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November 11, 2009 10:42 AM PST

Apple overtakes Nokia in phone profits

by Lance Whitney
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In the race for mobile phone profits, Apple has overtaken Nokia, according to figures for the latest quarter.

Apple earned $1.6 billion in the third quarter from the iPhone, outpacing Nokia's $1.1 billion cell phone profit to grab the top spot among all mobile phone vendors, said research firm Strategy Analytics on Wednesday.

This is the first quarter that Strategy Analytics has seen Apple surge past Nokia in mobile phone profits, according to Alex Spektor, the author of the research, who spoke with CNET News.

The contest between Apple and Nokia for top phone profits has been tight in recent months. In previous quarters, Apple's cell phone profits trailed those of Nokia by only $100 million, noted Spektor. For the second quarter of 2009, Nokia's earnings matched its third quarter results at $1.1 billion, while Apple's estimated earnings on the iPhone were $1 billion.

For Apple, which hit the cell phone market just over two years ago, its rank as the most profitable global mobile phone maker is impressive, said Spektor. In his report, he identified four key factors for the company's surge in cell phone profits.

One factor is the strong branding of the iPhone. "They created the iPhone as an easy-to-remember, sticks-in-your-mind type of brand," said Spektor. Each new iPhone is just one update on top of another, so the brand stays the same, and it's the same user experience.

Another factor driving profits is the high wholesale price that carriers like AT&T pay to Apple. By spending only $199 for a device like the 16GB iPhone 3GS, the consumer is shielded from the huge subsidies that Apple collects on the phone. "The consumer might not realize how much an operator really is paying behind the scenes for that $200 phone," noted Spektor.

The iPhone's wide distribution and availability is a third reason for its stellar profit growth. Apple started in 2007 with just AT&T in the U.S., then slowly spread into Europe. "And now they're popping up everywhere," said Spektor. "They're all over the world. Even in markets like the U.K. and France where they were previously with just one carrier, they're now with two or three carriers."

Finally, Apple's production costs are very tightly controlled, generating further profits. The iPhone's manufacturing is outsourced to the Chinese firm Foxconn. The specifications for the phone are kept very precise, and costs are kept very low, which delivers a higher gross margin to Apple.

The latest quarterly figures compiled by Strategy Analytics compared operating profits from Apple's iPhone 3GS and 3G with all of Nokia's mobile handsets, not just smartphones. And only profits were considered, explained Spektor. In overall shipments, Nokia still leads the mobile phone market, with 108.5 million cell phone models shipped in the third quarter, compared with 7.4 million iPhone 3GS and 3G units for Apple.

But overall, Nokia has faced a difficult year. Challenged by the global downturn, it's been forced to slash expenses, leading to a round of layoffs. The third quarter showed a net loss due to plummeting revenue.

Nokia has also grappled with the usual competition in the smartphone arena. Based in Finland, it's traditionally done best in Europe but has suffered in other markets, such as North America. The company has also failed to introduce a phone that can generate buzz like an iPhone, especially in the United States.

"The company has been slipping pretty steadily in North America," said Spektor. That's probably one of the reasons why their operating profits are a bit low. The U.S. smartphone market is very profitable...but Nokia has really failed to bring a compelling enough device to a U.S. carrier that would become a good enough hit to drive up their market share."

Nokia has debuted models in Western Europe that have proven very popular, though their high consumer costs and limited features have stifled some of their appeal. Nokia's first touch-screen phone, the 5800, has generated plenty of volume. "For a while, there was even talk about it being an iPhone competitor," said Spektor. "But at the end of the day, at wholesale levels, one (the 5800) is a $250 to $300 phone, and the other (the iPhone) is a $600 phone. So it (the 5800) is a cheaper phone and a less capable phone."

Some of Nokia's flagship phones, such as the N97, have done well in Europe, bringing in sales volumes in the millions. But Spektor said he feels they're still not compelling enough for the U.S. market.

Despite the competition and weak demand in the U.S., Nokia's market share is expected to stay steady or even rise. Due to its huge scale, the company is able to price its phones very competitively, especially in emerging markets. Nokia also enjoys distribution relationships around the world. "They're still the biggest player by far," added Spektor. "The competitors are chipping away at them, but Nokia is large enough to continue growing with the market as it continues to recover."

Updated at 12:35 p.m. PST to correct wholesale prices on the iPhone and Nokia 5800 and add information on Apple.

Lance Whitney wears a few different technology hats--journalist, Web developer, and software trainer. He's a contributing editor for Microsoft TechNet Magazine and writes for other computer publications and Web sites. You can follow Lance on Twitter at @lancewhit. Lance is a member of the CNET Blog Network, and he is not an employee of CNET.
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by EdCenter November 11, 2009 11:05 AM PST
Good to see that Apple's artificially high price point isn't hurting their profits! This is great news for Apple as this means they can continue with their premium pricing on their iPhones (I have an iPhone 3G and fully expect to purchase next year's iteration of the iPhone)! I wonder if customers benefit from Apple's good fortune in selling an item at a premium without fear of competition or price pressure?
Reply to this comment
by solitare_pax November 11, 2009 11:15 AM PST
If you read the article again, you might note that Nokia's iPhone killer costs a mere $600 vs $250-$300 for the current model iPhone.

Either way, they are both too pricey for me.
by seven7dust November 11, 2009 11:18 AM PST
actually the iphone isnt really priced higher than the competition
it's just that at the high end price points Apple is selling a lot more than the competition including Nokia
for example compared to N series phones like the N97 , the iPhone sells a lot more
and bear in mind that the iPhone is still locked to limited carrriers !
god only knows what would have a happened had apple worked with all carriers !
all this shows is that marketshare isnt really as importatant as everyone makes it sound ,
just like how Apple's notebook buisness is suppodesly worth more than Dells and Hps combined
by codynews November 11, 2009 11:19 AM PST
huh?
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 11:25 AM PST
Ahh, the old Apple is to expensive arguement, while study after study prove this to be wrong and yet people still like to spew this wrong information. Regardless of the fact that Apple is the only real computer maker making money, their market share is going up while others go down and they are ranked highest in customer care and product reliablity. So, "if it seems" I am paying more for an Apple product, I know what I am getting, a realiable product and good customer service if needed. Unlike those other guys and that other operating system.

Glad to see Apple doing well, in only two years. Chalk that up as another industry revolutionized by Apple.
by Perry_Clease November 11, 2009 11:31 AM PST
"you might note that Nokia's iPhone killer costs a mere $600 vs $250-$300 for the current model iPhone."

Well the $250-$300 for the iPhone is contingent on a 2 year AT&T service contract. For an unlocked iPhone one would pay about the same as for the Nokia.
by Vegaman_Dan November 11, 2009 11:13 AM PST
I helped with this by buying an iPhone myself. But then I had never bought a Nokia handset prior to that either as they didn't offer anything I wanted at the time.
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by frozenjello November 11, 2009 11:16 AM PST
I wonder how the Apple-haters are going to spin this one. Hopefully, they can intelligently argue their point without resorting to childish name-calling, but I doubt it.
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by jalessary November 11, 2009 11:42 AM PST
im not a apple hater but i dont think it proves anything.it just shows that there are too many people jumping on the iphone bandwagon.67% of people in the U.S. said they wanted the iphone cuz it was cool.i've had the iphone and now the bb tour and to tell you the truth i like the bb better.not a apple hater just not a iphone fan!!!
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 12:39 PM PST
Weird, wife hates her company BB and wants an iPhone, to each his own I guess.
by shycelticwitch November 11, 2009 12:21 PM PST
Although I own quite a few Apple products, the iPhone isn't one of them. I don't buy my electronics for their "coolness" factor. I buy for maximum productivity, and the iPhone doesn't cut it. I also am organized well enough in both personal and business life that I don't need to have access to a computer 24/7.
There is so much more to life than what's in that phone or that box on your desk... i choose not to be tethered to the rest of the world. Freedom is a wonderful thing.
Reply to this comment
by jalessary November 11, 2009 12:33 PM PST
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings
by shycelticwitch November 11, 2009 1:13 PM PST
Too bad so many choose to give it up for the sake of owning "things".
by Vorostatz November 11, 2009 12:45 PM PST
Actually what this proves is the fact that Apple overprices their products in an unwarranted fashion, while using the same components as other producers, and strong arming suppliers for cheaper prices for their components.
Furthermore ever see what apple does to people who want to produce an iphone compliant accessory, to get that stupid little apple logo, suppliers have to pay apple for the RIGHT to make something that has the words made for the iphone. This cool "appleness" isnt a factor with other phones. I dont feel the need to buy an overpriced accessory because I think some dumb fruit logo on it is going to make me cool or hip. I will just buy the cheaper product which is just as good and those profits might not be counted into the phone manufacturers profits.
Apple is over priced and the products they produce are no sturdier or better designed than anyone elses, in fact all you Iphone nuts get over it, the iphone is not sexy or well designed it's boring at best down right ugly at worst. Once again CNET demonstrates it's bias for apple. I no longer trust this site for any product information where apple is even remotely involved due to the inherent immediate bias.
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by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 12:52 PM PST
Again, wrong about price, but thank you for stoppoing by, we have a lovely parting gift for you.
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 12:55 PM PST
Also if the iPhone is everything you say it is, why is it selling like hot cakes and why are so many manufacturers trying to copy it? Hmmm, seems to me like an easy answer, but you'll get it wrong.
by Vorostatz November 11, 2009 1:15 PM PST
@ the_mrwhite
Hype Mr_White, good old fashioned apple whipped up hype. Remember when everyone was walking around saying EXTREME in the 90's or putting it on their labels (even bags of chips for Petes sake), well follow the logic, which I know might be tough for you as you're so used to apple telling you what to do, say, think, and buy ;-)
by Vorostatz November 11, 2009 1:24 PM PST
@ the_mrwhite
Hype Mr_White, good old fashioned apple whipped up hype. Remember when everyone was walking around saying EXTREME in the 90's or putting it on their labels (even bags of chips for Petes sake), well follow the logic, which I know might be tough. And if I am so wrong, refute me with facts not just saying I'm wrong
are the components in apples iphone special custom made components that cost apple more there for justifying the higher cost of apple products, no. Does apple force 3rd parties to pay exorbitant fees to produce "made for iphone" accessories yes (and the reason these 3rd party suppliers do it is because they know the drones will fall all over themselves to pay these higher prices slavishly) yes they do. Are apple products better put together or better designed than every other manufacturer well I know you will never agree with me but let me mention 3 things : No cut and paste until recently (years behind everyone else), exploding laptop and mp3 player batteries, and an OS that deletes all your account info should you log in as guest...'nuff said.
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 1:28 PM PST
@ Vorostatz

So it's OK for MS to put their God awful logo on everything and I mean freakin' everything, right up front and bold and in your face. At least Apple puts their logo in disgrete places if you really notice. A big giant MS logo on the consoles of cars that have the Sync feature on them, logo's on games just released for the Zune HD. MS charges licensing fees to use their OS and Office to corporations, this is where the bulk of their money comes from, selling licenses.

And if a company such as Apple wants to charge a fee to make sure these 3rd party accessories work with the number 1 selling phone, so be it. It makes the customer happy, because they will know it won't have any issues with the product they purchased. This is something Windows people have no clue about, because they're used to there stuff failing on them constantly.

So get off the frustrated high horse you're on and realize your pretty much wrong in every way.
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 1:43 PM PST
@ Vorostatz

Do you read?

Many others in this post have already stated that the iPhone is on par with other phones, but your blindness and hatred of everything Apple is clouding your judgement. The Nokia phone the article mentions is $600, without a contract, the iPhone without a contract would be about $500 to $600. Can you see the similiarity? Please God tell me you can. Now the iPhone is subsidized by AT&T like the majority of smartphones on the market (Droid, HTC, Pre), do you see where I am going with this? If these other phones were not subsidized by their carrier they would all cost about the same thing.

People like you hurt my face and society at large. /facepalm
by Staszek November 12, 2009 10:38 AM PST
Mr Vorostatz,

I will reply to your direct questions.

No Apple comments are not different in their computers then off the shelf versions, although their mother boards are custom designed by them, so there is R&D involved.

Does Apple force 3rd parties to pay fees (exorbitant is an opinion not fact if they were so bad no one would pay them), yes they do. So does many other 3rd party manufacturers for every other product out there. Apple gets more press on it because they have been one of the most successful companies at getting third party support for their items. Also when that item is stamped, Apple has a hand in testing it to make sure it really does work (also costs money or do you work for free at your job).

As for your last comment, lets look at the % of issues with Apple products over the years compared to others. Yes they had battery issues, so did Dell, Sony, HP etc.

OS issues., yes they have had some, and the most recent one on the Guest account (which didnt effect everyone) is a bad point in OSX history, but unless you are in a cave, you cant even compare the amount of issues that XP and Vista have compared to OSX they are not even close.

Lastly, the price of the phone is the same as most phones out there that do similar things. The Palm Pre sells for $549 retail, the iphone 3gs in 16gig form (8 more then the pre) sells for $599 retail. Nokia's own N97 sells for $700 retail! The new beloved Droid sells for $650 retail, so tell me again how the iPhone is so much more expensive?

Lastly, I just love how no one considers R&D anymore as a cost of business. Everyone who designs the software must work for free. The reason HP, Dell etc can sell things a bit cheaper (and its a bit because in the same setups Apple has proven over and over to only be slightly more expensive and even less in some spots) is that they R&D basically only the hardware, MS license's the OS to them for a fraction of what it would cost if Dell and company had to do all the R&D and developement themselves.

I use PC's and Mac's everyday and they both have their good and bad points, but it seems that the anti Apple people can only seem to point out price in every arguement,
by jalessary November 11, 2009 1:13 PM PST
i would bet that if you put the iphone on all the other networks everyone would get one!!then within a couple of years people would be bored agin.people want what they cant get.look at the wii.you couldnt find one forever then everyone had one and found out it sucks!not saying the iphone sucks just that it is just another phone!
Reply to this comment
by the_mrwhite November 11, 2009 1:18 PM PST
People forget pretty quickly what "just another phone" the iPhone did to the industry. It's not just another phone, it is the phone all other phones are trying to be.
by jalessary November 11, 2009 1:28 PM PST
in some cases yes but alot of cases not!we need to quit comparing every smartphone to the iphone! let there be choices! i will admit the droid brought it on themselves.
by Synthmeister November 11, 2009 1:17 PM PST
I don't buy Apple products because they look cool but because they work "cool" as opposed to frustrating, unintuitive and boring. They do what I want in a pleasant, enjoyable and intuitive way.

And yes, so far, except for the first few months, Apple iPods and iPhones have been completely price competitive with anything comparable.

Nokia should wake up and try to produce 6 really good phones instead of the 200 models listed here on Cnet. Once you get beyond 3 or 4 basic choices, it just confuses your customers and wastes your company's money. Also focusing on one mobile OS might be a good idea as well.
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by Gold_Storm_Mac November 11, 2009 1:18 PM PST
the iphone is not overpriced. how is it overpriced, really? for getting one of the best phones if not the best phone in the world (according to all people) for a mere $199 and 2 year contract is not too much to ask.
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by dazzone November 11, 2009 1:53 PM PST
hi im from australia to buy a good nokia cost $1500 but for a 32g iphone cost $1045
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by Norseman November 11, 2009 2:17 PM PST
Apple's profits are high because they basically produce ONE model instead of beaucoup like Nokia. Design, production, and support costs are all lowered by limiting the number of models. This works if the one model you produce is extraordinary. And in the case of the iPhone, it is.
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by November 11, 2009 2:28 PM PST
From an investor point of view, I could care less if Apple had 1% of the market and Nokia had 99%
Just as long as Apple was making more money, that is all I care about.

It all boils down to who can provide a better return for my invested dollars & right now Apple is doing some good business.
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by sbethi November 11, 2009 3:57 PM PST
I am from third world country, for me dollar it self is a premium product.
Companies like apple do not do any good for these countries and it will never be part of improving their lives. Without companies like Microsoft or Nokia very few people in the world could have become part of digital revolution.
Microsoft indirectly created more than 10 million jobs all over the world with their OS, Office & Programming languages (I think Apple created jobs only to the sales boys in their stores other than their office in CA) by making them affordable to third world countries and Nokia sells mobile phone for less than $20, this is what we needed to bring the technology to the masses.
Selfish investors like you will never realize the importance of affordable technology.
by November 11, 2009 5:39 PM PST
sbethi
When it comes down to business & my money I am not concerned at all about how many job's Apple is creating or how much they market products for. I am only concerned from a business prospective and their bottom line. Retiring with enough money in the bank to take care of my children and theirs is what matters, I am an American family man; and that my friend is what it's all about.
Selfish is not a correct word to describe me, how can I be selfish when the money I am investing is mine & hard earned ?
by Paul_Christie November 11, 2009 4:20 PM PST
If you want to be cool, buy an iPhone and think that everything in the universe is trying to copy it. Gotta love the misinformed iCustomers. And another reason why you must love capitalism.
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by frozenjello November 11, 2009 5:50 PM PST
Paul, you should thank Apple for lighting a fire under the complacent industry establishment. Here is a small list of devices that simply WOULD NOT EXIST if not for runaway success of the iPhone: Blackberry Storm, Palm Pre, many HTC models like the T-Mobile G1, Motorola Droid, Zune HD. Yes, competitive forces in action make capitalism great. More choices means consumers win.
by jalessary November 12, 2009 4:36 AM PST
It's not the product I dislike, it's the trolling fanboys that make me despise this rather unimpressive overhyped non multitasking failiure. MMS and 3.2 MP technology is pretty much yesteryear and the OS is looking dated, same stale design with nothig new on board minus the speed, the things I do like are the accelerom...eter interacting with the cover flow album art (the accelerometer not being Apple's invention by the way), the speed and the responsive touchscreen, that's pretty much it, the. I await a 1GHZ or NVIDIA TEGRA chip smartphone by HTC and to be used with the open source Android OS 2.0 Eclair with prefreably 8-12mp and the inclusion of Xenon Flash, and a 4.3 inch capacitive touchcreen with multi-touch gesturing. No matter how much better an Android or Web OS product is compared to an inferior device such as the Iphone, people will be blinded by the hype sensationalized by the media and do not appear to have a mind of thier own and will choose a closed source heap of junk.Read More
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by basit87 November 12, 2009 6:35 AM PST
Iphone is no doubt amazing product. but wait for nokia N900 to come out and will see how it will kill the iphone buzz.

go on youtube guys n see urself wat n900 is capable off and its coming in this quarter..without carrier $550 on amazon unlocked.

Iphone is amazing product but then still i wont consider iphone as a smartphone compare to blackberry or nokia capabilities in smartphones. Also a thing to be noticed is the Apple only has one cell phone compare to huge portfolio of phones under nokia and blackberry belt. unless Apple keep introducing whole new iphones each year (which is nothing to impossible) they will start losing it eventually, its always good to be diversified well to have constant long term growth which nokia, blackberry has done well.

its just my opinion.
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by aka_tripleB November 14, 2009 9:17 PM PST
How accurate is that statement given that Apple likely can split its costs between the iPhone and iPod Touch?
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