Microsoft program puts new Windows on old PCs
Under a new program announced Friday, large companies that sell refurbished PCs can get a brand spanking new copy of Windows to put on the machines--provided they pay Microsoft for the privilege.
The initiative, which provides refurbishers with a special version of Windows XP, could help save more machines from heading to the landfill. In many cases, though, it means Microsoft will be getting paid twice for putting Windows on the same PC.
That's because, to properly resell a refurbished PC using its original copy of Windows, Microsoft requires that resellers have either the "certificate of authenticity" that came with the PC or its restore disks--things that often get lost along the way. Businesses can also try to get a duplicate copy from the manufacturer, but that's a difficult and time-consuming process that doesn't scale well for the large refurbisher handling thousands of machines a month.
Microsoft won't say how much it is charging for the special versions of Windows XP, other than to say it is somewhat less than a computer maker would pay to put Windows on a new machine.
The company has had a smaller program that allowed refurbishers to put Windows onto machines destined for charities and educational institutions, but the new program addresses the broader market of PCs that are resold for general use.
For Microsoft, the refurbished PC market is an area worthy of more attention. The company did a study in 2004 and found that 20 million computers a year were being sold through formal refurbishment operations. The company estimates today that number has grown to 28 million, with growth in the refurbished market likely outpacing new PC sales growth.
"It's a part of the market that's been growing in both size and importance as PC specs improve and as countries tighten (their) environmental regulations," said Hani Shakeel, a senior product manager at Microsoft.
Today, rather than deal with the thorny licensing restrictions, many refurbishers just sell their PC's "naked"--that is without any operating system, leaving it up to the buyer to install Linux or a full retail copy of Windows, or perhaps go the piracy route.
Microsoft is launching the program with two large refurbished-PC sellers on board, but hopes to sign up additional North American refurbishers as well as computer makers worldwide. PC makers already have the right to sell refurbished versions of PCs they made originally, but they could use the new program to resell other brands of PCs they get through various take-back programs.
The idea of more PCs getting reused is one that is hard to argue with, as more and more usable PCs sit idle because of the hassles and concerns associated with re-use. But it does seem to me that there should be an answer that doesn't necessitate paying Microsoft twice to run Windows on the same PC. What do you think?
During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft. E-mail Ina.
However charging twice for the same software is fraud.
isn't requiring that people sell these refurbs with XP. If the
refurbers don't see the business argument for it then they'll
continue to do what they have been doing and selling them
naked. I don't think I'd buy a refurb with XP on it if it cost more
than a naked system. That's just me though - other people think
its worth doing.
It's also not entirely uncommon for licenses to require renewal if
the equipment and/or software changes hands. The place I
worked actually auctioned off an old Cray Y-MP on eBay. The
purchaser of the system had to buy a new license for the OS and
system tools if they wanted to actually use it as anything other
than a funny looking bench.
In other words, its not unheard of and the market will figure this
one out.
Linux just doesn't work for most people.
"eComStation Release 2.0 RC3 available"
http://www.os2world.com/content/view/15421/1/
At least Windows XP has drivers for my hardware and it seems to crash a lot less than eComstation did.
It is an old Dell XPS system, but it runs XP Pro really great. I couldn't even get online with eComstation 2.0 RC3 because there was no driver for my network card.
For anyone seriously considering eComstation 2.0 RC3, please check their hardware list to see if there are drivers for your hardware and be aware that it is a beta version and might crash on you a lot. I myself got "zonked" and had bad experiences with eComstation the modern OS/2.
If I still used my old IBM PS/2 Model 55SX it might run great because it has driver support for that hardware, but not my 3 year-old Dell system.
TPG
That probably explains why I (and lots of others) have evolved beyond Windows...
/P
http://www.news.com/2100-1016_3-5188084.html
http://www.oreillynet.com/windows/blog/2006/06/bill_gates_legacy_charity_not_1.html
so if you are dieing to pick on MS find another topic.
* MSFT is losing money on the Zune.
* MSFT recently got caught trying to bribe a Nigerian VAR with
$400,000 to re-install Mandriva Linux laptops with XP. The
laptops are part of the charitable OLPC initiative to give third-
world kids access to computers. It took the [i]Nigerian
Government[/i] to stop that from happening. (you know it's
corrupt when a government well-known for same steps in to do
the right thing).
* There's this - MSFT desperately trying to squeeze as much
revenue as they can out of anything they can by selling 2nd
licenses for a used computer.
* Vista sales are arguably and demonstrably a flop. If it wasn't
for OEM strong-arming, it would get less play than Windows ME.
Corporations practically everywhere (including Intel of all people)
have declined to install it in their networks for an undetermined
period of time.
* Office 2007 sales? MSFT is awful quiet about those...
* Mac sales are exploding in record numbers, and are growing
by astronomical percentages.
* Ubuntu Linux installs are going full steam ahead, and in record
numbers.
* Meanwhile, MSFT's sales growth is almost flat.
Yep - MSFT is beginning to scramble alright... but the strange
part is, instead of focusing on improving their products, they're
trying every sleazy method known to man to try and prop up
sales.
But who knows? Maybe Vista SP1 might actually overhaul the OS
entirely, and make it run decently for once. Not sure... maybe it
will, maybe it won't.
Meanwhile, MSFT for years had nowhere to go but down... and
now they're starting to go down. And it shows.
/P
if they do decide to provide me a second copy for reduced fee, I call that good business sense since they are detering me from piracy...
THAT is exactly what it is.
You should NOT have to buy a new one, even if someone has lost the restore CDs/license paperwork.
Seriously, IF Microsoft doesn't allow us the consumer to unbundle the software from the computer to reuse/resell, THEN we as a society shouldn't allow microsoft to DO that. (by charging a second time).
Just like a drivers license.. I shouldn't have to repay 100% when I lose the license, I should only need to pay for a fair replacement cost. ( with a DL, I don't have to pay more/"invest" by retaking the tests - I just need to pay for a duplicate license when I lose the original.)
likewise, paying for ANOTHER full license from microsoft is unethical and unfair.
yes, it is double dipping.
yes, it would be fair if microsoft charged a small amount for reissuing the license.
Own goal! You failed!
"...there is not a double dip since the license that was on that
computer went to the new computer that replaced it."
Uh, no. Typically the new computer that replaced it came with a
new copy of Winblows. Now M$ is getting paid *AGAIN* for
another copy of Winblows for the old refurb machine.
Sounds like triple dipping to me.
Just upgrade the RAM to 256M, reformat the Windows ME hard drive to Windows XP Home or XP Pro. 256M of DIMM RAM is cheap these days, about $35, slap one of them badboys in your DIMM socket and remove the slower 64M DIMM that only slows the system down.
XP needs a 200Mhz CPU or higher to run and at least 128M of RAM, I ran XP Home on an old 200Mhz Pentium-MMX Compaq Deskpro System with 128M and it was a bit slow, but was faster after I put in the 256M DIMM. Not bad for a system made in 2000. I gave it to one of my relatives who needed a computer to get on the Internet. I bought XP Home OEM edition for $89 from a store that advertised on Pricewatch.com, so you can upgrade for like cheap without this deal from Microsoft. $89 for OEM XP Home CD SP2, and $35 for the 256M DIMM chip.
This is almost as much fun as when you have to dispose of an old computer, and you're supposed to just kiss your license good-bye rather than reuse it on a new barebones computer.
At what point does it stop being about intellectual property, and start being about monopoly? (Ans: about 20 years ago)
Is Linux right for your mother?
http://blogs.cnet.com/8301-13554_1-9792477-33.html
If you have an old computer and are wondering whether it's time to get a new one, see this
http://blogs.cnet.com/8301-13554_1-9811114-33.html
If someone wants a new OS on an old computer, and still get all the latest features, why would they buy an OS with six-year-old technology, like XP... Especially when Linux costs $0.00 and is very easy to use.
Here's some more reasons why:
* In 98% of the cases, you never have to look for a device driver with Ubuntu (albeit the other 3% chance involves looking for an package and installing it through the easy Add/remove software function on the main menu). In almost every case with Windows, you have a very solid chance of having to go scrounge the Internet for drivers... unless it's a driver for your network/modem equipment, in which case you're SOL unless you've a friend who can help you by way of his or her computer.
* A typical Windows installation eats about two to three hours - before you go looking for drivers. A typical install of Ubuntu takes 30 minutes, where you can start using it immediately thereafter.
* While you're getting all of your Windows patches (at home), your computer is --in most cases-- exposed to the public Internet, where typical survival time for an unpatched Windows install (before getting owned) is measured in minutes. If you have a proxy or firewall to hide it behind, you can last a little while... but not direct and live. I can leave a fresh un-patched Ubuntu install directly online for days on end, perhaps weeks. While this may change, I doubt it'll change by too much.
PS: The first blog is grossly incorrect - you can purchase tech support for Ubuntu for a very small cost... less that what you'd pay retail for Windows or even OSX.
/P
/P
Puts his reputation as an IT Professional all into proper perspective, doesn't it?
In this base when computers go out to the public be it schools or not, they can now have a license add'd with them.
I understand what you are saying most companies bundle the license, but under most large standing offers those license are not included. We have the option of purchase with an image or with out. We purchase with out, and image when the system arrives at the office, before being shipped out to various other offices.
So no, its not a double dip at least not in the corp's I have worked in since 87.
I was reading a story a while ago, about swiss Air lines how they saved over 600k a year by getting of Linux, and have cut unexpected down times by 10%. NC Soft was another company that converted away from Linux in the past year, and have realised less downtime more scalability and lower support costs.
Apple does this too. The iPhone is an excellent example of buying hardware, but only having a license to use the OS.
It's nothing new and once again Microsoft is late to the party in this game. I doubt anything will come of it. Who is actually buying older/out of date equipment?
hardware, but only having a license to use the OS.
Please explain...this makes no sense.
I have bought Macs used - they all came with their install disks,
and both required nothing in the way of buying any sort of re-
registration during the obligatory re-install. By contrast, buying
an old Windows PC under this program that MSFT has would
require paying for another license, either directly or as part of
the purchase price.
Old-school Unices had done this a long time ago - but SGI has
been bankrupt and dead for years now, and SCO Unix is soon to
follow. IBM killed AIX years ago, and merely supports existing
installs of it (though you could continue to happily use an old
RS/6000 w/o paying IBM anything, and they didn't consider you
a pirate for doing so. You merely paid for any support you
wanted on it). SunOS/Solaris is now open-source - ditto on old
version support, and Solaris never required any sort of fee for
transferrals unless you wanted to continue the support contract.
HP-UX is the only exception I can think of - though it is a niche
variant on niche hardware.
The iPhone is a strawman AND incorrect... it is an appliance, and
transferring it to another person does not require re-buying the
OS.
So please, in the future, at least try lie to folks who don't know
better... because doing it in here will only get you corrected.
/P
We could recoup some of the cost of the OEM version of Windows that come on the box, but we don't and neither do many other companies in the same situation.
So basically, after the machines end up being sold by the refurbishers they have had 3 separate Windows licenses on them.
- Unbelievable
-
by The_happy_switcher
November 9, 2007 10:13 PM PST
- The gall of Microsoft knows no bounds.
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