New Apple ads tweak Microsoft marketers

Apple has fired back in the latest round of the Mac versus PC ad wars with two commercials tweaking Microsoft's marketing strategies.

One nice thing about having a sick girlfriend is a guilt-free weekend in front of a dozen or so college and pro football games. Apple released two new Mac vs. PC ads for that sedentary audience to ponder in between kickoffs this weekend, though both ads seemed to be tailored more for the tech industry than NFL fans.

Both commercials poke fun at Microsoft's recent massive ad campaign to "redefine" itself in the face of two years of clever Mac vs. PC ads that have helped Apple increase sales of the Mac. One commercial has John Hodgman in his now-familiar role as PC allocating stacks of bills toward either "advertising" or "fix Vista." Guess which pile gets more stacks.

The other commercial is also about Vista: Hodgman has developed a buzzer that bleeps out "Vista" whenever that word is uttered, so that people will start using the term "Windows" instead of Vista. This is actually funny, given that Microsoft was recently awarded a patent for similar technology, even if that wasn't the point of the ad.

Apple is trying to do two things with the ads: get under Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer's skin, and continue to define Vista as a glitch-ridden operating system. Vista's early problems with application and driver compatibility are well-documented, and while most of those problems are in the rear-view mirror, Microsoft is spending more time these days talking about stereotypes, Windows 7 and the "Apple tax" than it is about Vista.

Apple, on the other hand, is quite content to keep Vista in the firing line.

The fact is that the negative impressions of Vista have stuck, as Microsoft itself had to admit with the Mojave Experiment. Whether that's Apple's fault or your IT department's fault isn't really the point; Apple took the early reluctance of people to try out Vista and ran with it, while Microsoft sat on its hands for two years then vacillated between saying "Vista isn't so bad," "we've been unfairly stereotyped," and "yeah, you might want to wait for Windows 7."

Still, negative advertising, while effective in an election year, grows old. And it plays into the sorely outdated fanboy us vs. them mentality that the vast majority of consumers couldn't care less about; most people in America do not define themselves by the computer that they use, as hard as Apple and Microsoft are trying to make that happen.

The new ads will get a chuckle out of most viewers, as the polished comedy team of Hodgman and Justin Long could teach Seinfeld and Gates a thing or two. But God forbid that Apple should ever stumble with the rollout of a new operating system; they've taught Microsoft just how to respond.

[Iamkar33m]

Cue the angry ranting microsoft fanboys...

[Renegade Knight]

Right behind the line of smug MacBoys.

[ejeon1989]

Hey, Apple fanboys get just as ******, just to be fair.

[ckurowic]

What can the microsoft fanboys say except for the Apple ads are true. Microsoft put out a shoddy OS and now has to pay for it...wait a minute, all their OS's have been shoddy. Never mind.

[compudoc318]

speak for yourself, so shoddy an os that 80%+ of the world uses it, and your precious osx needs boot camp for windows to do all that os x cant do......

[ZetaZeta_]

NT4 was solid, XP was ridiculously well developed (over time, initially people complained, but after SP2, it was probably the best Windows release to date). If you haven't tried Vista SP1, or if you're running VIsta on inferior hardware, then you have no right to complain. I'm tired of reading mac fanboy comments.

Get linux or get Windows XP if you don't like Vista. Mac ads only addressed the problems with Vista before SP1 (some of which were solvable by the user) and now only the Microsoft ads themselves. They have never advertised their own product. Every Mac could easily be retitled "Get a Linux PC" because there is rarely anything in their commercials that actually advertises Mac.

[acdr92]

any OS wont be perfect when it just comesout. SP1 solved most of Vista's problems and XP became the most developed OS.
Its also funny how apple reminds one of McCain and his insistence on having the sole platform that "Obama pals around with terrorists." they need to start making their product look good instead of Microsoft's look bad.

[medezark]

Does no one remember the initial launch of MAC OS X 10?

[patch991]

@Medezark ... Apparently the Apple Fanboys seem to have mysteriously forgotten about it.

[random truth]

@Medezark
Im sure people remember. However it was first released in 1999 as Mac os X 10.0 (cheetah). People did not expect computers to work as well as they do now. So it was considered a nuisance but livable to most. Of course it got various updates that improved it. Then apple released Mac os X 10.1 (Puma) 7 months later as a free upgrade to current users of 10.0. This in turn fixed most of the problems. So also it took 7 months versus 13 months (vista service pack 1) to get their "service pack".

[ckurowic]

Okay "compudoc", you obviously make a living of microSUCKS crap OS, that much is clear. Thats why you defend it. It makes you money through all its craptasticness.

[Penguinisto]

@Tom:



To a point, I agree, but a failure on the scale of Vista is pretty rare (see also Windows ME). Also, Apple has one hell of an advantage in already knowing up-front how OSX is going to behave on Apple hardware.



You also have a point about beating dead horses - then again, it seems to work very, very well for Apple. Coupled with positive ads ab't Apple's other products (the iPhone and touch especially), there seems to be a good overall balance. Still, it wouldn;t hurt to cut loose with some solid ads about what's inside OSX as well.



(and yeah, cue the MSFT fanboy and astroturfing crowd screaming to high heaven in 3... 2... 1... )

[Tom Krazit]

That's the thing with two-party systems: you don't have to prove your idea/product/concept is good, you just have to prove the other guy's sucks. You can't blame Apple for sticking with something that works, but once Microsoft gets its act together and starts reclaiming Windows (which will happen at some point, if not with the current campaign), they'll have to retool the Mac vs. PC ad concept.

All good ad campaigns must come to an end at some point, and I think we're on the back side of the Mac vs. PC campaign. There's still life left in it, it's just that you can't bash Vista forever, no matter how much Vista failed to capture attention (we're agreed on that subject).

[Penguinisto]

True - it's pretty much played-out as a concept (which is kind of sad, because the two actors really do have an awesome chemistry together).

I suspect that slamming Vista will likely end very soon anyway - Microsoft is already firing up the hype engines for Windows 7, and Apple will have to roll out a new concept pretty soon.

[Michichael]

I can almost guarantee they'll have at least one camea Mac vs PC ad for Windows 7 - think of a younger PC and an older pc...

[Vegaman_Dan]

Penguinisto: It's easy to call something a failure without any sort of evidence. Vista is selling, it's made up its development costs, and it's turning a profit. How exactly is that a faillure? OS X has also met this criteria- do you call Apple's product a failure as well?

See, this type of behavior on your part is why you have earned the reputation fo being a troll here. This is exactly the sort of thing you should reconsider before posting if you want anyone to take your comments seriously.

It's up to you.

[Penguinisto]

Hiya Dan!

Vista is IMPO selling at roughly the same rates before the ads as after - while the numbers have yet to come in, there's been (at least from what I can find) no appreciable improvement in folks' attitudes towards or or purchases of Vista. It sellsin the first place at its current rates because the "PC"-centric OEMs are more or less forced to sell it, and because of market intertia. IOW, I believe that you're confusing intertia with popularity here.

As for Vista recouping its development costs? You have access to better information on that than I, since you work for Microsoft - how about telling us what those costs were? Six years and billions of dollars is my best guess as to what it cost to develop it. I suspect that OEMs certainly don't pay anything near full retail price, but I doubt they'll reveal what they do pay.

[medezark]

I'm gonna have to find a few good deprogrammers for the apple cultists.

[Seaspray0]

Too bad we don't have a "truth squad" similar to the ones monitoring the presidential candidates over the last few months. I'd be interested in knowing just how much apple has paid for advertising vs microsoft over the last few years.

[Mark_Anderson]

Good to see Apple extolling the virtues of OSX to give a positive comparison as to why it's superior to Vista.

Oh wait.

[Penguinisto]

Actually, they have in many of the ads in this line. Compatibility, reliability, ease of use...

[rnaoncfixd]

... Because those "I'm a PC" ads really tell us why windows is better than OSX? If anything, those ads just tell me that I can do anything with a PC, regardless of what operating system it's running; windows just so happens to be sponsoring the message at the end.

[Penguinisto]

Agreed w/ rnaoncfixd - the only thing the "I'm a PC" ads from MSFT tell you is:

1) lots of semi-sorta-maybe-famous folks that no one really knows are pretty angry and defensive about using a PC, and...
2) Apple's ads must've really jammed one into Ballmer's keister for him to have his corp put out such a purely reactive advertisement.

[Mark_Anderson]

@penguinisto

Ancient history. Next point please.

@rnaoncfixd

Irrelevant. Next point please.

Looks like Apple can't sell the virtues of OSX over Vista any more because now there actually aren't any meaningful ones.

Sad really.

[Penguinisto]

"Ancient"? Hardly - it refutes your point entirely. Calling it "Ancient" doesn't erase that fact. ;)

[Vegaman_Dan]

Apple ceased talking about their own product quite a while ago. And that's one of the reasons why the ads just don't work anymore. People watch the ads for the wordplay and lose any message that was meant to be given.

Apple needs to do something new and creative. The ads are funny and good to watch, but really- at this point they tend to only sound tired and old. The message is lost.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Apple ceased talking about their own product quite a while ago. And that's one of the reasons why the ads just don't work anymore. People watch the ads for the wordplay and lose any message that was meant to be given.

Apple needs to do something new and creative. The ads are funny and good to watch, but really- at this point they tend to only sound tired and old. The message is lost.

As for Penguinisto's comments- yes, they are old, tired, and flat out boring. Very much like Apple's ads, if you think about it. Perhaps he could use a refresh as well.

What do the Mac ads tell us about PC's and Mac's? PC's are used for business and serious use by professionals. Mac's are used by out of work slackers with poor personal grooming habits and unable to even grasp the concept of 'professional'. What does that really say?

They were cute and neat at first, but really, they are stale and old at this time.

[Mark_Anderson]

@penguinisto

So, because Apple showed some perceived benefits of OSX quite some time ago when they're ads were vaguely honest that excuses the fact that all their recent output is about why they would like you to believe Vista is bad?

Ancient History. Irrelevant. Move on.

[Penguinisto]

@Mark:

It excuses nothing, but does prove that Apple does extol the virtues of their OS. Also, you too easily forget all the other media in which they specifically do so.

@Dan: Do your employers in Redmond give you a bonus or something for astroturfing?

/P

[bsharkey]

Penguinisto, the 3rd selling point on their list in Apple's own PC ads are that "it runs Microsoft Office!!"

oh wait make that #4, behind "most popular" laptop on campus. translation for slackers: you too can be a lemming and spend too much for a quirkier product which may or may not be supported as widely wherever you go (say, intern at a fortune 500 company) because arguably it's the "most popular" one on campus. that's like buying something because you read in OK! magazine that Hayden Panettiere thinks it's pretty.

[bbabadu]

...And don't forget to invite the equally annoying and smug Apple zealots.

[close5828]

Speaking as a Mac AND Windows PC owner, I agree w/ 90% of what Apple is saying and less than 10% of what Microsoft is saying (in the press).

Whatever Apple is doing in the marketplace, they're clearly doing something right, and the numbers (stock, revenue, etc.) prove it. You can argue Mac-this or Windows-that, but it all boils down to numbers.

I've always said that a Windows-only or Apple-only world is a cold, cold place that no-one wants to be. Competition keeps things warm and approachable; it is the life-blood of innovation, and without it we are all screwed.

[hanzblinx]

Actually AAPL stock has done horribly, unless falling 50% is a good thing.

[Seanathome]

hanzblinx, all tech stock have been doing horribly. That's not really fair to put the blame all on Apple...

[Vegaman_Dan]

When I see Apple products in 90% of the business market instead of only in a small niche of consumer's homes, then those comments will make sense. Right now though- Apple isn't interested. It doesn't really matter what people think or want. Apple isn't interested in expanding to the business market. That's where the money is.

[fiman16]

actually no your wrong, apples stock fell horribly right after the ****** iphone 3g launch and has never come back. so dont try and blame the market crash because its clearly apples fault.

[Seaspray0]

It depends on what numbers you look at and how you can "spin" them. i.e. Enron executives made a fortune by making the company look stellar while it went bankrupt. I recommend you try both out and get the one you like rather than make judgements based on what other people like. They are not you.

[DrWuzer]

Not a MS Fan boi as much as I am an Apple H8r, but I'm currently running Vista on my current box and have been since I installed it over a year ago, and honestly, the only problem I've had with it was with one lame Sid Myers game. Besides that, its been more reliable than any computer I've previously owned, hasn't crashed, blue screened or failed to boot - ever. I think a lot more was made of the initial problems than was necessary, and for sure, whatever problems were present on the initial release have been completely fixed.

[blinkdt]

Agree entirely with DrWuzer on this one. I am, however, seeing more Macs than in years previous (anything greater than 'one' is more, I suppose) and these users are NOT the typical cult member. They are the one's talked into getting a Mac by a Cult member, and mostly they are less than enthralled. They are experiencing all of the problems and issues that the cult experiences but washes over: the annoying keyboard, the goofy software, the less than superior hardware . . . . Yeah, Dell doesn't have a monopoly on bad capacitor issues. "Do you know how much I paid for this piece of c***?" Why yes, yes I do.

[ballmerisanape]

It's all relative. You had to wait until Vista to even approach what OS X has offered for years.. and Vist is still way behind the curve. Like it or not.. what I just said was true.

Use a Mac for a few weeks and you will see what I am taking about.

[matttx]

I used a Mac for a month and didn't feel like Vista was behind the curve. Rather, I couldn't stand a lot of how OSX works from a user experience standpoint. I had assumed at the time that I just was used to Windows, but I guess if all it takes is a few weeks then my initial impression was correct.

I'll give Apple credit for developing UIs that are generally incredibly user friendly (whether or not I personally care for them is irrelevant, they certainly appeal to some people), but I have never been inclined to make the switch (paying more for less being the primary reason) and all these current ads do is make me more willing to stay with Windows.

[Zanny_Blowzsteve]

Vista is just fine. (Ask the 180 million PLUS people that use it. {compared to maybe 8 million OSX-Leper'd users) This is all marketing hoo-ha. Apple is still a single digit marketshare also-ran, & Microsoft still entertains a 90%+ marketshare.

Same as it ever was.

Anyone stuck w/ an Apple is stuck with (what was Steve Jobs' words?) Oh yeah, "A BAG OF HURT".

OUCHIE!

[gsmiller88]

Quick run and hide, here comes a trojan!

[compudoc318]

quick apple, run and hide, its time to work, or play games, and apple cant do either...lol

[ibeetle]

I see what you did there you clever little boy you.

You took the world wide numbers of all the versions of Windows, and put them in the Vista pile. Then you took just the U.S. numbers of only the current version of OS X and compared them to make it look like Vista was the greatest operating system to ever existed and the entire world only ran on Vista.

You are as clever as those kittens that found their mittens just so they could eat their pie.

[ddesy]

And market share (especially with inaccurate numbers) actually proves.... what?

I have used Vista, and my PC is back to running XP thank you very much. Vista is bloated and has enough DRM garbage to choke a horse.

[jessiethe3rd]

Hahaha... must hurt to not have Blueray.

[Perry_Clease]

"Hahaha... must hurt to not have Blueray."

No it doesn't

[Penguinisto]

BluRay? Why should I bother? The PS3 comes with one anyway.

[Vegaman_Dan]

Um, I'm sorry, but you're wrong. Vista is a horrible failure. Penguinisto said so.

[yelocab]

Yup. I am "stuck" with Apple for my home computer, it's actually the sixth "big bag of hurt" I have purchased over the past 15 years -- an iMac. And I wouldn't trade any of them for Windows. (I am forced to use Windows at work, so I know what I speak of).

[sciontcya]

@ Tom Krazit:

I believe Apple has learned after years of BEING the brunt of the jokes in IT just how to dish it out (finally)
But, like others, I kinda believe in KARMA, and I think to a point, it's funny, to a larger point - just asking for it to come back like a boomerang...
I'm an Apple guy - please, reserve the fanboy remarks for myspace gurlz - but I think less is more.
Time to move on...

[Tom Krazit]

I think you're right on both counts--pent-up frustration that was released in a very funny way with the Mac vs PC ads, and that you have to know when to say when.

[AdamMoore]

Cue the Apple zealots in defense.
I have an OS X machine and a Vista machine, and I have had zero problems with my system. Not a single crash, freeze, blue-screen, incompatibility, nothing. Funny that. Such a failure.

Good thing OS X keeps up with it's endless versions (read: service packs), version 10 will be out forever.

The ads basically have nothing to do with any Apple product, as it makes no reference to it in either advertisement, so, that's useful to consumers how? I don't try to sell cars without showing/mentioning/talking about cars, so how does that work any better for computers? Brand power and word of mouth go a long way, but in all reality, Apple wouldn't exist without Microsoft, and Microsoft wouldn't try to innovate with Apple, so the world continues to turn.

[gsmiller88]

I personally like how Apple just keeps updating version 10. Microsoft tries to change too much in one whack and the consumers get crap like Vista thrown at them as a result. Look how much more polished Mac OS X has gotten since its first version was released.

[sciontcya]

Yeah, it's SO much better to wait for 6-months before MS fixes something.
Oh wait, I installed Boot Camp for a client, and it was from an XP SP2 CD.
Only 178 updates to be installed after that.
LOL.
You ARE a Ballmer butt-boy.
I'll take the records for repairs/problems here at the office and compare any way, any day.
You need to get into this century, Adam.

[Vegaman_Dan]

WRONG! Penguinisto has stated that Vista is a failure. You are quite clearly wrong if you disagree with this. It doesn't matter that you have a system running Vista that isn't experiencing any of the issues that Penguinisto has claimed before. You are quite simply wrong. Vista is a failure. Obviously your machine can't be running and you are lying.

Penguinisto has said so. Do not disagree with him. You wouldn't like him when he's.... angry. (well, nobody really likes him when he's happy either, but that's beside the point)

[Penguinisto]

Hey Dan - I wasn't even in this thread... try to keep your obsession of me to a minimum, please. ;)

[slickuser]

I had to format my 1TB external USB hard drive with propertiary file system on my MAC using FAT32 before I
could use on Vista notebook!! Because, Vista could not even recognize the hard drive when I plugged-in.

That's pretty SAD folks!

Vista Sucks!!!

[maniactiger]

Sorry, I hate to tell you this, but either you are a computer newb or did not have it plugged in. And fat32, give me a break, why would anybody use fat32 (and please don't say that it is because Vista does not recognize NTFS). I work in an IT department and was a beta tester for Vista. External drives that are not 10 years old do work with Vista out of the box. Oh, and if Vista is so bad, why did Apple implement some of it's features (and XP's for that fact) in the last "revision" of OSX. Apples fans say it's not true, but it is documented. Sorry, Windows or PC, they both work great and fans on both sides can find PLENTY to whine about on both sides.

[bonesbautista]

Mac user with WIndows XP-via Boot Camp user chiming in here. Can't say anything about Vista as I haven't tried it out and likely won't - XP works for me quite well!

Brought that up because the ads don't work for me - I use XP and Leopard. I want an ad done by Christian Slater for guys like me in the vein of "My Own Worst Enemy" - one guy, two operating systems, everybody's out to get me....

That would be cool.

[zgreenwell]

Its nice that apple can spend a ton on making a commercial talking about how microsoft spends a ton on its commercials. The "I'm a PC" ads at least focus on the company's product. Neither of these new Apple commercials tell you one thing positive about a Mac.

[Penguinisto]

I sincerely doubt that Apple spent $300 million on their ad campaigns (which is what MSFT has publically announced as having set aside for theirs).

[Vegaman_Dan]

Penguinisto wrote:

"I sincerely doubt that Apple spent $300 million on their ad campaigns (which is what MSFT has publically announced as having set aside for theirs)."

And I spent $6.43 on lunch today. What does that have to do with the subject? Please try to respond to comments about the actual subject. Did zgreenwell say that Apple had spent $300 million on their ad campaign? No. Don't make insinuations that he did. He brought up the fact that the I'm a PC ads talk about their product and that Apple's does not.

Do you dispute the Apple ads?

FAIL.

[blinkdt]

There is nothing positive to say about a Mac. It's that simple, they are just bigger iPods. Toys. Now, hush up and let the kids play with daddy's money, I have work to do.

[selfkill]

Wow, I'm not sure what kind of idiots Apple takes us for. They've been spending money on advertisements for years and now Microsoft steps up their marketing and it's Apple that claims Microsoft is spending too much on advertising? Let's just put it this way: if you spend money on advertisements that blame your competitors for spending too much on advertising, you either have too much cash to burn yourself or you've really run out of ideas. That's not just ironic, it's hypocritical.

[sanenazok]

I know it's hilarious! Apple spends the vast majority of its budget on advertising, but gawd forbid someone else should do it too. Hey let's put Flash support on a $1700 phone first and then we can talk about who's spending too much on ads versus "fixin' stuff."

[medezark]

Apple should spend less on advertising and more on software development and better hardware for their offerings. Apple's are pretty, but their not state of the art hardware by any stretch of the imagination.

[random truth]

@medezark
That is true. They have some innovation that others dont, but the only one that is state of the art is the mac pro. I am disappointed. I was expecting much more out of the new macbook processor and port wise.
@Sanenazok
What $1700 phone. The iphone is about the same price as other smart phones. $199.

[YankeePoodle]

The question Apple fanboys have to ask other "apple" owners, how many of them use their macs as dual boots and use vista or xp?

Keep in mind Apple sales only started to soar when they moved to x86 platform and enabled bootcamp.

So the truth is somewhere in the middle.

[ddesy]

By supporting Windows use on a Mac, people can have a transition period to a non-Windows system. Plain and simple.

[Dylan_Wisor]

You're acting like it's a bad thing to use both.

My laptop is a Macbook Pro with Leopard. My desktop dual-boots XP Pro and Fedora 9. I really can't say that I favor any one over the others overall. (I've been playing with Fedora a lot though, just because I only recently installed it after having used Ubuntu for so long.)

Fanboys should be shot.

[dlw_Cnet]

No, Apple sales started soaring when Microsoft released Vista. For many Windows user, Vista required the purchase of new hardware. If you're going to have to buy new hardware anyways, why not buy a Mac and run OSX. If you don't like it, you can still run XP on it. Having to buy new hardware was one of the biggest hurdle that stopped Windows user from switching. Vista solved that problem for Apple by almost requiring a PC that was less than 1 year old in order to run Vista. That's full Vista not the cripple Home version. And the fact that most Windows user thought Vista sucks. They didn't need the Apple ads to tell them this.

[jgoto]

I think most Windows users who switch are reassured by knowing that they can run Windows on the Mac, but the majority never dual boot their system. Especially when they see the Retail price of Windows, and OSX will generally do everything a windows Machine will do (at least in a home setting, for corporate systems all bets are off).

[YankeePoodle]

The question Apple fanboys have to ask other "apple" owners, how many of them use their macs as dual boots and use vista or xp?

Keep in mind Apple sales only started to soar when they moved to x86 platform and enabled bootcamp.

So the truth is somewhere in the middle.

[compudoc318]

why dont the im a mac commercials mention how if youre a mac, you need boot camp so you can also be a pc to do real work or gaming....lol. boot camp is the answer in all the mac vs. pc wars, you need boot camp/windows for what the mac wont do.

[goodspeed8701]

You should be the one to plan M$ new ads... since i like your post.

[shycelticwitch]

what is all this garbage that mac can't do office work or play games? I have an company of 62 employees, 45 of them have Apple iMacs, the rest do not use a computer. I run MS Office Suite, my accounting software and all of my other business software on them... WITHOUT INTERRUPTION. I have ONE PC that I HAVE to have in order to open Publisher files. It is only one year old, and has Vista. It took three days to get it running somewhat properly. All 45 iMacs were up and running within 20 minutes after taking them out of the box. The PC "crashes" at least once every time we turn it on, yet virus scanning and conflict scanning shows nothing is wrong.

At home, I play games, lots of them. Good ones too. So you're argument has about more holes in it than shipwreck/

[Perry_Clease]

Define "real work." Exactly what programs do you need in order to do "real work?" As to gaming, yeah you all probably have better and more games, I don't play games.

[blinkdt]

Real work? Well, let's see. I support dentist offices, trucking comanies, car dealerships, accounting firms, law firms . . . they all use proprietary (and, I might add) expensive software and hardware that you never even heard of . . . and they all run Windows, baby. Vista? Yeah, that too. And all those old printers and all that old, expensive software? I haven't found a single piece of software or equipment that cannot run on Vista. You just need a solid Vista box to begin with, and I can buy three of those for every one Mac. From a dollar and sense standpoint, it's a no-brainer, and business can see that too.

The Apple adverts upset me in that they are not true. They lie. I DON'T need a new printer, I DON'T experience problems (that need fixing), I AM popular with young people. And I will not cozy up with such a duplicious entity. Ever. Apple users have no self-respect.

[Penguinisto]

So tell us - what do you install in a Windows box to do what a Windows box won't do (that is, run stable without throwing a ton of money and hardware at it, show some compatibility with drivers, exhibit at least some backwards compatibility, etc...)

[Vegaman_Dan]

Let's see, I'll take your challenge. I open new laptop boxes every day.

1: Open the box.
2: Plug computer in.
3: Use computer.

That's all there is to it. This myth that you have to throw 'a ton of money and hardware at it' is pure fiction and misinformation. It's typically spread by trolls to intentionally deceive others for the purpose of forwarding their own agenda or financial goals.

I think people can read your comments and make that qualification of your status themselves.

[atom3000]

Sorry
I haven't come across anything that my PC won't do.
regards

[Penguinisto]

@Dan: Your case is different - after all, your employer would obviously already know which configurations would actually work with Vista, since they wrote Vista. The rest of us aren't so lucky, and have to settle for the misleading "Vista Capable" labels and hope for the best.

@atom3000: Good for you. What do you do with yours?

[medezark]

Penguinisto:

#1 Penguins Can't Fly

#2 No problems, threw $100 extra for a HDTV Tuner card with Qam capability. I watch TV, schedule recordings of shows I might miss, create 3D animated videos, develop database applications, word processing, presentations, design and implement SQL databases, play games, edit photos, work on spreadsheets, surf the web, listen to music, make and enhance EVP recordings, edit home videos, run various flavors of Linux in Virtual machines (just for fun, I do all the stuff listed above in WINDOWS VISTA), Download and test the latest and greatest open source software from hundreds of developers, compose music, mix tracks . . . . .

#3 I do not now, nor have I ever worked for Microsoft.

Sure, Vista could be better. But for the difference in premium between buying a Mac and Buying a PC, I can afford to upgrade the entire OS about 4 or 5 times.

I have had no stability issues, no virus issues, no mal-ware issues, no one's been able to hack my machine in record time in order to win a contest.

So, how much is Stevie boy paying you to hawk his overpriced machines? Or have you just been drinking the kool-air again?

[jgoto]

You don't need to install anything. The trick is to not install trashy programs that will wreck your stability. As for drivers with backwards compatibility, Vista is bad with old printers and scanners and stuff, but Apple isn't really know for their backwards compatibility either.

[i_am_still_wade]

Microsoft can KILL Apple with one simple ad. Just get these same actors, Hodgman and Long, and have Hodgman playing a game. Long says "what are you doing PC?" "I'm playing a game, Mac." "But PC, I have games too." "Yeah, sure Mac, card games. (laughs) But not fun games."

Apple would have no answer, ever.

[ddesy]

.... what?

[Seaspray0]

It's not just fast detailed 3d graphics that makes a game fun, entertaining or good. Fun is relative to the individual. For instance, my favorite game is still Master of Orion, written in the days before windows. It has cheese graphics, a simple interface, was made to run on 2 mb "expanded" memory under DOS... but I don't care. The game was just a well written game. I'm sure you'll find others who would kill to get back that old game system so they could play sonic the hedgehog or pacman again. BTW, my second favorite of all time is robot wars written for the apple II.

[random truth]

Because guitar hero 3, guitar hero aerosmith, call of duty 4, halo, flat out 2, spore, world of warcraft, Battlefield 2121, Unreal tournament, Neverwinter Nights, Everquest, all of which run on Mac os X without bootcamp, so they must not be fun games.

[jaybarrow]

"I'm playing fun games too, PC. But mine aren't crashing."

"Touché, Mac. Touché."

[Seanathome]

Actually, I've heard some bad things (crashes, freezes, etc.) from the games on the Mac. Just saying... :P

[Glyld]

"I'm playing fun games too, PC. But mine aren't crashing."

"Touché, Mac. Touché."

How is this any sort of valid statement or arguement? I guess at best you could say that someone might find the few games you could play on a Mac fun. My grandmother is just crazy about solitare.

The other thing people need to realize is that the vast majority of crashes, especially with games, is not due to the OS but drivers or firmware developed by 3rd party hardware vendors or the code in the games themselves. Why do you think PC games get patched? Read some patch notes sometime, it's listed right there that the reason a game is being patched for crashes, bugs, etc. is because the dev team for the SOFTWARE made a mistake or missed a bugged line of code. THEIR product caused the issue. They don't say 'Well our game would run great, IF YOU WEREN'T RUNNING VISTA/XP/OSX!' It is the hardware and software vendors responsibility to ensure that their product is compatible with the OS and be prepared to further test and develop patches, driver updates, and/or firmware releases when the OS is patched or newer versions are being released.

It also seems a bit lopsided to compare Windows and Mac issues side by side when Windows has 90%+ of the market. Who do you think you will hear more issues from when there are that many devices out there running a product with that kind of market? It's also real easy to make your smaller market product look better when, let's be honest in the big picture, next to no one is using it.

Apple could overtake MS and get 90% of the market and we would be having the same arguements now, just on different sides.