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November 19, 2009 4:00 AM PST

Windows boss on building his first laptop

by Ina Fried
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LOS ANGELES--As a software guy, Windows division president Steven Sinofsky readily admits that he had little idea of all that goes into building a laptop.

Like many at Microsoft, he tended to think of products as done once the software was finalized. During the past couple of months, though, he has gotten a much better idea, as his Windows team went through the process of designing and building a Windows 7 laptop in conjunction with Acer.

Steven Sinofsky, surprised the PDC crowd on Wednesday, announcing that paid attendees would get a free notebook that Microsoft helped design.

(Credit: Ina Fried/CNET)

That laptop made its debut on Wednesday, as Microsoft handed out the devices to paid attendees of the Professional Developers Conference here. It's quite a little laptop, built around an 11.6-inch swiveling touch screen that works as either a tablet or traditional notebook.

Sinofsky wanted to give attendees at this week's PDC a computer that would really show off Windows 7's capabilities, including a touch screen and top-of-the-line wireless. Oh, and it should be light. And have a glossy screen. And not cost too much.

"They look at you like, 'what are you building'?" Sinofsky said in an interview with CNET.

Sinofsky said it's kind of like remodeling a kitchen. "You start off by saying I want these cabinets this counter top and this kind of a sink and all of a sudden you've got this kitchen you can't afford and don't have the time to build. That's pretty much the first phase of building a laptop."

In the end, Sinofsky had to make a few compromises, but the process itself was an important one for the Windows team, Sinofsky said. While PDC attendees got the laptops, his team got a better appreciation for the full process of designing and building a Windows PC.

"That was part of the learning, really making sure we can walk in their shoes," Sinofsky said.

The Windows team quickly learned about some of the trade-offs that computer makers have to make, as well as some of the hidden costs. At one point, Sinofsky said, he wanted to cut out Bluetooth in order to add GPS capabilities.

There were two problems with that, though. First, taking off Bluetooth would actually cost money. It was already part of the wireless chipset and the standard chassis had a blue indicator light built-in already, meaning that it would cost more to cover up that light.

And with Sinofsky's ideal laptop already containing multiple flavors of Wi-Fi, Ethernet, wide-area networking and three audio paths, there just wasn't room for GPS.

"They were like, look we're running out of room here," Sinofsky said.

Other things Sinofsky did get. Although most laptops with touchscreens have matte finishes, Sinofsky said "We really wanted a glossy screen."

Sure enough, the PDC has a glossy touchscreen.

That's just a part of what Sinofsky talked about in our interview on Wednesday. Look for more from our chat in the coming days.

During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft. E-mail Ina.

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by aMUSICsite November 19, 2009 5:04 AM PST
Why do companies have to say computers come with 'Genuine' Windows® 7?<br /><br />I guess it's MS back scratching like this whole 'yep you can try and design a laptop if you like'... Got to keep MS happy to sell windows machines.
Reply to this comment
by Mr. Dee November 19, 2009 5:41 AM PST
Because you have some System Builders that don't include 'Genuine Windows 7'.
by bschmock November 19, 2009 5:44 AM PST
Umm I have a hard time believing that it went down that way. First off I'm sure MS paid acer a good amount of money for the chance to build this custom laptop. Secondly I think it great that MS is getting into the hardware aspect of computers, it means that their operatering systems in the future will be better optimized. They are taking a step toward an apple approach who works closely only with a few hardware manufacutres ie(foxconn, intel, samsung).<br /><br />However I do not want windows to go proprietary.
by Random_Walk November 19, 2009 7:07 AM PST
"However I do not want windows to go proprietary."<br /><br />Err, software-wise, it already is :)<br /><br />I get what you were saying, though, and I doubt they could do it. The reason why is simple: world+dog among the other OEMs would quickly switch to Linux, and pour their resources into making it rather viable for consumer use (it would be easier to sell it to enterprises right now).
by winstein November 19, 2009 9:21 AM PST
Many computer sold in developing countries come with pirated Windows. Sometimes the dealers would even remove the genuine Windows from a computer and sell the legal copies to make extra money.
by billd888 November 19, 2009 9:30 AM PST
That is a requirement for the hardware companies that want to include Windows with the system. What I don't get is I read that they used a Celeron processor for this, that does not provide enough processing power does it?
by sasquatch3 November 19, 2009 1:39 PM PST
@winstein<br />OEM Windows is attached to the mobo so you can't remove it and resell
by sasquatch3 November 19, 2009 1:41 PM PST
@billd<br />Celeron is just a name<br />the laptop in the article uses a Core 2 CULV chip I believe
by dhavleak November 19, 2009 3:50 PM PST
Damn Sinofsky!! <br /> <br />Tablets were fast becomming the last refuge for glossy-screen-haters like me. Now even that's in jeopardy..
by aMUSICsite November 20, 2009 3:01 AM PST
My point was you would not advertise a computer as coming with a pirated version of Windows now would you. Just plastering Genuine over all the descriptions is not going to do anything...
by DragonStab November 19, 2009 5:56 AM PST
A glossy touch screen? Keep your cloth handy for all the fingerprint smudges......
Reply to this comment
by Henaway November 19, 2009 6:39 AM PST
No kidding. I thought that was the reason most touch screens are matte. But, y'know, matte isn't COOL like glossy. That's why Apple is all about the glossy.
by ProDigit November 19, 2009 6:57 AM PST
A touchscreen most of the time adds some sort of diffusion to the surface of the screen!<br />Besides when having a touchscreen,you need a glossy screen regardless. Otherwise the already blurred out image will be even more blurred through the touch screen.<br />The notion of a 'glossy' touchscreen is only natural to assume, and should not even be mentioned.<br />If it where somehow matte, then it should be mentioned, because a matte touchscreen could look really bad!
by stickfu November 19, 2009 7:03 AM PST
Not to mention a Celeron processor with intel integrated graphics, pretty weak machine overall. If I were MS and I wanted to showcase Win7 I think I`d want to beef up those specs considerably and make that thing fly.
by rapier1 November 19, 2009 11:45 AM PST
If they rolled out some beefy slab everyone would be complaining that you need a powerhouse to run Windows 7.
by rationalreview November 19, 2009 1:23 PM PST
At least it will outperform a Mac based on similar specs.
by sasquatch3 November 19, 2009 1:44 PM PST
@stickfu<br />Intel Integrated Crap is crappy, but remember, this is an 11 inch tablet we are talking about<br />Celeron is just a name, the Celeron inside the laptop is a Core 2 CULV chip<br />@review<br />it will outperform Macs with similar specs in some things and it will lose in others<br />I don't think there is a Macs with these exact specs to compare with though.
by dhavleak November 19, 2009 3:52 PM PST
@stickfu -- that might be the whole point -- that you don't need a beefy machine to run Win7. Having said that -- I'm not touching anything that says 'celeron' with a 10 foot pole.
by Button Boy November 19, 2009 6:35 AM PST
Now that Sinofski knows so much about hardware, he has tossed all hardware vendors off the MS campus. Says they won't be needed for Win8. A little knowledge goes a long way...
Reply to this comment
by sasquatch3 November 19, 2009 1:45 PM PST
MS won't risk doing that<br /><br />Linux is always there<br />and by the time of the Win8 launch, it might actually be friendly on the average user
by dhavleak November 19, 2009 3:53 PM PST
@ Button Boy <br /> <br />Nice attempt at FUD.
by viper396 November 19, 2009 10:00 PM PST
@Button Boy, Your FUD only makes you look stupid. A little knowledge is obviously what you lack.
by The_happy_switcher November 19, 2009 8:06 AM PST
Now don't forget to bog it down with the usual required bloatful amounts of antivirus, antispyware, antimalware, antikeyloggers, antitrojan software and it should be fine--at least until a 10 year old writes a new virus that turns your Windoze machine into virtual bits of ****** ****.
Reply to this comment
by JessicaInPink November 19, 2009 9:53 AM PST
LOL...
by Renegade Knight November 19, 2009 9:55 AM PST
10 year olds can practice infecting Macs. Windoze takes more work.
by renGek November 19, 2009 11:39 AM PST
for the technically inept like my dad....yeah they should use macs. Everybody else who knows what they are doing should use linux or windows.
by The_happy_switcher November 19, 2009 12:44 PM PST
@Ren, I built my own pcs for 15 years until I got tired of fixing Microsoft's mistakes.
by kojacked November 19, 2009 12:47 PM PST
Just like you never forget to bog down talkback with your FUD. <br /> <br />Honestly I hope you enjoy your pink mac emblazoned with unicorn stickers. I really wish I had a mac like that. Maybe I could be as arrogant as you if I did.
by The_happy_switcher November 19, 2009 1:57 PM PST
I sense your frustration and anger, Kojac, that comes from all those years of Windows use. It can be hard to overcome inertia, but do try and move on from your self-loathing masochistic tendencies and envy of others.
by viper396 November 19, 2009 10:15 PM PST
Ah yes, no CNET article would be complete without the usual load of mediocre commentary from The_happy_switcher trying to prove is own self-worth by trying to belittle anyone who doesn't own the same products he does.
by Jamie_Foster November 19, 2009 8:43 AM PST
I think the worse thing MS could ever do is design laptops, desktops, netbooks, smartphones or any more mp3 players. MS has shown with the Xbox 360 that they cannot design high quality reliable hardware. The Zune HD is very promising. But I think the point of Zune is to serve as a test bed for media playing side of Windows Mobile 7 and 8. I can see myself buying a WM7 Phone from Toshiba, HTC, Samsung, LG or even Panasonic. MS need to invest in software, the cloud and marketing. They need to re-assure their hardware partners. If they try and be what IBM was they will fail. Not to mention they cannot be what IBM was because Cisco is so powerful in Networking and Google so dominant in web services and online advertising.
Reply to this comment
by stickfu November 19, 2009 10:15 AM PST
looks like an out take from "Young Frankenstein" (colourized)
by stickfu November 19, 2009 10:17 AM PST
oops posted in wrong topic
by JessicaInPink November 19, 2009 9:55 AM PST
Why do PCs have to have so many damn stickers?<br /><br />90% of that palm rest is a sticker! - and they are not the removable kind.<br /><br />They should just put a sticker in the center of the screen too.Why the hell not?
Reply to this comment
by theveggiedude November 19, 2009 10:12 AM PST
"Why do PCs have to have so many damn stickers?"<br /><br />Why do you think they are cheap? The advertising is a way to subsidize the cost. Ever wonder why all the PC adverts on TV have the Intel logo and jingle? Because Intel pays them to put it there, thus their advertising costs less.<br /><br />Apple doesn't subsidize its adverts with Intel, and doesn't puts adverts on their machines to lower the cost.
by renGek November 19, 2009 11:41 AM PST
ummmm, its not like a mattress tag, you can peel them off if you like.
by Been_there_Saw_it_before November 19, 2009 12:03 PM PST
You can peel the mattress tag off too. The threat of law only applies to the supply chain. The retail buyer can do what ever he or she chooses to do with the tag.
by Jeremy Chappell November 19, 2009 4:21 PM PST
I ALWAYS remove these stickers - I hate them. When I build a system for someone I ask them if they WANT the stickers (amazingly they often say they do - go figure). I do apply the Windows OEM sticker, you have to do that the comply with the license (though they have been put in some pretty odd places, especially on systems with really nice cases).<br /><br />I've always been amazed that something you're supposed to not divulge is so prominently displayed on the side of a system. The license key seems like something you'd rather not let anyone see. It's weird when you think about it.
by lazycat202 November 19, 2009 7:00 PM PST
people say: if you hate somebody, you will hate EVERYTHING that relate to him/hers :P<br />grow up! we're not kids anymore!
by JessicaInPink November 23, 2009 8:39 AM PST
PC stickers DO NOT PEEL off without some intense product. Sorry, dont want glue left behind either.<br /><br />PC idiots, enjoy your stickers! They should put them on your cheap cars too!
by bikerdavid November 19, 2009 10:56 AM PST
Is this laptop going to be available to buy? I'm looking for a small laptop with a touchscreen, and this would at very least be worth looking at.
Reply to this comment
by bikerdavid November 19, 2009 10:58 AM PST
Oops - next time I'll follow the link in the article.
by Earth-1 November 19, 2009 10:57 AM PST
Microsoft branching out. This will be interesting.<br /><br />Mike Nyc -1 - tw88dj
Reply to this comment
by ViewRoyal November 19, 2009 11:00 AM PST
"The Windows team quickly learned about some of the trade-offs that computer makers have to make, as well as some of the hidden costs" <br /><br />Hey, we're Microsoft. We'll tell you how to build a computer... Doh! <br />(Reality rears its ugly head ;-)
Reply to this comment
by inachu1 November 19, 2009 1:26 PM PST
I want to know why netbooks are not available on sale with 4 gigs of ram?<br />STOP LIMITING RETAIL COMPUTER HARDWARE!
Reply to this comment
by soltech1 November 27, 2009 7:27 AM PST
A 2GB stick of ram is about $50<br /><br />You can always upgrade. You buy a new netbook with more RAM - in the same way when you buy a bed, you buy a mattress
by ReaderCNET November 20, 2009 12:56 AM PST
Wish I was there :)
Reply to this comment
by mike.gw November 20, 2009 7:12 AM PST
"LOS ANGELES--As a software guy, Windows division president Steven Sinofsky readily admits that he had little idea of all that goes into building a laptop. " <br /> <br />This is an area where an integrated company like Apple shines. The OS and hardware teams working in concert to produce a device that meets the user's expectations. As an IT Director, I have always been frustrated by the promise and reality of Windows power management on laptops and Energy Star desktops in a networked environment. Network cards that won't power up after the Windows has gone to sleep or hibernation mode, or are simply slow to reestablish a known connection after waking up. I find that the best reliability often is to simply disable power management of the NICS. These are some of the consequences of the OS team working separately from hardware vendors.
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by u2mr2os2 November 21, 2009 1:17 PM PST
"That was part of the learning, really making sure we can walk in their shoes," Sinofsky said.<br /><br />Well, that sure seems to suggest MS is going to get into making hardware. Next step after their "signature PCs" in their stores. Soon they will be embracing the Apple model that they say has been wrong for years. Of course, they aren't going to make killer hardware by sending some executives to ride along and watch as a real company makes some hardware, they will buy someone like Acer.
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by odubtaig November 22, 2009 6:03 AM PST
Acer? I thought MS loved their developers.
Reply to this comment
by BlueNexus November 27, 2009 10:08 AM PST
". Although most laptops with touchscreens have matte finishes, Sinofsky said "We really wanted a glossy screen." Uhhh,, yea..<br />A "glossy" finish on a Touch screen? For touch screens most companies use matte instead of glossy for an obvious reason..... It's called FINGER PRINTS and... SMUDGES!!!<br />From "I dont know maybe".... touching the "Touch" screen. Really now? <br />Ever Heard of Research? Or perhaps common sense MS guys?
Reply to this comment
by BlueNexus November 27, 2009 10:55 AM PST
". Although most laptops with touchscreens have matte finishes, Sinofsky said "We really wanted a glossy screen." Uhhh,, yea..<br />A "glossy" finish on a Touch screen? For touch screens most companies use matte instead of glossy for an obvious reason..... It's called FINGER PRINTS and... SMUDGES!!!<br />From I don't know maybe.... touching the *Touch* screen.<br />Really now? <br />Ever Heard of Research? Or perhaps common sense MS guys?
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During her years at CNET, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft.

Beyond Binary is a look at how technology is changing our lives and the people behind all that life-changing stuff, with an extra emphasis on that which emanates from Redmond, Wash.

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