PC makers find ways to extend XP's life
Facing a June 30 deadline to stop selling PCs with Windows XP, the world's largest computer makers are getting creative.
Taking advantage of the "downgrade rights" offered as part of the Windows Vista license agreement, Hewlett-Packard and Dell both plan to offer machines loaded with XP well beyond June.
Technically, the computers will be Vista Business or Vista Ultimate machines that have been factory downgraded to XP at the customer's request. In practice, they are more like XP machines that come with an already paid-for upgrade to Vista when and if the customer chooses to do so.
HP said it plans to continue selling the "pre-downgraded" desktops, notebooks, and workstations to its business customers until July 30, 2009. Dell is already pitching the same option on its Web site and promising the models will stick around long after it stops taking standard XP orders on June 18. Other computer makers tell CNET News.com they are still exploring what to do but also want to sell XP beyond June 30.
There are limits to the approach being taken by HP and Dell. Only the Business and Ultimate flavors of Vista come with downgrade rights, meaning consumer machines can't be sold in a similar fashion.
While companies can offer pre-downgraded machines via their Web site, things get a little more complicated when it comes to buying a PC at retail stores. It may be possible for customers to buy such a machine, but just how this will work--and if stores will offer such an option--is not totally clear. The tricky issue is that, to stay within Microsoft's terms, the customer has to somehow "request" the XP downgrade.
All of this prompts the real question: Why won't Microsoft just extend the deadline? The company's rationale that customers and computer makers aren't demanding a longer life for XP seems to be increasingly implausible.
Kevin Kutz, a director in Microsoft's Windows unit, said that the downgrade-rights option meets customer needs.
"While (computer makers) continue to see large numbers of customers making the transition to Windows Vista, there are some pockets--like small business--that need a little more time," Kutz said in a statement. "And from what we've heard from our partners, the downgrade rights option fulfills that need."
The pre-downgraded PC option is just the latest way that PC makers have responded to stronger-than-expected demand. After shifting largely to Vista after its January 2007 mainstream launch, Dell and others quickly began adding more XP options in response to customer requests.
For some time now, computer makers have been selling machines with an XP recovery disc as a downgrade option.
Lenovo, for example, plans to keep offering an XP recovery disc with some Vista models through January 2009, according to InformationWeek.
The latest twist is the machines, like the ones HP and Dell will sell beyond June 30, that have Vista rights but contain XP pre-installed.
As for whether a broader reprieve might yet come for XP, Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer has left the door open a crack.
"XP will hit an end-of-life," Ballmer said in Belgium recently, according to Reuters. "We have announced one. If customer feedback varies, we can always wake up smarter, but right now, we have a plan for end-of-life for new XP shipments."
CNET News.com's Erica Ogg contributed to this report.
During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft. E-mail Ina.
Why doesn't Dell or HP know about this?
Get over the fact that Microsoft, as a company, exists. As much as you LOVE to hate it, Redmond could care less you even exist. You are so very important in the scheme of things that your whining amounts to background noise.
Fact is Vista is not the OS that everyone expected. Microsoft is mostly to blame, not for their coding of the OS itself (although it IS very questionable) it IS about their choices of marketing and promotion.
The GREAT longhorn was to be just that; great. What we the people received was a stripped down ghost of what was promised to come.
Is it no wonder than, that so many people have hung onto XP?
I don't particularly hate Microsoft, and I use a myriad of software OS's in my personal and in my professional life.
I state what I stated, not because I have a desire to see/listen to myself vomit forth evil MS sentiment...but rather to state a valid, and thoughtful examination of the Vista/XP situation. Well, at least as far as I see it.
the_decider,
You could be rather constructive. You seem somewhat intelligent. You waste your venom in these posts on such a constant basis...it is clear;
All of worth you think you have to offer, is belittling to Microsoft. We ALL know you hate Redmond. By this point, anyone who has read ANY of your posts... really has no interest in your REPEATED comments that differ ONLY on the subject matter of the STORY you posted.
A fast google of your posts will result in the SAME general (and sometimes almost IDENTICAL)response to just about any story that even MENTIONS Microsoft.
It is a bore to read your SAME responses over, and over, and over again. You do not care about the story, or the subject of conversation.
You must be truly a horror to your friends, and loved ones who must live with your constant interjections of I HATE MICROSOFT when everyone els is discussing desert plans at Thanksgiving dinner. It's a wonder they even invite you to dinner any more? Maybe they don't? Now you have the answer as to why.
BTW, I'm no shill. I support the right of anyone to get whatever operating system they like. What irritates me is people like you who can only remember microsoft in 1998 as the "evil monopoly empire". Yes, they were... 10 YEARS AGO, but people like you continue to give them a bad rap while other companies who are practicing the same anti competitive policies completely escapes your attention (they all do it, and many are more worse now than microsoft was then). Alot has changed in 10 years; wake up and smell the coffee.
/P
That's hardly possible. Most parts of your PC will break in 4..10 years (although there IS the possibility that computer will live 50 years). And without updates and new drivers after 50 years there simply won't be any hardware supported by WinXP anymore.
So you should start thinking about changing OS. There are already Linux, MacOS, FreeBSD, (also Minix3 and ReactOS in development), etc. Of course WinXP will be usable for some time (5..10 years, perhaps, as Win2000 is still usable right now, with minor problems), but some time later you'll run into problems with applications not running due to missing OS features. So in the end you'll have either to change OS, or to stick using only old software.
Halo 2 might work but you wont get the Direct X 10 functionality.
First, Vista is only slow because your computer is old and slow. If you were to buy anything beyond a $300 computer, it would not be slow. In fact, it would be faster than XP. Talk to someone that actually knows what they're talking about, and you might learn something in this regard.
Second, you touched a laptop at Staples and Office Depot and it was full of junk, but people told you that? Did you actually touch them? Fact: XP and Vista come with basically nothing on them; it is the computer manufacturers (HP, etc.) that put the 'crap' on it.
Third, Vista is not the same as ME. As a matter of fact, Windows XP was written on ME. XP was and is simply an extention of Millenium Edition.
Fourth, in the long run, XP is not going to win the 'war' against Vista. The issue here is that people who hate Vista HATE it. The people who don't hate it, see it as a part of everyday life, and really don't speak up about it. This, Microsoft knows, and can see simply by mandating survey companies to talk to the public, and by monitoring sales trends.
Fifth, Halo 2 is only for Vista, and it does work on XP. There are a very large number of programs designed for one operating system that will work on others. One example going one way is meaningless. More and more software is coming out Vista only, and more and more of it will not work on XP.
Sixth, building off of my last point, Windows XP will not win the battle. A simple Wikipedia search for "Windows XP" will bring up an article devoted to this same arguement that happened when Windows XP came out. It details how 'slow' XP was, how 'insecure' XP was, and how little programs worked. And XP won. As Vista will.
Seventh, if you're this concerned with Microsoft lying to us, maybe you should stay under your rock. While you're there, try to pick up some proper grammar habbits:
"I stick to XP for 50 years"
"Because XP have solid core than Vista."
"I did tried touch Vista"
"No way to buy Vista."
"Vista is also same as Windows ME"
"XP is winner war against Vista."
...that's less than half of them.
In summary: Grow up.
XP is the best choice for my needs and the upgrades required to role out Vista make no sense, yet Microsoft seems intent on making it impossible for me to stick with it without having to commit piracy, which is a really really bad idea.
I'd like to see the feds force Microsoft to keep selling XP so long as there is demand from business and the public. They don't have to support it, they just have to allow us to load new machines with XP without breaking the law.
like it or not!
That's right, Ballmer made me switch to Ubuntu Linux and Mac OS X. Both of these I love. While they are not perfect and have sometimes their own minor issues, it is far better than XP or Vista or any OS MS ever made and it is getting better.
The level of arrogance on the part of people like Ballmer and his boss is unbearable. Why cant these people learn? It appears that they have moved far away from consumers needs and ignore their wants.
As for reporting to Bill Gates I don't even comprehend what you are talking about.
The level of arrogance on the part of people like Ballmer and his boss is unbearable. Why cant these people learn? It appears that they have moved far away from consumers needs and ignore their wants.
If you used any other desktop OS (e.g. MAC OS, Linux) you would have to put up with far more patches, security holes, etc.
Sounds like you have a severe case of Pebcak.....
extend the deadline? The company's rationale that customers
and computer makers aren't demanding a longer life for XP
seems to be increasingly implausible.
Kevin Kutz, a director in Microsoft's Windows unit, said that the
downgrade-rights option meets customer needs."
As if Kevin Putz or any M$ exec is going to tell us anything other
than what they want.
The following exchange, from early in the Bond flick Tomorrow
Never Dies, between evil media mogul Elliot Carver and his video
wall of global empire commanders, sums it up pretty well:
Carver: Are we ready to release our new software?
Crony: Yes, sir. And as requested, it's full of bugs, which means
that people will be forced to buy expensive upgrades for years.
Carver: Outstanding.
I?ll give you the benefit of posting your entire statement. You are just the type of person I was speaking of. All bluster and noise, but you offer no solution. Extending a deadline is not a solution. The new flavor of ice cream is coming and people love new flavors. This business has many shades of grey which leads to many ways of thinking and just as many opinions. You can like a product, use that product and still not completely agree with how that company may operate. So I ask what are YOU going to do about it? Not buy Vista? I?m sure you will really wound them. Are you going to make a better operating system? I sincerely doubt it. This is about making a profit which from what I?ve seen MS is pretty good at. When the day comes that some other OS has a better way and is compatible with the business suite?s most everyone in the word uses (See Microsoft) then I will most likely use it. Until then I anxiously await your OS and business apps to come to market.
R. Grant
R. Grant
loading any piece of shareware whose main objective is to run
well on Vista or XP can or will slow down your computer because
it may not care if it conflicts with other software you may have
downloaded ... I just happen to use MS products because they
more or less rule the business world for now and that?s just the
way it is."
Vista for the most advanced and secure OS, the standard for current and future software.
Both needs met by response to market conditions.
Macs for those who want to look hip and fashionable.
Linux for those who love to tweak and customize.
Wonderful world, isn't it?
By the way, not every Linux distributin is for "those who love to tweak and customize". This is a stereotype. Ubuntu and some others (OpenSuse, etc.) try to be user-friendly and easy to learn.
P.S. Why did they stop supporting Win2k? It was a nice system, without all useless features that were added in WinXP and Vista...
...compared to what? Previous versions of Windows, sure. Any other modern OS out there? Not even close.
[i]"the standard for current and future software."[/i]
There's a rather huge bucket of compatibility issues between current software and Vista... where's this "standard" that you speak of?
[i]"Macs for those who want to look hip and fashionable."[/i]
...and as a bonus, you get top-notch security, better performance, software that just works, and no longer will you have to hunt down oddball drivers just to get your goodies to run with it.
[i]"Linux for those who love to tweak and customize."[/i]
...and run a rock-solid system with monster performance, not have to bother with licensing fees or DRM, have the ultimate flexibility in nearly any enterprise environment, and get far superior security to boot.
You see, choice is good... very good. I suspect that Microsoft is beginning to learn this the hard way, and if they don't pull out some decent releases soon...
/P
Probably the most retarded statement I've read since Obama is the
candidate of change.
not innovative enough to be compelling--oh, and you need newer
hardware--so desperate consumers will be forced to buy Vista
AND its predecessor? In a competitive market this would not be
happening. I will be buying my next PC from Steve (Jobs, not
Ballmer).
Michael Horowitz
Ship and OS nobody wants, give them a decent one in the box to
actually use, and tehn say we shipped XXX numbers of Vista.
They are just pathetic now.
It's almost sad - almost.
Millions of people choose to drive classic cars, but thats not a big deal either.
They are technically inferior to a newer model, dont perform and handle as well and are not as safe but some people like the look and feel of the old technology that they are used to.
The downgrade part is the extra kludge unrelated to either improving the OS as on OS or improving the security for the user. Call it a DRM roadmap that impacts drivers (making them harder to write and buggier) etc.
Some of the directions Vista tried to go didn't work well. Some of my blue screen errors were Vista not getting along with itself.
But it is evident that they have made 2 great products, Win XP and any version of office from 97 on. It is also evident that they allow much more independent use of resources and developers in hardware and software then Apple, which is pretty much a walled garden.
I think this outpouring of support for keeping XP speaks very highly of MS's ability to make a very high quality product that is in much demand for years after it's introduction - very rare in the computer world, and I'm sorry for the openoffice folks, I use it and have for perhaps a year, but I find it inferior to MS Office that was put out about a decade ago.
1) Mac OS was not copied, it was purchased from Xerox/PARC.
2) It doesn't show XP is a quality product (it's decent) but more to
the point, Vista is a failure.
Not all, but most people I know simply pirate Office. Office is pretty expensive relative to OO, and if these people actually had to purchase the software I bet Open Office would be much more popular.
There are other office alternatives as well, and it isn't like OO is totally useless. Even OO has many features that I would never ever need. Contrary to what some may think, when I get home I don't create Excel reports to summarize the fourth quarter sales or publish 800 page novels or generate the marketing ads for my new health product. Usually when I get home I just watch a lot of news, clean up the house maybe, or space out or something. Of course if you need Office then you need Office, but I don't think most do.
If I do write anything it's usually an email or a simply one page of randomness. You could probably give me a word processor that only lets me write five pages max per document. I would probably not care, and unless someone told me, I would probably never even know.
- Microsnot
-
by hassan_bin_sober
April 28, 2008 7:26 AM PDT
- "Do not be alarmed, I only want to drink your blood"
-
Reply to this comment
-
Showing 1 of 2 pages (106 Comments)What's it gonna take? ...Pitchforks and torches showing up at the Redmond castle throwing burning piles of Vista disks over the walls.