Windows 7 bug likely not a 'showstopper'
Microsoft said on Wednesday that it is looking into reports of a potential bug in the final version of Windows 7. However, Microsoft's top Windows executive said in a blog posting that the issue appears to be neither widespread, nor the "showstopper" that some are claiming it to be.
(Credit:
Microsoft)
The issue, noted on several enthusiast sites this week, involves a fairly arcane process used to check for problems in a particular disk. Under certain scenarios, the site suggested Windows 7 would siphon off all the available memory to perform the scan, potentially crashing the system.
One report went so far as to characterize the issue as a potential "showstopper" that might derail the product's launch, while others such as ZDNet's Ed Bott have downplayed the threat.
However, in the discussion on one of the blogs, top Windows executive Steven Sinofsky said that the company is looking into the issue. But, he said that the company hasn't reproduced the crashing issue, nor has it gotten widespread reports of crashes.
"While we appreciate the drama of 'critical bug' and then the pickup of 'showstopper' that I've seen, we might take a step back and realize that this might not have that defcon level," Sinofsky wrote on the site. "Bugs that are so severe as to require immediate patches and attention would have to have no workarounds and would generally be such that a large set of people would run across them in the normal course of using their PC...So far this is not one of those issues."
Microsoft finalized the code for Windows 7 two weeks ago and is preparing to release it to developers in Microsoft's MSDN and Technet programs on Thursday, as well as make it available to some large businesses on Friday. Those plans are continuing, a Microsoft representative said on Wednesday.
The Microsoft representative also confirmed that Sinofsky's comments were authentic and that Microsoft was looking into the issue, but declined to comment further.
During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft. E-mail Ina. 
Everyone should wait for SP1 now...
Shocking!
At least you're consistent. :)
And a fix is being made.
Unless your telling me Apple never needs to release patches?
And in 2 years Vista has crashed on me once and that was the fault of Nvidia's shoddy drivers.
Stop sipping the damn kool aid for a minute and realize that Windows is not the POS you think it is. Not everyone using a windows system experiences crashes.
It's safe and harmless and kid-friendly, but some of us would like the option of building a lean machine that does 0-60 in 3 seconds.
Turning a computer into a set-it-and-forget-it appliance isn't everyone's idea of perfection, in the same way that some of us like cars with road feel and connectedness instead of Lexus' view that a sensory deprivation chamber is "perfection".
Why? Well come on its MSDN and technet! It's where all the support people are ;)
The leak occurs during checkdisk, both in Windows, and checkdisk.exe /r via command line.
Memory usage is normal in stages 1-3, and explodes during stage 4, the reading stage.
"Exploding" explained... in XP, this process held about 10MB of ram... in W7, its filling up to about 90% of the ram, in GIGABYTES.
Some have been able to confirm on various machines (Intel Core, Core2, P4, AMD, x86, x64) including VMWare. Microsoft claming it to be motherboard drivers, but that doesn't explain VMware showing the same cause. Windows Server 2008 R2 also occasionally showing the same issue.
Correct.
Incidentally, one of the options that often pops up in Windows 7 on a USB drive/stick/whatever insertion, is the option to scan the disks and fix any errors...
"...would you rather they find out now, or when there's millions of angry customers wondering why the act of inserting a geek stick suddenly turns their PCs into molasses on an Alaskan January morning?"
Are you clear that what you're arguing is the same as executing a chkdsk in the command line????
My point was that there are those that like to call out that the sky is falling.... for an issue that hasn't been reproduced and so far has been traced to motherboard chipset drivers- something that isn't even Microsoft's responsibility.
And then you post your comments about USB sticks, doomsday, etc. You've fulfilled the position of Chicken Little perfectly.
Of course I want problems to be identified and resolved, but then I also don't want to overreact like you have either. Keep things in scope, seriously.
Blame the mobo drivers all you want... but the customers won't, and (probably) neither will the OEM.
As far as being a "showstopper"? Maybe a bit hyperbolic. OTOH, Microsoft cannot afford another Vista-like debacle. They need this one to launch flawlessly, or they're going to hurt a lot longer than just these past couple of fiscal quarters.
Then what do you expect Microsoft to do recode everyone elses drivers?
I mean what you guys are asking is unrealistic and blaming something on them that isn't even their fault.
"My point was that there are those that like to call out that the sky is falling.... for an issue that hasn't been reproduced and so far has been traced to motherboard chipset drivers- something that isn't even Microsoft's responsibility."
I think we have a solution. Everyone with a computer that has a motherboard and drivers should switch to Linux or a Mac. Everyone else can use Windows 7.
And I'm someone who hasn't had any problems with the Windows 7 RC.
This is a good thing... Microsoft has the daunting task of designing an OS around a billion different hardware configurations.. This has its obvious benefits ... and obvious disadvantages. Apple's approach allows it to optimize drivers for it's own hardware configurations.. making the OS more efficient with what it has available.. but precludes the ability to build your own Mac.
=.=
He's probably referring to the fact that Apple took on their modern OS project some time ago.. and Microsoft is just now getting in the game. XP is archaic... OS X wasn't the real deal until 10.4... but even then.. that was a few years ago. MS is entering the modern OS game with version 2 while their biggest competition is way ahead in the market.
Should've been a Beta 2... if you know what I mean.
BTW. Not even the "Vista capable" was a "showstopper"... why should a tiny bug like this one, derail the Windows 7 thunder rail...
"Peanut butter is WAY better than jelly, man..."
;-)
Is it better than KY jelly?
Not a problem. We understand that you were trying to type on a Windows computer.
:)
PS. you left of the last quote.
http://www.laptopmag.com/mobile-life/tech-support-showdown-2009.aspx?page=1
Amen
I think Microsoft spent two more minutes on a name ( or even had a contest) they could have done better.
:-D
.
...... Vegaman_Dan
...... monkeyfun14
.
in their endeavors to put a positive spin on any posting relating to Micro$oft, no matter how crappy the odds.
This has got to be the most demotivating job there ever was, and I am sure a lot of people feel sorry for the guys.
You got to leave it to them, the guys are posting regularly and to anyone who makes a somewhat less than favorable post about the Redmond monopolist.
The time and effort these guys are spending day-on-day on their pro-M$ spin leaves only one conclusion:
They are GETTING PAID for what they do.
Oh well, they are just doing their job, 2 more poor suckers kept from the dredge of unemployment.
Arthur
What are these other guys excuses?
how much did Apple pay you to post that?
MF 14 = Bad cop
I don't understand when people don't realize that there are several shills for Microsoft that post everywhere. They have been caught doing it before, and you would think that if someone is a shill that people would want that info. Regardless of whether you love or hate Microsoft, there is always something positive and negative to say about a product. The people who get caught shilling will always post nothing but positive comments about the company and every product that they have, that's not useful information, that's PR.
The fact is this: If a person consistently does nothing but promote one company and every single one of their products, while simultaneously bashing their competitors then their opinion is no better than that of a company spokesperson. I called out Super2online once on this very same thing, as he is the king of loving all things Microsoft.
Of course, they will simply lash out at us complaining that we are paid shills of Apple, Google, etc., but the simple fact is that ANYONE who shills for ANY company should be called out. If you find someone who is an Apple fanboy and hate all things Microsoft, call them out. Biased comments aren't useful to anyone, and if they are biased against Microsoft they are just as bad.
I have no doubt that there are several fanboys for Apple and Google as well, but none of that changes the fact that if someone does nothing but promote every single product from a company, people should be made aware of that fact when they read that persons comments.
Just curious, even if you weren't paid in any way,it seems odd that you would claim that Vegaman_Dan isn't either.
Assuming you are an unbiased consumer and not affiliated with Microsoft, how could you possibly know that someone else isn't?
Because what is the likelyhood?
Besides he writes positively about Apple as well.
What interests me is that anyone who defends Microsoft is a shill
But we have people who do the same exact thing for Apple and no one says a damn word to them.
I wanted to let you know that your last check to Monkeyfun14 and myself bounced- apparently you didn't have enough in your account to pay us for posting to CNET as you agreed to do. I'm afraid we'll have to stop doing so. It's a shame and it was a good run, but unless you are willing to make good on your word and pay us what you owe us, then we'll have to stop. Remember, it was $50 per posting.
That's the simple fact.
What I do comment on are fanboys. I don't care what system you use- when you post garbage like an idiot or make outlandish claims without any evidence to back it up, I will call you on it. If you step out of line, then I'll try to guide you back to the topic.
@CraigC2000:
I use PC's at work, usually a Win7 for my main desktop, Win7 on a netbook, and I SSH into a Linux box for my file server. As I make this comment, I'm on a 15" MacBookPro that I replaced the LCD on. I use whatever works for what I need it to do.
@Monkeyfun14:
If people think we are paid shills for Microoft, why the heck would we be HERE? Microsoft pays really well and surely we'd be out enjoying ourselves with that money instead of hanging out here. Either that, or we'd be much more clever about it and claim to be Apple fans or at least have user names suggesting something geeky.
Sometimes people just can't believe that you actually can use more than one company's product without burning in hellfire.
What I do comment on are fanboys. I don't care what system you use- when you post garbage like an idiot or make outlandish claims without any evidence to back it up, I will call you on it. If you step out of line, then I'll try to guide you back to the topic."
I would tend to agree with that statement, except for one thing. I have yet to see you go after the Microsoft "trolls" with the same vigor as the Apple "trolls". I see one post after another going after the Apple shills, but what about the others??
See, you lose all credibility when you make fanboy posts. You defend Microsoft when people complain or post about bugs, but then you ridicule Apple for the exact same thing:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-10304342-245.html
Sorry monkeyfun, you are a proven Troll. You can complain all you want about Apple fanboys, but it's hypocritical as a Microsoft fanboy is no better than any other fanboy.
By your own admission, your opinion is just as worthless as theirs is.
To be truthful, this is how it works for any OS. There will always be those that jump on any vulnerability in an OS to run around screaming and pointing, "SEE? SEE? It's inferior to MY chosen product! That OS is inferior and so is anyone who uses it!"
It's just the way it goes. It is true of operating systems, car brands, political affiliation, cola choice, etc. Any time you have a polarizing factor like this where it's us vs them, you'll have this sort of mentality.
@CraigC2000:
Take a look at your own comments right there and ask yourself to define troll behavior. Are you really helping here or just adding to the problem?
Amen
Watching your pathetic, unfailingly regular pro-M$ diatribes (and often enough anti-Apple spin) is an exquisite fun just by itself.
:-)
watching fanboys is fun, ain't it
especially fanboys of the Apple variety
I'd be curious to hear what your experience with Win7 has been. How long have you been using it? What system did you install it on? What other applications do you use with it? Once we have that information, we can better evaluate your comments.
Thanks!
Better than Vista, but still has some niggles. Mine are as follows:
* they moved everything, obfuscating even the more basic controls. These can be found, but I pity the typical power user and especially Joe Sixpack.
* moving files, while far improved from Vista, is still slower than XP (BITS or CIFS/SMB - makes no diff. still pretty slow. I will give Windows props for keeping its default merge behavior (over OSX' default replace), however.
* there was a rather ugly bug I came across concerning sleep mode and dual monitors, but that may have been fixed.
The test system? A Dell Latitude e6400 w/ 4GB RAM and a decent Centrino2 under the hood. I don't recommend anything with less than 4GB of RAM in it to run the thing...
can we assume jtjt145 = Random_Walk = penguinsto?
may be I was just paranoid...
http://www.laptopmag.com/mobile-life/tech-support-showdown-2009.aspx?page=1
Amen
Unfortunately, Apple has not chosen to enter the Enterprise market at this time and simply do not have a product that can scale up to the levels necessary for support, service, or reliabiity. Linux and Windows both can handle this, but Apple does not.
Remember that while a product may or may not work for you, others have other experiences. I personally find the account management on OS X to be a serious royal pain in the rump when dealing with hundreds of systems. Active Directory can make this a simple task on Windows, but it's not an easy thing to learn initially. Linux has their own versions that are just as if not more powerful and adaptable, but again, it's not an easy thing to implement.
Use what works for your purpose and don't bother condemning others for their choice in products. You'll live a happier life.
But since 2000 and even more so with 2003? I have not had any issues with what you describe *period*
Often we have issues with custom written app's that are poorly written that leak, and need those app's restarted. I have had issues with poor unistall routines that call for a server reboot, but if you know what you are doing you can get past the *service marked for deletion* issues.
And they are not just linked to MS. I had bigger issues with printing problem in Solaris. If I wanted a nice iron clad Print/File with a wonderfull enterprise directory. I would love Novell, but well we saw how well they did with there marketing, and siting on there thumbs with high prices, thinking MS could never hurt them.
Try OS-X Server.
Still have not figured out what is causing it except its some dll problem when i go under problems and solutions.
Memory problems can cause all sorts of headaches as they won't show up until you poke a value at the right page in memory when it explodes.
Try this
2 nics enable internet connection sharing, off the second connection connect a PC. Enable media sharing to that PC.
Off nic 1 have it connected to a router, off that router have an XBOX360 connected, enable media sharing to that XBOX 360.
Now also off Nic 1 fire up some torrent downloads (FTP/HTTP work fine) must be torrent.
Now fire up the XBOX 360, and use the Media Extender. Watch some movies, now while its playing the movies, pull the power on the XBOX 360
Plug it back in, try to reconnect to media center.. you will get media center unavailable.
Check your torrents you will see they will stop, with an error saying the file can not be opened.
Check the file, and open up security properties, you will find you have no access.
Disable ICS, and you will find you now have access, the torrent should start back up, and the XBOX 360 will now connect.
Once all is working, re-enable ICS and everything is back to normal.
Its pretty odd, and one of my bugs I had submitted.
But how many people will run into that situation?
http://www.laptopmag.com/mobile-life/tech-support-showdown-2009.aspx?page=1
Amen
Enjoy Win 7 when it ever comes out... Hopefully by early spring!
The phrase, "Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" comes to mind here.
As for the public release of Win7, CNET reported that it will be October 22nd.
Although in all fairness Windows Vista (which I don't like) and Windows 7 (which I do like due to better speed) don't seem to have as many exploits as XP did.
http://www.laptopmag.com/mobile-life/tech-support-showdown-2009.aspx?page=1
Amen
When does Windows not lock up?
I can use my Windows XP based computer at work without turning it off or rebooting it for at least a month. The problem is that the updates come along and make me reboot, so I don't know how long it could really go.
Apple has released 10.5.7 and 10.5.8 in the span of two months, for example. They have updated Safari twice since the official release of version 4, and will update it again with Snow Leopard release next month.
Regularity is important.
I don't know of any large scale software product that doesn't have updates whether that be Microsoft, Apple, or Adobe or even Linux. There used to be the model of only releasing OS updates every couple of years with new versions. I'd rather have patches delivered in a timely manner.
- by Vergissmeinnicht August 6, 2009 2:19 AM PDT
- I'm with Leo Laporte on the Mac vs. PC thing....There's not really a difference between the two. Sure, mac os X may have a shiny shell, and some good software bundled with it.....but when it comes down to the basics....the only real difference is that Apple's menu bars are at the top of the window, MS's are at the bottom. On windows to close the window is on the right side of a window, mac it's the left side. THESE ARE TRIVIAL DIFFERENCES! At the end of the day, Mac vs. PC is just a distraction, and fanboys on either side end up looking like unrefined jackasses.
- Like this Reply to this comment
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- by ddesy August 6, 2009 6:08 AM PDT
- I hope you don't really think that these are the only differences. The terminal in OS X is far more advanced than what Windows has.
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- by Nataku4ca August 6, 2009 11:12 AM PDT
- @ddesy
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- by BogusBasin August 6, 2009 12:13 PM PDT
- The only difference? Here is another difference. Read it and weep. The argument that Apple costs more is debatable. The value they have is not.
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- by ralfthedog August 6, 2009 12:27 PM PDT
- OS-X and Linux use less RAM. They also eat less clock cycles. If all you do is play games and/or use MS Office that is no big deal. If you are doing high performance computing where you start a run then come back six weeks later to find you are half way done, it can be a killer.
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Showing 1 of 2 pages (142 Comments)define advanced...
http://www.laptopmag.com/mobile-life/tech-support-showdown-2009.aspx?page=1
Amen