10 February 4, 2010 12:36 PM PST
We have been following customer comments regarding black level on the AV Science (AVS) Forum.

We value our customers' satisfaction and have taken action to investigate the validity of the statements made on this forum.

PSTC PED display engineers have recovered 2 TVs with the assistance of the service network and shipped them to Japan for investigation.

We are aware of these Internet forums and articles, however, we must rely on our engineers to complete their investigation.
by Mvortec24 February 4, 2010 12:56 PM PST
Because it ships with sub-par black levels?
1 person likes this comment
by Bersquack February 4, 2010 1:05 PM PST
@ mdouglas10: Are you from Panny? I purchased a P65V10 before hearing about this and am awaiting delivery. I hope your engineers are putting in overtime work on this because at $4K I almost wish I had shot myself in the foot instead... it may be less painful.
3 people like this comment
by deepen05 February 4, 2010 12:46 PM PST
wow thats the worst load of crap I have ever heard!! "THE BRIGHTNESS of THE BACKLIGHT WILL INCREASE OVER TIME" yea my ASS..
Reply to this comment
by Nascar_Dog February 4, 2010 12:55 PM PST
Plasma backlight???
Or did you mean panel background brightness which actually means the black level will rise.
by peco412 February 4, 2010 12:48 PM PST
I'd bet even an older Panasonic plasma panel would have better black levels than your LCD.
Reply to this comment 4 people like this comment
by beaugpeterson3 February 4, 2010 12:59 PM PST
Thank you, David, for all your hard work in this matter. I purchased a P50S1 based solely on your recommendation. The old-fashioned style of investigative journalism with which you are pursuing this issue is refreshing and apparently necessary since Panasonic is being so vague about the voltage increase scheme they have implemented. I will be following your column closely and will definitely rely heavily on your advice for future television purchases. My only question is whether you think professional calibration (which I believe in) at each of the various life cycles of these units has the ability to minimize the effects of the voltage increases?
Reply to this comment 1 person likes this comment
by Nascar_Dog February 4, 2010 1:19 PM PST
No, but it will sure make the calibrators happy and rich
by beaugpeterson3 February 5, 2010 1:24 PM PST
I have discussed this issue with my calibrator and he has agreed to re-calibrate my panel if necessary after the initial calibration at no extra charge. I just want to know whether this could keep black levels acceptable or if I should just return the set immediately since I'm still within the 30-day window.
by beaugpeterson3 February 8, 2010 2:42 AM PST
Returned! The retailer can deal with Panasonic over this issue. Hopefully the S2 and G25 coming out this month or next will not go gray. David, will you do a long-term real-world test on one of this year's neoPDPs too?
Showing 1 of 5 pages (140 Comments)
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