Black spots afflict Canon's new SLR

Canon's EOS 5D Mark II

(Credit: Canon)

Some users have reported that photos taken with Canon's new $2,700 EOS 5D Mark II camera can be blemished with dark spots near areas with very bright highlights.

I first heard about the issue on the DP Review forums on Friday, but now one pixel-peeping user has come up with a fix spotlighted by Photography Bay: Disable for highlight tone priority, lighting optimizer, and noise reduction, according to commenter f_stops.

"No black dots," the photographer and new 5D Mark II owner reported on the posting, supplying before-and-after shots as proof.

Canon is checking into the issue. "We have been made aware of this and are looking into it," a Canon representative said Monday.

The spots appear on the right edge of some shots with very bright highlights.

One forum poster spotted a dark patch on a 5D Mark II video; it appears fleetingly at about 1:04 into the video.

[Kobe_No_Means_No]

The problem has been solved. Firmware issue... should be fixed by the next update.

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/715521

[chrbal]

Nope, not solved. Go farther down that post and you'll see that the original poster found that he was wrong.

[William Crow]

I don't have this problem with my film camera and there almost no loss of value over time! Digital cameras lose value faster than cars.

[Hep Cat]

There are lots of trade offs between digital and film; film has better permanence and can be more reliable, etc. That being said, let's not have a flame war; I shoot film and digital because there are advantages to both that I enjoy.

As for resale value, my film camera went up in value the past few years, but it's a larger format camera, and I don't know any professionals who buy their cameras with any expectations about resale value.

[tekwiz4u]

@william,

I take a shot, process it, and its a bad shot. Damn...didnt want that. Welcome to Film world.

Where as I take a shot on my digital, REVIEW it, and can decide to dump it and take another. Welcome to Digtal world. Film has its attributes, dont get me wrong. But in a pace of getting shots, and knowing they came out ok is the better advantage then waiting in One Hour Photo.

[Hep Cat]

"Damn...didnt want that. Welcome to Film world. "

And as a reminder, back when there were no digital cameras, those of us who started with film were far more careful about what we shot. There were fewer exclamations of "didn't want that" than there were of "I nailed a few and missed one while I was switching bodies".

Digital cameras have made professionals and amateurs alike more productive. That's the bottom line.

[thescale]

@William Crow - stop being lame.

[William Crow]

I make a few simple, honest comments and I get flamed.

[djacobow1]

Further discussion on the dpreview thread shows that the fix of turning of all the gimmicks doesn't really work. The dots are visible in the .cr2 files anyway, so that rules out NR and, I think, ALO. We're seeing more pics that exhibit this phenomenon. And there I gotta say, there is NO WAY that Canon's QA people did not see this before releasing the camera. Did they not think that the people who plop down $2.7k for a 21Mp FF camera aren't going to scrutinize its output at 100%?

There will be blow back -- deservedly. If they can't fix this in firmware, I expect to see a lot of quality used Canon glass showing up for trade as people make emotionally-driven decisions to dump C for N.

[Shankland]

If people switch from Canon to Nikon, it'll take more than this. Nikon has been on a roll lately, though, to be sure. The black spots problem smells to me like something that could be fixed in firmware. We shall see.

[djacobow1]

The sense I get -- totally unscientific -- is that there is a body of serious amateurs and pros who use 5Ds and xxDs who are increasingly frustrated and "ready" to make a move. The 1D3 focus fiasco (also a very real problem that Canon only fixed after being dragged into it) did not help. Another example of Canon just a bit off track: that the 50D, from an IQ standpoint appears to be a step sideways from the 40D.

These sorts of things are tippy. When the scale tips, it may move quickly.

[logaandm]

There is much discussion about the black dots, without a great deal of experience. I have a 5D Mark II. I can easily reproduce the effect. BUT, in order of image qualtiy impact:

1. Dust
2. CA
3. Sharpening effects
4. Noise effects
5. Black dots
6. Hot pixels.

The problem is noticable at 300% magnification and most people can't even see it at 100% magnification. It is a very minor problem which I have not seen at 100 ISO. It is only marginally more annoying that hot pixels because it is harder to find.

I suppose if you wouldn't buy a DSLR because it can get dust spots you might not want to buy a 5D Mark II because you get black dots under very specific conditions, but really - there are far more important things to worry about in the image than the black dots.

[djacobow1]

I don't have a 5DII, but I've seen the pics on dpreview. I can see the spots at 100% just fine. Anyway, though I agree that it is a minor problem with respect to image quality, it's not smart for Canon to get in the habit of telling its customers (people who sort of care about details, by the way) that it's a minor problem. The customer gets to decide that.

In some ways, if this turns out to be a hardware problem, it's something like the Intel FDIV bug. For the first week or so, Intel told its customers that it was a minor problem, and that they probably would never see it manifest in their computer use. And Intel was actually correct about this. But it simply did not sit well with people that their hardware could generate incorrect floating point results. In the end, Intel, at great expense, offered to replace anyone's Pentium that had the FDIV flaw -- and this turned out to be a PR boon to Intel because it showed that Intel was serious about its customers and serious about quality.

Now, cameras are not processors, but if Canon takes the tack of telling people that the 5DII is fine as-is, they are going to lose people.

[kyle5434]

I have a great deal of respect for Nikon and Canon's products, but I have to say that as an Olympus DSLR user for the past 3 years, I've never had a dust problem - and I change lenses in the field pretty frequently. I will admit that since my gear isn't the latest generation, I wouldn't mind a bit more dynamic range and somewhat better high-ISO noise performance, but shooting RAW and using Bibble's integrated Noise Ninja helps both of those issues, so for now I can live with those limitations.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
you are wrong


f_stops found out it doesn't work

Disabling highlight tone priority, lighting optimizer, and noise reduction, does NOT work !!!!!!!!!

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=30290315

[kevin2i]

Oops! I really stepped into this and dragged it over the internet.

Yes HTP off seems to help in some situations. Christmas trees outside are very problematic. Shooting at iso50 seems to be the largest improvement. Jpg/raw/sRaw/DPP/ACR - not much difference. The problem does get worse at higher iso.

Iso 50 vs 200 is here:
http://6887.com/5dII/blackspots-iso50-200.jpg
iso 3200 (sRaw2 doubled in size vs jpg)
http://6887.com/5dII/blackdots-sraw3200.jpg

Raw files:
http://6887.com/5dII/_IMG_9715.CR2
http://6887.com/5dII/_IMG_9716.CR2

Studio lighting crop 1940x2910 (metallic reflections):
http://6887.com/5dII/blackdots-grid2.jpg

[kevin2i]

c'est moi - kevin2i is f_stops . . .

[denisevans]

The firmware fix is out already.


http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/firm-e/eos5dmk2/firmware.html

It's downloaded and installed on my 5D Mark II.