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December 8, 2008 7:40 AM PST

Hands-on with Netflix streaming on TiVo

by Matthew Moskovciak

At the end of October, TiVo and Netflix announced that Netflix's streaming service would be coming to TiVo DVRs by the end of 2008. The companies have made good on their promise, and the service is rolling out to TiVo HD, HD XL, and Series3 boxes today. TiVo turned on the service for us over the weekend, and we've had the chance to give it a full workout. The short story: this is an awesome added feature for TiVo HD owners.

The interface is significantly different than what we've seen on the Netflix Player by Roku. Rather than offering up large box shots to scroll through, the TiVo's interface instead lists the names in text, with smaller box shots showing up on the right side. We preferred the TiVo's interface, as it allows us to see more titles at once, which is convenient if you have a large queue. On the other hand, we felt the TiVo interface was less responsive, which is a problem that affects almost all of the extra services on TiVo.

While the interface is an improvement over the Netflix Player, we still saw plenty of room for improvement. Now that Netflix has added a lot of content to the Instant Streaming service, our instant queue is getting pretty full. The current interface simply lists titles in the same order as your Instant Queue, which, if you're anything like us, is kind of haphazard. While the queue system makes sense for the traditional Netflix mailing service, we'd rather have more categorization options--such as by genre and star rating--for online streaming. We were also disappointed that there was no way to tell from the TiVo screen which movies were available in "HD" quality.

Like on the Netflix Player, video quality is determined by the speed of your connection. While the Netflix Player uses a "four dot" graphic to indicate video quality, the TiVo HD has a more granular meter, with about 14 bars. We generally got all 14 bars filled up, using a wired Ethernet connection and a standard cable modem.

Although the term "near-DVD" is often abused with video-streaming services, it accurately describes the video quality offered by Netflix streaming on TiVo. We fired up a bunch of movies and we were never disappointed by how they looked. Pan's Labrynth was available in "HD" and in most cases it looked as good as a well-mastered DVD--occasionally we could see some blockiness to the image or the background would be soft, but nothing to take us out of the movie-watching experience. Next up was Ratatouille, which wasn't available in HD. This looked slightly softer than DVD-quality (and much softer than the excellent Blu-ray), but not by much. Only the pickiest videophiles would turn up their noses at the image quality. In short, there's room for improvement, but it's darn good already. (You can read more about the technical details behind Netflix's streaming service here.)

We did notice some artifacts on the audio side, although it was mostly subtle. We really only noticed it on one movie, but we could hear some soft pops, similar to what you might hear on streaming Web video when it's not fully buffered. And, like all Netflix Instant Streaming content, you're limited to stereo audio rather than surround. We're really hoping Netflix adds surround soundtracks in the near future.

The most important takeaway for us is that we watched several movies without any hiccups and each movie started up in a few seconds. While many streaming services "feel" like you're streaming video over the Internet, this feels more like you're expanding the recorded content of your TiVo. And while you lose some of the benefits of watching the actual DVD (special features, surround sound), we couldn't help but notice that in some ways it's better than DVD; movies loaded right away and with no previews.

If you already have TiVo and Netflix, there's no reason not to take advantage of this feature. If you're choosing between a TiVo and a standard cable/satellite box, this is definitely a feature to take into consideration, although also be aware that Netflix streaming is available on many other devices, such as the Xbox 360, Netflix Player, LG BD300, and Samsung BD-P2550--and we expect it to be even more ubiquitous in 2009. While the hardest part about going with a TiVo over the standard options is the monthly fee, added features like Netflix, Rhapsody, and Amazon Video On Demand make it a lot easier to swallow.

Covering home audio and video, Matthew Moskovciak helps CNET readers find the best sights and sounds for their home theaters. E-mail Matthew or follow him on Twitter @cnetmoskovciak.
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by iwarrior-poet December 8, 2008 9:29 AM PST
This looks pretty darn good. Though I am hoping for an updated PS3 with Netflix Streaming---that would be a better bang for my buck.
Reply to this comment
by patchman10 December 8, 2008 11:14 AM PST
iwarrior-poet , FYI: PlayOn software is your answer...I stream netflix,Hulu and youtube right now with my PS3 to my HDTV in my living room. Using this software netflix shows my first 50 in my queue, by genre or alphabetically ....Hulu has even more choices......Quality so far has been very good. A 14 day free trial after a one time $30.00 ...After a real bumpy start it has been working flawlessly...

http://www.themediamall.com/
by smilin:) December 8, 2008 10:03 AM PST
So "HD" is not HD huh? I want my 1080 and I don't want to drive to my video store just to find out the only two copies of a new release available in BD are checked out. Grr.
Reply to this comment
by ddiddy415 December 8, 2008 2:27 PM PST
use netflix....its only a dollar more for bluray movies per month from your regular subscription......I've been using it for 2 weeks now and its awesome.....Netflix makes blockbuster and hollywood video look like crap
by dtsguy December 9, 2008 9:54 PM PST
I can not agree with you more. Why would I want to watch ANY movie in SD. I think ALL movies should be available In HD download NOW and in Dolby Digital at the least. I will NEVER watch a SD movie everagain unless its through my Blu Ray player which upconverts to 1080 and it looks pretty darn close to real HD. I agree with you. Grr.
by DanielDaly December 15, 2008 4:20 AM PST
Vudu is your answer. Check it out.
by thrasher545 December 8, 2008 11:35 AM PST
Seem like it is rather elitist because this service is only offered to owners of Tivo DVR's that are $300.00 or more. How about the thousands of subscribers who have the Series 1 or 2 DVR's??
Reply to this comment
by Riverdome December 9, 2008 5:52 AM PST
S1 and S2 DVRs can't support the HD content so that isn't even an option. As far as allowing streaming of SD movies it's a business decision. IMHO Tivo should keep the S1 and S2 boxes working in the same way they did the day the customer bought the product - which they had done if I'm not mistaken. If Tivo wants to add new features to newer boxes only it becomes the customer's choice to upgrade or not. Give the customer the product the expected when they purchased, anything more is bonus generosity.
by mbmarsh December 9, 2008 8:08 AM PST
So this means that if you have satellite, you're screwed six ways from Sunday, right? Because HD Tivos won't work with satellite, so you can't get one of the HD DVRs even if you want to, so you can't get Netflix either.

Love Tivo - really.
Reply to this comment
by christopher3232 December 9, 2008 8:40 PM PST
tivo is comming back to directv.
by IFLYMAUI December 14, 2008 1:48 PM PST
TIVO is again going to work with DIRECTV sometime this late Spring/Summer 2009 they say. That will be a HD dedicated TIVO box for Directv and hopefully just the one box. In the meantime, go for the TIVO HD unit, buy BASIC Comcast (or Warner, tec) and subscribe to NETFLIX. Use it for a few months and the roll the subscription over to your new DIRECTV/TIVO unit and EBAY the Comcast/Warner unit.

TIVO and NETFLIX are a perfect marriage.

You haven't seen half of what TIVO can do yet either. Expect more. Great units!
by tivolover December 9, 2008 8:17 AM PST
Tivo users already have a video download feature through Amazon. How does this compare? Can I buy and rent movies like with Amazon? Can I store the videos for viewing on a time schedule like amazon? How does the video rental library compare between Amazon and Netflix on Tivo?
Reply to this comment
by Fercho_d December 9, 2008 10:31 AM PST
well .. I have netflix since xbox was updated two or three weeks ago, I signed up just to give a try. I found netflix a really good idea, movies look great on screen ... but I wish instant movies (wich are the movies that you can watch on xbox and pc) have a much better seleccion ... so far there's no new releases at all .... the mail service takes long to me ... I don't know why .. I send a movie that I previously watch on monday, they receive it on wed, and I receive the new one by friday or sat ......
I have only 3 movies on my instant queque ..... I dont like the rest of instant movies......
Reply to this comment
by bbains December 9, 2008 12:59 PM PST
The hardest thing about going with Tivo is their self-imposed limitation to CableCard. I was a Tivo fanatic until they forced me to use this device to get HD content. Never could get that to work, and Houston's Comcast service is far less than adequate. In my opinion, Tivo's a doorstop until they open their HD boxes up to all service providers.
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by ev61 December 9, 2008 11:21 PM PST
Because Tivo prefers to limit its customer base and pay a monthly fee for cablecards that they see no revenue from. Who in the world told you it was Tivo's fault? The Cable companies are the ones encrypting their channels...
by December 9, 2008 1:05 PM PST
This is great news. I do have a quick question. I'm thinking about getting rid of my HD cable service, as I seem to only be watching Lost and old movies off of HDNET. And I hit up the bars for sports. I'm also a hardcore Netflix user, both through the mail and online, and have a PS3 for the Bluerays. Since I am planning on getting rid of my cable service and just use the OTA HD channels to watch Lost and primetime sports, is it possible to record these shows (like Lost and Fringe) with these Tivo players that have the Netlfix feature, since I was planning on also getting a Noku player? I remember reading about a Tivo-like the device that would do this, but haven't heard or read anything about it since. I also haven't really been paying attention to the Tivo scene, since I rent a DVR through my cable company.
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by noahbody1 December 9, 2008 1:36 PM PST
The Tivo HD and Series 3 record OTA HD. Looks great!
by dantripp December 9, 2008 2:11 PM PST
This is a nice feature, but the image quality over 1.5MB DSL is noticeably soft and full of compression artifacts, even at standard definition. I get about half the bars on the connection quality meter. I just bought a Blu-ray player, so I'm looking for higher quality video, not lower. Of course, the quality is as good as I can expect using live streaming on my DSL connection. But what I'd like to see is for Netflix to download movies in my queue to the TiVo disc. Perhaps a three-at-a-time Netflix subscription would mean the first three movies in my instant queue would be downloaded in HD overnight to the TiVo. When I watch and delete one movie, the next one in the queue would download.
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by green2u December 12, 2008 11:55 AM PST
What an EXCELLENT idea! To be able to download 3 Netflix flicks, watch one, erase it, and Netflix instantly downloads the next in your queue. And also have the option of selecting which in your queue you would like downloaded and which you want mailed to you instead. I'm no longer a Netflix subscriber, so I do hope you suggest this to them. Cuz I would become a subscriber again if this happened.
by bblackmoor December 9, 2008 2:41 PM PST
Netflix on Tivo. Lovely. Now if only Netflix offered streaming movies viewable in a standard web browser without installing pernicious malware like Silverlight, then I could actually use that part of the service that I pay for each month.

http://www.defectivebydesign.org/day02-netflix
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by johnofthetown December 9, 2008 6:56 PM PST
Won't work in Puerto Rico, even though the Tivo HD is being sold in the US territory, so forget it!
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by trishfitz December 9, 2008 7:19 PM PST
Anyone else having problems watching more than 20 minutes or so of Netflix content? I keep getting kicked out and then get a message telling me their system is down when I try to get back in. What I've seen looks pretty good, but it's frustrating not to get to see much of it...
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by mesohomey December 10, 2008 1:37 AM PST
I disagree with you there . I have subscribe to both companies (Blockbuster and Netflix) and prefered Blockbuster way over Netflix . Netflix sends crappy disc which is always scratched and there's always a very long wait to get the currently released movies . After 2 years w/ Netflix , I finally switched over to Blockbuster and been satisfied with their service and they to offer DVDs by mail and Bluray .
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by rikp December 10, 2008 6:17 AM PST
I'm gonna be 70 next month. It seems like technology is going way too fast for me. My son has moved back in here temporarily and has brought his Roku Netflix with him so I've had a chance to see this much. It's damn slick I think. And this is without Tivo and HD. However, once he's moved to his new abode taking netflix with him, I'll continue to watch movies at home by getting the DVDs from our local library. At my age, movies 2 and 3 years old are "new" to me. With my memory, movies 15 and 30 years old are new also :-) I suppose I might be able to see the difference between what I'm used to and HD, but I really doubt that if the movie is any good, I would care. Actually, my routine is to transfer the DVDs to iTunes and watch them on my iPod.
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by December 10, 2008 10:39 PM PST
I too am getting booted off about half way or less through a movie. Often I need to unplug TIVO because it hangs. I am using a 6m DSL connection and the TIVO wireless adapter. It appears to me that it is not quite ready for prime time. When it is working it looks GREAT. But so far I have not been able to finish one complete movie!
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by tpkidd3 December 14, 2008 2:21 PM PST
While a good step towards convergence, the application is not 100% on my FiOS connected TiVo HD. Best I can tell, Netflix is overestimating my connection speed and setting the quality too high. This manifest in a jumpy artifact laden picture that is unwatchable. To the best of my knowledge, there are no settings where by I could throttle back the quality to receive a watchable image. I look forward to user settings. But until then I will still use a media PC access Netflix.
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by dahnb December 15, 2008 7:59 AM PST
Audio sync problems. I watched some crappy horror film over the weekend. The audio was a full 6 seconds behind the video!! Like some badly dubbed Godzilla movie.
Tried another one last night & the audio delay was about 3 to 4 seconds. Lack of 5.1 sound and soft picture also add to the fact that this is a work in progress.
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by tomanjeri December 17, 2008 8:44 PM PST
I've run into the same audio sync problems the past few days as well, not sure I understand the point of buffering a download if they don't then ensure the audio and video are synched.
by ddanckaert December 15, 2008 5:52 PM PST
Unfortunately, Netflix is saying that you can register 6 unique devices, but in their system, it's actually limited to 4 (see text below--which is from today, 12/15). For example, I have three XBOX 360s and 2 Tivo HDs. I'd like to register all of them, but alas, Netflix.... get your act together.

---[From Netflix New Account Terms and Conditions]---

Q: Can I watch movies instantly on more than one PC or Netflix ready device?

A: Some membership plans allow you to watch simultaneously on more than one personal computer or Netflix ready device at the same time (for example, watching a movie on your laptop while another family member watches on a TV via a Netflix ready device in another room ).

1-disc plans may watch on one device at a time, 2-disc plans on up to two devices at the same time, 3-disc plans on up to three devices, and plans with four or more discs on up to four devices simultaneously.

In addition, due to requirements from content providers, there's a limit to the number of unique devices each account can use to watch instantly. Each Netflix account may watch instantly on up to six unique authorized devices, including personal computers and Netflix ready devices.
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by ddanckaert December 15, 2008 6:02 PM PST
My bad... either that or Netflix's site changed in the past few hours.. Now it actually says *6* devices.

So, ok, no problems here! ;-)
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