Apple tops PC customer satisfaction survey

Apple came out on top of a recent PC industry customer satisfaction survey.

(Credit: CNET)

Apple easily outdistanced its peers in a PC industry customer-satisfaction survey conducted by Forrester Research that found PC companies are only slightly more well-liked than insurance companies.

An overall satisfaction rating of 80 percent was good enough for Apple to trounce the second-place finisher, Gateway, which scored 66 percent. Forrester surveyed 4,564 U.S. consumers online in October in compiling the results, which were published Friday on the research firm's Web site.

Apple and Gateway were followed by HP, Compaq, and Dell, respectively in the survey results. (Compaq, though part of HP, is generally counted separately in branding surveys because it is marketed very differently than HP-branded computers.) Gateway was the only Windows manufacturer to crack the 65 percent barrier, which is equivalent to an "okay" rating in Forrester's survey. Apple's 80 percent score fell into the "good" category.

The University of Michigan conducts a similar survey each summer and usually comes up with similar results: Apple leading the pack, but amid poor ratings for the overall industry. Only Internet service providers, cable/satellite companies, and health insurance companies scored worse as industries than the PC industry in Forrester's survey; even airlines scored better than PC companies.

The timing of Forrester's release of this data is likely not a coincidence, as Apple this week has responded to Microsoft's latest PC ad campaign with statements emphasizing the Mac experience. Poor customer satisfaction ratings are the downside of Microsoft's marketing message that Windows PCs are the bargain alternative to Macs, in that sometimes, you get what you pay for.

[kool_skatkat]

Now tell that to Microsoft ...

[Vegaman_Dan]

Well, considering Microsoft doesn't make PC's or have a PC Help Desk, then... I suppose telling Microsoft won't really do much good now, will it?

Tell it to a PC OEM like Dell, HP, Toshiba or someone who actually makes the products.

[ikramerica--2008]

Ease of use and other factors in the ratings are directly relatable to MS and why all Windows box makers were 15 points lower. Apple uses many of the same parts and they have failures of hardware, especially HDs, just like everyone else. It's the software that runs the machines and the support you get when things go wrong and even when they don't that makes the difference. MS is a big part of that.

[danielwsmithee]

Apple can only have such high satisfaction numbers because they create both the hardware and software, so they can support both. Go to Dell/HP/Gateway with a problem with your PC, they run a hardware determine that it is not a hardware problem and tell you to reinstall the OS. Apple has the ability to actually support the entire user experience both hardware and software.

[Random_Walk]

"Microsoft doesn't make PC's..."

You are correct, but according to Microsoft's latest round of commercials, they certainly give the impression that they are.

"Lauren" certainly wouldn't know the difference.

[Vegaman_Dan]

@Random_Walk:

""Lauren" certainly wouldn't know the difference."

Ah, I take it you know Lauren personally then to be able to vouchsafe that fact that the person doesn't know the difference between a computer and the operating system? Or are you just making things up about a person you don't know or have met?

It takes a lot of gall to make such comments about someone you've never met or know. I'm certainly glad you know Lauren personally enough to make such comments about her. I'm sure she would really appreciate it.

[Random_Walk]

@Dan:

Intentional/feigned ignorance doesn't suit you.

I don't have to know the actress personally, but I do know the archetype, as should you. Most typical/casual users (which "Lauren" portrays, hence the scare quotes) do not make the distinction between a computer and an operating system. To that person, both are one and the same. Microsoft made a further error by conflating the two (OS and hardware) in its latest round of commercials.

[Vonmaxx]

A little problem with MacBook Pro's that I have and have heard a lot of people saying is Fan Noise. It seems most of the time it is the left fan with the problem. My MBP is 8 months old [I bought it 7/5/08] and I paid 2,500.00 for it. Apple should have a recall on this issue.
I had My old Powerbook G4 8 years.

[seven7dust]

@Vonmaxx
yeah I loved those Powerbooks too
that was the time Apple made absolute perfect hardware
Now they have been tainted a bit by all the X86 crap from Intel and Co.
Also the Powerbooks were made in Japan if memory serves me correctly
the Macbook Pros OTOH are made just like everything else in those crappy Chinese sweat shops. I hope they move production back to Japan !
but still Apple is far ahead of companies like Dell etc

[Perry_Clease]

applerocks, please be magnanimous, there is no use starting a flame war.

[Vegaman_Dan]

And your comments are not meant do the very same thing yourself?

Wow. *head shakes sadly*

[Perry_Clease]

"And your comments are not meant do the very same thing yourself? "

Well duh! :)

[gertruded]

doesn't vegaman work for M$?

[Perry_Clease]

"doesn't vegaman work for M$?"

No, I think he is pretty even guy, no one side or the other.

[The_happy_switcher]

I haven't commented on this story. Not sure why you are suggesting I would ever start a flame war. The title speaks for itself. I'm sure someone though will take the opportunity to call me a troll.

[Seaspray0]

Not if you behave yourself, applerocks.

As for the results, I have some questions/observations...

1. You don't find microsoft in the results since they do not make the hardware. Which brings up a delima. When you buy a PC where the hardware is from one company and the operating system is from another company, won't this automatically make support more difficut? That's common sense to me. More difficult? Yes. Impossible? No (I have never failed to have a hardware support call resolved successfully). It comes down to the value you place on it and whether you actually use it. Am I willing to spend $$$ on support that will have a repair tech show up onsite in 4 hours for a home computer? No, but I will for the company servers. The one year free support is more than adequate for my home computers (I have enough experience to repair my own, even the laptops). For me, I place little value on support for the computers I own since I have personally never needed it, and I place a much higher value on it for my company's servers which must run 24 X 7. It's your decision to decide how important support is for you.

2. This survey is for when your computer breaks and call support, it doesn't provide any reliability data on the computers themselves (i.e. how often will it break). A link to some data on reliability would have been nice. Actually an entire article on that would be very nice. Tom? Ina? Any CNet reporter willing to do it? I have asked for this information before and can find almost nothing on it by searching the internet. The only reliability survey I've seen was one found by VegamanDan.

2. Microsoft does provide consumer support for thier software. But they're listed in this survey because they don't make the hardware. Is there a survey to covers rating software companies on consumer support? And if so, would apple be included in that since they have proclaimed themselves a hardware company? This survey only shows the hardware support. If I want to compare the computer makers (dell, apple, gateway, HP), great. I can't make any judgements on microsoft support because they weren't listed. Do you have any software consumer rating surveys?

3. I would also be interested in what percentage of those who participated in the survey were from business or strictly from a home (the home/business ratio varies greatly between brands). Dell and HP are often found in business compared to the other brands. Did the home/business ratio vary greatly between brands in the survey as well? If 80% of the survey respondeds for Dell/HP were business customers and 5% of the survey respondeds for Gateway were business customers... would it be fair? With the vast differences in home/business ratios betwen brands, I can see this as a likely scenario. Too bad that information was not disclosed in the article.

4. I went, I looked, I'm not forking out $749 for a 6 page report. Yikes!

[bvdon]

If I were typing this on my PC, I'd probably be interupted with a "Restart Now, Restart Later" prompt... but, this is a Mac -- it lets me do what I want.

[Redswipe]

Funny. I have always found its Macs that are limited while PC's allow me to do what I want. It is a fact after all that you can do a lot more on a PC than on a Mac.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Pardon me, I didn't get a chance to read your entire comment- OSX on my Dell Optiplex needed to restart for an OS update.

What was that again?

[Spartan_458]

Windows is for getting things done and playing games. OSX is for screwing around and pretending that you're cool.

[Random_Walk]

@Vegaman_Dan: You're using a "hackintosh", which is not supported by Apple (and against their end-user agreement).

[Vegaman_Dan]

Random_Walk:

"@Vegaman_Dan: You're using a "hackintosh", which is not supported by Apple (and against their end-user agreement)."

And that doesn't change the fact at all that the OS had to reboot for a security update patch. Good attempt to try to change the subject, but I'm afraid it didn't quite work. :)

[Random_Walk]

Ah, but it does change the fact, since you are running a modified kernel.

[kcotham]

@Vegaman_Dan
It also doesn't change the fact that you are doing something illegal and that you are too cheap to buy the real thing.

[Seaspray0]

@bvdon. You comment makes no sense. The "Restart Now/Restart Later" prompt is only associated with software installations whether it be you or an OS update (not all updates require a restart). Windows is letting you do what you want... restart now or later. If it didn't, it would choose for you. Take the trolling somewhere else.

[sting7k]

Yawn. What else would you expect? PC users are picky and will point out the faults if something doesn't meet their expectations. While the Mac users would probably follow Mr. Jobs off a cliff MacBook's in hand, they will never say anything negative about their computers if they had to be repaired a dozen times in secret.

[sanjayb]

I know alot of people such as sting7k will twist it in a negative way but you have to give Apple some credit. I have found in my past experience that Apple goes the extra mile to make it's customers happy. This survey and Apple's consistent scores is no accident.

[Perry_Clease]

"While the Mac users would probably follow Mr. Jobs off a cliff MacBook's in hand"

Do you all remember this Apple lemmings ad?

http://pulsar.esm.psu.edu/Faculty/Gray/graphics/movies/Apple-Lemmings.mov

It is, of course, a QuickTime video :)

[ikramerica--2008]

Seriously? You are really lost here, sting. The message boards of the web are full of people ******** about their Macs not working right. It's just that Windows makers have even more problems. It's not like Apple got the "Excellent" they covet. They got an 80%, or "high Good" and that's not what they want for the long term. I'm sure Apple looks at this survey and strategizes on ways to improve the experience enough to get to at least 85%...

[kcotham]

All the manufacturers need to improve, Apple included. Heck, even the airlines scored higher for crying out loud!

[Jeremy Chappell]

Isn't there some middle ground? A sane person who owns a computer? I don't recognise the Mac user as clueless follower (the fuss that was made when Apple killed many of the features of Mac OS 9!) As for the picky PC user, well really most PC users I know don't actually care much about their computers, running Windows is after all the default, "I didn't even think about it" choice. Not necessarily "wrong" but not the result of deep contemplation either. I suppose the fuss over Vista might count against my argument a little.

Really, I'd not follow "Mr Jobs" off a cliff, hey I've even got a "non-Mac" (it's not Windows either, but that's not the point). Am I happy with my Mac? Yeah, it's great. Is it right for everyone - no, if you're a gamer then it's a bit pointless (here I mean that games are the reason you bought a machine). If you must run Windows all or almost all the time, well a Mac is a bit pointless. Otherwise, it might well be the right choice. Or a Linux box, whatever. But really saying I'm stupid for using a Mac - that's just retarded.

[slickuser]

Hoepfully, Windows 7 Ultimate Crap Edition and Windows 7 Crash Editions will change
this and put Microsoft on top!

[Seaspray0]

The name calling doesn't work anymore, slickuser. All it does is show you as an immature child and you will receive the same respect you are showing.... none.

[Inconnux]

it might be name calling, but atleast its truth in advertising.

[linuxgeek90]

You are all missing the point.

"An overall satisfaction rating of 80 percent was good enough for Apple to trounce the second-place finisher, Gateway, which scored 66 percent"

That means that people are not satisfied with their computers.

[ikramerica--2008]

Yep. Apple is in the high good range, but still only good, and I'm sure this upsets Jobs, rather than makes him happy he beat out all the box makers who make design and ease of use an afterthought.

[Mark_Anderson]

Do Gateway still make PCS?

[Seaspray0]

@linuxgeeks90. The survey coveres how satisfied people are with tech support. The survey did not cover computer satisfaction. Do not attempt to skew the facts.

[Seaspray0]

Yes, Mark, they do. They were bought out by Acer, but are still sold under the brand name. I'm typing on one right now.

[Arrgster]

It's interesting how gateway was second seeing they have gone out of business... I do agree that apple rocks! I changed over a year ago and don't see myself going back to the MS world anytime soon..

[dragonsky1]

Gateway didn't go out of business. They are now a division of Acer, but still have their own technical support and are marketed separately, just like Compaq and HP.

[espeed623]

@Arrgster: You mean MPC? They bought out Gateway's Business sector.

@Dragonsky: I believe he's talking about MPC, who bought Gateway's Business sect. MPC is bankrupt, and their support is crappy. I work at a school that employs "Gateways".

[Vegaman_Dan]

It's a good thing to see customer satisfaction in any industry. Kudos to Apple for their success in producing a product with these ratings.

[sanjayb]

Hear! Hear!

[Seaspray0]

agreed.

[Redswipe]

It never ceases to amaze me how the people who are most vocal in their support of Macs and condemnation of Windows are so utterly ignorant.

Macs and PC's are both good platforms. FACT. Windows machines do have more problems for one very simple reason. They do a hell of a lot more than Macs. They run far more software and allow far more freedom in terms of hardware.

Anyone who condemns one platform or another is an idiot. Its as simple as that.

[slickuser]

>> They do a hell of a lot more than Macs. They run far more software

Thats stupidest comment!

[linuxgeek90]

"Anyone who condemns one platform or another is an idiot. Its as simple as that."

Got that right.

Known fact: Most people that troll message boards are idiots.

Known fact #2: Most people that troll message boards love to argue about mac vs. pc.

Linux Rules! ;-)

[edgedesign]

It's true that PC users have more hardware configuration and software options. Unfortunately, more options doesn't equate to a better user experience for most users. Most users want a simple intuitive user interface installed on solid quality hardware. Microsoft and PC manufactures have dominated the market by selling inexpensive solutions to users and businesses, but that savings comes at a price. You get what you pay for and because of all the different hardware configurations, MS is now having a very difficult time developing a solid OS that is bug-free and secure against worms and viruses. Vista (still built on top of MS-DOS) is their best effort yet IMO - especially if you don't have older peripherals or software, but is still pales in comparison to OS X and Apple's iLife and iWork suites.

I've used both platforms since '91 and currently use the following regularly:
Macbook 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
Sony Vaio 2.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo

[sythara]

"Vista (still built on top of MS-DOS)"

oh really?

[kcotham]

Windows don't do any more than a Mac is capable of doing, that was a falsehood.

[Jeremy Chappell]

What is it that "Macs don't do"?

Seriously - I don't get it.

I also find it amazing how Microsoft succeed in equating PC with "Windows". Given how many people run Linux (and other things) on their "PC" it is quite a feat.

[Jeremy Chappell]

@edgedesign

Windows Vista isn't built on top of MS-DOS. The last version of Windows that had MS-DOS embedded was "Windows ME". Vista is part of the "NT" line. I know Microsoft have a command line that looks like MS-DOS, but it really isn't.

Microsoft engineering problems are not caused by having MS-DOS in the mix. Actually Apple's OS engineering came from a different source that they bought in (NeXT Software Inc.) as they'd been boxed into a corner with Mac OS 9 (which I suppose was like Apple's "MS-DOS"). Mac OS X is a totally different animal (I'll resist a cat pun here) to Mac OS 9. I prefer Mac OS X to Windows - though I've not spent that much "quality time" with Vista.

[cyclonica1980]

@Redswipe

totally agreed.

[cary1]

News headline: "Monster Cable tops Electronics customer satisfaction survey" so everyone should buy Monster Cable products. That's right. Buying a Mac is like buying Monster Cable: 10% better but 100% overpriced.

Plus if you have someone buys a $3000 computer, he will sound like a frigtard (sorry FSJ) if he do not tell surveyor that he is "satisfied"

[Jeremy Chappell]

I suppose this makes sense in your world?

[BogusBasin]

Sure they are better. But they cost more! Oh, they are so limited. Oh, they are just such a toy. Such a niche product. PC can do so much more! I have never tried a Mac, but all my PC friends told me this stuff so I am just passing it along. Gotta go. My PC has all these popups and it was really getting too slow anyway, so I am going to reload windows xp. Again. Amen

[monkeyfun14]

Maybe you should learn how to use a computer?

You don't need to reload a OS for anything..

[kcotham]

This from someone that has never used a Macintosh, or did a direct comparison.
You are unqualified to comment on the Macintosh because you have no experience with one.

(Doesn't anyone remember when XP came out? People HATED IT!)

[supoman]

Is this news? This is like saying "Porsche owners like their cars better than Chevy Cavalier owners!!"

[Angmarr]

Touche

[Universal_Indie_Records]

You guys starting the Mac Vs. PC crap (again) are totally missing the point. It's not really about Mac's... it's about the iPhone and iPod....

the majority of those owners are Windows users... not Mac Users. So it's not about Macs vs PC.. or Vista vs. Os X

DamN!! You guys never get tired of this petty arguing crap!!!!

[Angmarr]

we have no life but to argue !!!! LOL

[bet someone here may argue with me on this] LOL

[monkeyfun14]

You know what Angmarr im getting sick of your ****!!

jk jk

[Angmarr]

its true tho -

[Seaspray0]

@angmarr. I deflect your comments with my shield of power and use the spell of petty arguing crap to loosen your tounge. What is the average air speed velocity of two sparrows carrying a coconut husk by the creeper?

[Inconnux]

Its about the all around experience when you use your computer and this is where Vista fails. I've been happy with XP but Vista is a complete dog.

[dcradiostar]

Several people have said that Macs are for playing or don't do as much as a PC. Macs are used in scientific research, medical work, the humane genome was mapped on macs, they are used extensively in broadcasting, graphic design, film editing, and much more. Mac is built on Unix. On a Mac one can run Unix, Linux, Mac OS, Windows, and more. In fact a Mac will run every operating system that runs on a PC plus the widely acclaimed Mac OS X. Therefore the Mac will do more then a Windows PC. The design, craftsmanship, and parts used in a Mac are of the highest quality. Also to configure a PC with the same specs as a Mac costs nearly the same and sometimes more and you don't have the quality that the Mac design build affords. I use both PC and Mac and have done a lot of IT work. The Mac is a superior machine and gives a greater degree of satisfaction as a result. If you would rather have a Ford Focus then a Mercedes then the Windows PC is right up your alley. There will always be people who are willing to sacrifice performance and quality for lower cost. If not the low end Fords and Chevys would not sell.

[monkeyfun14]

They are both made in sweatshops so what is this about quality.

[kcotham]

They aren't made in sweatshops. The workers undoubtedly are underpaid however. The difference lies in the designs mainly. Apple's designs are better, period. Then it's up to the contractors, like Quanta, to actually manufacture the machines. And each company has the final say on quality control. Manufacturing relationships like this are actually rather complex, and as such, very difficult to compare.

[Seaspray0]

As for any claims of quality, I put to you the same... show me the data. Show me data that presents the average time between failure for the hardware of different computer makers (I've already looked for it). Not one of you has ever provided any data to support any claim of quality. NONE! Where are you digging up all your BS?

[pithenumber]

@dcradiostarthe
$600 hunk of junk under my desk right now can run Mac OS X if I want it to
its called Hackintosh

"parts used in a Mac are of the highest quality"
I object! Apple uses normal Intel processors with an ATi or nVidia graphics chip which was made by TMSC. They use WD HDD's and samsung RAM
not low quality, but not high quality either

I would rather have a Corolla than a Mercedes because Toyota is more reliable and cheaper, that's why I (mainly) use Windows/Ubuntu dual boot

[shycelticwitch]

@Seaspray

I had to wait until I stopped laughing to post this. I have a 15 year old Quadra 800 Mac that is still running. I have a 17 year old Mac Classic that is still running. When someone shows me another brand of computer that can go that long without failure I will buy the argument that Macs are just overpriced baubles. What an idiotic statement to make without knowing what you are talking about.

[monkeyfun14]

CNET must be looking for more money again this obviously was going to start a flame war.

[kcotham]

It is getting rather old. More hits for those advertisers!

[viper396]

If you read enough of these stupid mac vs PC articles the one thing you start to notice is the complete lack of objectivity in those surveys. The article serves no purpose then to feed the fanbois.

All those "dissatisfied" PC owners are no more likely to switch to Mac's after reading the article, many will just switch to a different PC vendor then jump to an entirely different OS platform.

[Angmarr]

LOL
so a company has less than 10% market share!
Its products are more expensive!
Its the only company that sells its products, only 1 company!

What does than sum??

The only people who end up buying apple are the people who are "convinced" that PCs suck - which is such a "small number" of people THEREFORE
It will be SAD if apple didn't have @ least a 75%+ customer satisfaction!

The people who are not satisfied with PCs are only the ones that are considering giving up their PCs but have yet to - or may never will!!!

Bottom line ... there results don't really say much besides that the SMALL PERCENTAGE of people that switched to apple are satisfied! AND
a LARGE PERCENTAGE of people are just fine with their PCs

Ya, wanna correct my math - if you know how!

[tm_anon]

To correct your math, I'd need you to have actually done some in the first place.

By the way, the "LARGE PERCENTAGE" of people you're talking about, do you have any evidence that they like their PC? I'd be willing to bet that being "fine" with their PC really just means that they don't or at least don't think that they have any choice in the matter. They have to be fine with what they have because it's all they have. It's also one of the main reasons XP is still around. It's the only choice those users have.

Having 80% satisfaction is, for any company, a major achievement. Having higher percentages would simply mean one of two things; your customers have started lowering their standards to the point that the same old thing looks better than it used to or you're actually getting better.

[Angmarr]

in other word you cant disprove any thing i just said!

and if you read the article 65% Gateway users were satisfied... the bottom line is that any person with some basic mathematical plus logic understanding - guess some still don't have it - would be able to see that

A company that holds LESS THAN 10% of the marked, which is SOLELY composed of individual who are there PRIMARILY because they dislike the other company ===

DUH they better be satisfied.

[seven7dust]

how much marketshare do Dell Hp and Gateway have again ?
no to mention the like of Asus Toshiba sony who all have lower marketsahre than Apple !
So stop with the marketsahre non-sense !
Apple has been leading is customer satisfaction for over 6 years
So other companies could do the same too create their Own O.S
you MS bias is showing !

[Angmarr]

I see that your missing the point, oh well

[Seaspray0]

@sevendust. Let's look at another percentage. For a company that makes roughly 7% of the computers, what percentage of posts on cnet are made by apple fanboys like you? Shall we count? I'm guessing well over 40%. And you wonder why you're called a fanatic?

[pithenumber]

@77dust
you are criticizing a maker of MacBooks
the MacBook is just an ASUS notebook with Mac OS on it and branded under the brand of Apple so any praise of the MacBook should go to ASUS as well as Apple
maybe not even any credit to Apple since ASUS is an ODM as opposed to a CM and prolly designed AND manufactured the MacBook for Apple

and ASUS scores higher on reliability than Apple

ASUS FTW

[seven7dust]

@seaspray
only re-enforces the point that Macs are more efficient at any task
and also macs are replaced a lot less than Pcs whic could account for the lower market-share but they are a lot more in use
you ever longing task of prove that Macs and Pcs are just as reliable
has yet again been proven wrong by this fact !

@pithenumber
I wasnt crtitsizing Asus I like asus too they are a great company
good for them that they scored that high on the reliability survey

But the company that gave out the survey was prooved to be wrong
Do a google search you'll see
your overstating the importance of the survey of 1 single company
Apple has consistently scored higher than others for years
in multiple surveys in both reliability and customer satisfaction !

Asus can never match Apple they may be better than Dell Hp maybe
but no where close to Apple infact no one can is in this regard even thinkpads
I'll give asus one thing though they use damn Fine LCD panels in their laptops
better than even Apple !

[mattumanu]

Hasn't anyone noticed yet? This survey was about PCs. I find it interesting how Gateway cracked the 65 percent barrier, yet Acer who owns Gateway is not included in the list. I bought my first Acer laptop recently and I'm thrilled with it. But notice I said laptop... who buys PCs anymore?

Considering that the business has changed dramatically in the last year, I find this survey to be irrelevant.

[kcotham]

Laptops ARE PCs. It was a survey of the entire computer industry.

[Jeremy Chappell]

The true test of any company is how they deal with stuff when things go wrong. So you have an Acer laptop, and it's working great - that's wonderful. But it doesn't tell me much about Acer's customer service. More informative would be, something like:

I have a {brand x} laptop and this went wrong and they {did something} and {fixed/didn't fix} the problem. This kind of experience really tells me a lot about "Brand X" as a company, and as long as their failure rate is no worse than anyone else's then it would be a useful when making a purchasing decision.

Now here's what I know about Acer, if you have an Acer product that's DOA (hey it happens to everyone - shipping isn't good for electronics goods) they'll replace it - but it might be replaced with a system that had failed, which they repaired. Now I can see where they're coming from, but I'd not be happy with that. I paid for "new" I got "not new", personally I think that makes a difference (Acer is the only OEM I know that does this - this isn't a "Mac v PC" thing).

We buy a lot of Macs, and yeah, sometimes things go wrong. Thus far, Apple have always fixed the problems in a timely manor, with good grace. So I'm not surprised Apple do well. After the amazing run around I have with HP a couple of months ago - I'm not surprised they were beaten. But I'm sure lots of people by HP and never have a problem (I see a lot of dead HP laptops, but that could be down to how popular they are - I dunno).

[free_fight49]

I'm currently using windows 7 beta, it's much better than vista and so far so good. that said i'm an entertainer and it seems to me that all the pros have macs.at the last workshop i went to i only saw macs no pcs at all. does that say anything about them?

[Inconnux]

its amazing what another service pack to Vista will do... hope Vista 6.1 (win7) works for you...

[pithenumber]

@lnconnux
7 is more than a service pack, but maybe less than a new OS

7 is Vista streamlined and a GUI change with excellent driver support even in its Beta stage and good compatibility
did I mention its FAST