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May 6, 2009 4:48 PM PDT

Ballmer: 'The world borrowed too much money'

by Ina Fried

Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer speaks to a crowd at Stanford University on Wednesday.

(Credit: Ina Fried/CNET)

PALO ALTO, Calif.--Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer began his talk at Stanford University by offering a quick course in economics.

Explaining the economic crisis that has slowed business worldwide and caused Microsoft to have its first companywide layoffs, Ballmer told the crowd at the school's packed Memorial Auditorium, "The world borrowed too much money."

Then he went back to his obligatory chat about the early days at Microsoft, including when he dropped out of Stanford's business school to join the software maker. He noted that he knew how to read a balance sheet, but not much else.

"All I'd ever done is interview for jobs and market brownie bits," he said, a reference to his days at Proctor and Gamble.

His decision to drop out was not well received at home, Ballmer noted. "My dad said 'What the heck is software?' and my mom said 'Why the heck would anyone want a computer?'"

The problem with software wasn't that people didn't want computers, though. The challenge, Ballmer said later in his chat, is that software doesn't wear out, meaning companies have to do something new and different to get people to upgrade.

At the same time, he said, software products are only as good as their last couple of versions. "Windows is only as good as its last release or two," Ballmer said, laughing and acknowledging his own backhanded dig at Windows Vista.

I'll be updating this post during the chat, but for those that want even more coverage, it seems like everyone in the room is tweeting the speech.

Ballmer has had memorable appearances at Stanford in recent years.

In 2007, he used his to label Google's growth plans as "insane" and called the company a one-trick pony. Back in 2005, he noted that, had he not gone into software, he probably would have landed in the insurance business. He also said he would probably retire around 2017.

Update at 5:45 p.m. PDT:

Ballmer moved on to questions.

He was asked about the company's browser strategy. Ballmer said the company's goal is to create a platform where more capable applications can be built. That said, the need for standards acts as a gate on the speed of change.

He also noted there is value in integrating search and other technologies into the browser but noted that because Internet Explorer is part of Windows it will also be separate in some ways from search and other Internet products. Rivals, he said, may "wire in" their search into the browser.

"That can't be our approach," Ballmer said.

Asked about his role in shaping Microsoft's culture, he said that he thinks he has had a big role. "I've shaped Microsoft culture a lot, for better and for worse," Ballmer said.

Ballmer said he and Bill Gates shaped each other and the company.

"We kind of, in a sense, grew up together," Ballmer said. "The ultimate test is if you are able to get done what you want to get done." Ballmer was also pressed on a comment he made that fewer bad ideas will be funded in the current economy. Ballmer said that, in general, truly bad ideas don't get funded, but that the number of companies does scale up with the availability of money. If there was four times as much venture capital funding, he said, "you'd have four times as many companies, but I am not sure you would have four times as much innovation."

During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft. E-mail Ina.
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by dylerl May 6, 2009 5:27 PM PDT
This man Ballmer really does not get anything, why is he CEO of Microsoft? He does not understand where the technology industry is headed and now this makes me think he does not even get finance. Our crisis has nothing to do with the world. If anything America borrowed too much money but thats not even it, it's because American Banks were greedy and giving loans to people who could not afford them, they were scamming the system and then selling those loans again and scamming the system a second time, it really had nothing to do with borrowing too much money and definitely had nothing to do with the world borrowing too much money, once again we have stupid comments from a stupid man who should step down as CEO and then maybe Microsoft may have a bright future, but I still may doubt that if they keep releasing lousy products.
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by renGek May 6, 2009 6:14 PM PDT
thats a 2 way street. You can't just blame the banks. They offered to lend you money you can't afford to keep paying mortgages on but YOU as an adult should have realized all by yourself that you cannot afford it.

I blame the borrowers more than the lenders. A person making 50K/year have no business trying to buy a $500K home without any savings. And then that person goes on susie orman and asks her if he can buy that $45K car on top of the home.
by ofmyony May 6, 2009 7:24 PM PDT
Banks are to blame. They were fully aware that many of these loans were toxic. Really just saying it's the consumers fault is like saying it's the consumers fault Vista sucks. If the banks cannot make sound judgments on loaning your money to someone else they better find a new business because the future of our economy depends on it.
by lordmorgul May 6, 2009 10:27 PM PDT
@ofmyony: the analogy to Vista only works IF AND ONLY IF buying Vista caused the consumer to go bankrupt. The choice of how big a loan they could afford is and will always be the primarily the consumer's problem. The banks did take bigger risks than they should have, and the big government funded programs to put ineligible people into homes were taking even bigger risks with the public's money (that would be you fannie and freddie, and just about every democratic congressional supporter of those programs.. you can only let Harry Reid hide here and blame Bush if you're a gullible blinded moron..).

Simple point is this: the consumer's who bought into loans they could not afford did so foolishly, and the banks who risked money on people who were well above reasonable margins of risk did so foolishly. The average (responsible) consumer who lost a fortune in the drop of his home price while he responsibly paid his mortgage is the victim, along with those who are out of work now who were the responsible guy paying his mortgage a year ago.

Banks did not give people loans that those people did not ASK FOR. It is that simple. The unfortunate truth is most of those bad loans are not hurting the irresponsible people who took them nearly as much as they are hurting the responsible consumer. That is not the solely the bank's fault either. You should be more angry at the irresponsible people taking loans they could never have repaid than at the banks... it is foolish to say ANY adult over 18 years of age and not handicapped shouldn't be held responsible for getting into loans they could not repay. Libraries are available to anyone who TRIES to get to them (key word is in there if you missed it). They had the opportunity to understand their finances before getting into that situation IF AND ONLY IF THEY TRIED.
by wolivere May 7, 2009 5:07 AM PDT
While a lot of this started in the US, it is a global crisis. Because the world as a whole borrowed or lent money to easily and to fast.

Those bank Debit's in the US, where backed by other banks retirement funds, investment funds around the world. Banks in many countries lent money they did not really have. Only countries with strong controls on banks have come out a little less weathered.

What happens in the US, tends to get mimicked around the world. Many times thanks to TV, have you watched many flip this house shows lately? They where the rage a year ago.

People in many of the G8 got caught up in belief that there was no end to what you could ask for a house, and the market in many countries, has not come back down.

This drive was fueled by the banks lending easy money, extending mortgages from the traditional 25 year to 35 and 50 year mortgages.

In my home town, I listen as real estate agents continue to try and promote increased housing prices, house prices that have gone up 200% over 5 years.

I have listened to them say its population influx, yet immigration is at an even 3.2% new housing starts at 4%. Odd new houses are being built faster then immigration.

I hear them say there are less houses on the market, yet over the past year used house inventory has gone up 17%, but thats only for houses on the market less then 3 months. When you take the 3-12 month into account its closer to 20% over the past year.

One radio add that ran daily finally vanished, as this real estate agent who use to run his own news type show, bragged about buying your house if he could not sell it in 30 days. Strange he has vanished.

But, as I said its not a US thing, and yes some people should have known they could not afford it, but thats not how the banks sold it.

They sold it with the balloon payments on the premise you buy house a) at x% and sell it in 1 year at y% of increased profit, since the average property saw a double digit increase in house value. You then use the capital you made to buy house b) with more money down, increasing your equity in the house, you then flip it again, before higher interest kicks in. You repeat till you can buy a house cash.

This worked well for a long time, then the housing market crashed, and suddenly all these houses lost values, and they could not be sold, then the higher interest kicked in.

It was a gamble taken both by the banks and the mortgage holder. It was a scheme cooked up, and taught to many in investment class's echoed on TV, and boasted about by self made millionaires. Many knew it could not last. But, it was a perfect storm created by some get rich quick boy's higher up in the financial markets. Many just bought into the dream. The only ones walking away happy are the guys who started the entire scam.

But as I said to people in the US they see this upfront, but its a senario playing out around the world.
by Renegade Knight May 7, 2009 12:02 PM PDT
Plenty of blame to go around. If anyone in the chain did their job we would not be here.

Realtors hyped real estate saying 'It's all ok" when it wasn't.
Banks loaned to people who they shouldn't have.
People borrowed more than they could afford.
Wall Street types didn't assess the risks of the "loan packages" they were hawking correctly.
Buyers of those packages didn't either.
The insuraners of those bundled mortgage packages didn't set their rates according to the risk.

If anyone had done what they were supposed to do the chain would have stopped.
by BlitzBoy1120 May 6, 2009 5:34 PM PDT
Ballmer looks odd in that dark space in the picture.
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by RompStar_420 May 6, 2009 5:47 PM PDT
Yes, Ballmer should resign. Bill, pick up the PHONE and call him... Come on! take out the Bong, like in the good 'old days, have a one-on-one conversation and do what you must!!!
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by Vegaman_Dan May 6, 2009 6:39 PM PDT
Wow, out of four comments, two people say that Ballmer should resign or be removed from Microsoft. The article had nothing to do with Microsoft other than asking a CEO what their opinion was and based on that, two people already are calling for his removal.

Mind you, these same two people are over the top pro Apple fanboys, so it is possible that they are just trolling and not actually adding anything of value to the conversation. It's up to the reader to determine that.

I agree with some of what Ballmer says and disagree with other parts. I would like to also hear Steve Jobs' thoughts on the matter.
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by PhaseDMA May 7, 2009 5:28 AM PDT
Ballmer does need to be removed. The reason people attack him so much is because he needs to be removed.

Just one example. Yahoo. Despite a company that was so dead in the water the flies had already come and gone he couldn't manage to take it over - Even with the massive power and money behind Microsoft.

He can't seem to do anything right, and at every turn people laugh at him. Half the time because he actually does something so absurd as to merit being laughed at. The other half? Because of the first half. I mean come on. He is a CEO. But not just of a large nameless company, but of a company with a enormous legacy.

I mean I can't think of a single good thing that has come out of Microsoft that was set into motion after Bill Gates left.

And trust me. I'm not Apple fan boy. The most I have ever done was buy a iPod... And I sold my iPod Touch when I bought my Omnia.
by BogusBasin May 7, 2009 7:27 AM PDT
If your intent was to appear as an uninformed ignorant person whose only purpose in posting is to blindly defend shortcomings about any and all things Microsoft without actually researching the facts you quote or even knowing the subject matter at hand, then you have succeeded greatly.

If that was not your intent, then some research may be in order before your next posting.
by BogusBasin May 7, 2009 10:15 AM PDT
Ever notice the same people in here over and over defending and making excuses for Microsloth (monkeyfun, vegaman)? There has never been a company more worthy of criticism. Amen
by Seaspray0 May 7, 2009 10:57 AM PDT
@BogusBasin.

1. Congratulations on posting something other than "Balmer is an ape. Amen".
2. Can you explain how "I agree with some of what Ballmer says and disagree with other parts." is blindly defending microsoft?
3. I have been reporting your other posts (balmer=monkeyfun) as a violation of the terms of service (flaming other users). Have a nice day.
by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:29 AM PDT
@BogusBasin

Excellent postings! Would you care to expand upon them with something like facts, evidence, or any sort of background? I would be curious to see what you have to base your comments upon. You might even sway me to change my opinion as well.

By the way, your macro key is stuck again- you're makin the same comment in all the Microsoft stories again. Please check on that, would you?

Thanks!
by Renegade Knight May 7, 2009 12:04 PM PDT
@PhaseDMA

Reality is the reason people attack him is that they don't like MicroSoft. MicroSoft has done a lot to earn that animosity.
by PhaseDMA May 7, 2009 9:03 PM PDT
BogusBasin -

I like Microsoft actually. However I hate Ballmer.

But I'm sorry. I am quite uniformed - I thought Yahoo has yet to be bought out. Apparently I was wrong. Can you do me a favor though? Tell every major news company about this fact. They all seem to also be uniformed.
by humanssssss May 6, 2009 7:05 PM PDT
Banks loan money from the Fed to loan to people. Banks felt they are immune to failure because the govt always come in to help them using tax payers wallet. This has happened before with the Savings and Loan crisis.

Another point of contention is the economic divide. We are so fixated in economic growth that the more money that's pumped into the economy the rich will get richer at the expense of the poor. It is very concerning if economic growth doesn't go in tandem with increase employment.

Ballmer is the least person respected to talk about the economy. His goal at his company is to maintain a monopoly to ensure greater profit. With $30B cash, Microsoft still opt to lay off 3,000 employees. When companies take a hold of the economy they will further increase unemployment while increasing their profit. Microsoft is still a monopoly.
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by rotordogg May 7, 2009 3:49 AM PDT
I agree with what you say. But I'd add that banks thought they were immune to bad loans after the change in bankruptcy laws in 2005. Even after bankruptcy individuals still had to pay the lionshare of their debt. They can give you unrealistic loans all day an in the end you'll just pay them X$ forever and they get to keep your stuff and resell it. Why wouldn't they want to trick you into a loan you couldn't afford?
by monkeyfun14 May 7, 2009 4:43 AM PDT
A company trying to make alot of profit now wh
by monkeyfun14 May 7, 2009 5:46 AM PDT
Eh why was half my post edited out?
by Renegade Knight May 7, 2009 12:08 PM PDT
Not quite. Banks borrow from the fed for different reasons. The government's method of rescuing a bank isn't a free check. Your bank will no longer exist. Best case you are now part of a another bank willing to take your bank on. Worst case that's it. The doors shut and people get their insured deposits from the feds.

It's only the magnitude of the problem that has the government doing things differently than normal practice.

One of the issuesi s that banks now make money by flipping loans. Not by carrying them. Loan fee's are the new bread and butter. The temptation is to loan more to less qualified people to make those fees. If they carried the loans they would pay a lot more attention to the ability of their borrows to pay them back.
by honorable1 May 6, 2009 8:30 PM PDT
How about: None of you realize that Mr. Balmer is spouting a "Man behind the curtain" mentality. Obviously the man didnt become fabulously wealthy by pure luck all this time. He's smart enough to 'toe the line' so to speak, so that MS looks like your 'friend' in this new Global Channel One fiasco that's lit a lightning path to our exit from the world stage. Take heed of your stock my friends. Take heed of your stock.
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by Commander_Spock May 6, 2009 9:14 PM PDT
Re: "[... Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer began his talk at Stanford University by offering a quick course in economics.

Explaining the economic crisis that has slowed business worldwide and caused Microsoft to have its first companywide layoffs, Ballmer told the crowd at the school's packed Memorial Auditorium, "The world borrowed too much money." ...]"

Economic crisis.....!!! What economic crisis???

Show us the missing "Applications Programming Interfaces" (APIs) in Code-Base OS/2 (Windows) that should/would inform our judgment.

And, remember always - "Technology Rules The World"!
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by Commander_Spock May 6, 2009 9:26 PM PDT
BTW, Re: "[... Economic crisis.....!!! What economic crisis???...]"

On January 20, 2009 - It was "Mission Accomplished" - Again!; and, that's why the question is - "Economic crisis".....!!! What economic crisis???

Long Lives OS/2!
by Vegaman_Dan May 6, 2009 9:55 PM PDT
@Commander_Spock wrote:

:Economic crisis.....!!! What economic crisis???:

Perhaps you haven't been paying attention to the news for the last five or so years? Heck, just the last couple of months? Look at the number of layoffs, trade deficits, gas/oil prices, government overspending, etc.

I trust you must be aware of some of this?
by sargess25 May 6, 2009 9:27 PM PDT
"The world borrowed too much money." - said Ballmer
wrong! the world spent too much money on your crooked overpriced products

"All I'd ever done is interview for jobs and market brownie bits," - said Ballmer
all you ever did was to act as a buffoon in TV commercial flogging the greatest con in the IT industry; Windows OS, that is

Time for people to start throwing bananas (instead of eggs) at this corpulent, stridently loud, sweaty monkey
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by Seaspray0 May 7, 2009 11:15 AM PDT
Why not just come out and say you really hate microsoft rather than bore us daily with a stupid rant?
by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:31 AM PDT
You could save those bananas for a food bank or other charity group that could make better use of them.

If you wish to hurl insults at the man, go right ahead. I believe he's got a fairly thick skin by now and can shrug off fanboys without too much effort.
by May 6, 2009 10:22 PM PDT
Ballmer + Ron Paul = buddies.
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by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:33 AM PDT
Every time I see the name Ron Paul, I keep thinking of the loud pitchman Billy Mayes. I know there is no connection whatsoever, but it's just an automatic mental image I have trouble resisting. I see him giving a speech about this or that policy like it's the greatest policy in the world PLUS it comes with a matching set of knives!
by EcuadorHomesOnline May 7, 2009 4:17 AM PDT
Yes, yes, and yes - personal debt, corporate debt, and government debt is 100% behind the downturn of the economy. Companies such as Microsoft with no debt and cash in the bank will weather the storm fairly well. Here's an article on this subject - http://www.halfbakedlunatic.com/post/2008/11/06/The-role-that-our-national-debt-has-played-in-the-financial-crisis.aspx
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by Random_Walk May 7, 2009 7:01 AM PDT
Microsoft does carry some debt - it is unavoidable for any corporation that size to not do so.

Also, considering their recent statements, they're not doing as well as you intimate.
by massfat May 7, 2009 6:31 PM PDT
Microsoft carries no significant debt. Companies sometimes carry debt for reasons that are not related to the necessity of having the money.
by Random_Walk May 7, 2009 6:56 AM PDT
Err, question: How much borrowing (at least on the business level) was done to finance IT upgrade projects, and to pay for Microsoft licensing?

Hand, feed, don't bite, etc.
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by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:34 AM PDT
What company are you referring to? Microsoft's IT department or any other company's? Your comments are a bit vague on the issue.
by biffhenerson May 7, 2009 8:55 AM PDT
Bllmer hit the nail right on the head. The world does borrow too much money. When the creditors call in their loans, the poop hits the fan. There is no free lunch. Someone has to pay. Somehow it always ends up being me! From single people to countries, there is way too much living beyond our means. Ballmer ROCKS! Are you kidding me? He is awesome! The energy, the charisma, ability to get people excited about any topic. He is the best of the best. Not as boring and stuffy as you? Perhaps.
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by The_happy_switcher May 7, 2009 9:16 AM PDT
"The world borrowed too much money." Gee, thank you Captain Obvious.
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by Seaspray0 May 7, 2009 11:19 AM PDT
Best post I've read today! LOL! Thanks for the good laugh, AppleRocks.
by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:41 AM PDT
It is rather obvious, isn't it? But then I also don't understand why they went to Microsoft to get an answer about the economy when instead they should perhaps talk to the government and banking industry instead?

Microsoft, Apple, Dell, Red Hat- they have nothing to do with the economy. They don't have an impact on those decisions our leaders in Washington have made. Seems like they are asking the wrong people for an opinion.
by massfat May 7, 2009 6:32 PM PDT
Microsoft and Apple (especially Microsoft) do have an impact on government policies. Though it is probably far less than financial institutions and the like.
by tundraboy May 7, 2009 10:17 AM PDT
Ballmer has near zero expertise on international monetary economics. Just because he's the CEO of the largest software company doesn't make him an expert on everything. Hell, he's not even an expert on running Microsoft successfully. Ruining, yes. Running, no.

As to blaming the borrowers, sorry that doesn't scan. The banking business has always been you apply for a loan and the bank grants you one depending on whether or not they see you as a good credit risk. Yes some borrowers weren't financially savvy, but that's why they're not bankers. Banks who we expect to be financially savvy, weren't. Plain and simple, they got stupid and greedy. Blame g
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by tundraboy May 7, 2009 10:19 AM PDT
(continuing) Blame goes 99% banks, 1% borrowers.
by dbloyd May 7, 2009 10:25 AM PDT
"The world borrowed too much money to buy Macs." - Steve Ballmer.
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by The_happy_switcher May 7, 2009 10:39 AM PDT
That photo looks like he's saying: "Man, the size of my prostate is like this big."
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by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:41 AM PDT
*hehs* Cute.

It IS a bad photo choice, to be sure. :)
by Vegaman_Dan May 7, 2009 11:39 AM PDT
@bogusbasin:

"Yeah, and now seaspray is reporting me for flaming. "

I don't agree that you should have your comments flagged for flaming- they are disruptive, illogical, immature and rather insulting to the readers of CNET. But the right to make yourself look like an idiot is just that- your right. I don't think you've violated the EULA for CNET at this time and should be allowed to continue to spout your nonsense as much as you wish as long as you do not cross that line and violate the EULA.

The manner in which you conduct yourself here is purely up to you. Nobody can force you to behave like a juvenile- that is your decision.
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by rpaloalto May 8, 2009 5:38 PM PDT
Ha, I think it's very sad. That a company as large as microsoft has such a bumbling moron as CEO.
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About Beyond Binary

During her years at CNET News, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once, and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days, most of her attention is focused on Microsoft.


Beyond Binary is a look at how technology is changing our lives and the people behind all that life-changing stuff, with an extra emphasis on that which emanates from Redmond, Wash.

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