Could a Zune phone come with free music?

In the absence of any concrete news from Microsoft about Zune, the same rumors crop up every few months. We've known for some time that Microsoft is porting the Zune software and marketplace to some sort of living room device--it's called the Xbox 360. (I doubt they'll do a separate piece of hardware like Apple TV, especially given the recent rash of cost-cutting around the company.) And as far as the latest crop of Zune-phone rumors, I expected Microsoft to announce Zune for Windows Mobile back in February at the Mobile World Congress show, and was surprised when it didn't happen.

Supposedly a screenshot of the Zune interface planned for Windows Mobile 7.

(Credit: WMPoweruser via CNET Asia)

Now I understand why it's taking so long. According to this unsourced rumor at WMPoweruser, Microsoft is planning to allow mobile operators to be involved in the process of selling downloads. In other words, when you download a song from the Zune Marketplace to your Windows Mobile phone over 3G, your carrier will set the price and handle the billing. Adding a third party--the carriers--to your development process introduces delay.

I believe the rumor for a couple reasons. The last time I talked to the Windows Mobile team, they emphasized that they consider carriers as a major customer, alongside end-users and handset makers. This is unlike Apple, which built the iPhone primarily to appeal to end-users, then told carriers they'd have to agree with Apple's terms to sell it--in other words, all downloads go through iTunes. Carriers want to keep control of the customer billing relationship, and they want to dictate prices for content downloads, especially ringtones. So I could see Microsoft capitulating here.

Second, Microsoft acquired a company called Musiwave in 2007, and has posted job ads for developers to work for Musiwave to help power the Zune Marketplace. Musiwave was a provider of back-end platforms for carriers such as Orange and Vodafone. That kind of expertise could be helpful in transitioning the Zune Marketplace to a model in which some transactions are handled by carriers instead of Microsoft.

Personally, I like Apple's all-in-one model, and if Microsoft's not careful, allowing the carriers in could create a usability nightmare. What if, for instance, Wi-Fi and PC downloads are handled by Microsoft, but 3G downloads are handled by carriers, leading to two bills and different prices for the same content? Epic fail. But I could see some advantages as well. For instance, today carriers subsidize the price of many phones (including, of course, the iPhone). What if Microsoft could convince them to subsidize the cost of a Zune Pass (Microsoft's all-you-can-hear subscription plan), or even build it into the monthly data plan fee? The result would be similar to Nokia's Comes With Music phones--a phone that offers you unlimited over-the-air music for a year or two.

Whatever the case may be, we probably won't see any Zune-Windows Mobile integration until Windows Mobile 7, which won't be out until 2010.

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[TinyIoda]

"In the absence of any concrete news from Microsoft about Zune, the same rumors crop up every few months. "
"According to this unsourced rumor at WMPoweruser,"
"I believe the rumor for a couple reasons. "

are you freaking kidding me?!?!?! an entire 'article' on nothing??????

I know you're paid to talk.. but try something other then speculation and BS for once....

[wojx]

word.

[coryschulz]

MS has consistently created one disappointing product after another. I always had hope that they might do something clever and create something useful, but they haven't. They had their shot, and at this point in time I now own an iMac and an iPhone and am completely satisfied with these products. The Zune was a complete failure, and Windows Mobile is terrible (I even thought it was terrible before the iPhone came out). XP is outdated, Vista is severely bloated and unusable, and Windows 7 will probably help them maintain their marketshare, but it isn't going to be anything impressive. Their Live services are terrible. Live Mail is embarrassing compared to Gmail. I would never use Live Search since Google is so easy pleasant to use. I mean... I could go on and on about how every service and product is just terrible. The only thing that they did which I thought had potential is the Ribbon interface in the new Office, which will be more heavily integrated into Windows 7. I thought that was pretty cool, and that was probably stolen from someone else. Also their Photosynth technology that they purchased is cool, but that didn't come from internal development, and I don't think they've done anything big with it so far. So overall, in my experience... MS = Fail.

[rubenerd]

Agreed, the extent to which I'm underwhelmed by Microsoft's products is... overwhelming. They seem to go out of their way to embrace mediocrity and when they try to create something new it's a failure.

My father is forced to use Microsoft software at his company, so for his sake and for all those who also don't have a choice, I hope Microsoft does get with the program (sorry bad pun) again soon. While as unreliable as heck, I thought the interface of Windows 3.x was classy and usable. I could go on.

I don't hate Microsoft, I've just learned that the Old Microsoft who's products I used to use is dead. Mac and FreeBSD with the Xfce desktop are what I use now.

[rapier1]

Uh photosynth was developed in conjunction with U Washington. It was a joint research project.

As for ther zune being a failure - have you ever used one?

[rubenerd]

"As for ther zune being a failure - have you ever used one?"

I have, but even if I hadn't it's a moot point. The Zune has been a failure.

[Rod Roddy]

Why does no one talk about the enormous failure that is Apple TV?

[rubenerd]

"Why does no one talk about the enormous failure that is Apple TV?"

True, but a non sequitur. Mark's article is about Zune speculation. The Zune has been a failure.

[callmemarc]

You must drink a lot of Apple juice

[rapier1]

If your criteria for success is becoming the number one PMP in the market then yes, the zune is a failure. So is every other PMP aside from the iPod. By pretty much any other criteria it's doing reasonably well.

[ccmike72]

" "Why does no one talk about the enormous failure that is Apple TV?"

True, but a non sequitur. Mark's article is about Zune speculation. The Zune has been a failure."

except for the comment we are all replying to is filled almost entirely with things that have nothing to do with the Zune.
The Zune is a failure if you expected it to overtake the ipod but then again in that case so are all mp3 players made by creative labs, sony, archos, sandisk, iriver, and the list goes on. Every mp3 make fails to get to get enough features, options, and overall points of strategy to overtake Ipod's early lead and name recognition that could sell the public on a turd wrapped in tin foil. I have had both Ipod and Zune and I prefer the Zune hands down. Zune pass is awesome and now you get 10 songs to keep very month so for the price of one CD i practically get a CD of content and then i can have access to unlimited songs. Also unless they ever added it to ipod, have to say I love the ability shuff within an artist amongst the songs of all their albums (zune).

back to the point though. coryschulz why don't you ask about 95% of the business world if MS has created anything useful, as all the enterprises running their own .Net programs, MS_Servers, Office, Outlook, etc. Look Microsoft isn't perfect but when can we drop the BS that apple is. What apple product has just drastically changed you life?

2 different companies with different strategies that server different purposes and user bases. Neither is perfect, neither is God and both are Large businesses that come with the so-called evils of being a large. MS is about making money. Apple is about making money. Thats what businesses do.

[viper396]

@rubenerd, by what criteria are you calling the Zune a failure?...the fact that it hasn't passed the iPod in marketshare?

If that is the criteria then what is the Mac? After 20 years it still has less then 10% market share and is still around.

Your statements are biased, arguments are short-sighted, and your reasoning is hypocritical.... a typical Mac user.

[SNOOP_ROCA]

Viper, lemme tell you something, for a computer that is $1000+ the mac is doing FINE. I am a Mac/PC owner and I've realized that for better or worse Mac is doing very well. If you compare the 5 or 6 types of macs (All very costly, I might add) the the hundreds (possibly THOUSANDS) of Windows computers, your hate crazed, fanboy ideas MAY change, its YOU that's bias.... seeing as 10% of computer users are using a Mac, I'd say that apple isn't doin that bad...


Oh yeah, and Apple TV is a COMPLETE failure, just like the Zune, and pretty much every other MP3... Not saying that the iPod is better, but MOST people wanted and iPod I guess, and oh yeah, before you attack me, I had both a Zune and an iPod, so I can say with personal knowledge that even with the nice features of the Zune, the iPod has MUCH more appeal to the average person (interface-wise)

Still trying to rid the world of uneducated, ignorant Fanboys, SNOOP ROCA

[castelazo]

It's great to know that not everyone thinks as you do. I love my zune. It's great. Period.

[dfic]

Same here, I use my zune all the time for a lot of things the iPod can't do.

[perontopsp]

But the Zune is hideous. And I know what you are thinking, who cares if it isn't as pretty. Well lets use a metaphor. MP3 players to women. The Zune is like a prostitute in the sense that it will do a lot more than the average woman. Also prostitutes are usaully ugly. because they are "used" a lot, so is the Zune. Now iPods are different. They are the social and classy women. They don't sell out for AM/RM radio just like classy women don't put out. I understand that is metaphor is, well it is extremely volgur, and I am sorry if I offend anybody.

Besides, when people say, "Hey look guys, I just bought the new iPod" everybody crowds around he/her to see it. And when people say "Hey guys look, I just purchased the new Zune" People reply "oh is that the new iPod?" " well no, its not" "meh".

[Jonnygthedrummer]

the iPod classic , or nano vs the zune, well , like perontopsp said,

the iPod is prettyer but the zune does do more,,,
but with the iPod Touch , the zune gets killed, the touch blows the zune away with features

i have both zune an touch \

[SPARTAN VI]

That was actually a terrible analogy, not a metaphor.

[iconoclast04]

@perontopsp

I don't know what you're talking about. The Zune is by no stretch hideous. Personally, I don't really like the new iPod Nanos, with the curvy edges...plus I don't like the metallic finish, which it seems to me could get scratched and end up looking like crap (look at any silver cell phone after 2 years). iPod aside, though, the zune looks better than most other mp3 players...

[dfic]

I dont see what looks bad about my zune. The screen is bigger than it's iPod counterpart and I have more functionality.

Given the choice of looks vs functionality, I'll almost always choose functionality. I dont really care if people are impressed by the look of my mp3 player.

[uptheironsrafi]

Why is this site filled with empty articles concerning Apple and Microsoft? These two companies are sort of turning into the "poster boys". anything they do(or are rumoured to do) attracts attention. take this article for example. the guy is theorising about a device which even he admits might not see the light of day until 2010. thats just bad journalism, in my opinion.

[Kendokill]

I completly agree. It's just a flashy topic to get people to make comments so whoever wrote the article can look like he's actually doing work, but in the end it's just a bunch of girly gossip. What drama queens cnet has. There has been a plethera of articles just like this one over the past few months, and it's all there for the comment hype.

[Lemon5]

I get what you are saying, but is outside beauty better than smarts and "inner beauty?" The zune may not be the most sexy gadget that my money can buy, but it is sure as hell nicer in other ways. The UI is years better than Ipods (i have both the 5.5gen, Classic, and an Ipod Touch, and the only one that is pretty cool is the Ipod Touch, but i am not a huge fan of Touch screens, but back to the topic at hand). I dont like that boring white background, I want something that is vibrant and colorful. I mean there a radio built in! Also, the bigger screen is quite noticeable. So it isn't the the hot prostitute, at least it isn't dead behind the eyes.

[zgreenwell]

As much as the Zune is a nice device, which I have and use, it would be nice to have an update at some point. However, Windows Mobile, which I also use, is entirely outdated. That doesn't mean it is unusable, but it is overdue for a major overhaul. My hope is that Microsoft can get this update out soon. It isn't like the rest of the industry is standing still and waiting.

[MrJayRjingles]

I was a satisfied user of zune until lately when i got this big problem wherein zune stopped working! damn! I have been using zune for a couple of months already and i cant believe that it didnt last for even a year! It was a very bad decision for me to get the zune 80 instead of ipod touch especially that im in the philippines wherein zune repair services is virtually close to impossible.. i have been searching for answers through forums all over the net and it's so frustrating to know that im stuck and seems that alot of people are experiencing the same prob..

[rapier1]

have you contacted Zune Support?

[C433Z]

I think the Zune pass is a great deal. $15 bucks a month for and unlimited subscription PLUS you get to keep 10 permanently each month. And now they offer drm-free music too!

Too bad i don't buy music very often, otherwise i'd sign up :/

[tom5965]

It seems to me like a lot of people have lost focus on what this article is reporting. There could be a phone in the near future to offer Zune Marketplace capability! I see a lot of arguments between Apple and Microsoft users. For the most part, people have chosen their camps so what's the use in arguing? I personally like Microsoft but I see the appeal of Apple's products. Let's face it - the iPhone is sweet as f+ck. What an idea. If Microsoft had an equivalent I would be first in line. If you hate Microsoft, so be it. I happen to like Microsoft a lot more than Apple, but I will admit that I'm very jealous of the iPhone. But how cool would it be if we could have the same type of experience with Microsoft business capabilities??

[jpricew]

I like the Zune, and pretty much every other MP3, I love zune. It's great.

[jdanielw]

it better not have a touch screen or copy the iphone in any other way!!

[tipoo_]

Come on, next generation Zune already! Skip the phone.

[friscoG]

I would actually like to see a zune phone running Window Mobile. All the functionality of WinMo....word, excel, PPT, plus gigs of music and internet. Sounds like a winner to me if they can pull it off.

[dplayer_09]

I don't see why the Zune is such a failure. I mean I have bought most of the ipods that came out except for the Iphone and all have either broken or sucked. The Zune software is easier to use and better looking. Its just a no BS download your music and go type thing. No hassling with worthless stuff like quicktime or Genius (which is pointless) I mean you got radio on it! Hell, you can even find a song thats played on the radio and then mark it to be downloaded. I'm not saying that the Zune is perfect but damn..most of you are just so negative

[monkeyfun14]

I like Zunes I have one and btw iPod is only the name of Apple's MP3 player. Not the name of all of them.

[KawasakiMike9]

Somebody could make a lot of money registering domains like people did for iphones.

http://blog.domaintools.com/2007/07/iphone-domain-owners/

[jpricew]

I like the Zune, and pretty much every other MP3, I love zune. It's great.

Jason Price
[e-mail]
http://www.walkersresearch.com/emaillists.asp

[atish505]

XBox = Zune Windows Mobile = Sucks.