• On The Insider: Criminal Past of Woods Mistress Revealed
August 14, 2009 11:52 AM PDT

Apple's Snow Leopard: A flurry of changes

by Erica Ogg
  • Font size
  • Print
  • 204 comments
Share

Snow Leopard

Apple's Bertrand Serlet outlines changes to Mac OS X 10.6 at WWDC.

(Credit: James Martin/CNET)

According to rumors, the release of Mac OS X 10.6, Apple's operating system also known as Snow Leopard, might arrive a bit early. Though Apple announced at the Worldwide Developers Conference in June that Snow Leopard would hit stores in September, tech blogs became overly excited when it was whispered that it might be ready to debut on or about August 28.

How much does it matter that it could arrive five whole days before September officially begins? It doesn't. Regardless of when the operating system ships, here's what to expect from Snow Leopard, and why it might matter to you.

What's the difference between Snow Leopard and Leopard?

First thing to know: This is not a complete overhaul of Mac OS X. Rather, it's a series of small to medium-sized improvements, what Apple calls "refinements." Much of the new shine to OS X 10.6 comes from changes that are under the surface, possibly not obvious to the unobservant. But Apple does say that the improvements make the overall OS much faster, including a 45-percent faster installation than the previous version of the operating system, OS X 10.5, or Leopard. Apple is also promising faster boot times, quicker shut down, a speedier process when joining wireless networks, and faster backups to Time Machine. And it's not just quicker, Apple says, it's lighter: Upon install it frees up 6GB of space.

Specific applications have been tinkered with as well, with a lot of attention focused on Quicktime, Expose, and a shiny new Safari 4 browser, which was released in June. For more on that, see here.

Quicktime gets a mysterious new version number, and is now called Quicktime X. It's a bit slicker, and the new interface appears similar to the iPhone's media player. The real change is that many features that were previously in the Pro version of Quicktime are now in the free version. You will be able to edit video inside QuickTime using a video timeline ribbon that appears along the bottom of the screen. And there will be fewer steps involved in video uploading. You don't have to worry about file formats--Quicktime will do any necessary conversion and upload directly to video-hosting sites or MobileMe, Apple's subscription service that syncs personal files on any of its devices. Apple promises it will take just one click to record audio or video (on a Mac's built-in mic or camera) with the new Quicktime. It will also support HTTP streaming of a wider variety of file formats (like h.264 and AAC). It's a feature that many competing media players have long offered, and it automatically adjusts the playback bit rate according to what the connection can handle. It also means you can stream video or audio through more firewalls.

Expose, an operating system UI feature for organizing open application windows, or just the windows from a particular application currently running, gets tweaked a bit too. In Snow Leopard, Expose is integrated with app icons in the dock, which cuts out the need to first switch to the specific application you want before activating Expose to see its open windows. It also means you don't have to use a keyboard, or use a trackpad gesture to call it up. Clicking and holding an app's icon will bring all windows open that are associated with that program to the front.

What's the one killer feature worth upgrading for?

Many people will probably consider support for Microsoft Exchange Server 2007 the most important new feature of Snow Leopard. Improved Exchange support will be integrated into Mail, iCal, and Address Book in Snow Leopard, which means e-mail, calendar appointments, to-do lists, and contacts from Outlook will be viewable on your personal calendar, mail, and address books. It also allows things like dragging and dropping contacts into iCal to schedule meetings, and your Mac will be able to discover time conflicts between personal and work calendars and change the meeting time and location.

Related: Microsoft is improving its Exchange support for the Mac too. This week Microsoft said that Outlook for Mac will replace Entourage, the current e-mail and calendar program in the Mac Office suite. Although it will still differ from the Windows version of Outlook, it will add support for more Exchange features, such as public folders and rights management features.

How much?

Apple surprised people by putting the price to upgrade to Snow Leopard at a very attractive $29 for a single license, and $49 for a five-user family pack. But there's a catch: you have to already have Leopard installed to pay those prices. If you're upgrading from a previous version of Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger), you'll have to pay $169, which includes an upgrade to 10.5 (Leopard) and 10.6 (Snow Leopard). For a 5-user family pack license, it'll cost $229. And Snow Leopard is only compatible with Macs containing Intel chips. On the OS front, Leopard is the end of the line for PowerPC Mac owners.

Is it worth upgrading right away, or should I wait?

Some people are fans of waiting until the first update, the 0.1 release, which tends to correct any of the immediate issues that inevitably pop up when a new operating system is released to the public. Some who attempted to upgrade to the first version of Leopard ran into trouble after the software was installed, and when they attempted to restart their machines a blue screen would appear instead. But it appeared to hinge on a specific piece of third-party software many had installed that was out of date. The majority had a smooth transition to Leopard.

Overall, we think this will be a worthwhile upgrade if the speed claims turn out to be true. Another way of looking at is that for the price of the Quicktime to Quicktime Pro upgrade, you get most of the Quicktime Pro features plus a newly tweaked core OS. We think it's a good deal for Apple OS X 10.5 users.

When will it be available?

So far, Apple has said only "September." Recent rumors have indicated it might be ready earlier than that, but it's mid-August now, so that's mostly inconsequential. No matter what, it's going to be available before Windows 7 is set to roll out on October 22. When it's available, we'll be sure to let you know.

Erica Ogg is a CNET News reporter who covers Apple, HP, Dell, and other PC makers, as well as the consumer electronics industry. She's also one of the hosts of CNET News' Daily Podcast. In her non-work life, she's a history geek, a loyal Dodgers fan, and a mac-and-cheese connoisseur. E-mail Erica.
Recent posts from Apple
Apple updates Mac Pro with 3.33GHz chip option
Time shows off tablet-size version of Sports Illustrated
Psystar said to have deal with Apple
Report: Apple accused of NAND price manipulation
What if: Apple Newton vs. Apple iPhone
Apple App Store collector's items: 10 rarities
iPhone officially lands in South Korea
Apple sues power adapter knockoff maker
Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 3 pages (204 Comments)
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 12:09 PM PDT
Looks good.
Reply to this comment
by Perry_Clease August 14, 2009 12:26 PM PDT
Yes, I am looking forward to installing it.
by BogusBasin August 14, 2009 1:10 PM PDT
I think hell just froze over. Monkeyfun? Are you feeling okay?

Amen
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 1:13 PM PDT
@BogusBasin

Call it an attitude change i'll attempt to be more neutral. Maybe others will follow one can only hope.
by mclaurin10 August 14, 2009 1:20 PM PDT
thanks Monkeyfun, good stuff.

ANyway, not nearly as big of a revision/iupgrade as Win7 but Im really looking to see how OpenCL pans out.
by BogusBasin August 14, 2009 1:26 PM PDT
@monkey

I will try to do the same. Emphasis on TRY.

Amen
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 1:33 PM PDT
BTW,

I also emphasize the importance of this towards other Windows and OSX users as well.

Random_Walk and Mr.Dee and any others from both sides.
by myles taylor August 14, 2009 1:38 PM PDT
I'm impressed Monkeyfun. I'm glad to see that you can be objective. I hope Mr Dee, Seaspray, and others follow your wise example.
by Seaspray0 August 14, 2009 1:56 PM PDT
"Upon install it frees up 6GB of space". That alone is worth the $29 upgrade.
by walker2151 August 14, 2009 2:27 PM PDT
@dano10000:

I'm a little confused, at the article saying small to medium changes. To my understanding they made a completely 64bit kernel which is not a small change and not at all possible with a "service pack". Using 10A432 does feel like it's just small changes, but correct me if I'm wrong it's actually some pretty big code changes at least.
by ralfthedog August 14, 2009 2:35 PM PDT
Small from the user perspective. This was more of a trim things down and get it running faster/cleaner release vs lots of new features.

I plan on upgrading my computers one at a time. I have never had trouble with a new Apple OS but I know some people have. One concern I have is the $30 price is upgrade only. I plan on writing 0's to my boot drives then upgrading. Will it just require me ti insert the leopard disk for verification or will it make me reinstall leopard then install snow? If the second I will just buy the full price.
See more comment replies
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 12:14 PM PDT
sounds good. though some people will probably wait until the os has been updated a bit (bugs). i hope apple spent much more time fixing the bugs with the os sp what happened with leopard doesnt happen agsin
Reply to this comment
by lil-yankee August 14, 2009 1:21 PM PDT
What happened in leopard? A conflicting 3rd party app from The end user molesting The shut down?
If it was that, before you update, just update ur Mac
I had no issue wse with mine, hope you deliver again apple, windows seven is looking good, dual boot in my macpro
by EarthToApple August 15, 2009 9:23 AM PDT
I just downloaded from the ADC site and it's pretty polished, one of the best install experiences from Apple to date.
I do agree with you Gold_Storm that Apple dropped the ball when they initially released Leopard, there were way to many bugs to let the software have the "It Just Works" feeling.

From using Snow Leopard I can say I think they hit the nail in the head & it's fast ! blazing.
by Firehazel August 16, 2009 4:09 PM PDT
i like snow leopard. but personally, it's substantial enough for me to get it. Apple has a AWESOME OS, but at this point, Windows 7 seems more significant to me.
by ecotopian--2008 August 14, 2009 12:19 PM PDT
Very enthusiastic about Snow Leopard, but I'll upgrade a clone first & see what happens to my Adobe CS3 apps, since I'm waiting for CS5 to upgrade.
Reply to this comment
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 7:52 PM PDT
Same here... CS3 is more important than Snow Leopard.
by Vegaman_Dan August 14, 2009 12:24 PM PDT
I'll be sure to upgrade my MBP to 10.6. This looks to be a worth OS update. I won't go so far as to call it a new OS though- even Apple doesn't do that.

Strange that the biggest/most dramatic feature to make you want to upgrade is support for Microsoft Exchange natively. I expect we'll see all sorts of fuss made about that, pro and con.

At $29 for an OS update, it's not a bad deal. Heck, I'd do that just to get the installation media- might get two since I have a bad habit of losing or damaging them. :/
Reply to this comment
by Renegade Knight August 14, 2009 2:41 PM PDT
It took me all of about 30 seconds to get used to multi touch support. Better support in an Old (one generation ago) MacBook would be worth it in my mind.
by jumpjetta August 14, 2009 5:25 PM PDT
Exchange support for me and my company is a completely useless thing since I can't think of a single place I or we would interface an Exchange server now or ever. With all the fantastic *nix and Mac OS X Server-based mail/contact/calendar servers out there, I think Exchange is expensive, hard-to-maintain nonsense.

Personally, with Snow, I'll be happy to reclaim some drive space and move up to complete 64-bit support.
by Synthmeister August 15, 2009 8:26 AM PDT
But having Exchange support will allow Apple to get it foot in the door with many businesses and individuals who have gobs of info tied up with Exchange and Outlook. Meanwhile, Apple will continue to work on it's own MobileMe alternative to Exchange.
by bobmarleypeople August 14, 2009 12:26 PM PDT
"a specific piece of third-party software"
It was an application enhancer (called "Ape" or something). Apple have edited the installer to find known and potentially incompatible programs and disable them prior to OS installation. How well this will work remains to be seen...
Reply to this comment
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 12:37 PM PDT
wow no trolling yet
Reply to this comment
by ckh1272 August 14, 2009 8:16 PM PDT
Read the above comments form dano10000 and bring_it_on. Unfortunately, they are about. I am with some of the other users and wait and see about any issues and the subsequent 10.6.1 update.
by baconstang August 15, 2009 5:16 PM PDT
Yeah, I can wait a month or two....what's the rush?
by stickfu August 16, 2009 5:17 AM PDT
I`ll wait too, but in all fairness what OS has ever had a seamless launch?
by saturdaysaint August 14, 2009 12:43 PM PDT
My favorite part of the upgrade - all multitouch-trackpad Apple laptops (not just the most recent generations) will now be able to do multitouch gestures (i.e. the "pinch" gestures, the three and four finger gestures).
Reply to this comment
by mclaurin10 August 14, 2009 1:21 PM PDT
Are you sure? I havent heard anything about that, I have an early 2008 MBP which has multitouch ability, it just cant to 4 finger gestures, to get around that Im using the AppleUSBMultitouch.kext hack, but I would be psyched to see this.
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 8:04 PM PDT
mclaurin10.

Yes it seems from reports that Apple is indeed adding 4 finger gestures to Macbook Pros that already have the multitouch trackpad.
by sanjayb August 15, 2009 12:21 PM PDT
Wow I hope that is true. The multitouch pad is one of the best things about my Macbook Pro.
by baconstang August 15, 2009 5:18 PM PDT
I have a late 2007 MacBook, it does the two finger scroll. I hope it goes 4 fingers!
by truthbetold2011 August 14, 2009 12:55 PM PDT
what is the difference between Mac os X snow leopard and Mac os X snow leopard server
Reply to this comment
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 1:00 PM PDT
server features...
http://www.apple.com/server/macosx/
by RobinQueens August 14, 2009 1:07 PM PDT
Is Quicktime going to be in in full screen? or is that the caveat to make people buy QT Pro?
Reply to this comment
by djames42 August 14, 2009 1:13 PM PDT
That's what VLC is for :)
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 1:13 PM PDT
it already is and i dont think that is going to change.
by Renegade Knight August 14, 2009 2:42 PM PDT
Good question. I had to install a scropt to fix that QT problem.
by baconstang August 15, 2009 5:18 PM PDT
I think I read that there will no longer be a QT pro.
by ex2bot August 15, 2009 8:10 PM PDT
SHIFT-COMMAND-F for full-screen mode in Quicktime (including the current version)

This was added to the free version of Quicktime sometime in the last year or two.
by cary1 August 14, 2009 1:08 PM PDT
I am glad it frees up 6GB of space. Because Mac Minis and MacBooks come with tiny storage and Apple charges a fortune to upgrade them
Reply to this comment
by BogusBasin August 14, 2009 1:25 PM PDT
I will not argue that point. I would suggest to you that they use standard hard drives and that you can find much better deals elsewhere. Same goes for RAM.

Amen
by Vegaman_Dan August 14, 2009 1:35 PM PDT
@BogusBasin:

Unfortunately while Apple does use standard memory and hard drives, they also will void your warranty if you choose to use / install non-Apple approved products in their laptops.

This is fairly common in the industry and by no means limited to Apple. It's just the way of warranty repair and support.

"Oh, I'm sorry... I see that you have some Kingston memory in your laptop that is crashing. That's a non-OEM product in our model and is not certified for use here. We have no way to determine that this memory is not the cause of the problem, nor may have caused other undocumented damage to your system. Your warranty is hereby voided. Now then, we CAN work on your laptop still, but it will cost you a few... fees....."

Ask me how THAT experience went with the Genius bar sometime. :/
by OS11 August 14, 2009 4:02 PM PDT
100% UNTRUE Vegaman_Dan -

You CANNOT void your Apple warranty by putting in a another hard drive or ram, or anything else in your Mac... in fact, NOTHING voids your warranty unless you "break it" in the process. Apple has the most lax warranty in the business, it's considered a "hackers box" for a reason.

If a Genius ever says that it does, SLAP him or her... HARD... the warranty doesn't prevent you from using any 3rd party hardware or software... NONE... that's a pure myth. Sure if a 3rd party item is causing a problem, take it out, but again and for the 3rd TIME... Apple's warranty DOES NOT preclude you upgrading it the way you want.

Thank you.
by ikramerica--2008 August 14, 2009 4:10 PM PDT
Once again, Vegaman spreading lies. Why do you do that?

I took my MacBook Pro in for service. Not only did the non-Apple RAM not phase them, but they REPLACED IT along with the motherboard and the fans. No questions asked. Warranty work.

Same goes for HDs, though I always put the apple HD back in before I take it in for service anyway...

You claim to fix Macs, but you lie about Apple's repair policies and prices on a consistent basis.
by jumpjetta August 14, 2009 5:30 PM PDT
Apple absolutely doesn't care if you use 3rd party memory. They will just not support it if it turns out to be an issue. They suggest you remove it and put the Apple-supplied RAM in for testing issues and before you take their machines in for service.

With 3rd party HDs, again... not supported if it causes issues. In a portable, you'd simply want to keep the old drive and put it back in before taking it in for AppleCare service.

I have a friend who has been Tier 2 at Apple for portable support for the better part of 10 years. That's been the official Apple line for at least that long.
by gertruded August 14, 2009 8:05 PM PDT
Note that vegaman is the one that started the on purpose trolling tonight.
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 8:09 PM PDT
@ Vegaman_Dan.

The statement you made appears to be false. I contacted Apple to see if they could replace my MBP hard drive with a new hard drive I purchased from tiger direct, and they said "we can install absolutely any hard drive you wish."
by ckh1272 August 14, 2009 8:20 PM PDT
"by Vegaman_Dan August 14, 2009 1:35 PM PDT
@BogusBasin:

Unfortunately while Apple does use standard memory and hard drives, they also will void your warranty if you choose to use / install non-Apple approved products in their laptops.

This is fairly common in the industry and by no means limited to Apple. It's just the way of warranty repair and support.

"Oh, I'm sorry... I see that you have some Kingston memory in your laptop that is crashing. That's a non-OEM product in our model and is not certified for use here. We have no way to determine that this memory is not the cause of the problem, nor may have caused other undocumented damage to your system. Your warranty is hereby voided. Now then, we CAN work on your laptop still, but it will cost you a few... fees....."

Ask me how THAT experience went with the Genius bar sometime. :/"


@Vegaman_Dan--Maybe you had a bad experience with Apple regarding this, but you are beating a dead horse with "authorized" hardware mess. I have said it before, but I have done memory and hard drive upgrades and have NEVER had any issue with Apple regarding it, when I have had a problem. Apple will ask in the effort of helping pinpoint a potential, but the upgrades have never been used against, which is what you seem to imply. Please enlighten us why you still feel Apple is so militant regarding 3rd party upgrades.
by ckh1272 August 15, 2009 1:47 AM PDT
Sorry for the omission of certain words (never type half asleep). This is what I meant to say:

@Vegaman_Dan--Maybe you had a bad experience with Apple regarding this, but you are beating a dead horse with "authorized" hardware mess. I have said it before, but I have done memory and hard drive upgrades and have NEVER had any issue with Apple regarding it. When I have had a problem, Apple will ask in the effort of helping pinpoint a potential PROBLEM, but the upgrades have never been used against ME, which is what you seem to imply. Please enlighten us why you still feel Apple is so militant regarding 3rd party upgrades.
by mconnect August 15, 2009 7:11 AM PDT
"I am glad it frees up 6GB of space."

it frees up 6GB hard drive because 10.6 does not include powerpc installation file.
See more comment replies
by YankeePoodle August 14, 2009 1:25 PM PDT
I will be the person who will wait for 0.1 version or for about a month late, I use my Mac for work so I have to be conservative with the upgrade.
Reply to this comment
by LaTene_Man August 14, 2009 1:30 PM PDT
You can always roll it back if you have your machine backed up to the minute before install of 10.6 on Time Machine.
by Jeremy Chappell August 14, 2009 5:19 PM PDT
@LaTene_Man

Look I'm with YankeePoodle with this - his set up isn't broken, and he's happy to give it a little time. Is that conservative? Yes. Maybe there is no need at all, but what does it hurt? His make is making money - if he wants to be cautious, well I can understand that.

Restoring from Time Machine isn't fast and you're down to relying on a backup. For me, that's last resort stuff (what backups are actually for!)
by RompStar_420 August 14, 2009 1:34 PM PDT
I am still kind ticked off that PowerPC won't be supported in 10.6, my Power Mac G5 is still a power horse, it does everything for me!!! and before you start to make some stupid jokes about it, when I worked at Microsoft - MS ordered many a G5 and used them to develop the current Xbox 360, it used a PowerPC chip as well and then a slightly modified IBM power-cell processors.

" Before the launch of the Xbox 360, several alpha development kits were spotted using Apple's Power Mac G5 hardware. This was due to the system's PowerPC 970 processor running the same PowerPC architecture that the Xbox 360 would eventually run under IBM's Xenon processor. The cores of the Xenon processor were developed using a slightly-modified version of the PlayStation 3's Cell Processor PPE architecture. According to David Shippy and Mickie Phipps, the IBM employees were "hiding their work from Sony and Toshiba."[9] "
Reply to this comment
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 1:41 PM PDT
Power PC is a great architecture but nowadays you need efficiency, especially with notebooks. thats why there was that switch to intel because it had better performance per watt. also the g5 was a big chip and took a lot of room that could have been used for more storgae and other things in the comp. power pc is great for consoles cause they dont need to be efficient.
by CA1900 August 14, 2009 3:38 PM PDT
The G5 is a fantastic desktop platform, but that's irrelevant. The whole point of 10.6 is under-the-hood optimizations to take advantage of the Intel architecture.
by jumpjetta August 14, 2009 5:35 PM PDT
@Romp... And your G5 will CONTINUE to be a "power horse" in its current state. It's not like Apple is disabling your machine as of the release of Snow Leopard. I get really tired of people using that logic. So keep using it as it is if it's so important to you. Or if you REALLY need the latest operating system, buy a new machine.
by mbenedict August 14, 2009 11:47 PM PDT
Not quite true jumpjetta.

The reason is the way OS X is constructed, many new versions of applications tend to target only the latest version of the OS, i.e., they're not "backwards compatible".

For example, with Leopard there was a new version of Objective-C, the language used to program most Cocoa apps. However programs written in Objective-C 2.0 only work on Leopard. You can't run them on Tiger or on any previous version of OS X.

There should be no reason to tie a programming language version (like Objective-C) to a specific version of an operating system, but that's just how things are in Apple-land.

The same will be true for Snow Leopard. We already see the upcoming version of Photoshop will only support Snow Leopard, so PowerPC users will have no chance to upgrade.

"But just use your current version of Photoshop, it still works fine", you might say. Well that might be ok until you buy a new digital camera with a RAW format support that's only available in the new Photoshop. Then you're just out of luck. You either have to buy a new computer or use a third party converter or abandon Photoshop for a different product.

That's just one example of why RompStar_420's PowerPC will become obsolete the moment Snow Leopard is released.

A lot of people make fun of Microsoft's legacy but the fact is even the upcoming Windows 7 will run on that old Pentium 4 machine from circa 2000. Not only it will run, it runs surprisingly well (see YouTube for examples), and is an officially supported configuration.
by EvanSei August 14, 2009 1:48 PM PDT
looks like apple is responding to microsofts new os, I think they realized windows may just give them a run for their money and decided to up their game.
Reply to this comment
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 1:51 PM PDT
when did you realize apple is coming out with a new os
by shellcodes_coder August 14, 2009 1:55 PM PDT
LOL, that ain't gonna matter. With in a couple of days the number of copies of Windows 7 sold will exceed the number of Macs ever SOLD!
by ballmerisanape August 14, 2009 2:10 PM PDT
Shellcodes... actually.. you should look at Amazon.com's #'s.. it seems as if Snow Leopard is on top.
by OS11 August 14, 2009 4:08 PM PDT
@EvanSei

Don't make everyone laugh! Snow Leopard was announced long before Windows 7 was even on the horizon, so I think you mean Apple was giving them a run for their money. No serious computer user uses Windows anymore, think about it.

Side by side in all current tests, Apple's Snow Leopard is smoking Windows 7 as much as 70% in most tasks. Windows 7 is just a rehashed Vista, that's why it's so slow and wonky.

You'll get a Mac someday and see what the big boys use, until then, do research so we don't have to correct you each time. Thanks.
by pithenumber August 14, 2009 4:22 PM PDT
@OX11
"No serious computer user uses Windows anymore, think about it."
what do you define serious user as
I see serious users using Windows, Linux, and Mac OS
by bananaphonerules August 14, 2009 4:23 PM PDT
@OS11

" No serious computer user uses Windows anymore"
Wow. quit smoking crack...its not good for your brain.
Serious computers users keep an OPEN MIND to anything good. Not just drink the cool-aid.
by EvanSei August 14, 2009 4:59 PM PDT
I say that windows 7 is giving OS X a run, because if windows 7 wasn't out snow leopard would have ben released on time, they release early to get people excited and attempt to overshadow the competition, and I have used a mac before I am not a fan of the OS If I wanted a mac I would have got a mac. could my opinion on the mac os change sure one day I might like os x better that windows but right now that is not the case. before you start criticizing windows 7 please wait till it is finished remember that it is a RC meaning there will be some problems present. and really keep an open mind to products you get a better things that way.
by ckh1272 August 14, 2009 8:26 PM PDT
"by shellcodes_coder August 14, 2009 1:55 PM PDT
LOL, that ain't gonna matter. With in a couple of days the number of copies of Windows 7 sold will exceed the number of Macs ever SOLD!"

With almost 90% of the market, it had better outsell 10.6. You are just a bona-fide genius 'shelly. Such insight. NOT!! GO AWAY TROLL!!!
by heygeo August 16, 2009 12:01 AM PDT
@ballmerisanape
Well... i dont think any large corporation is buying windows off of Amazon... so I wouldnt argue against shellcodes_coder's statement because all though exagerated Win7 looks like its going to fly off the shelves.. keep in mind Win XP is going EOL soon.
by lazycat202 August 16, 2009 5:31 AM PDT
" No serious computer user uses Windows anymore"

are you on drug?
Like the other guy said: "serious computer users are opened mind. They'll use anything to get their jobs done." Linux and Win come first.
by myles taylor August 14, 2009 1:51 PM PDT
I'm pretty excited about this and I'm happy Apple is doing the $29 upgrade deal. Really it's good all around and I'm often more excited about background cleanups than features that I may or may not use.
Reply to this comment
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 8:17 PM PDT
Same here... if My MBP wakes and goes to sleep in half the time it used to, and reboots faster and all the other speed things promised, I consider that to be worth more than a fancy new expose.
by baconstang August 15, 2009 5:34 PM PDT
It's like getting a tune-up instead of a new car air freshener.
by shellcodes_coder August 14, 2009 1:54 PM PDT
$29 for a patch? Damn that sucks when it should be free. Anyways Linux and Windows have had 64-bit kernel for ages and endangered os--Snow Leopard finally catches up!! That's damn funny
Reply to this comment
by ballmerisanape August 14, 2009 2:08 PM PDT
Yea.. Windows 64-bit is awesome! One day there will even be application drivers for it!

btw- OSX has been 64 bit for a while too... you might not have realized it though.. you know.. since there is only one consumer version of the OS. Perhaps Apple should make more versions (Ultimate, Ultimate-Ultimate, Super-Ultimate Gaming....). ;)
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 2:09 PM PDT
many components of mac os x have been 64 bit since 2005. now the entire os has become 64 bit. also this is not a patch, ALOT of things have been refined and new technologies have been added. some more prominent than others. the biggest changes include quicktime (entirely rewritten) and exchange support which windows users need to pay for.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 2:45 PM PDT
Shellcodes_coder

$29 is definitely worth what this upgrade offers OSX users.
by pithenumber August 14, 2009 4:29 PM PDT
@shell
10.6 is as much an upgrade as Windows 7 is
@Gold
Mac OS has had 64 bit components for a while, true
but only now is Mac Os truely 64 bit
@ballmerisanape
XP 64 had driver problems, but not Vista 64 or 7 64
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 8:19 PM PDT
hey monkeyfun14,

glad to see you're posting useful stuff these days. I've seen plenty of 'trolling' by you and I like the change. :-)
by ckh1272 August 14, 2009 8:28 PM PDT
Poor poor shillcodes_coder. Can't see the outside world when there are no windows in the basement.
by whitingrj August 15, 2009 7:03 AM PDT
@pithenumber
I can't see how you can say 10.6 is as much of an upgrade as Windows 7 is. I took the leap and actually installed Windows 7 RC as my primary OS and a lot is new here. There's no way you can compare the number feature enhancements that Windows 7 is offering to what Snow Leopard is. 10.6, while I'm not disagreeing that it has a few worthwhile updates, but, from what I see, there isn't enough there to warrant spending more than $29. Maybe I'm wrong though. I haven't had the chance to see it. Apple unfortunately doesn't allow the public to beta test in the same way Windows does. Wherever you go in Windows 7, things have been tweaked. I have been hard pressed to find windows that haven't found at least slight adjustments. So, in my mind, Windows 7 is definitely worth its price; the performance increases are just that major. And, from what I see, OS 10.6 is also worth the $29, though by n means is it a lackluster update.
by pithenumber August 15, 2009 1:00 PM PDT
@whit
Leopard brings full 64bit, OpenCL and a number of other things
by Firehazel August 16, 2009 4:19 PM PDT
plus MS is allowing you to upgrade to 7even for free if you qualify...

"Called "Windows 7 Upgrade Option Program," the deal provides free or nearly-free upgrades to Windows 7 for people who purchase a new Vista PC between June 26, 2009 and Jan. 31, 2010."

Apple is running theirs thru Dec. 26th '09. and still charging $29...
by Minotauro79 August 18, 2009 4:43 PM PDT
Windows has only had a hybrid kernel but never a true 64 bit kernal like snow Leopard will have. The base code has also been re-written in 10.6 which in not something Microsoft has ever done in a Service Pack. So how again is this merely a patch?
by DanRobinson August 14, 2009 2:01 PM PDT
I just scanned the comments; but didn't anyone notice the main difference from the original 10.5 Leopard?

It's half the size! They're stripped out all the old Power PC code! So if you don't have an Intel Mac, Snow Leopard won't run on your machine.

But whoopie! It sure is noticeably faster!
Reply to this comment
by shellcodes_coder August 14, 2009 2:09 PM PDT
ya, this is a good news for owners of PowerPC based Mac because they can finally enjoy the world's most advanced and FIRST 64-BIT OS AND LOTS OF KERNEL PANIC LOL
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 2:11 PM PDT
they also said they used a technology called fancystep compression to shrink the size. they made the switch to intel a long time ago. alot of people should have gotten a new intel mac by now. if not maybe they should think about getting one now.
by Dalkorian August 14, 2009 4:54 PM PDT
Shell, do you really have to jump up and down and prove to everyone that you know nothing about anything you comment on?
by merlefisher August 14, 2009 8:22 PM PDT
@ Dalkorian August 14, 2009 4:54 PM PDT
"Shell, do you really have to jump up and down and prove to everyone that you know nothing about anything you comment on?"

Yes unfortunately he does...
by Ilgaz August 14, 2009 9:35 PM PDT
It is not faster because of stripped down PPC binaries or languages. It is faster because Intel performs way more better when run in pure 64 bit with twice the registers and technologies like x86 only OpenCL exists on Intel only (blame IBM for it).

There hasn't been a single time when Mac OS (yes old one too) had speed issues because of unrelated files or libraries. It is NOT Windows.
by heygeo August 16, 2009 12:20 AM PDT
its hilarious how thin skinned the apple fanboys are... they sure like to dole out anti windows comments..but the moment you so much as question anything against the all mighty apple well then the whining and crying begins... because its only trolling when Apple is being skewered... hypocrites.. I've heard everything from windows users being called ill informed to non serious users and those are the nicer ones.. bottom line on this topic is for 29.00 you get what your paying for and thats ok but to compare this to Win7 is outright crap.. its not just "fine tuning", its been overhauled and many parts completely rewritten and yes for the better. Now i'm sure I'll be labeled as a shill because I said something nice about Microsoft but at least it was honest.. unlike most of the comments on CNET...
by ballmerisanape August 14, 2009 2:05 PM PDT
No mention of Grand Central Dispatch????? Open CL???? Those are not minor, imho.
Reply to this comment
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 3:02 PM PDT
Well I think those weren't mentioned is because they are more aimed towards developers
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 3:13 PM PDT
but those are the biggest reasons for the speed improvements
by ikramerica--2008 August 14, 2009 3:40 PM PDT
Also no mention of the 64-bit apps and more 64-bit parts of the OS, and finally breaking the 4GB barrier in a real way. Leopard and Vista both don't do a great job of that, though Leopard is far superior to Vista, which only makes 2.3GB available to the user in most cases.
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 3:50 PM PDT
@ikr

Actually 3.5 in most cases but Leopard still does have that on Vista.
by mmntech August 14, 2009 4:35 PM PDT
Speaking of Open CL, I wonder if Apple has updated any of their apps to support it. I know programs like Final Cut Studio and Aperture would see a huge benefit from it.
by ikramerica--2008 August 14, 2009 4:36 PM PDT
Well, it's about 3.3GB if you have shared video/system ram, if you take into account the 700MB of MMIO addresses used. And of course, the RAM is shared with video, so RAM available to software is lower.

If you have a video card with 512MB, it actually still takes away addressable space in your system RAM of that size. If you have a high-end video card of 1GB, you go down to 2.3GB. Either way, most users who install 4GB of RAM in a 32-bit Windows machine can only use 3GB of it or less, so when Dell or HP tries to convince you to buy up from 2GB to 4GB and get a high end video card together on a 32-bit system, you are being scammed.

Due to the 32-bit addressing in Vista, the video memory addressing uses 1GB. No, not 1GB of the RAM (if you have video RAM installed), but 1GB of the 4GB addressable space. So 1GB of the system RAM sits unused even if you have physical VRAM rather than shared system/video RAM. Most people are not running Vista x64. The vast majority of consumers are running XP or Vista 32-bit, and thus it doesn't matter how much RAM you install, your applications can use less than 3GB.

On the Macs (starting with Santa Rosa chipsets and later), 8GB or RAM is addressable. Since MMIO doesn't use actual RAM, only uses the address registers RAM also uses, it can be shoved to the address space above 4GB, as can the video RAM addressing, so the full 4GB that many have installed in MacBooks and IMacs is usable. This is also why you can go up to 6GB on later Macs, because all 6GB is addressable. 6GB + 700MB MMIO + 512MB VRAM < 8GB. 32-bit Windows can't do this. So that means that more virtual memory is paged to disk more often, which slows the system down for multi-tasking, a reason that Leopard really speeds up compared to Windows in multi-tasking when 4GB of RAM is installed in both machines. It's also why that commercial with that film maker who dismisses the Mac for only having 2GB of installed RAM is a scam. The machine she was buying can barely use more than 2GB of the 4GB installed anyway, while the Mac she dismissed could use 6GB of RAM. All she'd have to do is add it.

But with Snow Leopard, even more physical memory will be usable. Right now, Leopard can address more than 6GB of memory on XServes and MacPros with a trick, where most of the memory is used as Virtual Memory Paging space, basically instead of paging to HD. It's basically a RAM disk scheme by another name. But from what I understand, Snow Leopard will actually address that RAM directly, not through the Paged Memory Manager.

Windows 7 64 bit will also allow for more memory to be addressed, but there will still be a lot of Windows 7 32-bit installs out there, with 4GB of RAM installed, much of it not usable...
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 4:53 PM PDT
@ikr

Oh yeah your right just double checked it is 3.3 on my system.
by Ilgaz August 14, 2009 9:37 PM PDT
If people in IT media had a clue about Grand Central or OpenCL which are x86 64bit only, they wouldn't be surprised for the drop of PPC including G5.

Of course, thanks to non reading, non researching IT media, Adobe milks this lack of information and uses Apple as excuse to stop supporting PPC while the reality is, they want to copy/paste their Windows low quality code to OS X.
by mbenedict August 15, 2009 12:17 AM PDT
@ikramerica--2008:

Too many "half-truths" in your statements. For example 4GB addressable RAM is an irrelevant point for most Mac users looking to upgrade to Snow Leopard, because most Intel Macs in existence today are hardware limited to just 3GB of RAM.

Basically unless you have a new Mac (less than 1.5 yrs old) you can't have more than 3GB. Yet even an old Pentium 4 XP system can use up to 3.5 GB. Whatever your explanations about MMIO, video cards, are meaningless.

Those people who bought 4GB of RAM and large memory video cards from HP and Dell can use XP 64-bit, Vista 64-bit or Windows 7 64-bit and enjoy the full capacity of their hardware.

The same can't be said about all the poor suckers who installed 4GB of RAM in their 3GB-limited MacBook Pros 'cause some "Genius" claims that Leopard is 64-bit.

To your comment "but there will still be a lot of Windows 7 32-bit installs out there", well guess what?? There will STILL BE A LOT OF 32-BIT SNOW LEOPARD installs out there.

Realize that a ton of Intel Macs out there are only 32-bit machines. MacBooks, MB Pros, Mac Minis and iMacs bought until mid-2007 may be 32-bit only (depending on the model).

How many of them know their Mac is 32-bit only? Close to none, I'd hazard to guess. They're happily running Leopard supposedly in 64-bit land while actually operating at 32-bit all along. Ignorance is bliss, I guess.
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 2:14 PM PDT
stop pointlessly trolling and try using a mac. then make an opinion
Reply to this comment
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 3:02 PM PDT
No one is trolling.
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 3:11 PM PDT
sorry i was talking about the shelcoder guy
by monkeyfun14 August 14, 2009 3:23 PM PDT
Oh alright
by Xyraxel August 14, 2009 2:31 PM PDT
This will be the first OS I ever buy!!! , before this iv always upgraded a mac and got the latest OS with it or u know borrowed a CD from a friend :P but this time around ima buy it no borrowing.

Oh and i'll be buying win 7 too!!! , get all MS OS for free from UNI, apple should have such a program aswell
Reply to this comment
by RompStar_420 August 14, 2009 2:32 PM PDT
I am not worried that my G5 PowerMac that it will become a paper-weight, I can still use it for many years to come and even later, I can install Linux on it and turn it into a kick-ass server. But "I" like the PowerPC architecture.

Check it out, IBM Power 6 running almost at 5Gigahertz.

http://arstechnica.com/hardware/news/2007/05/ibms-power6-flies-the-coop-at-4-7ghz.ars
Reply to this comment
by Gold_Storm_Mac August 14, 2009 2:47 PM PDT
it wont necessarily become a paperweight. you can still use it with leopard which is a fine enough of os.
by pithenumber August 14, 2009 4:41 PM PDT
lets all hope that Apple switches to AMD before POWER7 comes out
http://news.softpedia.com/news/8-Core-IBM-Power7-With-Opteron-Soket-Compatibility-89848.shtml
by Ilgaz August 14, 2009 9:42 PM PDT
Did IBM contribute a single line of code to OpenCL and its grandfather (soon) NVidia CUDA? That is one of the main reasons while there are other reasons like Intel 64bit (amd64 in fact) can only use 2x GP registers when run in 64bit kernel mode. No such thing on G5 as PPC was designed with 64bit in mind from the start.

IBM Power6 (I submitted the first story about 4.7 ghz to slashdot) will perform amazingly good on AIX in an enterprise environment, it is not a desktop processor. I wouldn't waste it with Linux although virtualising several linux servers under AIX makes sense.
Showing 1 of 3 pages (204 Comments)
advertisement
Click Here

The yogurt makers of tech: Gadgets to avoid

Don't buy these one-trick ponies--unless you like gizmos that gather dust.

Google wants to unclog Net's DNS plumbing

The Net giant, ever eager for a faster Internet, debuts its Google Public DNS service. With it, Google could become even more central to the Net.

About Apple

At the start of the 21st century, there's no tech outfit more influential than Apple. CNET News' Erica Ogg and other reporters will attempt to make sense of the rumors, hype, products, and people that will shape the future of the company. But Apple's not the only game in town, as the established cell phone companies and others strike back against the iPhone. E-mail Erica at erica.ogg@cnet.com.

Add this feed to your online news reader

Apple topics

advertisement
advertisement
Click Here

Inside CNET News

Scroll Left Scroll Right